Golden Sun Mafia

[BBM]

It would be kinda dickish to lynch Snike so early, but my vote on Paperblade wasn't based on inactivity. You can still seem like an inactive townie. Paperblade's last minute Marth bandwagoning seemed scummy to me. Sorry Snike, but I'm not going to remove my vote just because you entered the game only yesterday.

[Shinori]

I'm sitting here trying to think over who to vote for and frankly the best choice to me is paper/snike but i 'm gonna wait until snike posts a bit more because hell, maybe it was just paperblade. so whatever.

Manix is whatever is he screws us over it will just get another mafia killed.

Iris was helpful but now almost missed an entire phase which is meh. Very unhelpful. School stuff though.

Rapier is still partially likely for a vote because who knows.

Kay and ether both seem okay ish to me, i guess. Kay is alot more safer than ether.

BBW and Bizz are both town reads in my book.

Eclipse and strawman are the only ones left. Between the two I think i''m more inclined towards thinking straw is more scum and eclipse might be third party. Overall I'm not gettin any good reads that i trust.

[Iris]

okay, so I was really worried for a second, since we were at NL (by default, since tied votes), but then I realized phase ends in 5 hours.

and I'm talking to myself... yay. I've finished rereading, I just need to formulate thoughts and opinions and other things.

[Grace]

yeah okay

##Unvote: Paperblade/Snike

and

##Vote: Ether

because I still can't get reads on Ether either, and also isn't contributing much. Come on now. Even though Ether had a posting restriction, doesn't much in the slightest. You never know, it could have been a town role/djinn that put that restriction on. Although, do note that Kay was also hit with a similar stick during C1.

[Grace]

although on that note, my vote will probably swing towards Snike if Spike is kidnapped again.

[Kriemhild]

More subbing...

ETHER HAS BEEN REPLACED BY KAOZ.

The cycle has extended by yet ANOTHER 24 hours. There will be no more extensions for C2 after this.

[Grace]

are you actually kidding

##Unvote: Ether

Let me determine my plan of action now...ugh, this doesn't make it easy.

[Snike]

although on that note, my vote will probably swing towards Snike if Spike is kidnapped again.

I don't really see how I'm considered scum if my name twin is kidnapped again, but OK.

Also, based on previous comments, I'm a bit more wary of Kay, and a bit less wary of BBM, mainly because of the Unvote and vote staying of them, respectively. How long I've been subbed in should not be a real factor on a lynch if it's not based on inactivity.

[Jaybee]

motherfuck

##Unvote

[Grace]

I don't really see how I'm considered scum if my name twin is kidnapped again, but OK.

Sure, I'll elaborate on that. I consider Spike to be the scummiest player atm, and Paperblade was next on my list. So, by extension, you were put there in place.

[Kay]

How long I've been subbed in should not be a real factor on a lynch if it's not based on inactivity.

If I feel like there's more of a chance of you actually saying things, why not? Paperblade didn't give any reason why he would be more active later on, and if he needed multiple votes on him to talk, then he wasn't much use. I think you're probably still mafia, but maybe I'll get a different read on you if you talk more. It's worth a try, no?

And the thing was, I thought I had unvoted already. I just wanted Paper to talk, and if he was subbed out, that wouldn't do any good.

[Rapier]

From the ashes, I rise. I was too busy for even accessing a computer, sorry.

First, I'll Unvote since Manix explained himself. If he does ressurect Marth, it's a win/win situation for the town anyway.

1) First off what do you think of marth's votes before cycle one end? Do you think there is any relevance behind them? Do you think the people he started voting for are most likely town?

As I already said, yes. He tried to get me, Shinori and Bizz lynched and that was by no means benefitial to the Mafia. The first two were just excuses so that he could vote someone, he just sheeped, and Bizz's case was a failed attempt to make her look scummy.

