The Lunatic Club

[Azz]

I am officially gonna try Lunatic and I was wondering what the strategy is for prologue->chapter 3(When you get outrealms)?I will be grinding and I will be playing casual for now.

Advice?

[Czar_Yoshi]

Prologue: for the top wave, give Avatar both Vulneraries and a Lissa support. Have those two swim out on the water where only the Mage can reach them and duel the Mage with Thunder, healing on player phase. Since he can't have Luna+, you'll almost always win barring crits. From there, snipe all the Myrms and Barbs at 2-range so they can't attack. Fight the Boss at range with Fred supporting and Chrom/Lissa adjacent for the +10 Dge- he'll have no listed crit that way. You should be Lv.6-7.

Cht.1: Use the Bronze Sword. Have Fred get you to the Fort with the Event Tile and tank there, trying to dodge everything. Use Vulneraries for healing if things get dicey. If attacking on PP instead, prioritize limiting the number of times the Mercs fight you, as they rarely miss. Having 11 Def going into the map is very good, because it means the Archer will tink you on the Fort and you can completely ignore him. Once all the 1-range enemies are dead, kill the Boss with Thunder. You should be Lv.8-9.

Cht.2: Grab Virion's Elixir, throw Avatar x Fred into the middle with Thunder equipped and reset if things don't go your way. Dual Strikes are very useful for KOes and misses good for survival, try to get the enemies to not bodyblock you so you can reach the Fort on turn 2. Have the scrubs bail left, there's a Soldier they need to kill but it's very safe if they gang up on him. A Barb might break off and follow them, gang up on him too. Miriel and Virion are good. Just tank the top wave on a Fort, and start running in circles if things go sour.

Cht.3: Blast through with pure stats. Fight the left side first and kill the Knight with magic, then tank the right side, then go up and clear the top from the left. You should be strong enough by now to not have much trouble.

Cht.4: Bonus Box. Grab Celica's Gale, power up with Naga's Tear and clean house. Or sell the Supreme Emblem and recruit Travant if you're feeling lazy.

There are much more consistent strats out there but they're usually complete overkill for vanilla Lunatic and would take more time to explain than they would save.

Edited April 10, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[Bovinian]

I have a question about Lunatic+. Why is it generally considered the optimal strategy to reclass Avatar to Mercenary or Dark Mage early on? I guess it makes sense if playing as MaMU, but when I play as FeMU I find it more effective to go Tactician (promote ASAP) -> Grandmaster 15 -> Dark Flier 15 -> Sorcerer. I know going this route shits all over her internal level, but I always manage to get Galeforce in time to pass down to Lucina (and later Morgan) on a Classic no-Outrealm playthrough, not to mention these additional advantages:

- Ignis (fairly reliable proc)

- RALLY SPECTRUM

- Gives at least two additional Galeforce users for a much stronger player phase

- Never have to give up tomes, and never have to deal with swordlock (levin swords are expensive)

- Better stats for surviving difficult chapters like 5 and 6

I know Armsthrift is great and all, but Avatar's kids can easily SS to Merc and get it on their own. Is there something that I'm missing, that's valuable enough to compensate for not having the above perks? I admit that this is contingent on getting lucky enough to have a Master Seal by Chapter 4-5ish, which is the only real drawback as far as I can tell.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Dark Mage has really strong skills (Anathema makes a lot of promoted skills look bad by comparison) and very similar growths and bases to the Tactician. Tier 1 has such a fast EXP gain that getting 20 Tact/20 DM lets Robin overpower stuff with raw stats. Also, Anna Master Seals are fairly rare in the early game, whereas not only do Second Seals spawn more often, but there's one in Renown.

It's also worth noting that a Robin that goes Tact -> DM -> Sorc -> Dark Flier can still fairly easily have Galeforce by C13 (although I prefer to pass Veteran to Lucina).

