48 replies to this topic

[AstraLunaSol]

Works for me.

Dunno what the problem is AK.

[Thor Odinson]

Go install adobe acrobaaaat

Unless you did already in which case
Idunnowhathappen

[· j e a l o u s y ·]

; n ; I has it, but it won't loaaaaad.

[Thor Odinson]

DDDDDD: Noes

I blame your compu.

[Primefusion]

Now that there's a bunch of posts after mine, here's the next part of my mapping tutorial.

Mapping Tutorial Part II: To the Castle!

Spoiler - Introduction

Welcome to Part II of my mapping tutorial. Just like part I, we'll be taking a very simple map and improving it through some basic
rules and concepts. In this part I'll be covering the basics of indoor maps.

Here's what we'll be working with:



If you read part I, you should hopefully be spotting things to improve already. Plenty of the concepts from outdoor maps
carry over into indoor maps. However, there's also a few new concepts I'll be introducing here.

Spoiler - Exhibit A: Tile Spam and Empty Space

Just like part I, I would like to talk about tile spam first because it's a very common problem with new mappers.

If you've read part I, hopefully you're first thought is to use different grass tiles as well as some of the dark grass to help
take out some of the tile spam. So let's do that:



Alright, our outside is looking a little better now. (Note: I'll just be touching on outdoor topics. Read Part I: The Great Outdoors for more help)
But, what about the inside? How do we make it look better?

Let's check out our floor tiles:



You'll notice that a lot of them have black lines (For lack of a better phrase. These are actually shaded tiles)
on the top and/or left side. I'll talk about those later. For now, focus on the tiles without shading.



You would not want to do something like this. Why? You've got no transition from one type of floor tile
to the next (Something I'll be covering later on). So that really restricts us to two different floor tiles.



Okay, so we've broken that up. But what else can be done? Well, we're indoors so we could add some more walls, some pillars,
quite a bit really. Let's point a few kinds of tile out first though.

Here's the basic wall tiles:



Now pillars:



The ones I circled in red may look like pillars, but are actually considered walls by the game. If you use those
for a hack, units won't be able to walk on them.

The ones I circled in blue are pillars units can stand on to gain a defense and avoid boost.

You'll also notice that there are some tiles that have pillar bases at the top of the tile. Right now, the pillars
in the example map lack bases.

So let's add more stuff.



This might be a good time to talk about wall joints.



See how the areas I circled don't really connect? They lack joints that put them together.



Each joint has it's own purpose. Some are to be used when the wall is two or more tiles thick,
while others are for simple one tile walls. Other still are meant to be at the end of a wall. Check it out:



Now we're getting somewhere. But I've got a question for you.

Do things look a little...flat? Check out Exhibit B to find out the correct answer!

Spoiler - Exhibit B: Shading

So the question was: Do things look a little flat?
If you answered yes then you're correct!

This is caused by a lack of shading. (And you thought you could escape shading by making maps instead of sprites fufufufufu.)
Remember when I was talking about those floor tiles with black lines (Aka shading)? I'll point them out again:



There you go. So, here's some basic principles to follow for shading:

Let's go through the shading process step by step. First, we want to shade all the walls, pillars, and chests on the right side.



Next, we need to shade on the bottom of all the walls and chests (That door just beneath the throne too).



Hmm, but what about the walls in the corners? They need shading on both the right and bottom sides. There's tiles for that:



So let's shade the corners of walls and chests (and shade stairs if they're facing down, forgot to mention that).



Alright, so it's looking better. Let me ask you another question: Does the shading by the pillars seem cut off?
To fix this we would need some sort of half shaded tile. Luckily, they exist:



Certain ones have certain purposes (I'm always saying that, aren't I?). We want the one that has just a little bit of
shading in the upper left corner of the tile.



Subtle, but important.

So here's the map in it's entirety:



See? Isn't everything looking much more defined? Yes is the correct answer.

