Best promotions.

[RWB]

Yeah, I think we've established that the Swordmaster owns the Assassin at equal levels, and that the Assassin's only strong point is faster level growth, both with silencer and without.

[Mekkah]

Hey guys I don't know what you're thinking but Silencer and your already existent crit do not stack. He can only get Silencer if he was already going to crit anyway. So that in no way compensates for +15% crit. On any enemy that Joshua 3-4HKOs, Swordmaster has the much superior kill rate.

Higher EXP gain for Assassin is cool but as Fox said, he needs to catch up in stats first before he can start surpassing. More level-ups are only useful if they let you do something new, but I do not think they make a difference. The majority of his growths are focused on stats where even gaining 3-4 extra points wouldn't help him do anything new (hp, skl, spd)...maybe he'll get an extra point of str out of it, but Swordmaster has a 1 pt str lead to begin with.

Lockpicks are worthless at this point. You have plenty of unit slots for Rennac/Colm (you might already be using a trained Colm to begin with), and you have plenty of inventory slots to field anything with Chest and Door Keys. Assassin Joshua can carry around Lockpicks, but Swordmaster Joshua can carry around Chest and Door Keys. What's the big difference?

Fog of War? The only FoW map left after Joshua's promotion is Ch19, and it isn't an issue there because it's a Defend Map (so you don't need to move your characters far enough into the fog to begin with, just into choke points and that's it). Maybe if we're rushing Riev or something, but in that case it's easy enough to blow a torch of some kind like I do

. (don't strawman me about the fact that it's 100% crit)

[Rewjeo]

Doesn't stack? Dang. Think I'm back to SM.

15 uses>3 uses. I'd rather field Joshua than Rennac, and then there are times when Colm isn't enough on his own (Chapter 19 and Endgame have chests on both sides of the map. Although one of the endgame ones is a master seal, which is useless unless we're using Ewan/Amelia)

That's why it doesn't count for much. Again, though, it's there. What if a sniper comes towards you and just into Joshua's vision and you have a flier close by? With Assassin Josh, they'd live, without, they'd die.

One more thing, though. Does assassin get the 100% pickup rate for the desert?

[Parrhesia]

I once reached the final stage with only 13 characters left alive. It included 20/0 Joshua, Garcia and Marisa. Garcia didn't make the cut, Colm got the master seal and just before he could get it to Joshua (Marisa was majorly strscrewed) he died. So Colm gave it to Marisa, who became, fleetingly an assassin, then suicided against a Gorgon, or Manakete or something.

...

But yeah. Lockpicks don't count towards much. And when an SM crit (which occurs more often anyway) will usually kill all but the most stubborn enemies, especially if Joshua's equipped Audhulma. Lethality's just overkill.

At this point SS is easy enough anyway, even without supports or tower/arena/ruins. :P

[Candlejack]

Colm is your best utility unit in the GAME bar none.

Why make Joshua a redundancy when you can make his combat ability BETTER?

[Rewjeo]

It's not a redundancy. At least not in chapters 15/19. Colm can only be in one place at a time, and Assassin Joshua>>>Rennac.

[BK-201]

It's not a redundancy. At least not in chapters 15/19. Colm can only be in one place at a time, and Assassin Joshua>>>Rennac.

Rennac works well enough, you don't need to waste Joshua's above par offense to pick locks.

[Shadow Mir]

It's not a redundancy. At least not in chapters 15/19. Colm can only be in one place at a time, and Assassin Joshua>>>Rennac.

I don't know why you bothered mentioning Chapter 19, seeing as that one gives you a ridiculous number of unit slots.

[Candlejack]

LOL you don't even NEED two thieves for Ch. 19; with the amount of units you get and with a very lengthy timeframe of 13 turns to survive, Colm is VERY capable of looting the chests within the time limit. And you could get the treasures with Colm as well ANYWAY even without a promotion.

[BK-201]

Chest and Door Keys exist.

[Junkhead]

Not seeing how Assassin Josh > Swordmaster.

Experience boost is cool. But for it to really matter, he first has to keep a consistent ~3 level lead on SM Josh just to tie Str and HP. He needs 2-3 more levels to actually start winning. And then of course, +15% crit is better than another RNG roll on half your crit. I don't understand how Silencer can be better unless he's fighting a Cyclops or something, and even then a strong enough weapon can at least get him to 4HKO.

Lockpicks? Lol. I can buy Chest Keys.

FoW vision? That's kinda cool. It would be cooler if there was more than just Rausten Court left in the dark.