I only wish people would tell me why I look like I'm trying to clear myself over this, instead of just saying "He's trying too hard let's lynch him" without counter-arguing. Tell me why Marth would vote me and Shinori if we were his scumbuddies, for example.

2) To go along with question 1 Who do you think is the most town at the moment? Also why do you think they are the most town?

Shinori - My theory above.

Bizz - My theory above, Marth tried to lynch her desperately in the end.

Manix - Mafia Reviver sounds stupid. If he is really a scum who wants to buy more time, then he's going to get screwed next Cycle. I don't think that is a good idea.

Ether - Inactive, but he tried to contribute to his best, or that's what I see from his posts. He also got inflicted by status ailment, so I don't think he's Mafia unless he lied. The status ailment in question is a scummy one, because restricting one's posts is a scummy power more than anything else.

3) Now the opposite of that, Who do you think is most likely to be scum? And why do you think that? Any specific reasoning?

Clipsey - Not really scummy, but she's quieter than usual (may be justified, of course) and she hardly attacks. All she does is ask for info and press the players' opinions.

Paper/Snike - Snike just began playing, but I disliked Paper's last vote in C1 and his lurking. I'd rather give him some time to try to fix that, though.

Straw and Iris are saved by the Law of Meta. I can't get better reads from the others.

4) Do you think the kidnapper is more town or scum?

I'm not sure. For all I know, it could be a Djinn. I bet on a noobtown, in any case.

5) What do you think the chances of a third party being in play are? Say a survivor or cult?

Well, we had 15 players on C1, so I think there must be some third parties. I dislike the idea of a cult however, they don't seem to fit storywise.

1) I'd have to go back and check. Really it could go either way. He either could have actually been trying to get someone else lynched, or if it was way past when he was pretty much definitely being lynched he could have potentially voted another scum knowing they wouldn't get lynched and making seem like they wouldn't be on the same team.

Then why didn't you check already? Casting doubts is a scum move rather than a town move. Go and look on the cases you're in doubt about. The only time we were sure he was going to get lynched was when he voted Bizz, so this only applies to her.

2) Hard to answer. BBM doesn't seem like scum, Shinori doesn't anymore, Bizz seems townish for now but I would like to note her confirmation of Prims being role blocked doesn't mean she is town, I'm still pretty suspect on everyone else though.

Well, at least you're convinced about the other two... Though not by my reasons.

Except this is info much more valuable in the hands of the mafia. Mafia's found their next target, Town's found someone else to protect. Much easier for the mafia, no?

... I don't get this right now.

You'll be dead in all likelihood ;/

;/

A Doctor could save him, if such a role exists in this game.

##Clipsey

Give us your thoughts.

[Shinori]

Isn't the phase supposed to end any time now?

[Shinori]

Nvm saw the extension.

[Percivalé]

If Snike is actually mafia you guys suck

I kinda don't want to retract my vote.

[Kay]

You never know, it could have been a town role/djinn that put that restriction on. Although, do note that Kay was also hit with a similar stick during C1.

Why would a townie do that? It doesn't prevent mafia from voting, all it does is prevent people from talking, which is about as anti-town as it gets. Sure, it could have been a Djinn, but why would a townie use a Djinn with an effect like that instead of idling or using their role?

And what does me being targeted have to do with it? I don't see how that implies anything about Ether. Mind explaining your logic?

[Grace]

Why would a townie do that? It doesn't prevent mafia from voting, all it does is prevent people from talking, which is about as anti-town as it gets. Sure, it could have been a Djinn, but why would a townie use a Djinn with an effect like that instead of idling or using their role?

I dunno, it just does make a lot of sense. It was just a little something that passed through my head. It's still possible...

And what does me being targeted have to do with it? I don't see how that implies anything about Ether. Mind explaining your logic?

I'm glad you asked, and the answer is it doesn't have anything to do with it. It was merely an observation. And hence, doesn't imply that much about Ether.

