0% growths run

[dondon151]

So my computer died, and this is the third time that I've lost my HM saves before finishing the game. Since I'm pretty damn tired of trying to rank FE6 HM, I thought this would be a refreshing challenge for a rather stale game.

In addition to keeping a turncount log, I'm also going to record my exact movements used to complete each chapter. Xeld said in another topic that resetting the game in between chapters should result in a consistent string of RNs when restarting a new map, thus it should be fairly simple to do a turn-by-turn walkthrough. Even were this not to be true, I'm still planning on recording this run on video (at some point in time...), so this effort won't be totally fruitless, whatever the case.

So far I've created one text file that essentially outlines what units I'm planning to use and how I'm planning to distribute resources (promotion items, supports, stat boosters) among them. If anyone would like to take a look and help me out, I'll gladly copy the file into a code box here.

         Supports  HP  S/M Skl Spd Luk Def Res Con Support bonuses
Marcus   none       32  09  14  11  10  09  08  11 none
Clarine  B Rutger   15  02  05  09  08  02  05  05 +3 def, +10 hit, +20 avo, +15 crt, +20 cev
(promo) B Klein    26  05  07  11  08  04  08  06
Rutger   B Clarine  26  09  14  15  04  06  01  07 +1 def, +5 hit, +10 avo, +10 crt, +10 cev
(promo)            31  11  16  16  04  09  03  08
Zealot   none       35  10  12  13  05  11  07  11
Astohl   C Barth    25  07  08  15  11  07  03  08 +5 hit, +5 avo, +2 crt, +5 cev
Barth    C Astohl   25  10  06  05  02  14  01  16 +5 hit, +5 avo, +2 crt, +5 cev
(promo)            29  13  08  08  02  18  04  18
Shin     none       29  09  11  14  09  08  01  07
(promo)            34  11  13  16  09  10  04  08
Gonzales none       43  16  08  11  06  07  01  15
(promo)            47  18  13  13  06  10  01  16
Klein    B Clarine  33  16  16  13  13  10  07  07 +4 def, +15 hit, +20 avo, +5 crt, +20 cev
        B Tate
Tate     B Klein    29  09  12  15  06  09  08  05 +2 def, +10 hit, +10 avo, +10 cev
(promo)            35  11  14  17  06  11  10  06
Lalum    B Echidna  28  01  02  11  09  02  04  04 +2 def, +5 hit, +10 avo, +5 crt, +10 cev
Echidna  B Lalum    35  13  19  18  06  10  07  11 +2 def, +5 hit, +10 avo, +5 crt, +10 cev
Miledy   none       38  17  15  13  08  16  04  09
(promo)            50  19  17  19  08  18  06  10
Cecilia  C Percival 30  11  07  10  10  07  13  06 +2 hit, +5 avo, +2 crt, +5 cev
Igrene   C Fa       32  16  18  15  09  11  10  07 +1 def, +5 hit, +2 avo, +2 crt, +2 cev
Percival C Cecilia  50  22  17  22  15  18  13  12 +2 hit, +5 avo, +2 crt, +5 cev
Garret   none       55  21  16  11  13  11  05  13
Fa       C Igrene   23  14  14  03  07  17  26  01 +1 def, +5 hit, +2 avo, +2 crt, +2 cev
Douglas  none       46  19  13  08  11  20  05  17
Niime    none       39  21  20  22  15  05  18  04
Dayan    none       43  14  16  20  12  10  12  09

Promotion items obtained:    Stat boosters obtained:    Ch16 secret shop:          Ch21 secret shop:
07 Hero Crest   Rutger       04 Angelic Robe Lalum      Angelic Robe    Fa         Speedwings    Niime
08 Knight Crest Barth        06 Goddess Icon (sold)     Angelic Robe    Clarine    Speedwings    Niime
08 Guiding Ring Clarine      08 Secret Book  Douglas    Angelic Robe    Niime      Boots         Percival
08 Elysian Whip Miledy       11 Speedwings   Miledy     Angelic Robe    Niime      Boots         Miledy
11 Orion Bolt   Shin         11 Angelic Robe Lalum      Angelic Robe    Miledy     Boots         Percival
11 Orion Bolt   (sold)       11 Dragonshield Echidna    Angelic Robe    (sold)     Speedwings    Miledy
11 Elysian Whip Tate         13 Body Ring    Echidna    Angelic Robe    (sold)     Speedwings    Niime
11 Hero Crest   Gonzales     14 Talisman     (sold)     Angelic Robe    Roy        Boots         Miledy
12 Elysian Whip (sold)       14 Speedwings   Percival
14 Guiding Ring (sold)       14 Boots        Douglas
15 Knight Crest (sold)       19 Energy Ring  Percival
16 Hero Crest   (sold)       19 Goddess Icon (sold)
16 Knight Crest (sold)       20 Dragonshield Percival
20 Guiding Ring (sold)
21 Knight Crest (sold)

