Olwen and Eyrios, who do you pick?

[Illiterate Scholar]

I don't know if this really counts as a debate, but I personally have nothing to debate because I can't decide on who is better. I want to hear what everyone here has to say about these 2 characters. FAQs seems to recommend Eyrios, but I don't think it's as clear cut as they make it. I'll lay out some points and I want to see what everybody thinks. It's not a debate between 2 people, I want to get an idea and some thoughts.

1. In terms of stats, Eyrios does have a slight upper hand. He will cap speed and luck on average and get very close in skill. His magic on the other hand is a little low, but he's also more durable with higher HP and defense. Olwen will get very close to capping magic, skill, speed, and luck. The thing is, these problem are very very easy to solve with a few good scrolls. Of course the same can be applied to Eyrios so he wins IMO.

2. Pursuit Critical Coefficient - Olwen wins this. It's not even worth debating. Eyrios has 0, Olwen has 4. Olwen will critical more than Eyrios.

3. Skills - Eyrios has Prayer and Sun Sword (Sol)! Olwen doesn't have jack. Using scrolls shouldn't be a factor in this IMO since whatever scrolls you can give Olwen, you can give to Eyrios.

4. Weapons - Eyrios has good weapons rank, but I think Olwen wins because she gets 2 very powerful personal weapons. As I recall, it's possible to steal Olwen's Daim Thunder the first time you fight her if you get lucky with Lifis' build. I don't know, it's been a while since I played. If my memory is right, you end up with 2 Daim Thunders for 120 hits. The Holy Sword has THE highest power of all the swords in the game, and +10 to magic. Eyrios does have higher strength allowing him to do well in both magic and physical attacks though. Holy Sword is strong, but Olwen needs some serious scroll abuse to make her strength up to par, but again, +10 magic whether you attack with it or not. She could magic tank. Plus, the freakin' sword allows you to attack twice, effective against horse (though pointless at that point in the game) and give her Prayer. I think Olwen wins.

5. Usage - You get Olwen for more chapters, but her low HP makes it hard to send her out for too many. I can use S drinks, but I don't want to baby just her with them. Eyrios is in less chapters, but he seems more durable. Hard to say who wins.

So I like your thoughts. Please add more points you feel like I missed out on something. I feel like both characters are actually more evenly matched. I hate choosing between the two of them.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Illiterate Scholar

[Ansem]

I think you're right when you're say they are evenly matched, that's the way I've seen them in terms of choosing between them, and I've gone PTs using different ones. I usually prefer Eyrios because he can kill most physical units with magic and unlike Olwen, he can take out dark mages as well since he has a good sword rank and the Str to wield swords better. In addition, i think prayer/wrath can be devastating if you give him the scroll(idk if they can activate together).

[Baldrick]

3. Olwen and Eyrios want different scrolls to cover their different weaknesses, though. With a prf 1-2 brave weapon Olwen can put Ambush to good use, and Eyrios would like Wrath to buff his offence and make the most of his bulk.

Both units are mage knights and good combat units that join fairly late, so you can judge them by how they slot into your existing team. You will probably have a lot of powerhouses and not many tanky units, and Ambush Olwen can have hit problems so Wrath Eyrios is probably better, but the Wrath Scroll is more in demand compared to the Ambush Scroll.

[Illiterate Scholar]

I don't think Olwen joins that late. You're about 1/4th the way through the game when she joins. Eyrios a little over half way through.

I think Olwen just might be a little more fun to play with due to all her toys. Holy Sword is almost broken. Then again, Eyrios can use swords better because of higher build.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Illiterate Scholar

[General Banzai]

I pick Olwen, because I always go B route for Miranda.

[Katie]

I like Olwen as a character better, so I like to pick her.

[Lady Sansa]

I would never kill off a unit for any reason. That's just retarded.

[Ansem]

I like Olwen as a character better, so I like to pick her.

i find her annoying with the whole "fred save me"

I would never kill off a unit for any reason. That's just retarded.

i kill her and fred off bc i dont like them. thundersword can go to eyrios =D

yeah im missing out on miranda, but i get misha and eyrios instead

[Illiterate Scholar]

I would never kill off a unit for any reason. That's just retarded.