[Jaybee]

A Doctor could save him, if such a role exists in this game.

##Clipsey

Give us your thoughts.

Except, well, look at it this way - If mafia knows that the doctor is going to be on Manix, they essentially have a free shot at everyone else. It essentially removes the chance of the doc stopping the mafia's kill, because mafia wouldn't take the risk of shooting Manix, who has the highest chance of having the doc on him.

I was of the opinion that Clipse was the most active player this phase, but if that's what floats your boat. She also said she got hit by her allergy again (>:), so yeah.

[Kaoz]

@Rapier

It's called distancing. Basically the idea is that when you think you're going to be lynched anyway, you try to cast suspicion on a fellow mafia member so that when you flip, they look better.

That being said, just because you guys managed to lynch a mafia C1 doesn't mean you can start slacking off. I'll reread the cycle after this post, but from what I recall, most votes boiled down to "Oh crap, it's almost deadline and we didn't really scumhunt this cycle, let me throw a vote on an inactivate guy.", which doesn't really help you at all unless you get really lucky.

I want everyone to vote for someone, and I want to see some sort of proper reasoning behind the vote. I'll vote once I reread.

If someone feels like there's something I should definitely know, or has a question they'd like me to answer, please say so.

[Shinori]

My thoughts still rest on strawman, and partially rapier. I have my doubts on manix but if he is mafia and doesn't revive then he's just gonna die anyway and we end up ahead. I've been fairly inactive this cycle as well i know that, but not everyone has yet to answered the questions i posted.

[Percivalé]

I mentioned why I was suspicious of Paperblade in pieces, and him replacing like that just makes me even more wary. Sorry.

[Percivalé]

Err, subbing out like that.

I need sleep.

[Kaoz]

First things first...

##Vote: Haze

Now then... this is all stuff from C2, if someone wants me to adress something prior to that, bring it to my attention.

Well, I guess if Shinori didn't give Bizz a gift, someone would have counterclaimed, so that clears Shinori for now... Unless both of them are mafia, but I think Bizz is town. Also, I lol'd at the second-last line of Paperblade's post. Is there anyone who doesn't make you uneasy? (This may sound slightly mocking, but it's a serious question)

Mafia Inventors exist.

"Gut feeling" is, according to my memory, an even better way of getting yourself lynched because you're still not fully explaining yourself!

##Vote: Bizz

1) First off what do you think of marth's votes before cycle one end? Do you think there is any relevance behind them? Do you think the people he started voting for are most likely town?

To answer the last question first, no. As has been mentioned multiple times before, those kind of votes can easily be used to make a mafia look better after the flip. Especially the vote for Bizz seemed out of place since it was clear that that wouldn't go anywhere.

2) To go along with question 1 Who do you think is the most town at the moment? Also why do you think they are the most town?

3) Now the opposite of that, Who do you think is most likely to be scum? And why do you think that? Any specific reasoning?

Going to combine these two and just give opinions on everyone:

JB - Posts are reasonable for the most part, leaning very slightly towards town.

eclipse - Not leaning either way here at the moment. If you could provide your opinions on everyone I would appreciate it.

Kay - Had a good C0/C1 from what I recall, but got significantly weaker C2. Seemed too fixated on BBM at the beginning and her votes had little reasoning behind them from what I recall, overall appears non commital at the moment.

BigBangMeteor - Was rather active but the posts could have had more content for my taste. I would like to hear your opinions on everyone as well, and don't be afraid of being wrong or something (at least that's kind of the feeling I got so far), everyone makes mistakes at times (even Life).

Domu/Rapier - Was rather self centered so far during this cycle, the last post is a little better. Still not feeling too great about him.

Shinori - Neutral I guess. Was the only one who tried to kick discussion off during C2 from what I recall, so that's a positive at least.

Strawman - Pretty much the same as JB.

