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Golden Sun Mafia


Kriemhild
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I am going to my chorus concert right now, so I will be inactive until around 9:00 PM. Since I haven't eaten, I'll have to eat something when I get back and that will give me some time to catch up and cast a vote. But that is where I will be for right now. Bye.

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I'm not sure of there being a lynch proof, but one of the optional bosses, dullahan, is a headless guy. Lynch proof but also could have no voting power, would be interesting and quite possibly match his stuff.

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What I promised earlier...

eclipse - claimed Mayor which is really the thing that matters most atm.. if we go through with the test (which the majority seems to be in favour of), this cycle will make or break her

Kay - would have expected her to check the votals more carefully, especially given her post restriction, so that unvote didn't look great

BigBangMeteor - hasn't really said much this cycle, so about the same as before

Shinori - same as before, although I'm not quite sure how headless leads to lynch proof (if you explained it and I missed it, my apologies)

Strawman - not much changed

TheTinyImp - I very much hope she gets in here and posts something of substance

Regarding the Mayor test, I'm still not completly sure about it, but leaning towards it as I can't think of any problem we wouldn't have anyway... my opinion on this may change if I can think of such a scenario. Currently leaning towards Imp or Kay as target.

As for the extra kills, Snike's Djinn, Vig, second mafia/SK that got unlucky before are things I can think of atm.

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I don't think headless means lynch-proof...

TinyImp replaced Iris right? I'd rather him than Kay for the test, personally, but Kay would be okay I guess.

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I don't think headless means lynch-proof...

TinyImp replaced Iris right? I'd rather him than Kay for the test, personally, but Kay would be okay I guess.

I'm a girl :P

Anyway, it doesn't look like much happened while I was gone. I'm not too sure about the mayor thing, but we do need to test the mayor's claim, so, I'm cool with it. I'm starting to get wary of Kay now. I don't know how she got the post restriction or how restricted she actually is, but I don't know. I just don't understand why she'd unvote.

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Ok guys, it's late and I'm falling asleep at the desk from being tired from preforming. I want to hear what Kay has to say about stuff (though I'm not sure if she can because of the post restriction) before I start voting for people though. I'll be headed to bed, and I won't get online again until around 2:30-3:30 tomorrow, because of school. Good night.

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The current situation is 5-2, so assuming a mislynch (assuming a random lynch that's a probability of ~83%) and a successful mafia kill (not too unlikely given that the role Doc has been killed), we'd be at 3-2. Now obviously, if you silenced one of the remaining three town, it'd effectively become 2-2 for that cycle, meaning that they can force a NL and then just even the numbers with their next cycle kill, meaning we'd lose.

Reasoning for why you think that BBM and I are the next two in line?

I think there's really only one question we have to ask for whether we want to go through with the Mayor test or not: Do we believe that the mafia has another way to either increase or decrease the value of votes? If the answer to that is no, it's not really different from a normal lynch besides there being less people actually voting. If the answer is yes, we might want to be careful.

Fair enough, I see your point.

I still think it's odd that Ether would have been targeted by a post restriction, I didn't like the way you were pushing a lynch on Manix (I think the length of time doesn't matter as much as the fact that you were seriously trying to convince people to lynch him), then wanted to lynch Excellen over Snike, and you just haven't really helped with finding scum at all. BBM because I think that Eclipse is scum and Eclipse defended him, and he's just generally not acting very townish. His last-minute vote for Excellen, lack of either refuting my plan or cooperating with it, that odd statement back in C2, and other people just act less scummy.

Except that it's removing the need for other people to act, so they're happier to stand by and let Eclipse decide everything, and there's less discussion. It theoretically shouldn't work that way, but eh, I'd say it makes sense when it comes to reality.