You don't need to kill her. As I recall, you can just not recruit her in her Gaiden chapter and you still get Eyrios.

[Mekkah]

Eyrios is the stronger of the two. His weapon ranks and stats are so good that he doesn't need crits or something like Dime Thunder to get ORKOs. Olwen, meanwhile, is super fragile. Using Dime Thunder isn't really any better than just doubling with a normal weapon, since it weighs her down to like 0, but it's inaccurate. Normally brave weapons have the nice added bonus of avoiding counters, but with 1-2 range you can already do that anyway, so it's whatever.

Eyrios >

[Gradivus.]

Olwen is good, she just has to be used right. With no buffs whatsoever, Dimethunder is too risky to function, but a Pure Water or M up can allow for OHKOes against most mooks, and a Leaf or Fred support ramps the accuracy up to 99 hit, often only needing 1 hit to kill generics. With vantage, that's a solid option for EP, and the wind crit build works well for taking out single enemies.

Eyrios is probably a better low-investment unit, but I haven't actually used him so I can just guess

Edited May 7, 2016 by Gradivus.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Eyrios statistical specs is so broken his story or "i hate how mediocre i am" borders on pure bullshitery. Third tankiest unit in the game iirc(or is it the tankiest? If i remember correctly his only competition for this title is Dagda), enough speed to double majority of the game, Sol with 1-2 range, Miracle, insane growth, gives you Sol without needing to spend sleep/steal the scroll.

Edited May 8, 2016 by JSND

[General Banzai]

Eyrios statistical specs is so broken his story or "i hate how mediocre i am" borders on pure bullshitery. Third tankiest unit in the game iirc(or is it the tankiest? If i remember correctly his only competition for this title is Dagda), enough speed to double majority of the game, Sol with 1-2 range, Miracle, insane growth, gives you Sol without needing to spend sleep/steal the scroll.

Eyrios's story is that he's from common birth but wants to be a noble

[MisterIceTeaPeach]

Olwen has crappy base stats for her tier and level, but she has dimethunder, an awesome brave tome.

You can make her a beast, if you give her ambush and some scrolls which increase her HP, magic, skill and defense.

With ambush and dimethunder she should be able to ORKO almost everyone without getting any counterattacks.

She'll become a very useful sworduser, when she gets the holy sword.

Eyrios is better in the beginning because of his bases, but Olwen is better later on because of dimethunder.

[Renall]

Eyrios statistical specs is so broken his story or "i hate how mediocre i am" borders on pure bullshitery. Third tankiest unit in the game iirc(or is it the tankiest? If i remember correctly his only competition for this title is Dagda), enough speed to double majority of the game, Sol with 1-2 range, Miracle, insane growth, gives you Sol without needing to spend sleep/steal the scroll.

The only characters with higher base HP than Eyrios (40) are Dagda (43) and Galzus (54). Conomore, Dean, and Xavier are slightly bulkier at base when factoring in Defense but everyone other than Galzus has worse Magic. None of them have Sol either.

[Kriemhild]

I like Olwen better, but I know I'm biased on that because she's the imouto of my favorite Jugdral character. I can explain why I think Olwen is better than Eyrios, but I can't claim that my analysis is bias-free.

Eyrios has better stats than Olwen, yes, but in my experience, stats don't mean much in FE5 because scrolls can be abused to easily hit the low 20 caps. Especially if you're playing on Normal Mode (i.e. not Elite Mode). With a bit of scroll abuse, I had Olwen with excellent stats. But while stat disadvantages can be overcome with scrolls, other important factors like PCC and personal weapons cannot be changed, which is where Olwen beats Eyrios (4 PCC, DaimThunder, HolySword). Eyrios does have Prayer and Sol which, coupled with his higher HP/Def, make him much more durable than Olwen. Olwen murders stuff and tanks magic attacks better, while Eyrios tanks physical attacks better and has better survivability in general.

I disagree with your point about skill books not being factored in, because Olwen and Eyrios don't utilize the same skills to the same level of effectiveness. Eyrios likes Wrath because it lets him actually crit on EP, because 0 PCC is annoying. But Olwen with Ambush is just amazing. Her durability issues will vanish once she murders everything that dares to approach her in EP. You can stick her alone in a swarm of enemies, and she'll murder them all without eating a single hit. Also, I personally feel that there is a lot less competition for the Ambush Book than there is for the Wrath Book. DaimThunder makes a really strong case for Olwen to get the Ambush.