Epic. Especially the chest key part.

[Mekkah]

You can use Warp/Rescue to transport your thief in Ch19 if you insist, or else just use both Colm and Rennac. The right side is almost completely devoid of enemies (besides Fighters and a Druid with totally shitty hit) until the General reinforcements come in. You might have to send ONE of your fighters that way when it comes to that, but it's possible you end the map before that happens...or you can realize that if you send Joshua there to pick those locks, you already lost a fighter to begin with.

[Parrhesia]

Even though the Knights are incredibly incompetent, often flanking around the Poison Sword thieves and exposing them to the treasure, a) you got plenty of time, b ) you got plenty of reinforcements to add a thief, rogue or even Assassin!Marisa if Colm and Rennac are dead, or if you considered Rennac free XP; c) Joshua's a superb fighter and you really need him at the front lines.

EDIT: Stupid B) emoticons...

Edited January 19, 2010 by The Ferret Whisperer

[Anouleth]

Not seeing how Assassin Josh > Swordmaster.

Experience boost is cool. But for it to really matter, he first has to keep a consistent ~3 level lead on SM Josh just to tie Str and HP. He needs 2-3 more levels to actually start winning. And then of course, +15% crit is better than another RNG roll on half your crit. I don't understand how Silencer can be better unless he's fighting a Cyclops or something, and even then a strong enough weapon can at least get him to 4HKO.

Lockpicks? Lol. I can buy Chest Keys.

FoW vision? That's kinda cool. It would be cooler if there was more than just Rausten Court left in the dark.

Epic. Especially the chest key part.

Is that sarcasm?

[CATS]

Ch 19 Chests are a terrible reason to go with Assassin Josh. Just give keys to Syrene or some worthless unit and let them have chest duty. Josh is better used on the front lines.

[Salad Utensil]

Ch 19 Chests are a terrible reason to go with Assassin Josh. Just give keys to Syrene or some worthless unit and let them have chest duty. Josh is better used on the front lines.

Eh...lock picks are more like icing, the real advantage that I saw was an exp bonus from the assassin class allowing Joshua to gain more stats faster. The promotion loss of 1 strength and 2 HP can be made up quickly and the advantages to speed may allow Joshua to double more (though I think he doesn't have this problem) and maybe gain more defense and dodge better. However, I probably used the complicated EXP formula incorrectly. I'm definitely see the advantages of SM over assassin, but there is definitely merit IMO to using assassin over SM in some circumstances. But I admit that I am wrong and SM is probably a better promotion branch. If the crt bonus was 15% and Joshua had better supports, it would be a definite blowout.

Edited February 2, 2010 by Brighton

[Junkhead]

Is that sarcasm?

Yes, because I would joke around in places that aren't Far from the Forest.

[Thor Odinson]

Franz-Great Knight. Sometimes I make him Paladin and sometimes Great Knight, but he usually comes out better as GK. Plus, he usually handles Garm on my team. (Yes, I know Ross has way more STR than him. I don't care. I'm used to using Franz and it's pretty difficult to let Ross kill things in the beginning. I also prefer mounted units). He's the exception to my Paladin favoritism.

Gerik-Ranger. Now, I've heard about him being a wonderful Hero, and Hand Axes are amazing (BARST ON H5 IS MY SAVIOR), but this man is my default Dracozombie killer. He usually ends up doing Lagdou 10 with Colm (for the chest) because he can. He has 60 HP so no worries about getting killed. I don't trust Neimi with those things, her HP usually turns out really low for me. I may try him out on Hero, though. I still favor mounted units.

Colm-Assassin. If I need to pick some locks I'll throw him a lockpick or make room for Rennac, since I don't need to bring a full set of units anyway. Throw him a couple of Killing Edges (in CC, Shamshirs) and he silencers fairly often. In CC he silencer'd the Dracozombie boss.

Lute-Sage. Because she maxed Mag at 30. That's all I need.

Artur-Bishop. One word: SLAYER. Plus, I don't need more than one sage and Lute makes a damn good one. Plus, Natasha can only have either Latona or Ivaldi. I chose Latona. He's getting Ivaldi.

Natasha-Bishop. SLAYER>Horse.

Ewan-Druid. Last time he got a bit MAG screwed but he'll generally max that. Knoll's Summons own his anyway, and Lyon's own them both. And Lute makes a wonderful Sage.

Joshua-Swordmaster. Colm is a wonderful Assassin and I don't need another one.The extra 15 Crit is nice. I've actually tanked with him. Quite often.