Besides, I realized that it doesn't matter if the mafia can increase or decrease vote value. Because, you see, she doesn't even need to have a mayor ability. If the votes are tied, that is, Eclipse's vote for me and one other, her scumbuddy can cast the last vote. (Read the rules about lynch ties this time, you guys!) After that, all the mafia has to do is eliminate one vote, with an extra kill role like Snike's Djinn, a kidnap or silence, something that affects votals, all sorts of things. It's not just whether the mafia has a doublevote. You wanna bet they don't have anything to get rid of one player? If Eclipse is mafia, probably they do, or she would have had a different plan.

Kay - would have expected her to check the votals more carefully, especially given her post restriction, so that unvote didn't look great

I told you, BBM ninja'd me.

Ok guys, it's late and I'm falling asleep at the desk from being tired from preforming. I want to hear what Kay has to say about stuff (though I'm not sure if she can because of the post restriction) before I start voting for people though. I'll be headed to bed, and I won't get online again until around 2:30-3:30 tomorrow, because of school. Good night.

I think I've said about all I can say. I've claimed, I've explained all of my actions that I noticed anyone questioning as best I can, what do you expect me to do? It's up to you guys now. Unless there's anything in particular you want me to say?

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Hmm, he did post 11 minutes before you, but considering how you had to quote and write for that post, I can believe you're telling the truth about that.

And I know I've said BBM is super noob town, but he still voted for excellen who we know was town right at the end of the phase like that...

He could very well be mafia.

UGH.

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I voted for Excellen last minute like that firstly because he subbed in for Spike who I thought was suspicious, and secondly because that post he made annoyed me. Most of his points against me were incorrect, wrongly supported, and/or had already been answered previously in the thread. Maybe it was because he was tired and didn't read the thread properly, but at the time it made me think he was mafia.

If you guys want me to claim, I can.

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Also, the post where I actually voted for Excellen was only 11 minutes before Kay's, but I made a post almost two hours before that saying that I was an inch away from voting for Excellen. I didn't vote at that time because I was trying to decide who to vote for between Snike and him.

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Also, the post where I actually voted for Excellen was only 11 minutes before Kay's, but I made a post almost two hours before that saying that I was an inch away from voting for Excellen. I didn't vote at that time because I was trying to decide who to vote for between Snike and him.

So? Just because you said you were gonna vote for him doesn't mean you actually would. There wasn't a lot of time left in the phase, and how could I know if you would make up your mind? Besides, if I had managed to post first, it would be reasonable to assume you would follow my strategy.

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So I have no idea why, but the quote tags aren't working out for me here (there aren't the same amount of opening and closing tags, but I can't find where one is missing). I coloured the quotes to hopefully make it somewhat readable, sorry about this.

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

I still think it's odd that Ether would have been targeted by a post restriction,

To be fair, Strawman isn't really the most obvious choice either. Also this might be a long shot, but there's a possibility that the target is randomized or something I guess, either among all players or all non mafia players.

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

I didn't like the way you were pushing a lynch on Manix (I think the length of time doesn't matter as much as the fact that you were seriously trying to convince people to lynch him),

I see. I think I pretty much said all there is to say regarding this matter, except I guess this would be applicable as well:

quote name='Kay' date='19 April 2012 - 09:50 AM' timestamp='1334821806' post='1945272'

But why should the mafia speak up and say anything, when everyone's perfectly happy to mislynch and wait for them to talk? We need to bug them to say something of note. You should know this.

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

then wanted to lynch Excellen over Snike,

Remember Touhou Mafia? I simply didn't find Snike scummy enough to warrant a vote at that point, and while it shouldn't be the first priority, at some point you'll have to look at inactives as well.

Also, earlier you said that you weren't really opposed to lynching him, so I'm unsure why you're having such an issue with me voting him.

quote name='Kay' date='19 April 2012 - 09:50 AM' timestamp='1334821806' post='1945272'

I didn't want someone besides Excellen and Snike to be lynched, since Kaoz was seeming less suspicious at that point. Figured if I wanted one of them to be lynched, why vote for someone else?

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

and you just haven't really helped with finding scum at all.