Snike - I recall Paper making some decent posts when he actually did post. Inactivity is an issue, but that's always the case, I expect Snike to rectify that. What I find somewhat noteworthy is that someone (or maybe multiple people, not sure) saw him as more town because of his inactivity, but then voted him for exactly that reason.

Iris - Seems incredibly forgetable to me and was basically non existant. One of the people I expect thoughts from the next time they post.

Manix - The reviver claim was just bad for multiple reasons. Adding to that, I don't recall any good posts aside from one sometime during the beginning of this cycle, overall doesn't do a whole lot that makes me want to keep her around.

Spike - I remember him posting quite a bit during C1, but nothing that really stuck out to me. Might reread C1 later I guess.

Bizz - Could go either way depending on how certain things are interpreted. For now, please prove your role to me this cycle, I'm pretty sure you can assuming I'm right about it.

4) Do you think the kidnapper is more town or scum?

Someone remind me to answer this in a cycle or two when we have more than one data point to work with.

5) What do you think the chances of a third party being in play are? Say a survivor or cult?

Not leaning either way at the moment. However, if someone has a role indicating a Cult, speak up.

But Proto made a role for every single Djinn. Probably several of them are revivers of some sort. The randomized choice thing was fairly complicated, it would make sense if he was trying to differentiate several different Reviver Djinn. Keep in mind that a lot of things about the setup will be based on luck because of the Djinn system.

I would expect Proto to make sure the game is reasonably well balanced, even with the somewhat random nature. Of course we can't know for sure, but there would have always been the possibility of giving a lower number range to ensure that no broken combinations exist.

But Proto made a role for every single Djinn. Probably several of them are Also, it doesn't matter if Manix is scum right now. If he's mafia, and there is no mafia reviver, we can lynch him when Prims isn't revived. If he is a mafia reviver, why not make him help the town first? I'd say reviving Prims is worth keeping him around for, in that case. There isn't anything to be gained from lynching Manix this cycle.

I disagree. Who says that Manix was telling the truth about the restrictions? Say she revives Marth, we have to kill both of them again which puts us at the end of C4 at the very least (chances that we mislynch this cycle in that case aren't exactly low), so even though we would have confirmed mafia, we would still give them lots of time to do whatever they want, possibly protecting more devastating roles with this.

BIZZAnyway, throwing this out before I get back to schoolwork.##Vote: EtherYou haven't been in here after over 30 hours, and I wub Iris too much to vote for her now.

JB...

When I said that I couldn't see there being a harmless third-party, I wasn't saying this out of hard proof I had. I said it because the only third-party character I could see existing would be the Wise One, and he doesn't strike me as harmless, considering he creates the Doom Dragon and all.

Random piece of advise, don't assume too much about the game based on flavour.

That's a hell of a lot of trouble to go to just to save one guy, when the net result is yet another mafia member dead.

As said above, it's about time more than anything. We don't know how many mafia there are, so those additional cycles might very well be all they need.

Unless, maybe the post restriction was a result of something like say an inventor type role that gives random effect to people? That could always be a possibility, since cursed to only be able to post 6 times doesn't quite seem like something that would be the main definitely ability of a role.

It's certainly possible that the whatever-it-is is part of an Inventor type role. I dislike repeating myself, but possibility of Mafia Inventors etc.

I remember, when I was hosting CM4, how upset Paperblade was because "it's bad luck" whenever he's on the side of the mafia. This is more meta, but it's entirely plausible that outside distractions plus the D1 lynch of a teammate with an invaluable role made him give up. He didn't state his reason for replacement, so I really am actually willing to believe this, but yeah, it's pretty dickish. I don't know what other leads I have, though.(by the way i made a terrible mistake and pulled an all-nighter so brb sleeping forever)

This would maybe be worth considering (except that it's still meta, i.e. unreliable), if Paperblade wasn't already fairly inactive at the beginning of the game when there was probably no reason to give up.

Lastly,

##Unvote

##Vote: Manix

Reasons stated above. The risks of keeping her around outweigh the benefits in my opinion.