I actually used to take a GM route, myself (Tact -> Tact -> GM -> Dark Flier), but I found swapping to DM gave me better overall results. Sure, Ignis is a decent way to cut through Counter, but at those lower levels, it's far from reliable (neither is Vengeance, but it still has a better proc rate). Rally Spectrum is by far not worth using with a main tank!Robin, though, as her turn(s) are better spent murdering Counter guys.

Can't really speak for the Merc route, because I've only taken it once and on a test run that allowed grinding (and went for Hero instead of Bow Knight).

[Bovinian]

I see. It seems like we value different things based on our respective playstyles. Starting at around C17 I like to let the children handle most of the combat (Lucina, Morgan, and two others - Severa and Laurent work well for me). FeMU w/ Galeforce can still get rid of one problem enemy (I like to pair her with Tharja for the Mag boosts, so Hex/Anathema are active anyway), then Rally on her second action if necessary to help the kids reach Spd/ORKO thresholds.

I usually have Lucina go Tact -> Merc as soon as I get her so she picks up the useful skills and blasts through 18 easy levelups, ending at Bow Knight. She does just fine sticking to swords and looks adorable in the Tactician jacket. I have Laurent go through DM as well so even after I ditch Tharja for Chrom Anathema is still a thing.

[Lylium]

I beat lunatic and am now painfully working my way past the first chapter on lunatic+, I swear to god it's broken.

[eclipse]

I beat lunatic and am now painfully working my way past the first chapter on lunatic+, I swear to god it's broken.

Say hi to Kuroi, two posts above you. His sig contains two very useful links for Lunatic+. If you can, tune in to his stream when he tries it! It won't tell you how to beat the mode, but it should give you some ideas.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Can't really speak for the Merc route, because I've only taken it once and on a test run that allowed grinding (and went for Hero instead of Bow Knight).

Merc has Patience (counteracts Hit+10 allowing you to effectively dodgetank for much longer, especially with a sword in Axe-land), AT (make Forges last longer for more effective Counter bypassing), gives very useful pairup boosts for getting other units started (particularly relevant on Vanilla where you're likely to use a slightly larger team), and has two very useful promotions (BK has 8 Mov Bows and is extremely effective at keeping Cht.9/10 under control, Hero has Sol, high Def and Hand Axes, both give Breakers). There's not really anything it gives that you can't use, just a few things it doesn't have (like Tomes, but that's hardly unique to it).

[Lylium]

Say hi to Kuroi, two posts above you. His sig contains two very useful links for Lunatic+. If you can, tune in to his stream when he tries it! It won't tell you how to beat the mode, but it should give you some ideas.

Cool Thanks :D

It really helped.

Edited April 11, 2015 by Lylium

[Vyse Skern]

Just finished my Lunatic+ run under specific conditions

- Every characters ended with their base promoted class (meaning Owain stuck to Swordmaster or assassin)

- No Limit Breaker (but All stats+2 and Paragon was ok) postgame excepted
- No Exp grinding outside the main battles, postgame excepted again (but I grinded for money)

My pairings was

ChromxOlivia : Usually, I choose Sumia but I never tried Olivia before and also because ...

MaMUxSumia : I liked it very useful pairing and great children but Cynthia was less awesome than I expected

LissaxRicken : Disappointing but logical

CordeliaxStahl : Severa is always great

SullyxVaike : Kjelle Tank is an invicible juggernaut

TharjaxDonnel : Noire was both one of the best offensive and support unit

NowixGaius : Usually awesome under others difficulties, Nah became a bit weak here

MaribellexHenry : Still a great Brady

CherchexGregor : Great Gerome as a support unit

Mirielxlon'qu :Laurent is solid as always

PannexFrederick : I barely used Yarne

I will try a new run with some changes like SullyxDonnel. Never tried but I read it was great, the same goes for TharjaxGaius, often mentionned but never used.

