CrashGordon94

FE8: The Crash Hack!

117 posts in this topic

But the thing is that 80 uses would still run out, and I don't like the idea of a unit expiring like that...

And if this is true then I might as well just make it infinite instead.

There are like, 80 enemies left after you get myrrh, in the whole game. Are you runing a myrrh solo after you get her or something?

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A balance hack (well, it's not all about balance, but that's most of it) of FE8!

This is not balance at all. Allow me to point out the various problems.

• Removing FOW, Status Staffs, Stone and Lockpicks because I hate them.

That's not balance, that's just removing interesting gameplay elements.

• Some chapters will be made a little easier (5, 6, 11B and 14B mostly.).

That's not balance. Besides, those are, like, the only remotely challenging chapters in the game to begin with; if anything, I'd raise all other chapters to the difficulty of these four chapters rather than do the opposite.

• Staff EXP increased hugely, to DS levels or beyond.

While increased staff EXP may not be that bad an idea (it is difficult to promote staff users in a timely fashion if you're aiming for Lv20 - although you could just make use of staves other than Heal or Mend and be done with it), a "huge" boost is unnecessary.

• Gender stuff: I will give all female classes with a male counterpart (i.e. Myrmidon) the same CON as the male version and both versions will have the same caps, taking the higher ones of each gender (i.e. Swordmaster has the male STR cap and the female RES cap). Also, enemies will be unisex. Also, either giving female mounties the male mountie Aid formula or giving both the infantry Aid formula.

That's not balance, that's removing diversity between units. Female characters are more nimble and better with magic, while male characters tend to have better physical strength and defense. What's wrong with that?

• Armors have 5 MOV, Generals have 6 MOV, Great Knights and Assassins have 7 MOV and Rogues have 8 MOV.

What do assassins and rogues need increased MOV for?

• Class skills: Myrmidon, Archer, Assassin, Super Recruit and Super Pupil have the same critical bonus as Swordmaster and Berserker, though Archers would lose it from going Ranger and Myrmidons could lose it from going Hero (more on that in a bit). I might even replace Pierce with that same crit bonus (I still haven't gotten over Saleh getting Pierced by Valter and dying in my first playthrough. :cry:). Warriors have the same terrain-crossing capabilities as Berserkers. Thieves and Assassins Pick the same way Rogues do in vanilla and Assassins can Steal the normal way. If at all possible I'd like to give Rogues the ability to Steal any enquipped thing (disregarding the Speed and "must be an item, not a weapon" restrictions) but that could require ASM.

Myrmidons don't need a Crt bonus. Just make enemies not suck, so that their huge Spd and Skl actually matters.

While archers could do with better offense, giving them a Crt bonus seems out of place.

Assassins don't need a Crt bonus. Just make enemies tougher, so that their silencer skill actually has value.

Super recruits already do have a Crt bonus.

Super pupils don't need a Crt bonus, they have every offensive magic type available to use already.

Replacing Pierce with a Crt bonus just because Pierce pisses you off is not balance, it's removing variety. Although Pierce is somewhat broken, I guess...

Warriors don't need the same movement type as berserkers; they have bows. Make bows more useful (for example by making 1-2-range weapons like javelins or hand axes worse) and that'll be enough of an advantage.

Removing the need for lockpicks is not balance either, it's just your preference.

• Promotion changes: I might remove Merc to Ranger because I find it depressing,

That's not balance. In fact, mercenaries' current promotion choices seem pretty reasonably balanced to me - a horse and a somewhat useless secondary weapon type, or no horse, but the awesomeness that is axes?

I WILL replace Super Journeyman with Journeyman to Brigand (same promotion choices as Pirate but uses Hero Crests and of course has different CON and terrain-crossing compared to Pirate, like usual).

Why?

Also, someone who hates brigands becoming a brigand makes no sense whatsoever.

I might replace Super Pupil and Super Recruit with Monk and Wyvern Rider (respectively). Priest to Druid or Summoner as a third option, Myrmidon to Hero as a third option (though I would have to grab the Hero F sprite from FE6 for Marisa).

That's not balance, and a light magic class becoming a dark magic class no matter what makes absolutely no sense.

• General has C in all its weapon types, GK has D in all its weapon types, Warriors have D Bows, Hero MIGHT have E Axes but I'm very unsure about it.

If anything, I'd lower the other classes' new weapon ranks to what they were in FE6/7 (that being E in most cases). What do you have your specialists for if someone else basically makes them obsolete upon promotion?

• Dancers have E Light because I don't like having them unable to fight.

That's not balance, that's "I don't like using a class the way it's meant to be used". Besides, there's a problem with their animation if you have them attack that can cause the game to freeze.

• I'd optimally like to change the way magic swords work and let people get unlimited S ranks (like FE6) but that could be tricky.

