My Headcanon concerning the FE7 and FE13 Avatars

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

So my headcanon concerning the avatars of FE is this

Fire Emblem 7: The Avatar is the same as in Awakening

New Mystery: is a unique individual not appearing in any other game

Awakening: Is the exact same person who appeared a few thousand years earlier in FE7... I'll explain my theory as to how this is possible below

Fire Emblem 14/if: Uncertain, looks 99% probable to be a new character

My headcanon is that when Avatar's mother spirited her child away from Validar, she fled into the outrealm gate. The pair was sent through time and space, ending up on the continent of Elibe some time before FE7. This is why Validar never found the Avatar. The Avatar studied strategy, magic, and swordplay, becoming a master strategist and fighter. Eventually, Lyn finds the Avatar lying face down in a field, and the two journey together and Lyn returns to her grandfather. Some may not know this, but if you skip Lyn's story the player's character will not be present. Instead their lines will be replaced with comments from Marcus and other characters. You'll lose access to the Avatar Affinity bonus and the Afa Drops, though, so there's no practical reason to do so. It's my headcanon the avatar canonically accompanies Eliwood on his quest. Even if he doesn't appear in Eliwood or Hector mode, Lyn mode is 100% canon and the "adventures" the Lyn einherjar refers to specifically,although again, I reason the avatar canonically accompanies Eliwood.

After the Avatar departs from Eliwood and naming his/her godchild Roy, he/she returns to his own time period in the world of Yllise and eventually becomes Grima's host, although by will or not I'm uncertain. It's possible the premonition at the beginning of awakening was in fact a memory in the Avatar's subconsious, and he/she never became Grima by will.

And then the events of the bad future happen, the Avatar is split into two, Chrom finds the good avatar in a field, and Awakening happens.

Are there any fallacies in the order of events...?

Let me know what you think of this headcanon.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Hero of the Fire Emblems

[MCProductions]

It's a good theroy, but I prefer that all the avatars so far are related by blood.

We already have the proof of a connection between Mark and Robin; however, Katarina in RAR DLC mistakes Robin for FE12's avatar, and Marth in his recruitment convo in COY DLC claims Robin reminds him of Kris.

That, and in FE12, in Marth and Kris' supports they claim their children will be friends too.

Huh, Chrom is Marth's decendant and if Robin is Kris'; the support becomes a reality.

So my headcanon is after FE7, Mark hits the Dragon's Gate, has a kid in Archenea which leads to Kris, who has a kid which leads to Robin.

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

Did Katarina RAR and Marth COY say they merely REMINDED them of Kris? That happens all the time in Zelda because each Link is a different person in the same green clothes excluding sequels and prequels. Lyn, however, was belligerent and insistent that she KNEW it was FE7 avatar. If Marth and Katarina say they have a passing resemblance, I think they might internally acknloedge they aren't the same.

Besides, FE7 avatar has a black hooded robe and no backstory. That's not familiar at all lol. At the very least, the two have a similar appearance down.

Not to say yours isn't a good theory either. It sounds good and I think it's nice to tie them all together. Heck, it would still work for the FE12 avatar even if 7 and 13 were the same thanks to time travel.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Hero of the Fire Emblems

[shadowofchaos]

Lyn, however, was belligerent and insistent that she KNEW it was FE7 avatar.

Not so fast.

Localized script only. Wording in Japanese implies that it is just like the other two instances of being "reminded" above.

Just like how Eirika is more blatantly a naive girl in English, changes were made.

Edited May 2, 2015 by shadowofchaos

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

Well then =P It's still my headcanon at least for the English versions, maybe not the Japanese versions.

Out of curiosity, what does the Japanese text translate to?

Edited May 2, 2015 by Hero of the Fire Emblems

[shadowofchaos]

Same type of translation as the English, more or less, but while she's in your face in the English about it, her tone in Japanese is more hopeful than "I AM SO SURE IT'S YOU!"

A difference of headcanon simply because of language is... silly.

Sorry to be a party pooper, but I think you just want to fit things to the way you see them to present this "idea".

Lyn's "recognition" is just simply pure fanservice, and more likely she's breaking the 4th wall to talk to the player more than anything.

Edited May 2, 2015 by shadowofchaos

[Book of Ereshkigal]

Lyn's "recognition" is just simply pure fanservice, and more likely she's breaking the 4th wall to talk to the player more than anything.

Bingo, it's like the other DLC characters asking if you heard about them, being a roundabout way of asking if you played their game.

[Misses Elise-chan!]

I say Mark is Morgan.

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

A difference of headcanon simply because of language is... silly.

Well, you yourself said Erika is more of a ditz in the English version, and stats, dialogue, and even major mechanics are changed moving to the english version. Off the top of my head, I know Tellius added Level based promotion in the English versions AND a set of Regalia that were not in the Japanese version in Radiant Dawn, so they're part of the English canon but not the Japanese one.

A difference in headcanon due to language is plausable, but MU7 and MU13 have far more similarities than they do to 12 or 14, including general backstory and even appearance from what we've seen.

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

I say Mark is Morgan.

I also hate to shoot a hole in this theory, but the FE7 avatar is mentioned to be the same gender as the FE13 one. In addition, I think Lyn would be a straight up idiot if she can't tell whether or not MU is a boy or girl when she could CLEARLY do this in 7 (Or at least Sain and Florina can) and everyone else in Awakening can. Morgan is always the opposite gender of MU.

