What are the optimized combinations of Asset & Flaw?

[Noah25648]

I'm curious as to what other players picked for optimization.

Strength:

Asset Strength & Flaw Luck/Def

Magic:

Asset Magic & Flaw Strength/Skill/Luck

Speed:

Asset Speed & Flaw Luck/?

Defense:

Asset Defense & Flaw Luck/?

I kind of hate going with defense flaw. If the enemy can double your avatar, then that's taking additional 6 physical damage and 2 magic damage; brave weapon would be additional 12 physical damage and 4 magic damage.

If I'm going with pure magic build, should I go with flaw in strength or skill? How much accuracy do I lose for going with skill flaw of -3 skill?

Thanks.

[Zepher-Tensho]

When I do magic builds I just do -str. I don't like -skill because I love using Thunder spells, which have low hit. Plus more skill = higher skill triggers.

Other than that, I usually do +def and -mag. I like an avatar that can tank. Plus he/she seems to develop decent magic even with mag flaw *shrug*

But all I can say is experiment. Everyone has a different play style so everyone uses different asset/flaw set-ups.

[burgerkong]

I'm curious as to what other players picked for optimization.

Strength:

Asset Strength & Flaw Luck/Def

Magic:

Asset Magic & Flaw Strength/Skill/Luck

Speed:

Asset Speed & Flaw Luck/?

Defense:

Asset Defense & Flaw Luck/?

I kind of hate going with defense flaw. If the enemy can double your avatar, then that's taking additional 6 physical damage and 2 magic damage; brave weapon would be additional 12 physical damage and 4 magic damage.

If I'm going with pure magic build, should I go with flaw in strength or skill? How much accuracy do I lose for going with skill flaw of -3 skill?

Thanks.

It depends on what you're trying to "optimize." Apotheosis and a Lunatic run are both entirely different beasts.

If you're going for godly builds for Apotheosis, a Defense flaw is generally-considered the best. Defense is mostly useless in Apo due to you slaughtering the enemies with Braves or being a dedicated Support and never facing direct combat.

If you're playing for a Lunatic clear, then I can't really help, but the general consensus is +Defense/+Speed or -Skill I think.

[Roflolxp54]

It really depends on what you want.

If you want to have a single pair solo/sweep the Apotheosis map, consider +Mag/-Def.

No grind Lunatic runs usually favor those with +HP, +Def and +Spd. Preferred flaws in those instances are typically -Lck and -Skl.

And of course, there are those who want Morgan to be the very best in a particular stat. For instance, play as a female Robin and have her with +Str and -Mag, -Spd, -Def or -Res. Have Vaike marry Cherche and then have that Robin marry Gerome. With enough training, male Morgan can have a Strength stat of 71 as a General or Berserker class with the Limit Break skill equipped.

[Czar_Yoshi]

I kind of hate going with defense flaw. If the enemy can double your avatar, then that's taking additional 6 physical damage and 2 magic damage; brave weapon would be additional 12 physical damage and 4 magic damage.

Doesn't matter. In Apo, pretty much everything 2HKOes you anyway, so it doesn't change the number of turns you die in. You should also never be getting doubled in Apo.

It's a tougher flaw to take ingame, but that's because of the effect on your bases and growths. By the time you cap Def, it probably won't matter again.

For ingame (Lunatic(+)), Def and Spd are good assets and Skl and Lck are good flaws. For postgame, Mag and Spd are the best assets (Str and Skl are close seconds) and Def is the best flaw, though Lck works too.

[Thor Odinson]

I like to do +Str -Res just because I like to maximise Str, since it's my favorite stat, -1 speed mod be damned. It's not /the best/(in terms of dealing with L+ superearlygame) but it does allow for some fun things like utterly ignoring counter between the chapters 7-10 on L+ with only an iron sword. I tend to not care much about postgame, though.

So it really depends on what you want the particular build to do.

Edited October 21, 2014 by Thor Odinson

[Terrador]

>with only an Iron Sword

I get that you've had that experience, but have you run the averages on those levels? I find it rather difficult to believe that the theoretically average Hjordis can do that with Iron. Steel or a forge? Yeah, I can totally get behind that... but Iron? Not on average. No way.

[Thor Odinson]

Capped str (30) on Mercenary full +str Hjordis after 32ish levels isn't unreasonable (and that's after spending all of Tact being str screwed), and this is with pairup into account. She entered chapter 7 as level 1 Hero after the chapter 6 promotion, since I spent para2 training Chrom.

Taking advantage of veteran use unpromoted is key.

You fully well know the growths on site are only estimates based on a bar instead of actual numbers. I don't like working with potentially inaccurate data.

