Jump to content

Why does ever Fire Emblem game have to have an archetype?


IceBrand
 Share

Recommended Posts

Why do most characters in the series follow the same basic pattern with little differences here and there? For familiarity? So that we know what to expect? If so, doesn't that take away the joy of wonder suspense? What's the fun of knowing what you're getting in too? It's like knowing what presents you're getting on Christmas Day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some people like putting things in easy-to-label containers. This extends well beyond Fire Emblem (see: tumblr. . .wait, don't). I'm not a fan of label over-use, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because FE is yet another Nintendo series that likes to use the same shit over again.

Bandits, early face of the enemy kingdom, more bandits, stopping the shit up elsewhere, get new allies, face more countries controlled by the big bad who may be using dragons of some form, fight the main army, which is controlled by some power behind it, usually a cult of some sort, then kill the big bad, get the ending and squee at the ships you made.

Why the hell are we not getting more F-Zero games where we can just throw the story away for good gameplay.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Most of the archtypes are forced. Merric Archetype? Really? It's only natural that you're going to get a mage sometime if a mage class exists and is common. The only real members of this archtype are Merric, Linde and Asvel ie young mage characters that come early with superpowerful tactical nukes (Excalibur, Aura, Grafcalibur). Gordon Archtype? This one is really weak. The only thing holding them together is that they're archers. Well no shit. Of course you're going to get an archer eventually.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For a large part I reckon it's for gameplay reasons. It cuts down a lot of work to present a certain class in a certain situation with certain character traits...And really there's not that huge a problem with it. The still manage to make the characters unique to some extent. Does it matter that Nabarl is similar to Shiva?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because it's easier to reuse formula than it is to create something completely new.

Take anime for instance. They mostly focus on a loud, good-looking male teen blowing up various variety of monsters and/or moustache twirlers in the name of friendship, with little to no deviation. Does that bother anyone? No.

By following the train of "Noble leads a romp through the continent against an evil empire for divine right" gimmick of samurai fables that Star Wars Americanized in every game, the player can follow the actions that happen around it to give humanity to the multiple elements that make it possible to immerse the player in these Excuse Plots.

Look up "Strictly Formula" on TVTropes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because it can. Deal with it.

Why the hell are we not getting more F-Zero games where we can just throw the story away for good gameplay.

That applies to 99% of Nintendo franchises lol.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why the hell are we not getting more F-Zero games where we can just throw the story away for good gameplay.

GX had a story and a bajillion pilot interviews and they were awesome... but I guess they were more like the appetizer for the main dish.

Anyway...

FE Archetypes are there mostly for gameplay reasons, I guess; maybe it's there to make the player know what sort of unit they're going to use. I don't mind them... in fact, I'm sort of fond of them, they feel like a trademark. I also really like it when they completely subvert them (personality wise) like with Sain and Kent, or heck, VIRION (not exactly a Wolt or a Gordon).

And I'm waiting for the next Christmas Cavaliers with anticipation, too!:D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

Not to mention not every Fire Emblem has a characters or charcters of a certain archetype. For example, Awakening lacks both a pegasus trio and an Est type character.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cynthia and I think Donny is the best match for the Est, despite being obtainable pretty early.

Take anime for instance. They mostly focus on a loud, good-looking male teen blowing up various variety of monsters and/or moustache twirlers in the name of friendship, with little to no deviation. Does that bother anyone? No.

Those anime are bland as all hell and are everywhere, so yeah it bothers me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The archetypes work well in game design I suppose, you usually start out with basic classes like cavaliers and archers to learn the ropes, an early healer is a big help and later add axemen and mages so that the player can get used to the weapon triangle and learning the advantages of magic. Why the characters have to be so similar in personality and appearance is beyond me, but I guess it's just tradition.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For the sake of map design, starting the player off with roughly the same type of units in every game coming in at roughly the same order makes it easier for the designers to look at past games and then change things around. Which means for the forseeable future will see Lords, paladin/great knight, two cavs, an archer, armor knight, and a foot healer as starting units, with an axe guy, thief and mage shortly after, and then another sword user and someone who flies. That's not going to happen exactly the same in every game (Sacred Stones held off the cav duo for awhile, for instance) but it roughly works out that way. The similarities in the early game are an intentional design choice to ease players into the game. Veterans will know the pattern and just be better prepared in general, but it also slowly dolls out options to new players at a brisk but not overwhelming pace.

As for actual character archetypes, some get reused but honestly a lot of comparisons between characters beyond their unit type is pretty forced. Enemy myrmidon with a killing edge who can be recruited is a common occurrence, but the personality and motivation of the characters involved often changes despite the reused mechanic. Everyone talks about the Jagen archetype but the early game paladin's usefulness in the long term fluctuates between each game so people then make subcategories. But as people get better at the games over time and we also get more games, said subcategories don't really hold up very well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gordon Archtype? This one is really weak. The only thing holding them together is that they're archers. Well no shit. Of course you're going to get an archer eventually.

I thought that the Gordin archetype was "the archer that you get at the beginning of the game who turns out to be completely shit"... I think you'll find that definition holds up pretty well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I thought that the Gordin archetype was "the archer that you get at the beginning of the game who turns out to be completely shit"... I think you'll find that definition holds up pretty well.

But saying this is an archetype is silly. There needs to be something stronger holding it together.

Take the Merric example. Not every early game mage is a Merric. Why? Because the Merric archetype is also characterised by the unit coming with super strong magic tome that is way too powerful for so early in the game. Excalibur, Aura(FE3/12), Grafcalibur, etc. Those fit. But just early game mages like Lute or Erk is stretching it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Most of the archtypes are forced. Merric Archetype? Really? It's only natural that you're going to get a mage sometime if a mage class exists and is common. The only real members of this archtype are Merric, Linde and Asvel ie young mage characters that come early with superpowerful tactical nukes (Excalibur, Aura, Grafcalibur).

I don't think having a powerful tome would be enough criteria for trying to establish a "Merric" archetype. I doubt Linde would count for instance because she wasn't exactly taught by a professional such as her father, IIRC. In all honesty, I'd say that Arthur, Lilina, Erk, Ewan, and Soren are closer Merrics than her. They even have their own teachers, which are respectively Lewyn, Cecilia, Pent, Saleh, and Soren's unnamed teacher.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The mere fact that you can even do something like that when the chars are so drastically different, both mechanically and narratively, is simply beyond my fucking understanding. She isn't even your first mage, that's Lugh, and he has green hair and is male so he fits practically more things than she does, lol. Tangential relations like this are just so dumb.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...