??? means that the item is unused

Turn counts:

01   8 turns   07  13 turns   12   9 turns   16  12 turns   20xS 1 turn    F    1 turn
02   8 turns   08  18 turns   12x 10 turns   16x 10 turns   21  15 turns   T  293 turns
03  11 turns   08x 10 turns   13  11 turns   17S  6 turns   21x  2 turns
04   9 turns   09  11 turns   14  11 turns   18S  6 turns   22   9 turns
05  10 turns   10E  9 turns   14x  9 turns   19S 14 turns   23   9 turns
06  10 turns   11E 12 turns   15   6 turns   20S 11 turns   24  12 turns

Video links:

Chapter 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZJkQuPw5j0

Chapter 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAfAGyKk52Y

Chapter 3 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCDNSTvdk8w

Chapter 3 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfiZOTl7UsQ

Chapter 4 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7Z_6r3VO2I

Chapter 4 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z97DqOYCAkU

Chapter 5 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90kY_HBl6dk

Chapter 5 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJxpD0lOIA8

Chapter 6: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcQ2vTqqbtU

Chapter 7 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uu1SI7-i180

Chapter 7 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRZ6DAEYIS8

Chapter 7 (3): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAJrzrAsAEE

Chapter 8 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk3Ypzo_xeM

Chapter 8 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLZSjYtqUac

Chapter 8 (3): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWOxBAMIwFs

Chapter 8x: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZzk3qQud1c

Chapter 9 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPlRV6G7-Z8

Chapter 9 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmO1NCFlCw4

Chapter 10E (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICJ8VBjLs8k

Chapter 10E (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkBivHCW-Dw

Chapter 11E (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzl-S7QD29Y

Chapter 11E (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atcmgjxrJ50

Chapter 12 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3ExjsU_3tw

Chapter 12 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gC3cfssSyQ

Chapter 12x: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlS6gucY8Rs

Chapter 13 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdoXAFnon7E

Chapter 13 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3fn3mzfxDA

Chapter 14 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlLsRAwnVdk (if you don't watch anything else, you must watch this)

Chapter 14 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTDKmkWMwLU

Chapter 14x (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp1pfMd5TC4

Chapter 14x (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfU-A9eSA7g

Chapter 15 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1F_mznxX2M

Chapter 15 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-h939MpIAKY

Chapter 16 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8nF-Z3Zk7w

Chapter 16 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vh4CR4bBZDc

Chapter 16 (3): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIRjiUERWYs

Chapter 16x (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z5AmPb0Ru0

Chapter 16x (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqZwfhwDOwM

Chapter 17S (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N--a2urq5BA

Chapter 17S (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsO3N54QQ5Q

Chapter 18S: not available, sorry

Chapter 19S (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cus1r7yJ3A0

Chapter 19S (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAElUykk0nM

Chapter 19S (3): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KS_cMSgy4E

Chapter 20S (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbvr8n1wH7Q

Chapter 20S (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGfG600vJwA

Chapter 20xS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDbIwQ3yy3s

Chapter 21 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXoBz7sVtus

Chapter 21 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkmQBWXP7zU

Chapter 21 (3): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ2wdSLMAns

Chapter 21x: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcWZnbo-GgQ

Chapter 22 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0zV0vxCiME

Chapter 22 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8E9ud1dqy4

Chapter 23 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rcFgFeCyx8

Chapter 23 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPHxM7DbXPE

Chapter 24 (1): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGEBvU23924

Chapter 24 (2): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccmqnqJdaYk

Final chapter: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrjZX8yBKos

Edited March 10, 2010 by dondon151

[Dat Nick]

I'm iffy on the issue if this is even possible but good luck I guess.

