How would the shapeshifters technologically advance?

[Dragoncat]

Purely hypothetical topic here. There will most likely never be things like guns and cars in FE...but imagine for a second say, Tellius had 21st century technology. The beorc no longer use swords/axes/lances/etc, guns are the main weapon. How would the laguz respond to that? If somebody's shooting at you with a rifle, turning into a saber toothed tiger wouldn't work as self defense. Even though there is bows in the medieval setting, guns are faster and more accurate...

Do you think they'd put cyborg attachments on their animal forms? Bullet proof vests? Or do you think they'd stop shifting all together and use guns like the beorc?

[VincentASM]

That's an interesting idea.

However the sad truth is the shape-shifters would probably be extinct by this time, as a result of human persecution.

Awakening pretty much showed the future of the Laguz and it's just one bunny warrior... and the Manakete, but those guys aren't in good shape either.

[Anacybele]

Except that's the Taguel, not the laguz. The laguz are from a different world entirely and Ike and Elincia both started better relationships between the two races. Micaiah also helped since she had laguz fighting alongside her to save the laguz-hating Daein. I can see her lessening that country's prejudice against them because she becomes their queen. With these events, I don't see how the laguz would eventually go extinct at all.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Anacybele

[Dragoncat]

Keep in mind guys, that the topic title says shapeshifters, meaning manaketes/taguel/etc, not just laguz.

I would run a Deviant Art contest about this, but my contests never go far...that being said, I'm sure we can come up with some interesting ideas for modern non beorc weapons. Bird/dragon laguz and manaketes could probably drop bombs from above, but idk about the beast types or anything else.

[VincentASM]

Except that's the Taguel, not the laguz. The laguz are from a different world entirely and Ike and Elincia both started better relationships between the two races. Micaiah also helped since she had laguz fighting alongside her to save the laguz-hating Daein. I can see her lessening that country's prejudice against them because she becomes their queen. With these events, I don't see how the laguz would eventually go extinct at all.

Spoiler: the Taguel (and likely the Manakete) are the Laguz.

Story-wise, you have characters talk about lion and hawk (falcon) Taguel (those are just the ones I remember). A bit too coincidental perhaps?

Also in the ROM, Taguel are called Laguz XD

As for the events of FE9/10, don't forget there's the war a thousand years afterwards. Besides, relationships don't always remain the same and peace is never eternal. Otherwise we'd never have all these wars in Fire Emblem.

[Dragoncat]

As for the events of FE9/10, don't forget there's the war a thousand years afterwards. Besides, relationships don't always remain the same and peace is never eternal. Otherwise we'd never have all these wars in Fire Emblem.

True, but what war a thousand years after? Is that something at the end of RD I didn't know about?

[Elwind]

True, but what war a thousand years after? Is that something at the end of RD I didn't know about?

It's said in the best ending, I think. The one where Ashunera speaks with Lehran during the epilogue.

[Anacybele]

Spoiler: the Taguel (and likely the Manakete) are the Laguz.

Story-wise, you have characters talk about lion and hawk (falcon) Taguel (those are just the ones I remember). A bit too coincidental perhaps?

Also in the ROM, Taguel are called Laguz XD

As for the events of FE9/10, don't forget there's the war a thousand years afterwards. Besides, relationships don't always remain the same and peace is never eternal. Otherwise we'd never have all these wars in Fire Emblem.

1. Then how do you explain the Taguel and Manaketes needing stones to transform and the laguz being able to transform without them?

2. That could be referring to Awakening at this point. It takes place 1000 years after the other games. I don't think Lehran or Ashunera actually say WHERE this war occurs.

3. And even if the war IS in Tellius, who says it's between the beorc and laguz or have anything to do with how they view one another?

Edited October 22, 2014 by Anacybele

[Sunwoo]

1. Then how do you explain the Taguel and Manaketes needing stones to transform and the laguz being able to transform without them?

Evolution is a thing.

2. That could be referring to Awakening at this point. It takes place 1000 years after the other games. I don't think Lehran or Ashunera actually say WHERE this war occurs.

Awakening takes place about 2000 years after Marth's games. For the conflict at the end of Radiant Dawn to be related to Awakening, you're suggesting that whoever was involved in this battle is the first exalt and that Marth's game takes place chronologically before or around the same time as Ike's. Which I highly doubt is true, as Ike's games are the only one with an actual creation story.

3. And even if the war IS in Tellius, who says it's between the beorc and laguz or have anything to do with how they view one another?

There's no way to prove this, but who says it isn't either?

Edited October 22, 2014 by Sunwoo

[Magical Glace]

1. Then how do you explain the Taguel and Manaketes needing stones to transform and the laguz being able to transform without them?

2. That could be referring to Awakening at this point. It takes place 1000 years after the other games. I don't think Lehran or Ashunera actually say WHERE this war occurs.

3. And even if the war IS in Tellius, who says it's between the beorc and laguz or have anything to do with how they view one another?

1.Evolution. Perhaps the Laguz steadily degenerated into madness (FE1/3 Manakete backstory) and sealed away their power.

2. Awakening takes place at least 2000 years after FE3 according to Tiki, which is definitely after the Tellius games

3. ...Why wouldn't it be? That's essentially why they've been warring in the entire Tellius saga and it's mythos, and I doubt it would stop soon. Unless we have a second Ashnard somewhere

Edit: Dammit Boron

Edited October 22, 2014 by Glaceon Princess

[VincentASM]

1. Then how do you explain the Taguel and Manaketes needing stones to transform and the laguz being able to transform without them?

