Geriba Posted February 1, 2012 Author Share Posted February 1, 2012 Oswin w/ Uber Spear for God Tier. Or anyone else capable of having a Lance rank for that matter. This is mentioned in the OP: all lance-users are assumed not to have the US at first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Hm. That sucks. A separate tier list including the US could be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geriba Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 Hm. That sucks. A separate tier list including the US could be made. Again, this is addressed in the OP. Given that a) there is only one US available, and b) any given team is likely to have two or more lance users, bunching all lance users in a separate top tier does little to compare characters or classes. Under your proposal, for example, Paladin units- who will almost never get the US, since there are plenty of superior candidates- would likely be at the level of, or above, Warriors or Berserkers. There's also the issue of "proportional quality" among lance users, which (again) is addressed in the OP. In other words: read the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Mind clarifying? Paladins have horrible stat caps, and everyone will be carrying a horseslaying weapon. At least sages can hit pretty hard while they're alive. First, horseslaying weapons are nothing to worry about. They are all strictly worse than their corresponding S rank weapons, and in some cases are strictly worse than silvers. There's no reason to tote a horseslaying weapon into the link arena unless you're really short on axes, and even then, the affected unit is still taking less damage than if he got hit by Basilikos. Second, Isadora should at least be in the same tier as the falcoknights, because her spd cap allows her to double SMs with the uber Spear (and both Body Rings), and her caps are essentially identical otherwise. Her supports are somewhat lackluster with most of them being in bad classes, but she does support Geitz, and this is no worse than Fiora, who also has no good supports other than Geitz (who, by the way, is missing on the list). I don't understand why lance classes are being ranked assuming the lack of the uber Spear. Link arena teams are not exceedingly likely to have multiple lance users given that the top of the link arena tiers is dominated by axe users, and optimal link arena teams have 2-4 axe users. If you're using a lance user, you're using him for the uber Spear anyway, because lance using classes in general tend to have bad stat caps for link arena play (since every class but general has elevated movement to compensate, and general gets manhandled by berserker). No one is going to use both Isadora and Oswin on the same team because one of them is going to get shafted, but there are perfectly reasonable combinations that employ Isadora and 4 other non-lance using units. If you don't assume the uber Spear on lance using units, then the falcos and the wyverns need to drop quite a bit. Falcoknights have very few merits in link arena play outside of the uber Spear because their offensive and defensive caps are among the worst in the game, and they require Body Rings to function at all. Wyvern lords are just really bad generals. Furthermore, the uber Spear is a great weapon, but it doesn't break everything all by itself. The one thing is does do is to make generals very difficult to kill safely, but it's also a relatively weaker weapon overall (4 less MT than Rex Hasta after factoring in the str bonus) and it locks the user to WTD against enemies like warriors and berserkers. Other comments: - I'm surprised that the heroes aren't lower. They're basically like sages that do less damage and are vulnerable to bow users. - Speaking of sages, Pent should probably be a lot higher than Erk and Nino than he is now, because he can potentially wield Excalibur with only 1 AS loss. Erk loses 3 AS and Nino loses 5 AS; Nino in particular is rendered unusable because everything threatening doubles her; Erk now gets doubled by berserkers and falcoknights. Switching to Fimbulvetr does not fix this problem (and Fimbulvetr is 5 MT weaker than Excalibur). Pent's drawback is that he can't support anyone but Louise and one other unit, but at least he can support Hawkeye, whom you have ranked high. - Which brings me to my next point. Hawkeye has no good supports. Forget good caps, but either his lack of good supports drags him down or the fact that he actually is that good by himself brings Pent and Louise up. - Karel has 2 amazing supports (Dart, Geitz), and Karla herself has 2 or 3 good supports (Vaida, Bartre, Farina). Guy has, well, no good supports. As much as the Swordslayer and uber Spear are kind of "fuck yous" to SMs, they're one of the best options against warriors, and are partially responsible for why every class with less than or equal to 26 spd and no other significant merits is a bad class in link arena play. - Why is Eliwood lower than Lowen? Eliwood has a higher str cap and a top tier support partner. No axes, but it's not like you're giving a Basilikos or Swordslayer to Lowen anyway. Durandal is generally bad, but it has some niche utility if Eliwood needs the extra atk. Edited February 2, 2012 by dondon151 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekkah Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 By the way, according to the site, Armads and Durandal have double Mt vs dragon units, the same as Wyrmslayers. That means Vaida and Heath get massacred by Hector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titamon Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Sol Katti is effective against Wyvern's too... but it sucks hard tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eliweed Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Geitz is missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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