[dondon151]

Chapter 4 finished in 9 turns, which I think is pretty good.

I'm open for ideas on how to complete chapter 5 quickly. Preferably something that doesn't involve opening and holding the gate, and I'm sure there are faster ways than going around. I'm thinking I could have Thany airlift Marcus onto a fort.

[Mekkah]

I attempted this a while ago, but never came very far due to laziness. I planned to raise Alan and Lance (with their usual supports) to L10 and then promote them. This didn't work out for Forde and Kyle in my FE8 run except for in one chapter, but it's a just in case thing I guess...you don't get many good prepromotes until later.

I would just open the gate in Ch5 tbh, maybe not expose Marcus to everything at once.

[Colonel M]

I didn't even know you could open the gate olol. (How?)

Anyway, with Marcus you could try routing the north and sit on forts | forest. Sucks you won't attack the Nomads reliably with a Javelin or Hand Axe but otherwise that's about all I can think of...

[Mekkah]

Put someone right next to the gate and it will open.

[Fruitloop Multipuck]

I'd be willing to look at your outline.

[dondon151]

In how many turns does one normally complete chapter 5 (i.e. not 0% growths)?

Oh, and I posted the outline.

Edited September 30, 2009 by dondon151

[Jaybee]

I didn't even know you could open the gate olol. (How?)

Just have someone wait in front of the gate and it will open, letting ~15 bandits come charging at you <_<

Also, good luck on this, dondon!

[dondon151]

Thanks, bro.

I completed chapter 5 in 10 turns. Any suggestions for chapter 6? The item locations page say that there is a stealable Chest Key; where could I find it? And, should I forego getting some of the items (namely, Unlock and Short Bow) in the interest of time?

[Fruitloop Multipuck]

You could maybe use Ray? He wouldn't be very good, but your options aren't exactly great here, and you're not doing anything with the first Guiding Ring besides selling it anyways.

Fir's slightly worse than Rutgar in raw stats but gives supports to Shin and Rutgar, for whatever that's worth.

[dondon151]

You could maybe use Ray? He wouldn't be very good, but your options aren't exactly great here, and you're not doing anything with the first Guiding Ring besides selling it anyways.

Good idea, as one can stick an Angelic Robe on Ray and have him Nosferatu tank. The problem is that he has no fast supports outside of Lugh and his hit rate is far from perfect. The cash I get from selling Guiding Ring might come in handy for buying more Angelic Robes or something, I guess. I've never paid full price for Hugh before, and I'll also have to spend a lot on killers, so I'm not certain on how my cash situation will be.

Fir's slightly worse than Rutgar in raw stats but gives supports to Shin and Rutgar, for whatever that's worth.

Yeah, but I have Hero Crest problems, since I'm planning on promoting Gonzales. Also, Fir's supports start at 1 and her Rutger support doesn't grow very quickly.

I noticed that I have a lack of sword users (none outside of Echidna lol), which is bad because I need people that can slay mamkutes. I didn't plan on using Rutger in the long term, but I suppose I'll have to use him anyway.

Edited October 1, 2009 by dondon151

[Icon of Sin]

I noticed that I have a lack of sword users (none outside of Echidna lol), which is bad because I need people that can slay mamkutes. I didn't plan on using Rutger in the long term, but I suppose I'll have to use him anyway.

If it helps, you do have Percival.

[dondon151]

Right... I forgot that Percival can use swords >.<

[Mekkah]

You'll also have Karel (lol 0% growths) when Mamkutes start getting really common.

[dondon151]

True. I didn't bother thinking that far ahead though, because that's pretty much endgame and you'll get to unleash the fury of S rank weapons against the mamkutes then, so having a dude that can use Wyrmslayer against them is rather redundant.

I'll probably end up buying Angelic Robes in the 16 secret shop so that Roy doesn't get anally raped by long range magic... though if those guys reach 11 AS, he's fucked anyway.

[Mekkah]

You can RNG abuse so that he survives pretty easily due to FE6's extremely low weapon hit, so it's not the largest problem.

[dondon151]

I'd rather not, though. It's really tedious, and enemy weapon hit isn't that low.

The Bolting mage in chapter 16 has 70 + 12*2 + 4/2 - 7*2 - 7 = 75 hit, or 87.75 true (about 7/8 chance of hitting Roy). That's extraordinarily bad. Similarly, the Purge bishop in that chapter has 77 hit. I'm assuming that Roy is supportless because Marcus is likely obsolete and all of his other potential supporters are either supporting other people (Cecilia) or are plain unusable.