2. That could be referring to Awakening at this point. It takes place 1000 years after the other games. I don't think Lehran or Ashunera actually say WHERE this war occurs.

3. And even if the war IS in Tellius, who says it's between the beorc and laguz or have anything to do with how they view one another?

1. The Dragon Laguz are almost exactly the same as the Manakete in their prime. One day, something big happened and the Manakete couldn't stay in dragon form without using Dragonstones. Who's to say a similar thing didn't happen to the other Laguz?

Plus "Beaststone"... that's hinting something as well. Dragonstone, Dragon Laguz. Beaststone, Beast Laguz. Just missing a Birdstone really.

2. That might be possible. Others mentioned how Awakening takes place 2000 years after FE3 and FE9/10 almost definitely don't take place between FE3 and Awakening, but hey there's always dimension/time-warping. Ike did it just fine.

3. The way they played the saga, another massive Beorc-Laguz war seems most likely. FE10 ended with the return of the great goddess and how she finally has the power to overcome everything.

What's the one thing she never overcame before? The Beorc and Laguz warring between themselves, which led to her splitting in two and causing the entire events of FE9/10.

Although if Awakening is any indication of the future, it seems like her return didn't help much sadly...

[Cancer Lancer]

Idk, I feel FE9/FE10 happened after FE3.

I mean, they managed to get crossbows! That's more technology than FE3 ever had lol.

[Magical Glace]

Idk, I feel FE9/FE10 happened after FE3.

I mean, they managed to get crossbows! That's more technology than FE3 ever had lol.

Awakening essentially paints Tellius as the first chronologically.

[Cancer Lancer]

CROSSBOWS THOUGH

[Magical Glace]

CROSSBOWS THOUGH

MAKE LITTLE DIFFERENCE WHEN TELLIUS LITERALLY BELIEVES THEY ARE THE ONLY CONTINENT.

IKE PROBABLY DIDN'T TAKE THEM WITH HIM, IT ISN'T LIKE HE COULD USE THEM.

[Ϲharlie]

The original Fire Emblem had a crossbow and a cannon available as weapons. Your argument is null.

[Cancer Lancer]

The original Fire Emblem had a crossbow and a cannon available as weapons. Your argument is null.

Noway, I thought the original FE was nulled because of SD.

I DON'T SEE NO CROSSBOW OR CANNON IN SD, HUEHUE.

[S_Cero]

Well from the assumption that Marth's games take place in a different continent or world, their technological advancements should be different so it can be plausible for tellius to be more advanced earlier.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Cero

[VincentASM]

Yeah, technological advances don't cross between continents in Fire Emblem much.

Kaga made a point that FE4 takes place before FE3 yet FE4 is more technologically advanced than FE3.

[Anacybele]

Sorry, but I don't see how going from not needing stones to needing stones or going from sane to insane is evolution. Both sound more like de-volving to me.

But my mistake on the timeframe between Awakening and the rest of the series. >_< I guess I remembered wrong.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Anacybele

[dondon151]

1. anacybele doesn't understand the biological concept of evolution

2. arguing against vincentASM about evidence that can be extracted from the game is bound to result in defeat

[Magical Glace]

Sorry, but I don't see how going from not needing stones to needing stones or going from sane to insane is evolution. Both sound more like de-volving to me.

But my mistake on the timeframe between Awakening and the rest of the series. >_< I guess I remembered wrong.

That happens too.

It still qualifies as a change in species over time.

[Anacybele]

1. anacybele doesn't understand the biological concept of evolution

2. arguing against vincentASM about evidence that can be extracted from the game is bound to result in defeat

1. I know exactly what evolution is, thank you very much.

2. Just because the Taguel were labled as laguz in the game's ROM doesn't mean they are laguz. It could easily mean that they were going to be laguz at first, but became their own race later.

[Naughx]

Except that's the Taguel, not the laguz. The laguz are from a different world entirely and Ike and Elincia both started better relationships between the two races. Micaiah also helped since she had laguz fighting alongside her to save the laguz-hating Daein. I can see her lessening that country's prejudice against them because she becomes their queen. With these events, I don't see how the laguz would eventually go extinct at all.

People would end being branded by intermixture.

People of mixed heritage are usually refered to as a "branded" Beorc. (If you look at Micaiah's or Soren's stats pages in Radiant Dawn; it says "Beorc")

-

EDIT - 20:32

2. Just because the Taguel were labled as laguz in the game's ROM doesn't mean they are laguz. It could easily mean that they were going to be laguz at first, but became their own race later.

You're right about that, since Lucina is refered to as "Marth" in the game data.

Edited October 23, 2014 by Naughx

[Sunwoo]

Sorry, but I don't see how going from not needing stones to needing stones or going from sane to insane is evolution. Both sound more like de-volving to me.

Evolution is basically a species adapting to survive in its environment. Needing stones to keep from going insane may seem like a "devolution" to you, but Radiant Dawn hinted in 3-E that laguz, when exposed to high levels of chaotic energy, can start to lose themselves.

Imagine a battle that was longer, fiercer, and more destructive than the war in Radiant Dawn ever was. If the laguz were starting to be driven mad from chaotic energies, wouldn't you consider it an "improvement" if laguz could seal their energy into stones to keep from going insane? Versus those who didn't seal their powers away and went mad as a result? It's adaptation, at the very least.

Also, thanks scorri and wikipedia, but I found this excerpt from the wiki article on devolution:

The term "devolution" and its associated concepts never were prominent in biology and now are at most of historical interest, except where they have been adopted by creationists.

Edited October 23, 2014 by Sunwoo