This I'm curious about though. I admit that my activity isn't as high as it usually is in NOC games due to some rl issues, but I think it would be a stretch to say that I've contributed significantly less than basically anyone else who played this game with the exception of maybe two or three people.

There's also the problem that eclipse and you are the most vocal people at the moment, and because the new semester started, I can usually make maybe one or at best two posts before leaving and then one during the night instead of being able to produce a longer discussion.

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

Except that it's removing the need for other people to act, so they're happier to stand by and let Eclipse decide everything, and there's less discussion. It theoretically shouldn't work that way, but eh, I'd say it makes sense when it comes to reality.

That's a fair point. While it's not perfect, I believe everyone has at least stated who they want to be tested though I believe, so that's something.

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

Besides, I realized that it doesn't matter if the mafia can increase or decrease vote value. Because, you see, she doesn't even need to have a mayor

Ok so according to this, wouldn't you have to strictly oppose the Mayor test? You said earlier that you think she's mafia and here you're saying that you think we'll lose if she is. Like, you did raise a few concerns but overall seemed to go along with it, instead of saying "No guys, this is really stupid because [insert what you said above]".

quote name='Kay' date='20 April 2012 - 05:17 AM' timestamp='1334891877' post='1946620'

I told you, BBM ninja'd me.

Well, as I said I would have expected you to be more careful, i.e. make sure nobody would ninja you and check whether anyone had posted while you were typing. I mean, you knew that you wouldn't be able to post again before the phase ended.

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Sorry Impy, I understand that you have a life. Do make sure to check the thread, though! I just came home from my grandma's house, and I'm a bit shaky 'cause I ate too much chocolate.

##Unvote

##Vote: Kay

I see Kay's name being mentioned quite a bit. We've still got some time in the phase (41.5 hours, if my math is right). I'm not sure if I'll be here at phase end, but I'm not gonna skip out like normal, 'cause it's a Saturday for me. Also, let's not forget this:

In the event of a tie, the phase will be extended for a short time. The phase ends immediately after the first vote or unvote to break the tie.

I hope Proto says whether or not he's ending the phase late or if it's extended because of a tie. If so, then feel free to vote me off.

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Ok so according to this, wouldn't you have to strictly oppose the Mayor test? You said earlier that you think she's mafia and here you're saying that you think we'll lose if she is. Like, you did raise a few concerns but overall seemed to go along with it, instead of saying "No guys, this is really stupid because [insert what you said above]".

I only just realized it. I was trying to justify my unvote earlier, and then thinking about the lynch tie rules made me notice it.

Well, as I said I would have expected you to be more careful, i.e. make sure nobody would ninja you and check whether anyone had posted while you were typing. I mean, you knew that you wouldn't be able to post again before the phase ended.

Yeah, I should have, but I didn't have a whole lot of time to post at all and was somewhat distracted and I just forgot to. Nothing more I can really say about it. I made a mistake, that's all there is to it.

Also, earlier you said that you weren't really opposed to lynching him, so I'm unsure why you're having such an issue with me voting him.

Because he turned out to be town. Just because I did something scummy doesn't mean it's not scummy for you, too.

This I'm curious about though. I admit that my activity isn't as high as it usually is in NOC games due to some rl issues, but I think it would be a stretch to say that I've contributed significantly less than basically anyone else who played this game with the exception of maybe two or three people.

You've posted, but have you actually contributed to any mafia deaths?

Anyway, it doesn't look like much happened while I was gone. I'm not too sure about the mayor thing, but we do need to test the mayor's claim, so, I'm cool with it. I'm starting to get wary of Kay now. I don't know how she got the post restriction or how restricted she actually is, but I don't know. I just don't understand why she'd unvote.

Sorry, I thought I explained this enough. If BBM hadn't posted, my unvoting would have meant that Snike and Excellen would have the same number of votes. I wanted Snike to claim, and preferably Excellen as well, but I didn't expect either one of them to be online in time. So, I intended to tie the vote, so that Proto would extend the phase until another player voted, giving Snike/Excellen time to claim (or refuse to). That way, we would have slightly more info to base the lynch on. Make sense?