(just to make you happy 19*.65 +11*.7+9(base from lv 1 as merc as a +str) has an expected value of 29 as Mercenary at 20/12, which is 1 from Merc cap or capped with an energy drop from renown.)

Edited October 21, 2014 by Thor Odinson

[Terrador]

Consider me schooled! Carry on.

[Czar_Yoshi]

You fully well know the growths on site are only estimates based on a bar instead of actual numbers.

Not for much longer. Vincent already dug out a mostly complete set of growths from the ROM, and it's very similar to what we have now.

[fengaridotdll]

I tend to go +Strength -Luck (LUCK IS ALMOST COMPLETELY USELESS!)

Edited October 21, 2014 by Mastergabe2000

[Thor Odinson]

Not for much longer. Vincent already dug out a mostly complete set of growths from the ROM, and it's very similar to what we have now.

Did he? Link me. I'd like to see the actual data.

[Czar_Yoshi]

I tend to go +Strength -Luck (LUCK IS ALMOST COMPLETELY USELESS!)

Having a Lck flaw also reduces your Str and Mag by 1, which hurts practically any build. Better to take a flaw that only lowers useless stats.

Did he? Link me. I'd like to see the actual data.

BEHOLD! http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=50170&page=1

The growths are ciphered like FE12, so we can't just go through and read them easily, but people are working on it. Priam has growths now. That's a start.

[Thor Odinson]

BEHOLD! http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=50170&page=1

The growths are ciphered like FE12, so we can't just go through and read them easily, but people are working on it. Priam has growths now. That's a start.

:O

That is pretty awesome. Thanks for the link!

[Czar_Yoshi]

Indeed. I'm checking that topic daily waiting for map sprites to be ripped (already got a ton of system icons, whoo) to give me a reason to get to work on that Apo simulator I've been meaning to make.

[Zepher-Tensho]

Doesn't matter. In Apo, pretty much everything 2HKOes you anyway, so it doesn't change the number of turns you die in. You should also never be getting doubled in Apo.

It's a tougher flaw to take ingame, but that's because of the effect on your bases and growths. By the time you cap Def, it probably won't matter again.

For ingame (Lunatic(+)), Def and Spd are good assets and Skl and Lck are good flaws. For postgame, Mag and Spd are the best assets (Str and Skl are close seconds) and Def is the best flaw, though Lck works too.

I got doubled doing Apo's secret route. Damn OP Snipers 8U

Granted I wasn't thoroughly preparted for the secret route. Too many einherjar. Not enough supports. I got decimated.

[fengaridotdll]

Having a Lck flaw also reduces your Str and Mag by 1, which hurts practically any build. Better to take a flaw that only lowers useless stats.

BEHOLD! http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=50170&page=1

The growths are ciphered like FE12, so we can't just go through and read them easily, but people are working on it. Priam has growths now. That's a start.

What is one that affects useless stats? And my unit was fine with -luck (Or maybe it was Skill?)

[Thor Odinson]

Indeed. I'm checking that topic daily waiting for map sprites to be ripped (already got a ton of system icons, whoo) to give me a reason to get to work on that Apo simulator I've been meaning to make.

I'm pretty excited for avatar creation stuff to get ripped too. Always wanted to write an avatar creation simulator.

[Czar_Yoshi]

I got doubled doing Apo's secret route. Damn OP Snipers 8U

Granted I wasn't thoroughly preparted for the secret route. Too many einherjar. Not enough supports. I got decimated.

Keyword "should"- 66 Spd is the threshold for not getting doubled, and with 25 minimum from LB/Rally/Pairup/Tonic (stuff everyone can get/should have with enough prep time) you only need 41 from class base, mods, other skills, and a pairup that doesn't give nothing (Hero, Assassin, Berserker, Paladin, and DF are all great options), which is fairly hard to miss.

But if you're not prepared, then anything can happen.

What is one that affects useless stats? And my unit was fine with -luck (Or maybe it was Skill?)

Assuming all stats are capped... When supporting, -Mag and -Res have no effect on physical units, and whether supporting or leading -Def lowers your hit by 0.5, physical DG by 0.75 and magical DG by 0.25, and in very rare cases it can change the number of hits you're killed in. DG doesn't matter and sometimes won't even have an effect, that little Hit won't matter on a unit with Avatar's class set, and in the rare case where you would die from the Def drop, have another unit fight instead.

I don't doubt that you did fine with -Lck, but Awakening's metagame is a game of good and better. Outside of nogrind of higher difficulties and challenge runs, nothing is actively bad- even Maiden!Lucina and Gregor!Inigo are better than their dads. But there's still a large (often 10+%) gap in stats alone between well-optimized units and poorly optimized ones, before taking skills into account, so it does pay off if you're going for better than good (and is often necessary in challenge runs). Basically, why settle for having 1 less Str than you could have otherwise?