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so who could actually take on the black knight?


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i was talking to a friend about this and he made me wonder how many characters in fire emblem could actually stand toe to toe with the black knight, in either FE9 or FE10.

assuming that the black knight doesn't get his skills if he faces someone from a game without skills to make it bit more fair.

...also not sure if this belongs in this section of the board

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Effective weapons like heavy spear, amorslayer and hammer aren't that good in FE9.

No physical unit can double BK, only Naesala can. I think Giffca does the most regular damage with 20.

In FE10 in 3-7 Boyd with hammer could do serious damage to him. I think Caineghis could kill him with 3 hits.

Edited by The Taninator
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Effective weapons like heavy spear, amorslayer and hammer aren't that good in FE9.

No physical unit can double BK, only Naesala can. I think Giffca does the most regular damage with 20.

In FE10 in 3-7 Boyd with hammer could do serious damage to him. I think Caineghis could kill him with 3 hits.

that is true, though they'd still risk eating a one hit kill from his skill

EDIT: not to mention boyd's at a weapon triangle disadvantage

Edited by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai
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that is true, though they'd still risk eating a one hit kill from his skill

Without third tier units it's impossible.

Rolf and Shinon with silencer (they can double him), Soren, Ilyana and finishing him with hammer. And don't forget Reyson in 3-7.

Edited by The Taninator
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Without third tier units it's impossible.

Rolf and Shinon with silencer (they can double him), Soren, Ilyana and finishing him with hammer. And don't forget Reyson in 3-7.

well i was talking about a one on one fight with the Black Knight, like what ike did

Sephiran if he was playable Greil if he used a sword

these i think i could see happening

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And don't forget Reyson in 3-7.

How?

Also, on Greil...idk. We can say it was the weapon triangle disadvantage that got him, but I've had lots of times where I was able to have say, an axe user go up against a sword user and win. I'm more willing to bet he was just a bit rusty. He hadn't been in actual combat at all in the short time he was alive in PoR. Sparring with Ike doesn't count. It was a combination of him not having to kill or be killed for a long time and underestimating BK.

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How?

Also, on Greil...idk. We can say it was the weapon triangle disadvantage that got him, but I've had lots of times where I was able to have say, an axe user go up against a sword user and win. I'm more willing to bet he was just a bit rusty. He hadn't been in actual combat at all in the short time he was alive in PoR. Sparring with Ike doesn't count. It was a combination of him not having to kill or be killed for a long time and underestimating BK.

That's not true. Let me see if I can count the ways without referring to the script...

-In the chapter where you're defending the mercenary fort against Daien, Greil takes the rear exit alone. I don't think he would have stayed there if there wasn't fighting to be done.

-Greil, Shinon and Gatrie create a diversion during the chapter where Ike and the rest cross the river and fight the halberdier boss (first promo'd boss in the game I think). They almost certainly fought Daien forces at this time.

-After the river crossing chapter, Ike and co. end up at a fort and get ambushed by Daien troops lying in wait. A turn or two (actually it may be based on progression through the map, I don't know) after this, Greil shows up with Gatrie and Shinon and kills a unit (I think a knight).

-After this, Greil has a duel with Petrine. He doesn't kill her, but it's implied that he has the upper hand while they are fighting. So he's probably in pretty good shape at this point if he can beat out Petrine, who is pretty strong.

-Also, a more tenuous one...during the chapter where you fight pirates with Ike, Shinon, Titania and Gatrie, Greil has Oscar and Boyd (and maybe Rhys too?) off with him on another mission. It's not clear if they were in combat at this time, though.

Anyway, the primary reason for Greil losing stated in game is that he had cut tendons in his strong hand to enable Volke to kill him more easily if he lost control due to the medallion. This is why he doesn't use Ragnell. I would assume that cut tendons make it harder to use an axe as well...

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Rolf with maxed speed, double bow and a triangle attack would be enough to beat him in one turn.

He can get a maximum attack power of 63 (36 strength + 22 might of double bow + 3 strength boost double bow + 2 strength boost due to support, red dragons excluded).

BK has 70 HP and a defense of 40.

So my damage calculation: 3*(63-40)+(63-40)= 92. 92>70

I think Micaiah with boosts of Nasir could beat him in one turn too.

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Rolf with maxed speed, double bow and a triangle attack would be enough to beat him in one turn.

He can get a maximum attack power of 63 (36 strength + 22 might of double bow + 3 strength boost double bow + 2 strength boost due to support, red dragons excluded).

BK has 70 HP and a defense of 40.

So my damage calculation: 3*(63-40)+(63-40)= 92. 92>70

I think Micaiah with boosts of Nasir could beat him in one turn too.

that's pretty cool actually, thank you for doing all that

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That's not true. Let me see if I can count the ways without referring to the script...

-In the chapter where you're defending the mercenary fort against Daien, Greil takes the rear exit alone. I don't think he would have stayed there if there wasn't fighting to be done.

-Greil, Shinon and Gatrie create a diversion during the chapter where Ike and the rest cross the river and fight the halberdier boss (first promo'd boss in the game I think). They almost certainly fought Daien forces at this time.

-After the river crossing chapter, Ike and co. end up at a fort and get ambushed by Daien troops lying in wait. A turn or two (actually it may be based on progression through the map, I don't know) after this, Greil shows up with Gatrie and Shinon and kills a unit (I think a knight).

-After this, Greil has a duel with Petrine. He doesn't kill her, but it's implied that he has the upper hand while they are fighting. So he's probably in pretty good shape at this point if he can beat out Petrine, who is pretty strong.

-Also, a more tenuous one...during the chapter where you fight pirates with Ike, Shinon, Titania and Gatrie, Greil has Oscar and Boyd (and maybe Rhys too?) off with him on another mission. It's not clear if they were in combat at this time, though.

Anyway, the primary reason for Greil losing stated in game is that he had cut tendons in his strong hand to enable Volke to kill him more easily if he lost control due to the medallion. This is why he doesn't use Ragnell. I would assume that cut tendons make it harder to use an axe as well...

Well that's what I get for not playing PoR in eons. I remembered he weakened his sword/axe hand though...still, the part about him underestimating the BK still stands.

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Well that's what I get for not playing PoR in eons. I remembered he weakened his sword/axe hand though...still, the part about him underestimating the BK still stands.

Well, why do you think Greil underestimated the Black Knight? He couldn't have used his sword even if he wanted. And the fact that he went out to face him alone implies that he had a pretty good idea about how powerful the Black Knight was. After all, Greil was way above everyone in his group. I mean, he was able to wipe the floor with an endgame boss without breaking a sweat. If he couldn't beat the Black Knight, then nobody else could either. But if he could beat the Black Knight, then help wasn't needed anyway.

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There isn't much to the movie script, but it still kinda shows confidence on Greil's side:

not to mention the next words after those are "come on boy, just try me!"

it was either false courage or he was legibly cocky

Yep and yep.

I don't think he's the kind of guy who would run out and get himself killed on purpose. If he was suicidal at any point...it would be when he got ahold of the medallion and as a result, killed his wife. That would make anybody question whether or not they deserve to remain alive. I have a feeling if Ike and Mist weren't around, he probably would've hung himself or something. His death scene was hands down one of the saddest dang things I've ever seen. But he seemed at peace before he went, like he knew he would be with Elena again and that she had very much likely forgiven him.

Did he know about the blessed armor though? Maybe there's another reason he didn't use Ragnell...

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