I guess what sucks is that Roy needs 2 Angelic Robes to survive any of those hits, although Angelic Robe with a +4 Pure Water lets him survive by the skin of his teeth. Though, once he gets to 16x, he needs 2 Angelic Robes plus a +2 Pure Water to survive the first Bolting sage, but at least the bishop is survivable with the previous setup.

(I just noticed that those guys have 10 AS, so they're 1 short of doubling Roy. lol)

I want to give Niime an Angelic Robe for Nosferatu tanking purposes (as has been proposed for normal play when Niime was being discussed in the tier list), and Lalum would probably like Angelic Robes as well because dancer utility is incredibly useful in 0% growth runs, but dancer durability is horrible.

And, uh, what is a reasonable turn count for chapter 6? And for that matter, does anyone have turn count guidelines for future chapters?

Edited October 1, 2009 by dondon151

[Mekkah]

There's no precedent for 0% runs in FE6. Just take that guy's ranked run in HM as a very vague guideline, I'd say.

[dondon151]

There's no precedent for 0% runs in FE6. Just take that guy's ranked run in HM as a very vague guideline, I'd say.

I understand; I was asking for a normal run as a guideline. No offense to Balcerzak, but he wasn't exactly the most efficient player around (e.g. his chapter 6 completion is 22 turns with all treasure looted while mine is 10 turns without Unlock or Short Bow looted), but I guess it's a place to start.

Turn counts added, as well as chapter 6. This next map will be FUN.

(by the way Mekkah how far did you get)

Edited October 1, 2009 by dondon151

[Mekkah]

I deleted the patch and saves and everything with it, but I think I got bored around Ch6.

Anyway, for a different approach, look whether you're ferrying Roy or whether he's walking himself. Look at the minimum amount of turns you'd take if that guy moves full speed every turn. Then add 1-5 turns depending on how nice you are to yourself, and you have your range.

[dondon151]

Hey, does anyone know if:

- the reinforcements that appear around Devias only show up if you unlock the door, or if you cross a certain y-coordinate?

- the cavalier reinforcemets that show up from the south are also triggered by unlocking the door, or appear at a certain turn?

[Dat Nick]

- the reinforcements that appear around Devias only show up if you unlock the door, or if you cross a certain y-coordinate?

I THINK it's by passing through some coordinate. Don't quote me on that.

- the cavalier reinforcemets that show up from the south are also triggered by unlocking the door, or appear at a certain turn?

These I know for a fact are turn-based. Don't ask me which one.

[dondon151]

Chapter 7 completed in 13 turns; all items obtained and all units recruited and alive =)

I promise I'll get around to making recordings soon, but you kind of lose motivation after completing the chapter.

I THINK it's by passing through some coordinate. Don't quote me on that.

This is correct. The reinforcements appear on the same enemy phase as when one of your units steps on the pathway between the throne and the dent in the wall where the door is.

These I know for a fact are turn-based. Don't ask me which one.

For future reference, they appear at the end of turn 10 but don't move until turn 11.

[dondon151]

Chapter 8 completed in 18 turns. I took advantage of support building when rescuing to get C supports with ThanyxDieck and ClarinexRutger. AllenxLance also reached B, but I'm probably not going to use them from here on out since Noah is better than them in every way, plus he supports Zealot!

I also got Barth to level 10, which means he's ready for promotion. I can't confirm Grandjackal's strategy of plugging up the reinforcements in the top left corner, since they stopped after 1 turn (they stop when Leygance dies, I think). However, I noticed that the mercenary moves first, then the archer, which means that all Barth would be able to do is to snipe at the mercenary with Javelins at ~55 hit while the archer is stuck in the chokepoint. Not exactly ideal for gaining EXP, but I suppose it's better than trying to keep up.

I noticed two interesting things this chapter: one was that pillars have a 2 movement cost for fliers, yet they still don't get terrain bonuses; the other was that thieves don't need to have higher speed than the enemy to steal their stuff. Chad was able to pilfer Cath's Lockpick and Vulnerary, despite his 10 speed being lower than Cath's 14 speed.

Edited October 3, 2009 by dondon151