But wait! The outside of the castle needs shading too. Use these fancy grass tiles for the job:



Use those tiles I circled in red to shade the outside.



Notice that the outer walls require shading on the right and bottom sides, just like walls inside. Oh, and
the walls in the corner require shading too where appropriate:



Use the ones with shading on the left side of the tile!



But do the shaded walls by those stairs look funny to you? It would make more sense if there were some pillars
so that those kind of shadows would be possible. Find those kinds of pillars here::



Notice that some of the tiles I circled are pillars, while others are bases. Remember, pillars need bottoms!

And here's those pillars in action:



Now the shading makes more sense since the pillars would be able to create that kind of shadow.

In addition, wall caps (Those gray, brick looking wall tiles) need some shading when they're in a corner. Here's the tiles
I'm talking about:



Let's put them to use:



Look in the corners of walls and you'll see that I've shaded them. But things are a little different when
the wall is next to a pillar brace.



See how the wall cap is shaded all the way from top to bottom? Do this when next to a pillar.

Where are the tiles you ask? Here:



Thanks go to Feaw and Hero of Time for reminding me to shade wall caps.

There's one other thing I should talk about, the throne room.



See how it's got carpet all over the place? (I won't point out where the carpet tiles are, it's pretty obvious)
Well, because there's carpet going all the way to the wall, the room looks very flat without shading.
Never have a room that is all carpet because you won't be able to do any shading. Instead,
do this:



Leave a one tile perimeter around the carpeting (At least one tile). You've got to have shading or else
the room will look flat.


There's a lot of shading to remember in this section so here's a quick check list:

Walls - Shade on the bottom and right side

Chests - Shade on the bottom and right side

Doors - Shade on the side the door is facing

Pillars - Shade on the right and bottom right sides

Stairs - If the stairs are facing down, shade on the bottom. Otherwise don't shade.

Walls - Shade them when next to a corner or wall.

Wall Caps - Use half-shaded walls for corners. Use full shaded walls when next to a pillar brace.

Spoiler - Exhibit C: Height Errors

Height errors are another common problem in indoor maps. We all have them from time to time.

What are they exactly? It's where the implied elevation from stairs and the height of the walls
don't agree. Let's look at an example:



See how the stairs go three tiles up? To be consistent, the walls would need to decrease in height by three tiles.
But they don't and this is a problem. Let's look at one way to fix this.



Look at how the walls are 2 tiles high, and then when you go up the stairs the walls become 1 tile high.
Note that those pillar bases which are half a tile don't add to the height, they simply help with perspective.

But wait, the rest of the castle isn't of the same height, it looks funny still. Let's change that:



The upper right portion of the map is now consistent with it's height. But I didn't fix the rest of the map. Why?
I've got other ideas in mind:



Varying the height is a great way to add pizazz to your map and really make it interesting.

But there's still a problem:



The height of the ground doesn't agree with the building. If that wall broke, a unit would be able to go
from the outside in without going up in height. But look at the entrance in the bottom of the map.
Units need to go up two tiles worth of stairs to get inside. This is a more subtle height error, but an
error nonetheless (Thanks go to Feaw for pointing this out).

But what to do? I've got an idea:



I moved the breakable wall over 1 tile and then added enough stairs to be consistent with the other side
of the map. Now it's correct and still looks like units can come in from the outside at the top of the map.
Here's the finished product:



Let's follow the general flow of what's happening here. If a unit stands outside the castle, they'll
see the walls are 3 tiles high. If they move up the staircase (Which is 2 tiles high) and into the castle,
the walls will be 1 tile high. (3-2=1 simple math yay)

So the unit continues moving along, up the map, and comes to a staircase leading to the right. They go down the
one tile high staircase and now the walls are 2 tiles (As are the pillars, 1+1=2). If they move to the throne room
they'll have to go up a 1 tile staircase. The throne's walls are 1 tile high. If they move towards the chests,
there will be another 1 tile high staircase and so the walls within the chestroom will be 1 tile high as well (2-1=1).

