79 replies to this topic

[Levant Fortner]

True, but you can depend on Ember AND Flame Body after all. Ember just helps as a buffer. It's also not that big a nerf in damage since he has better Sp Atk and STAB. Rock Throw still hits harder, but if it roosts then it's not THAT big a deal.

Either way, I still think this reeks of hype, and that's one bad habit I think it'll be a cold day in hell before you kick to the curb.

[grandjackal]

Either way, I still think this reeks of hype, and that's one bad habit I think it'll be a cold day in hell before you kick to the curb.

Try it yourself and call me a liar then. In the meantime I got more testing to do. As I said, this is only early portions. I still got a whole game to test it out in.

[Levant Fortner]

Try it yourself and call me a liar then. In the meantime I got more testing to do. As I said, this is only early portions. I still got a whole game to test it out in.

Hey, don't blame me for thinking there's a limit to how much usefulness a Pokemon with bad stats in everything aside from Special Attack and a late evolution can have. Also, I should've pointed this out, but Whitney's Miltank has a Lum Berry.

Also, it getting Recover is pretty damn silly since while Slugma's no tank, he's not exactly fragile either.

- Slugma
- not exactly fragile

What's 40/40/40 base Hp/Def/SpD to you then?

Edited by Metal King Slime, 05 March 2012 - 10:07 PM.

[grandjackal]

Hey, don't blame me for thinking there's a limit to how much usefulness a Pokemon with bad stats in everything aside from Special Attack and a late evolution can have. Also, I should've pointed this out, but Whitney's Miltank has a Lum Berry.

1. Sp Atk is all it needs, since everything early on it either resists or is a complete pussy. You do not run into a lot of things that have ground attacks, nor is there a lot of water. And of course anything that goes down before it can hit you too many times isn't doing that much damage. Good offense is the best defense, etc etc.

2. Miltank's indeed got a Lum Berry, but you'd prefer to not even attempt to status it? Unless you're using Machop, you are pretty much strapped for options against that damn thing. Even WITH Machop, she can just flinch hax you until Machop derps out.

- Slugma
- not exactly fragile

What's 40/40/40 base Hp/Def/SpD to you then?

For how much it can do on it's own, you seem to not think it's getting a good early level lead, that is unless we're dumb and log our entire 6 team roster immediately. Seriously man, I have a damned log you can read just below this topic on the pokemon forum, I'm not exactly pulling this out of my ass.

[Levant Fortner]

1. Sp Atk is all it needs, since everything early on it either resists or is a complete pussy. You do not run into a lot of things that have ground attacks, nor is there a lot of water. And of course anything that goes down before it can hit you too many times isn't doing that much damage. Good offense is the best defense, etc etc.

2. Miltank's indeed got a Lum Berry, but you'd prefer to not even attempt to status it? Unless you're using Machop, you are pretty much strapped for options against that damn thing. Even WITH Machop, she can just flinch hax you until Machop derps out.



For how much it can do on it's own, you seem to not think it's getting a good early level lead, that is unless we're dumb and log our entire 6 team roster immediately. Seriously man, I have a damned log you can read just below this topic on the pokemon forum, I'm not exactly pulling this out of my ass.

1. I thought that rule was only true if you could KO crap before you got hit too much?
2. TBH, I think I'd rather Thunder Wave it twice than pray I luck out with Flame Body twice, considering it'll be faster than damn near anything you have at that point.

[grandjackal]

1. I thought that rule was only true if you could KO crap before you got hit too much?
2. TBH, I think I'd rather Thunder Wave it twice than pray I luck out with Flame Body twice, considering it'll be faster than damn near anything you have at that point.

1. Slugma can do this, just it can't ignore the first blow at the least for the most part.
2. Not saying it's perfect, but he has the option. It still makes things easier as it reduces it's ridiculous attack and whittles it's health down.

I should probably note I'm merely reporting Slugma's earlygame performance since I'm clearly still testing (for the umpteenth time), and I'm not arguing it to top tier here. I'm giving it an Upper Mid thought at best for what I'm currently experiencing with it right now, but my opinion could clearly change as I delve deeper into the game.

EDIT: By the way, how many reliable Thunder Wave users do you have that won't just get punked out by Miltank on entry?

Edited by grandjackal, 06 March 2012 - 12:23 AM.

[frat_tastic]

Bugsy I'll give you, but Falkner... I'll just state that Roost removes the user's flying type for the turn, and since Slugma's, well, sloooow... Rock Throw will be just a normally effective attack assuming he uses it

According to Serebii, Roost removing Flying type doesn't happen until Black/White. Is serebii wrong?

[Levant Fortner]

According to Serebii, Roost removing Flying type doesn't happen until Black/White. Is serebii wrong?

I found this about Roost on Bulbapedia:

If the user is a Flying-type, it will lose its Flying-type (thus being treated as a single-type Pokémon) until the next turn.

[Sho.M.the.Fallen]

It usre loses it here. The countless raeg that pidgeotto caused to me on my nuzlocke with dat move

[frat_tastic]

Yeah, just checked Bulbapedia and Smogon and both say that in Gen IV you lose your flying type. Guess Serebii was wrong and they need to add that in there.

[dondon151]

a better question is

why are we walking a few thousand steps so that slugma can hatch before it is wrecked by everything

[Aquaman]

Because GJs walking the hype train up.

Umm, because being useful for 2 gyms after a shitton of walking and being mediocre/alright in 2 more is good?

I'd think that because we're not considering rarity or time required to get mon out of egg is part of it.....

[dondon151]

yeah let's not require training to be counted against a pokemon either

the difference between hatching an egg and finding a rare wild pokemon is that rare wild pokemon still have like 10% encounter rates, whereas there's no easy way to get around hatching an egg (especially when you have no pokemon with flame body and no bike)

[Sho.M.the.Fallen]

Why do we care abaut possibility of burning miltank? Not only has slugma that yawn to use, but we should wonder how long paper thin defense of slugma can take rollout

[Levant Fortner]

EDIT: By the way, how many reliable Thunder Wave users do you have that won't just get punked out by Miltank on entry?

Very funny... Because last I checked, Flaaffy's more durable than Slugma, in addition to not being weak against Rollout.

Edited by Metal King Slime, 06 March 2012 - 11:59 PM.

[Kon]

While I don't care for tier lists, I can vouch for Flaffy's usefulness against that Miltank. It's tanky enough to survive a good few of Miltank's attacks (although that Flinchax is still annoying) and it can definitely T-Wave the little bastard without having to rely on a shit-ton of luck like Flame Body.

[Don Draper]

Because GJs walking the hype train up.

Umm, because being useful for 2 gyms after a shitton of walking and being mediocre/alright in 2 more is good?

I'd think that because we're not considering rarity or time required to get mon out of egg is part of it.....

Time taken to hatch an egg will absolutely count against a Pokemon. Its just as much a waste of time to walk around waiting for an egg to hatch than it is to train a Pokemon. Considering the number of Pokemon that don't require that amount of walking/training, Slugma is not "good" if it requires it.

[Merry Sioux]

As much as I love Cyndaquil I could see why Totodile would be better. Ever since the original GSC, Cyndaquil has always suffered from a shallow move-pool

[dondon151]

In terms of movepool, Cyndaquil is actually worse off in this game than he was in the original because he functionally lost Thunderpunch. He makes up for it a little with Sprout Tower and a more difficult Bugsy battle.

[grandjackal]

Ya know, ok. So Slugma gets penalized for coming in an egg and needing to hatch immediately to be good. However, I have this question to give.

Why is Togepi in high in this case? What exactly does it do in comparison?