I also have to find a new father for Nah and for Owain to make them more useful and to try a new wife for my MaMu but I'm not sure for now. I already chose Lissa, Sumia!Lucina, Aversa, Chrom!Cynthia during my previous runs and I can't decide yet. I wanted to try Tharja but I can't

Edited April 13, 2015 by Vyse Skern

[Ownagepuffs]

Congrats!

[sthbdis]

I don't really ever use the kids if I'm doing a run with no grinding. Maybe Lucina and Morgan. So these may not be the *best* pairings, but if you need everybody as their base promoted classes and without grinding, I would say Stahl as Owain's dad is going to be your best bet. And I would say Kellam for Nah maybe, or Freddy.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

In no grind, Kellam fathering Nah isn't really great, at least, so long as one wants to use the parents (and in no grind, if neither get any experience, Nah is going to be garbage for the point in the game where she can be recruited). Unless a Second Seal (and associated levels) is/are invested in him, he provides no Spd bonus to Nowi. Even with the stacked Def, her starting HP isn't very good and being doubled by most things is not something she needs. This also causes Luna+ to wreck her even harder than normal. Generally speaking, she wants a Spd support to get her out of that hole ASAP.

[Vyse Skern]

I don't really ever use the kids if I'm doing a run with no grinding. Maybe Lucina and Morgan. So these may not be the *best* pairings, but if you need everybody as their base promoted classes and without grinding, I would say Stahl as Owain's dad is going to be your best bet. And I would say Kellam for Nah maybe, or Freddy.

I don't use all the kids during the main run but I use them postgame, especially for apotheosis. That's why I prefer to create good pairings during the main story even if I don't use this kids for the main storyline. I grinded postgame during my last lunatic+ run but I kept everyone on their natural promoted class

I though too about Stahl as Owain father (who, with Vaike, looks like to be the best father for a physical Owain) but I usually use him for Severa but maybe, you're right, sound like a good choice for him, I should take Lon'qu instead for Severa or the Avatar.

About Nah, Fred and Kellam hurt her speed but can make her a great tank. I never tried them because their supports always seem weird (adult falling in love for a little girl x_x except Ricken, Donnel and a little bit Gaius, all the others make me feel uneasy) to me but based on their stats, they look like good choices

Thanks for the advices

Edit :

In no grind, Kellam fathering Nah isn't really great, at least, so long as one wants to use the parents (and in no grind, if neither get any experience, Nah is going to be garbage for the point in the game where she can be recruited).

Yes, it's my main problem. On my first game, I married Nowi to Donnel, then Ricken and finally Gaius and I never changed. Until now, Nah was great but on my lunatic+ playthrough, she became very weak and I put her away

Edited April 13, 2015 by Vyse Skern

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

About Nah, Fred and Kellam hurt her speed but can make her a great tank. I never tried them because their supports always seem weird (adult falling in love for a little girl x_x except Ricken, Donnel and a little bit Gaius, all the others make me feel uneasy) to me but based on their stats, they look like good choices

I did Nowi/Kellam on stream on my last more-standard playthrough and me and just about everyone else was weirded out by their supports. Not because of the adult x little girl in appearance thing, but because their supports build and play up a brother/sister sort of vibe. Then they get married. :I

[sthbdis]

In no grind, Kellam fathering Nah isn't really great, at least, so long as one wants to use the parents (and in no grind, if neither get any experience, Nah is going to be garbage for the point in the game where she can be recruited). Unless a Second Seal (and associated levels) is/are invested in him, he provides no Spd bonus to Nowi. Even with the stacked Def, her starting HP isn't very good and being doubled by most things is not something she needs. This also causes Luna+ to wreck her even harder than normal. Generally speaking, she wants a Spd support to get her out of that hole ASAP.

I see what you mean, I have never done the pairing in that kind of a format, but ya Kellam doesn't seem like the best match for her there. Thanks for correcting me. I assume Freddy would give her the same issues. Who would you recommend instead? Gaius comes to mind for me.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Either Gaius or Gregor, as they give her nice all-around bonuses. Lon'qu can work if both of them are already taken, but he won't be as good.

