Grassbridger Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 You also decided Reinbach was town after he cleared you as doctor. I also fail to see why he was given a pass because he claimed rolecop while I was scum despite no one knowing why I'd claim tailor as scum. Yes but that was the same post that he claimed rolecop. As I said, I thought the argument that "he could have just claimed cop" was a good argument for townieness. I'm not saying I wasn't biased (that's impossible for me to determine for sure, although I am considering the possibility) but I did have other reasons. But you're right about the claiming-tailor-as-scum part. It only makes sense if you knew (or suspected) there was a (town) rolecop, which there's no reason for you to know (or suspect). But the argument is just "maybe you (as scum) were worried about the existence of a rolecop, which probably exists given the existence of a full tailor". It definitely should have been a point in your favor, and the fact that it wasn't is our (other townies') fault, because you did bring it up. But there's your counterargument. Manix do postgame! We've told you why you're bad, now it's your turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 (edited) Yes but that was the same post that he claimed rolecop. As I said, I thought the argument that "he could have just claimed cop" was a good argument for townieness. I'm not saying I wasn't biased (that's impossible for me to determine for sure, although I am considering the possibility) but I did have other reasons. But you're right about the claiming-tailor-as-scum part. It only makes sense if you knew (or suspected) there was a (town) rolecop, which there's no reason for you to know (or suspect). But the argument is just "maybe you (as scum) were worried about the existence of a rolecop, which probably exists given the existence of a full tailor". It definitely should have been a point in your favor, and the fact that it wasn't is our (other townies') fault, because you did bring it up. But there's your counterargument. Here's the thing: tailor is virtually always a scum role, outside of draft picks or something like Nostalgia mafia. It has very little benefit as a town role, and it's even worse when it's fucking compulsive and I can't target myself. The key point you are missing is why the fuck would I claim a role that is exclusively scum in the first place as scum? Claiming the role in the first place draws attention to me, which is not something I want as scum. And if I were actually a scum tailor, why would I WANT to claim it in the first place? Mystery Mafia had a 1-shot mass tailor and a 2-shot tailor that absolutely wrecked havoc on town D1 and in a later phase and the tailor was the last to flip. Tailor WRECKS town. If I were scum I would not claim that at all if I actually were tailor. Nor is it such a common role that I would think of one if I didn't roll it. Your counterargument is poor and does not excuse you for giving one role a pass on the basis of role and not giving equal consideration to the other. Edited December 2, 2013 by Sangyul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 2, 2013 Author Share Posted December 2, 2013 rule 1 of manix games: there's a 50% chance there's a tailor or variant present in the game #modmeta2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunwoo Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Even if Manix is like the only person I can think of who actually likes tailors, it's still an uncommon role so that I don't think "Manix game" and "better be on the watch out for a tailor". Also Manix, postgame coming anytime soon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 2, 2013 Author Share Posted December 2, 2013 Soon read as not today because /effort levels are too low Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Soon read as not today because /effort levels are too low that's what they all say. i wasnt here for itemafia but i bet sds made the exact same post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 2, 2013 Author Share Posted December 2, 2013 prims i haven't missed a single postgame (except maybe EO? maybe that one was just incredibly late) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperblade Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 (edited) I basically agree with what Rein said about the setup. If you don't want people to make use of roles then don't give them any.Seriously this If you don't want people to make decisions based on roles don't include roles (or host an open/semi-open setup like C9++). Everything you include in your setup, from the flavor to the roles to the rules is part of the game and you should expect players to use everything they can to their advantage (this is why we ban quoting role PMs, faking flavor is lame). It's part of the game, if you don't like it don't host games like that. Doing shit like including a miller then having no cop just so you can go "LOL GOT YOU THAT'S FOR ROLESPECCING LOSERS" makes you look petty and vindictive. This doesn't apply to just Manix either, btw. also I think D1 vengekill for mafia is fine, mafia have a really low winrate when they get D1 lynched in NOCs (on SF I think it's something like 5%, the only game I've seen here since I started playing where it happened was NSFMM3), and just randlynching will probably give you like a 25% chance of D1 lynching a mafia. Edited December 2, 2013 by Paperblade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Doing shit like including a miller then having no cop just so you can go "LOL GOT YOU THAT'S FOR ROLESPECCING LOSERS" makes you look petty and vindictive.yeah FUCK people who do that ;_; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 IMO, every role should have a purpose, and not "protect someone from the one hooker in the game" kind. Otherwise, that role might as well be vanilla. At least vanillas know that the only thing they can do is talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 IMO, every role should have a purpose, and not "protect someone from the one hooker in the game" kind.I agree, Town Safeguard is a bad role. not fakeposting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 I agree, Town Safeguard is a bad role. not fakeposting No, that role I described. . .worked EXACTLY as I described it. It's in Unicycle. May no one ever take that role again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 IMO, every role should have a purpose, and not "protect someone from the one hooker in the game" kind. Otherwise, that role might as well be vanilla. At least vanillas know that the only thing they can do is talk. I think protecting someone from the one hooker in the game is better than protecting someone from the zero kills in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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