[eclipse]

Hooray, phase extension~! My head's not in the best of shape, but I think I can put together something coherent (this is the longest I've been affected by my allergy, ever. . .damn thing usually goes away in 24 hours).

My thoughts is that my head fucking hurts, and that there is precious little discussion going on. I'm sorry for not being as aggressive, Rapier, but I'd like to see you play properly when your sense of balance is thrown out the window.

I only wish people would tell me why I look like I'm trying to clear myself over this, instead of just saying "He's trying too hard let's lynch him" without counter-arguing. Tell me why Marth would vote me and Shinori if we were his scumbuddies, for example.

It's called bussing, and a move that's meant to disassociate yourself from your scumbuddies. You'd know what this is, as you were a victim of it at least once.

As for everyone else. . .

JB - DO YOUR HOMEWORK! (seems busy with RL)

me - Corn Pops are evil.

Kay - Comes in, picks on someone, leaves. I'm not sure if I like her idea of "being active" (this isn't an attack on you, BTW). This is about the time where her life kicks in, so meh.

BBM - Rather invested in flavor, but at least isn't giving away info for no reason. I guess that's an improvement?

Rapier - I'm not liking his insistence that he has to be clear because Marth voted for him, BUT it's not quite enough to warrant a vote from me. Yet.

Shinori - Probably the most helpful person during this phase. . .everyone, step it up~!

Strawman - IIRC, this is your busy time. I hope you find time between your homework to say more.

Snike - I'd like to give him a bit more time to say something, but that's because his time zone sucks. Didn't like the fact that Paper only opened his mouth when pressured.

Iris - If you're gonna be that busy, sub out at the end of this phase.

Kaoz - Doesn't seem to trust anything, which is par for the course.

Manix - I don't care for hiding behind one's role as a way of proving yourself (this might be my fault from Training Mafia, so sorry everyone), but having Prims back would liven things up. Also, get well soon.

Spike - Don't forget this game exists!

Bizz - Get well soon! Drink lots of water!

I hope you guys can say SOMETHING interesting while I'm asleep. Since it's Saturday, I'll be back well before the phase ends.

[Grace]

Firstly, it's "he", but I'll let that slide.

Also, which restrictions about my role? Okay, let's throw this down (also, I hate repeating myself):

- I can revive people, and can choose whether to keep them alive or not.

- It's a role ability

- I can only keep one person alive at any one time

- Another fact I'm omitting for safety purposes (see below the quote below as for why)

Think about it: I wouldn't have the capacity to revive multiple people, it'd just mean I'd have stupid amounts of power for town, making the game imba as hell. I doubt.

Also, I admitted that my claim was probably not the best idea in the world.

Might I remind you that claiming Reviver as Mafia is quite possibly one of the stupidest ideas ever. Hell, claiming Reviver as Town isn't the best either. Claiming Mafia Reviver would just set me up very easily for a lynch. Yeah, that's an incredibly smart idea as mafia /sarcasm

Actually, your entire post towards me rubs me completely the wrong way. You're fishing for more information about my role. No one else has asked anything about what else my role is capable of. Let me fish out some quotes for you:

I disagree. Who says that Manix was telling the truth about the restrictions? Say she revives Marth, we have to kill both of them again which puts us at the end of C4 at the very least (chances that we mislynch this cycle in that case aren't exactly low), so even though we would have confirmed mafia, we would still give them lots of time to do whatever they want, possibly protecting more devastating roles with this.

This irks me sooooooooooo much. This is fishing for information for beyond what town would actually care about. And if scum knew exactly what my omission was, they'd have a perfect reason to kill me off immediately. Town wouldn't mind if they didn't know.

##Vote: Kaoz

You've given me a very good reason to vote you right now. That makes it easier to decide.

Tip to the maybe non-existent Doctor: You might want to target me this cycle