See? As the stairs go up, the walls will decrease in height.

It's important to get rid of all height problems in a map. If you don't, the map won't make sense.

I should also say that if you use stairs, you can also change what kind of floor tile you use because you've
got a transition from one level to the next. Check out how I've got one type of tile on one side of the stairs
and then a new type on the other side.

Spoiler - Feaw talks about Wall Patterns

Have you been wanting to spice up your wall patterns? Feaw has some great tips, check them out:

Now, for my promised wall decoration/variety tutorial.

Spoiler - 1 tile high walls.

As you can see, there are a lot of possible patterns possible. Not all of them work for both ways (shaded or not shaded), but you can always improvise or use the different types according to the situation.

Spoiler - 2 tile high walls.

Now, it gets a little bit trickier. Some patterns just won't look right for 2 tiles high walls. But, there are still several possible ways to do them.

Spoiler - 3 and 4 tile high walls.

Now it gets even trickier. 3 tiles high walls can still be done in a few ways, but you have to think more.
As for the 4 tiles high walls... I only know 2 ways to get them done.
The right one is used in FE6's chapter 16. It cannot be used with shading since the big window tiles lack any shadowed tiles.
That's where the left version comes in. It's used in FE8's chapter 16. Although that one is only 3 tiles high, but I added the top row to make it 4.
This one CAN be used with shading, so you have almost no choice to use something like this for that situation.

Keep in mind, there are waaaaaay more possible patterns and ways to do walls, but I listed the most used ones. So be creative and make your own patterns to make your maps more interesting.
If you're having trouble, I recommend looking to the official maps from the games.
That's basically all there is.

Thanks, Feaw!

Spoiler - Conclusion

This concludes part II of my mapping tutorial. Remember: Shading and height are very important issues that need to
be addressed for your map to make sense mechanically. Shade properly and count your tile height.

If you follow this simple ideas I've laid out, I'm confindent that you'll be able to take a map like this:



And turn it into something like this:



Happy mapping!

Edited by Primefusion, 06 July 2011 - 06:13 PM.

[miyokowarrior]

Love the sprites!!!

[BlackSoulou]

Hello there, sir Prime! I got into mapmaking about 2 days ago and all I can say is that I'm always keeping the things you wrote in mind while working. Thank you very much!

Also, I've stumbled upon a post made originally by Astelaine here: http://serenesforest...dpost&p=1495221

A very interesting read if I may say so. It summarizes the more advanced but less technical aspects of a map which I realize are just as important. Maybe it can help other people too.

Take care!

[deranger]

Most commonly given advice/critique given to new spriters:


When starting out, use only colors from FE8 or FE6/7.

To display your images like everyone else does, upload it to an image host (i.e. imgur (personal recommendation), imageshack, photobucket) and post the forum code they give you.

Reference existing mugs/whatever to learn proper shading.

Edited by deranger, 29 March 2013 - 02:48 PM.

[Khrene Cleaver]

This tutorial isn't for FE Spriting, but I think its a good start for Full Costuming and full bodies

Basing Without Tracing
by ~kawaiihannah

Edited by Khrene Cleaver, 23 April 2012 - 09:37 PM.

[Jubby]

Uhhh, for hackboxes.

This is how you format the mug properly for blinking and talking frames, and then there's a bit at the end about actual insertion if you need it. If you're making your own frames this'll still work, you just won't need to C/P from the original.

For frames:

and I was using this mug:
http://i1238.photobu...rules/chris.png

which uses frames from Kent.

Spoiler -

Okay, awesome XD So, we rip Kent's FEditor thing.

Kayyy, cool. Now, open up YOUR portrait in Usenti. Since it's already in a hackbox, event better. Go to view, put Tile grid on. Should get something like this...?