[Czar_Yoshi]

I though too about Stahl as Owain father (who, with Vaike, looks like to be the best father for a physical Owain)

Appearances can be deceiving- in postgame/Apo, Stahl is one of Owain's best dads but Vaike is very near the bottom of the barrel. People often see his "highest Str mod in the game" and put him on Owain to make his sword hand stronger, but there's a lot more to it than that: all told, Vaike!Owain has some of the worst mod clash in the game (his mods are worse than a good few G1 units), and Vaike gives him a poor selection of new classes, only adding Hero and Trickster into the mix. Stahl!Owain's mods still aren't fabulous (they're pretty lame, to be honest- but this is Lissa's fault), but he more than makes up for them with one of the best class sets in the game.

[Vyse Skern]

Ok thanks everyone for your advices

I think I'm going with this

Chrom x Olivia

Sumia x Henry

Lissa x Stahl

Cordelia x Lon'Qu

Miriel x Ricken

Cherche x Gregor

Sully x Donnel

Tharja x Gaius

Nowi x Vaike

Panne x Frederick

Maribelle x Avatar )

Except Lucina, Morgan, maybe Cynthia, Morgan and Brady, i don't think I'll use the others children. It will depend how my team will develop.

I'll try to make the avatar family my main healers

For my avatar, I will try +def-Lck or +Spd-Lck.

defense seems better but I often get doubled during my first lunatic+ so speed can be more useful with an offensive avatar

I did Nowi/Kellam on stream on my last more-standard playthrough and me and just about everyone else was weirded out by their supports. Not because of the adult x little girl in appearance thing, but because their supports build and play up a brother/sister sort of vibe. Then they get married. :I

Exactly

I'll never understand japanese and their lolicon or imouto fetishes

[Irysa]

just never marry kellam to anyone

seriously

[ultmatelifeform]

For my Lunatic + run ( going great by the way i rage quit on chapter Warrior Realm. (Whichever number that is) until this morning and got to chapter 15 already.) I was going to marry MU to Tiki. I already had Nowi as my wife and Morgan was awesome as a manakete so I thought I would have Tiki this time. What I was wondering is if i can re class Tiki, get galeforce and then change back to a manakete. Im pretty sure thats possible but I would be mad if it wasn't so, can I do that?

[sthbdis]

I think only spotpass Tiki has access to Galeforce, so she could learn Galeforce, but she would not be a candidate to be the mother of Morgan.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Yeah, P17!Tiki only gets Manakete, Wyvern Knight and Mage, so no inheritable Galeforce. However, Morgan will have access to Pegasus Knight and Robin can pass her Veteran, allowing her to blast through and nab Galeforce in 2/3 the time it would have taken Tiki, anyway.

[ultmatelifeform]

Oh well Ok then.

Edited April 14, 2015 by ultmatelifeform

[Irysa]

I'm enjoying a baller Myrmidon Stahl taking names left and right in Lunatic atm. I used the renown Seal to turn Avatar into a Troubador (goofing off, but she's a decent pairup for Miriel when not healing), then pissed around for Anna to give me another one so Stahl could reclass after Donnel's Paralogue. Then Outdoor Fighter and Avoid+10, Lon'qu's Killing Edge and a support with Sully let him wreck stuff in Chapter 5.

But I have to say that the lack of earlygame second seals really limits the amount of fun/experimenting you can do on any given run. It really makes me miss the DSFE reclassing system. I'm not neccesarily all for reclassing in the first place, but when the possibilities are right there it's frustrating to be so limited in terms of ingame experimentation. You sort of get pidgeonholed into a few early units you invested into snowballing, and second seals just exemplify it massively because you level up so fast. Perhaps I should have just gone for a Hard Mode no pairup or something instead.

Edited April 17, 2015 by Irysa