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Black/White In-Game Tier List


Smiley Jim
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I feel a bit bothered by Archen; since that ability a.k.a Defeatist...

Urghh...

Hey, so do I, but I'm in no position to contest that Archen's still effective.

Defeatist won't activate often when Archen is rolling the place with STAB Acrobatics and Rock Slide / Stone Edge. He's got a pretty effective movepool to hit many times super effective. Even if he can't, 165 STAB Acrobatics is going to hurt off base 112 Atk. It also has creative ways of defeating the enemy at such low health like Endeavor. Even if Defeatist activates, chances are he can still hit the 2HKO marker provided that the Pokemon isn't stupidly durable.

I don't see Endeavor as practical since it's likely you're getting KOd the turn you use it...

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Hey, so do I, but I'm in no position to contest that Archen's still effective.

I don't see Endeavor as practical since it's likely you're getting KOd the turn you use it...

In the process that you're KOed, you leave a Pokemon weak enough to be finished off. It's kind of like a sacrificial Baton Pass.

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In the process that you're KOed, you leave a Pokemon weak enough to be finished off. It's kind of like a sacrificial Baton Pass.

True, but I still think it's impractical, and since Archen's defenses are nothing to write home about, it's possible you can get KOed before you get to the HP threshold where Endeavor could be useful.

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True, but I still think it's impractical, and since Archen's defenses are nothing to write home about, it's possible you can get KOed before you get to the HP threshold where Endeavor could be useful.

I found in most cases Archeops was 2HKOed, except under the weird ass circumstance (but then you would still get your full attack power). It would usually take a super effective or boosted attack to really knock Archeops. Or Haxorus I guess.

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I found in most cases Archeops was 2HKOed, except under the weird ass circumstance (but then you would still get your full attack power). It would usually take a super effective or boosted attack to really knock Archeops. Or Haxorus I guess.

Okay, but I called Endeavor out as impractical since I like to look at things with a touch of realism. And with Archeops demolishing everything it faces (well, most of everything, at least), you'd actually have to try to get to the point where Endeavor would be useful.

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Okay, but I called Endeavor out as impractical since I like to look at things with a touch of realism. And with Archeops demolishing everything it faces (well, most of everything, at least), you'd actually have to try to get to the point where Endeavor would be useful.

Precisely.

Endeavor was only suggested as a resort of people complaining about Defeatist as an ability. There's ways to work around it, is what I'm getting at. Though the best solution is to just kill them in the first place or switch the fuck out.

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I agree on Ferroseed moving higher; that Power whip hurts and can resist most stuff not named Fire; and laugh at the Water and Ice types.

I support this motion: the only thing ever really hurting it is fire, and it can still take fighting type hits well enough. Then again, I'm not sure where I'd place it epsecially since its not that easy to train it either(its slow, Gyro ball is its best attack, its at lvl 25-28 and steel attacks don't hit many weaknesses). Its decent against skyla and great against Brycen. Perhaps B tier but I dunno.

Also about Archen: I've not used it in a playthrough, but it comes before the fifth gym. So I think S tier is too high since its not there for about half of the game. Perhaps pulling it down to the top of A would be fine.

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I support this motion: the only thing ever really hurting it is fire, and it can still take fighting type hits well enough. Then again, I'm not sure where I'd place it epsecially since its not that easy to train it either(its slow, Gyro ball is its best attack, its at lvl 25-28 and steel attacks don't hit many weaknesses). Its decent against skyla and great against Brycen. Perhaps B tier but I dunno.

Also about Archen: I've not used it in a playthrough, but it comes before the fifth gym. So I think S tier is too high since its not there for about half of the game. Perhaps pulling it down to the top of A would be fine.

About Archen: The last time I checked, the fossils comes before the fourth gym, not the fifth. Also, Archen/Tirtouga join at Lv25, which is around what the level of an efficient team should be at. Some people complained about Defeatist, but that was shut down as well, as Archeops basically OHKO's most things anyway with STAB Acrobatics. He's staying where he is for now.

As for Ferro, yeah, based on type, he trolls all the gyms after he joins, though I will admit that having only 5 PP for your main STAB royally sucks(Leveling isn't an issue with Lucky Egg, and grass STAB is covered by Power Whip after evo anyway). At least he's better than dipshits like Trubbish that really don't do anything meaningful. Yeah, Ferro is going up a few places. I currently have him below Solosis/Gothita, but where do you think I should put him, and if it's a higher tier, below or above who?