Marisa-Swordmaster. Untouchable dodge+15 extra Crit=win.

Gilliam-General. Franz is a pretty good GK and General makes good use of Gilliam's DEF stats. He maxes them.

Amelia-Paladin. Only because I favor mounted units except in the Magic department and Gilliam has more DEF anyway, even though he has less SPD. And GK has no movement compared to Paladins. Even the animation is slow.

Tana-Falcoknight. Last time I made her a Wyvern Knight to change things up her Def and Res both got significantly lower (19D 18R as Falco and 15D 15R as Draco), and pierce, while good for offense, does not to anything for her tanking abilities. I'll just have Joshua Armorslayer those Generals.

Neimi-Ranger. More MOV than Snipers and I like mounted units. Sure Shot isn't that useful anyway. Most of my characters hit things at 90+ Acc.

L'archael-Either. IDK. It really doesn't make a difference to me. She maxes everything but DEF and HP anyway.

Kyle-Paladin. I have blatant Paladin favoritism, even though GK makes better use of Kyle's ATK. I don't use him that much anyway since he has no Res to speak of. At least Forde sometimes may tie Res with Seth if he gets lucky.

Forde-Paladin. I have used him once as GK (swapped Garm ownership with Franz) and I definitely like him better as a Paladin. Except that once where he got DEF screwed, but then again, he got DEF screwed has a GK too.

Cormag-Wyvern Lord. More ATK, DEF, and HP ultimately wins out against the SPD. Although I don't mind either way, and pierce is nice. I just like him slightly better as WL. He still has no Res either way. But he does have way better range than a Paladin since mountains are useless against him.

Vanessa-Wyvern Knight. Falcoknight is actually better but as Tana>Syrene and Cormag usually gets Lord, I have Vanessa on WK and she's not bad at it. Her Res is high enough already anyway.

Ross-Berserker. 15% extra Crit is good.

Garcia-I don't actually use him. Warrior because Ross>him either way.

Knoll-Summoner. Ewan>him as Druid. He>Ewan as summoner. It all works out.

Moulder-Bishop. I don't actually promote him until CC and then I S his Dark Magic with Stone. Then I give him Lyon's Nagalfar and watch him do 95x2 damage in Lagdou for the laughs. You can't do that with Sage, since without slayer, you might as well just use Lyon himself for 50x2 Damage. Which is still Lulzy but it's not the same as 95x2. He's pretty useless past CH5 ingame, though.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Luminescent Blade

[BK-201]

Bishops wield other light magics much better than Ivaldi against monsters. Ivaldi reduces the effective from 2 to 3.

[Thor Odinson]

I'm aware. I just like having each Holy weapon go to someone.

Normal battles consist of me giving Natasha and Artur Lighting anyway. I don't even use Aura unless it's a Dracozombie that Gerik somehow doublemissed on (highly unlikely).

[Shadow Mir]

I'm aware. I just like having each Holy weapon go to someone.

Normal battles consist of me giving Natasha and Artur Lighting anyway. I don't even use Aura unless it's a Dracozombie that Gerik somehow doublemissed on (highly unlikely).

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care for using all of the Sacred Twins. For one, lol dark magic. Also, I see an S rank in staves as practically useless. That aside, I also have a Paladin favoritism - and hate Great Knights. I also refuse to make Colm an Assassin since I hate Rennac.

[Thor Odinson]

When it comes to SS I'm horribly OCD and have to assign them all to a character. The ones I actually end up using are about 4 of them.

Though Glephnir does suck.

I can't make Colm a Rogue anymore after what he did to that Dracozombie as an assassin. It was just too good.

[Bryan]

When it comes to SS I'm horribly OCD and have to assign them all to a character. The ones I actually end up using are about 4 of them.

Though Glephnir does suck.

I can't make Colm a Rogue anymore after what he did to that Dracozombie as an assassin. It was just too good.

I like you :)

For the record, Ewan -> Super Trainee = Fail. He can't double shit with elfire at 10/20/0. :( (I know PEMN)

[Salad Utensil]

I like you :)

For the record, Ewan -> Super Trainee = Fail. He can't double shit with elfire at 10/20/0. :( (I know PEMN)

Yeah with super pupil he's stuck with only 5 con so on average his speed at 10/20/0 is only 15.4 which is 10.4 AS which means he isn't doubling much unless he got blessed PEMS. Than again 20/1 Lute as a Sage has even less con and will end up with 9.6 AS.

[Rewjeo]

She seriously only had FOUR CON as a sage. I guess I never realized she was 6.