Those gridlines are super important for your blinking and talking frames. The GBA stores graphics in 8x8 tiles like that, so that's how your portrait gets stored. Thuuuuus, your frames need to match up with those gridlines. So to get blinking frames:


Select a 2 tile high, 4 tile wide box that has the eyes in it. Then C/P it to where the blinking frames go.


Then, we just need Kent's eyes, so open that in Paint or Usenti or whatever :P Just copy paste his eyes onto yours, and line up the eyebrows.


Looks good but he needs that bit of Kent's hair to gtfo, so just fix little stuff like that...


Looks good, so I'll copy paste that over... Again, using gridlines :P

Rinse and repeat...


Forgot to mention, you can also just copy paste over the frames you moved over to the side, as long as you took them using gridlines. And that's it xD Same for talking frames :P

And then if you use it in a hack, you open it with FEditor and drag and drop the frames on the bottom mug///

XD

I will probably C/P this to a topic at some point :3

and apologies for huge images :(

[SgtSmilies]

It'd be pretty useful to just have a template for the sprite-insertable boundries, and the FEditor insertable mug positions.

[eCut]

It'd be pretty useful to just have a template for the sprite-insertable boundries, and the FEditor insertable mug positions.

This is the hackbox for mugs, if you want it:

Believe I got it from Blazer's ultimate tutorial, though I can't quite recall~

Edited by eCut, 27 August 2012 - 08:38 PM.

[SgtSmilies]

Thank you!

[Anacybele]

Here's a tutorial I just made that should be helpful for peeps that make comics with battle scenes. :) It's for making those stretched numbers you see when a character is hit for some damage. I discovered a very easy way to do them without having to spend hours looking for the right numbers and making characters get attacked just so you can rip them. And all you need is Paint and a sheet with the numbers on it.

Spoiler -

[Lord Glenn]

Here's a tutorial I just made that should be helpful for peeps that make comics with battle scenes. :) It's for making those stretched numbers you see when a character is hit for some damage. I discovered a very easy way to do them without having to spend hours looking for the right numbers and making characters get attacked just so you can rip them. And all you need is Paint and a sheet with the numbers on it.

Spoiler -

There's a significantly simpler method of doing this. You grab the relevant numbers off of either the FE8 sheet or the FE6/7 sheet (from here), paste them into Paint and position the HP digits such that the space in-between them matches what it should in the correct game (which can be determined from images in that prior link, assuming that the number is above 9 HP). Then, simply use the Resize function, set the Vertical value to 200, hit OK, and then C/P the newly-stretched image back to your battle scene. No manual measurement required.

Edited by Lord Glenn, 11 September 2012 - 05:15 PM.

[Anacybele]

There's a significantly simpler method of doing this. You grab the relevant numbers off of either the FE8 sheet or the FE6/7 sheet (from here), paste them into Paint and position the HP digits such that the space in-between them matches what it should in the correct game (which can be determined from images in that prior link, assuming that the number is above 9 HP). Then, simply use the Resize function, set the Vertical value to 200, hit OK, and then C/P the newly-stretched image back to your battle scene. No manual measurement required.

...I have absolutely no clue what you just said in most of this post. o_O Some people might not know what "vertical value" and all that stuff is, like me. My tutorial shows you how to do it if you don't have this kind of knowledge. xP

[Lord Glenn]

...I have absolutely no clue what you just said in most of this post. o_O Some people might not know what "vertical value" and all that stuff is, like me. My tutorial shows you how to do it if you don't have this kind of knowledge. xP

Not hard to figure out.

[Anacybele]

Well then. Thanks for making me feel like a total idiotic noob.

(not that it was your intention)

[Sw3Et]

Does anybody know where I can find more of these? FE10 (or 9) characters in the style of the GBA battle animation sprites. I love them!

[Jubby]

Well tbh you could just make some yourself, just take an image from a spritesheet and recolour it using Usenti or Paint...

Or there's some here (They're not amazing but some of them are pretty decent)

http://fc04.devianta...aru-d33z81q.png