And from my own biased experience, I personally scroll-abused Olwen to get very good stats, gave her Ambush, and she turned into an absolute monster that wrecked everything. She even trivialized the lategame. Ch 22 being annoying? Warp Olwen, have her talk to Onii-chan, and watch her KO those Paladins on EP with just Ambush + Holy Sword while the GelpRitter can't scratch her boosted Res. Having trouble with Ch 24x? Olwen with Holy Sword is pretty much immune to status staves, even though the centered Dark Mages have boosted Mag too. If you still have a Warp for 24x, you can send Olwen to the center and demolish all the status staff users so that everyone else has an easier time. Sure, I understand that it's very possible to make other units super OP in FE5, but Olwen requires relatively little investment to get there due to having a solid advantage from just her personal weapons (and 4 PCC). Just give her an Ambush book and maybe abuse scrolls a little bit, and you have a terrifying unit. I'm pretty sure Eyrios can't get that OP that easily.

Eyrios is still great, but not as good as Olwen. In my opinion, at least, which I already know I'm heavily biased on.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Rainbow

[Original Alear]

Olwen is truly a total babe. Eyrios is a babe but not totally so.

Edited May 13, 2016 by Togami Byakuga

[Illiterate Scholar]

I disagree with your point about skill books not being factored in, because Olwen and Eyrios don't utilize the same skills to the same level of effectiveness. Eyrios likes Wrath because it lets him actually crit on EP, because 0 PCC is annoying. But Olwen with Ambush is just amazing. Her durability issues will vanish once she murders everything that dares to approach her in EP. You can stick her alone in a swarm of enemies, and she'll murder them all without eating a single hit. Also, I personally feel that there is a lot less competition for the Ambush Book than there is for the Wrath Book. DaimThunder makes a really strong case for Olwen to get the Ambush.

But what's to stop me from giving Eyrios the same Ambush skill and doing the exact same thing while having Prayer and Sol for added effect?

[Baldrick]

But what's to stop me from giving Eyrios the same Ambush skill and doing the exact same thing while having Prayer and Sol for added effect?

Ambush is pointless unless you OHKO. Eyrios has 0 PCC and the only Brave Weapons he can use are 1-range swords. Other units use that combo better since his strength isn't great and he's at a high level.

Even if you do get to the point, Prayer and Sol don't add much because you won't be taking enough damage for it to matter. In short, there's nothing stopping you, but it's inefficient, not very effective and a waste of his unique utility.

Edited May 13, 2016 by Tricky Drick

[MisterIceTeaPeach]

If you still have a Warp for 24x, you can send Olwen to the center and demolish all the status staff users so that everyone else has an easier time.

Literally the easiest and cheapest way how to beat this chapter.

Edited May 13, 2016 by Ayama Wirdo

[Kriemhild]

But what's to stop me from giving Eyrios the same Ambush skill and doing the exact same thing while having Prayer and Sol for added effect?

Simple. The fact that Eyrios can't use DaimThunder.

The point of Ambush is to cancel the enemy's attack and murder them first. If the enemy gets the chance to counterattack anyway, then it generally indicates the Ambush skill had no positive effect for that round. Unless Eyrios activates Continue, this means he only gets a single hit to kill the enemy before Ambush becomes useless, i.e. he needs to OHKO, which rarely happens unless he crits. He could equip a sword with Auto-Continue, allowing Ambush to protect him while he 2HKOs enemies but a) this leaves him vulnerable to 2-range attacks that he can't counter, and b) there are a few durable high HP+Def enemies that can survive two non-crit sword hits.

Olwen doesn't have these issues because she has DaimThunder, which a) counters both 1-range and 2-range attacks, and b) hits Res, and there are much fewer enemies with high HP+Res (compared to HP+Def) that can shrug off DaimThunder x 2. Ambush!Olwen generally murders everything that approaches her while they all fail to actually attack her. Ambush!Eyrios can't do the same, and in fact, the Ambush skill would be wasted on him.