Edited by Mercenary James
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It doesn't matter when the opponent can't kill you in a timely manner, while you're dishing out damage by existing.

Anyway, that's a much better placement for Ferroseed. I believe I was using Metal Claw as its main move - the longer the battle goes, the more dangerous it gets.

If you're that worried about Speed, it learns Thunder Wave via TM. It also learns Thunderbolt and Energy Ball. . .the latter I understand, but WTF is up with the former. Don't remember when Poison Jab comes, but it's another thing in its arsenal (since it's not like it has a glut of moves you want to keep forever).

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Poison Jab requires Surf, which is after the 6th Gym.

Plenty of Steel types learn Electric moves, such as Klink and even Durant (funnier considering the basketball player with the same name plays for the Oklahoma Thunder). Considering it also comes in an electric cave, that makes a bit of sense.

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Poison Jab requires Surf, which is after the 6th Gym.

Plenty of Steel types learn Electric moves, such as Klink and even Durant (funnier considering the basketball player with the same name plays for the Oklahoma Thunder). Considering it also comes in an electric cave, that makes a bit of sense.

Bold: I'd make a Yggdra Union reference, but it'd go over everyone's head but eclipse's.

Other than that, I don't relly have too much to say, other than Poison Jab wouldn't hit as hard as Gyro Ball even if it was SE.

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It doesn't matter when the opponent can't kill you in a timely manner, while you're dishing out damage by existing.

but you're being slow at it and you're taking damage, which you have to heal off, and that's slow

If you're that worried about Speed, it learns Thunder Wave via TM.

that doesn't solve its speed problem

it's about as fast to gum at someone faster than you than to paralyze him first, then gum him, unless you get a full paralysis

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Plenty of Steel types learn Electric moves, such as Klink and even Durant (funnier considering the basketball player with the same name plays for the Oklahoma Thunder). Considering it also comes in an electric cave, that makes a bit of sense.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought of Kevin Durant (he's one of my favorite players and I'm a big fan of him) when I see the pokemon, and loled so hard when he was able to learn Thunder.

I was going to argue against Archen, but it seems like Defeatist was proven to be not as big of a drawback because of his sheer power anyway, so I have nothing else to say really.

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but you're being slow at it and you're taking damage, which you have to heal off, and that's slow

that doesn't solve its speed problem

it's about as fast to gum at someone faster than you than to paralyze him first, then gum him, unless you get a full paralysis

Last I checked this wasn't a ranking based off of speed.

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Speed isn't everything, or Liepard would be a hell of a lot higher (and, uh, don't move it. . .it's fine where it is. . .)

I am using Ferrathorn in my current runthrough, and I'm telling you that speed is a harsh mistress to this mon, especially Ferroseed who has shit for offensive stats. Evolving to have Steel/Grass coverage in Gyro Ball and Power Whip isn't THAT good. More than speed works against it. Accuracy is another factor. The fact it's slow so is just another minor thing, since it means it's durability is more finite than mons that can just straight sweep an opponent.

While I would say that Ferrathorn isn't bad, it's not good either. If we're also accounting for Ferroseed, Ferroseed sucks on toast.

EDIT: Why the hell is Dwebble so high?

Edited by grandjackal
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wrt Dwebble: I've used it before, and it's actually pretty good. It's workable until it evolves, and then you get Shell Smash. It's capacity to sweep is stupid (with Shell Smash), and it's coverage is quite good as well. I think it's fine where it is.

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Speed isn't everything, or Liepard would be a hell of a lot higher (and, uh, don't move it. . .it's fine where it is. . .)

way to miss the point

the difference between liepard and like, i dunno, nidoking (let's pretend that nidoking is in this game) is that the latter has good speed to complement excellent offense

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Any reason why Joltik and Blitzle are a tier apart? They're both electric pokemon, Blitzle would've probably been evolved by the time you have Joltik, both do well against Skyla(and Zebstrika is more durable to boot) and it also has flame charge against Brycen and Burgh. Not to mention it does pretty good against Elesa's Emolga. Zebstrika also has a small defensive advantage over Galvantula.

Now granted Galvantula has a slightly better variety and such, I don't think Signal beam/Poison Jab should be what makes these two a tier apart.

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