[shadowofchaos]

You're ignoring language changes again.

Morgan's name in Japanese is... Mark.

Completely throwing that out without even considering it is simply ignoring what doesn't fit with your theory and accepting what does.

I know Tellius added Level based promotion in the English versions AND a set of Regalia that were not in the Japanese version in Radiant Dawn, so they're part of the English canon but not the Japanese one.

What does gameplay additions have anything to do with your theory, again?

Those Regalia were added to make the Dawn Brigade not suck as much.

It has nothing to do with the lore.

Just like how Battle Saves were added.

The same way as how the Master Crowns lost significance in Part 4, which made the dialogue in base conversations awkward.

If anything, English version addition "canon" screwed with what was already there.

...why the hell are you talking about FE10?

Pretty much a Red Herring tactic.

I also hate to shoot a hole in this theory

Yours has a lot of them too.

I think Lyn would be a straight up idiot if she can't tell whether or not MU is a boy or girl

This is also possible.

[/トローリング]

Why the hell is it important for people to have others accept their headcanon?

Does it make them feel more important?

There's really no discussion taking place here.

Edited May 12, 2015 by shadowofchaos

[Hero of the Fire Emblems]

I would've brought up Bartre dying in the English version if it actually made any sense XP

And also, it's Marc with a c and not a K from everything I've seen, presumably to make it gender neutral...? I still see the 3 out of 4 letter similarity though, but I didn't bring it up because that's still a different name, unless both of the wikis are wrong or if c is interchangable with k in japanese. Orsin from Thracia and Orson from Sacred Stones are an example of why I'm so picky about the one letter. Either way, the issue of gender still is the nail in the coffin as it were.

Unless Lyn is an idiot who thinks she's talking to a man when it's clearly a woman and other Einherjar recognize the fact it's a woman and vice versa. XD The circumstancial evidence just stacks too heavily against the argument of "Lyn is a dumba$$" though.

I brought up FE8 and 10 to show examples of where canon in other games was changed in translation, not to provide a red herring.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Hero of the Fire Emblems

[Roflolxp54]

And also, it's Marc with a c and not a K from everything I've seen, presumably to make it gender neutral...? I still see the 3 out of 4 letter similarity though, but I didn't bring it up because that's still a different name, unless both of the wikis are wrong or if c is interchangable with k in japanese. Orsin from Thracia and Orson from Sacred Stones are an example of why I'm so picky about the one letter. Either way, the issue of gender still is the nail in the coffin as it were.

Mark's name is written in katakana -- literal English transliteration/spelling is known to be ambiguous. Many English-sounding words and names are written in katakana.

BTW, Morgan's non-English European name is Linfan. What does that sound like off of the English tongue?

[MCProductions]

Mark's name is written in katakana -- literal English transliteration/spelling is known to be ambiguous. Many English-sounding words and names are written in katakana.

BTW, Morgan's non-English European name is Linfan. What does that sound like off of the English tongue?

How I never noticed that about Morgan's european name I'll never understand.

To the OP, differentiateing your headcanon just because of different langauge is silly. Admittately, the only games I use for my headcanons are those released here and those with fanslations, but if the ORIGINAL Japanese version of the game conflicts with the localized version on a plot level,(names are another question altogether) you always go with the japanese version, because that's what the writers intended for the games plot to be.

I'll keep my blood decendants theroy as my headcanon, but I acknowledge the Einherjar's antics as likely nothing more than breaking the 4th wall in a ingenious, if not ridiculos, fashion. Heck, I honestly don't care if you agree with me or not on my theroy. If you do, awesome, if you don't, also awesome.

If I come off as harsh here, that's not my intention. I'm just trying to make a point about writer intentions

[sirmola]

Headcannon is just that: HEADcannon. I actualy agree with the OP with regard to his theory, but trying too hard to convince other people to like it is just silly. (heck: my other favorite theory is the fact that nills is the past version of holsety, but i recognize the many issues with that theory that could cause other people to not belive in it, especialy at the same time as the theory in this thread.) As for interpretation of different versions, i am weary about using the Japanese versions simply because many English fans think that they know japanese a lot better than they actually do (witness the endless arguments on any fan translation topic). As such, I only trust a few people with regard to "what the Japanese version says", and have a habit of asking for translation sources. On another level, I do not always interpret a work according to authorial intent, if i see an issue or inconsistency with said intent. For example, The official zelda time line requires a slight adjustment (namely the stipulation that actions other than time travel can cause alternate time line branches), in order for the "hero is defeated" timeline branch to make internal sense.

Edited May 14, 2015 by sirmola

[Misses Elise-chan!]

I also hate to shoot a hole in this theory, but the FE7 avatar is mentioned to be the same gender as the FE13 one. In addition, I think Lyn would be a straight up idiot if she can't tell whether or not MU is a boy or girl when she could CLEARLY do this in 7 (Or at least Sain and Florina can) and everyone else in Awakening can. Morgan is always the opposite gender of MU.

Unless it's the other Morgan. Remember that Robin had twin Morgans.

[MCProductions]

Unless it's the other Morgan. Remember that Robin had twin Morgans.

Only in the Future Past DLC, which operates under different rules and a somewhat different timeline from the main game.

ie, Grima is much more powerful in Future Past, Falchion can actually kill Grima in stead of merely putting him to sleep, and all the gemstones for the fire emblem are availible for the children.

It's not to hard to think Robin only had twin Morgans in FP.