Note that DaimThunder is the only 1-2 range weapon with Auto-Continue, which is why I argue that Olwen is definitely the best candidate for the Ambush book. Nobody else, Eyrios or otherwise, can boast a 1-2 range Auto-Continue attack to fully exploit Ambush like Olwen can.

EDIT: Okay, there's also the Master Axe with 1-2 range and Auto-Continue, but that's a much worse weapon and I doubt any of the Ambush competitors are abusing Master Axe.

Also, the fact that you're considering Prayer and Sol to be relevant already implies that enemies get the chance to attack Eyrios and inflict damage on him, which already means that Ambush was not helping. Olwen with Ambush and DaimThunder won't even get hit at all, so her survivability would be perfect, thus surpassing Eyrios with his Prayer and Sol (and useless Ambush).

Edited May 13, 2016 by Rainbow

[The Draco Knight]

My problem with Olwen is that her utility is based on the dime Thunder: Personal weapon are supposed to be simply better than normal weapons, not something the character must rely for the entire game because without it they are worthless. And you can say that a good player will be careful and even get the dime Thunder of Rinehardt,but considering that you'll probably want her to fight a lot and this can break the dime thunder(s) rather quickly.

Also, another her problem is that she is basically a promoted est(start very weak but later become a powerful unit), but the fact that she is promoted gives her little Experience when killing un-promoted enemies(which are present for most of the game, considering the first normal promoted enemy appear in chapter 16, If I remember correctly), so for a good part of the game she just steal exp from units who need it more.

Eyrios, while he suffers from 0 PCC and others things, can be useful with just a normal and good weapon and Sol and prayer to survive pretty well

But I'm just an Eyrios fanboy, so I could have said some meh things, so....yeah

[Kriemhild]

My problem with Olwen is that her utility is based on the dime Thunder: Personal weapon are supposed to be simply better than normal weapons, not something the character must rely for the entire game because without it they are worthless. And you can say that a good player will be careful and even get the dime Thunder of Rinehardt,but considering that you'll probably want her to fight a lot and this can break the dime thunder(s) rather quickly.

Also, another her problem is that she is basically a promoted est(start very weak but later become a powerful unit), but the fact that she is promoted gives her little Experience when killing un-promoted enemies(which are present for most of the game, considering the first normal promoted enemy appear in chapter 16, If I remember correctly), so for a good part of the game she just steal exp from units who need it more.

Eyrios, while he suffers from 0 PCC and others things, can be useful with just a normal and good weapon and Sol and prayer to survive pretty well

But I'm just an Eyrios fanboy, so I could have said some meh things, so....yeah

- She's not useless without DimeThunder. She still has a PCC of 4 and has decent Speed to double stuff and murder them on Player Phase. Her Enemy Phase survivability is a bit eh, but she has DimeThunder for the really brutal swarms.

- She joins at 11x and DimeThunder has 60 uses. That's actually plenty of uses. Note that due to the Fatigue system, you can't just deploy Olwen every single chapter but she's very powerful when she's there. She has 60 uses to burn through until she gets a restock in Ch 22, and that one should never break. I didn't steal the Ch 10 DimeThunder but I abused Olwen a lot and she never ran out of DimeThunder. I even overused her in all of Ch 24, 24x, and Endgame and she still had her Onii-chan's DimeThunder and Holy Sword.

- I don't understand how she is an Est. She does not start off weak. It's not her growths that make her powerful, but her personal DimeThunder which she has at the start. And her starting stats are decent for taking on the enemies around her jointime.

- Yes, she is promoted, which means abusing her a lot at the start would suck EXP from units that need it more. This is NOT a negative point for Olwen. She is promoted, which means you shouldn't abuse her too much at the start since other babies will want the EXP. Which helps with the DimeThunder preservation, fyi. But she's there when you need her and can pull off amazing achievements (like endure brutal swarms without a scratch with Ambush+DimeThunder). A little later you'll be able to afford utilizing her more consistently and she'll be a very powerful unit.

- The "good part of the game where she steals EXP from others" (which shouldn't be happening unless you play terribly) is also the part of the game where Eyrios doesn't even exist. She can contribute a lot during that time, unlike Eyrios.

Edited May 13, 2016 by Rainbow