BTW, I don't have a restriction this cycle.

I want eclipse to prove as well. So I'll let that be. I also don't want to vote kaoz in case he is lynch proof. But that could also be strawman, dunno. Frankly i think there's a time bomb somewhere around here that is someone who's lynch proof. Which could be annoying.

"Lynching" a lynchproof is better than lynching a townie. In fact, as much as I hate it, No Lynching this cycle might not be a bad idea... We may or may not have a ML, but we almost certainly have a NL.

Assuming there are 4 mafia and no third parties, it's 5-2. A nightkill and no lynch puts it at 4-2. Even with stuff like possible third parties or additional kills or vote blocks of some sort, probably it would still be effectively 3-2 at worst. Whereas a mislynch today will mean the mafia has lynch control if they have any way to stop a vote.

Not that I really want to NL, but it's better than lynching me, and isn't automatically stupid right now, I think.

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Also this:

That's a fair point. While it's not perfect, I believe everyone has at least stated who they want to be tested though I believe, so that's something.

Strawman was clearly in favor of Eclipse's plan, and testing the claim on me. Then he sounded more unsure.

Imp said the mayor plan was iffy, but necessary. Nothing about who to test it on that I noticed.

Shinori didn't really say much either way, except that he wanted to test Eclipse's claim on someone.

BBM is somewhat more in favor of lynching Imp.

You've said either me or Imp, but not which one of us.

...yeah.

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I hope Proto says whether or not he's ending the phase late or if it's extended because of a tie. If so, then feel free to vote me off.

Proto, can you say whether or not you'll announce that?

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Well. . .

Sorry, I thought I explained this enough. If BBM hadn't posted, my unvoting would have meant that Snike and Excellen would have the same number of votes. I wanted Snike to claim, and preferably Excellen as well, but I didn't expect either one of them to be online in time. So, I intended to tie the vote, so that Proto would extend the phase until another player voted, giving Snike/Excellen time to claim (or refuse to). That way, we would have slightly more info to base the lynch on. Make sense?

Sounds like you answered my question.

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I hope Proto says whether or not he's ending the phase late or if it's extended because of a tie. If so, then feel free to vote me off.

I know I won't be online when the phase ends, anyway. Can anyone else confirm that they'll be online at that time?

Also, all you other guys. Even if you agree with testing the mayor claim, please at least state who you think should be lynched, because majority opinion doesn't seem to be that clear.

Furthermore, just pointing it out, if anyone else thinks Clipsey is likely to be mafia, remember that you guys can vote on your own. Maybe you won't look great for it, but not mislynching is important. If we mislynch, the game may very well be lost anyway. If we don't, you're probably not gonna get lynched for voting off scum. Don't start thinking you're an uninvolved bystander and can let someone else make the decisions, unless you've cleared them or something.

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Why do you think I'm volunteering for this? I welcome other people's input on this matter. I don't want to see a rush right before phase end, because we couldn't get our collective acts together.

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Because he turned out to be town. Just because I did something scummy doesn't mean it's not scummy for you, too.

Uh... it's easy to say that in hindsight now that he flipped, but just because I was part of a mislynch doesn't mean I'm mafia. Also you don't look bad because we lynched a townie, you look bad because you were one of the more decisive factors in the lynch. That being said, we both explained our actions I believe, so that's about as much as we can do here.

You've posted, but have you actually contributed to any mafia deaths?

Well, Ether was part of the Marth lynch for whatever that counts. And really, besides that one, nobody we can determine contributed to a mafia's death since Snike wasn't lynched.

You've said either me or Imp, but not which one of us

I would like to hear a bit more from Imp before deciding.

I'll also have to think about the NL possibility a bit more.

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If there is a tie at phase end, I'll announce that it's a tie and start the tiebreaker phase.

Thanks Proto~!

Hey everyone else, just because I'm doing this doesn't mean you can STFU for this cycle. Talk, dammit.

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