FE6 didn't boost your Hit and Crt for those S ranks, though. FE8 does. Giving the player the ability to obtain multiple S ranks is unnecessary if you ask me. Besides, if you have to choose one weapon to S-rank, but have multiple units of that class, that add least keeps a tiny bit of diversity between them if you have them choose different weapons to S-rank.

• General buffs to Light, Dark, Swords and Bows.

I don't think swords or bows need to be buffed - making light swords buyable and giving enemies non-crappy Avd would easily fix swords, and making lances' and axes' 1-2-range options less good, as well as 2-range attacks more useful in player phase (by making enemies more dangerous, for example), would probably fix bows.

• Short Bow will be 1-2 range. May or may not make Nidhogg 1-2 range too.

What's the point? Allowing archers to make melee attacks is completely out-of-character and completely misses the point of the class. Increase the need for 2-range attacks during player phases and bows will be fine.

• Blades will get enhanced Might/Hit with lower Weight and 3 WEXP for all of them.

What's wrong with blades as they currently are? I can see why one might want to change the silver blade a bit, but I honestly don't see the issue with the steel and iron blades.

• Devil Axe will be a bit lighter and very accurate (Akaneia style!) and I'd like to change its backfire formula to (21 - Luck)%, WITHOUT THE THING THAT PREVENTS IT BECOMING 0%!

What's the point of it being a devil weapon if it cannot backfire? Again, that's not balance, that's "let's remove something because I happen to not like it".

• All Light tomes have the same monster bonus as Ivaldi, but none of them override Slayer.

What's the point? Light magic already has the advantage of guaranteed WTA against monster magic users.

• Shamshir will be upgraded in every stat (including 60 uses) and made a personal weapon for Marisa.

What's the point?

Gilliam will get a personal Axeslayer (it is to the Axereaver as the Swordslayer is to the Swordreaver).

What's the point? Gilliam doesn't need to be able to OHKO every axe user ever to be useful - simply make his tankiness more practical (for example by making enemies more dangerous).

L'arachel will get a personal Staff (bright pink, higher use Mend with a massive EXP gain and 1-2 range).

What's the point? Simply increase her base level to something reasonable and be done with it.

• Dragonstone will DEFINITELY have infinite uses, and MIGHT have 1-2 range.

Dude, that thing is already broken as heck with just 50 uses. Not being able to continue using Myrrh in the creature campaign is meh, but do we really need any more roflstomp in this game? If you really must continue using her, simply add buyable dragonstones to one of the secret shops on the world map (as you can't access them during the main game) and be done with it. Make them expensive.

• Different bonuses for statboosters.

What's wrong with them as they currently are? Angelic robes are vastly better than everything else, but other than that I don't see any issues.

• Seth is now a General with the same bases (with the exceptions of A Axes but 0 Luck) but very low growths (15% HP, 10% STR/DEF/SPD, 5% everything else).

That's not gonna stop him from roflstomping the game. His bases are the issue, not his growths.

• Gilliam has somewhat higher stats (mainly Speed).

Dude, he's supposed to have bad Spd. He's a freaking armor knight. Make him a bit tankier, make said tankiness more needed and you've got a solid unit.

• Marisa has MUCH higher stats (still starting at a lower level than Josh but with bases that beat him at a higher level and better growths than him in literally everything).

Marisa may be terrible, but making her better than Joshua in everything isn't "balance", it's "I like Marisa better than Joshua, so let's make her ridiculous".

• Dozla and Syrene having halfway decent stats.

Their stats are decent enough. Maybe give Dozla 2 more Spd and Syrene a bit more HP, but other than that I don't see the issue with them.

• L'arachel with higher bases, growths and starting level (Yep, I'm BUFFING her!).

Her growths are decent enough, there's no reason to buff those. A higher base level with accordingly adjusted bases will make her usable just fine.

• Tethys with exsitent stats.

Tethys' stats are great (especially considering she's an unpromoted unit), what's your problem?

Edited by Shade of Shadow

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Just have it give miniscule bonuses but be infinite. Like, instead of Strength +12, Skill +12, Defence +15, Resistance +20 just make them +4s or some shit.

Sounds pretty decent.

Only thought: Would that make Myrrh suck at first with the smaller bonuses? If so, maybe give her higher bases and lower growths.

There are like, 80 enemies left after you get myrrh, in the whole game. Are you runing a myrrh solo after you get her or something?

Then I stand by my second statement.

Also, it's mostly just a matter of principle and there's the Creature Campaign (not like I'd make the hack with that in mind but the people playing it might be interested).

I'll check out Shadow's post in a bit, he ninja'd me and it's rather long so it could take me a while.

Edited by CrashGordon94

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Doing it in another post because it's a biggie.

Also, not bothering with any instead of "Why?", "That's not balance" or "What's the point?", none of those are helpful.

that's just removing interesting gameplay elements.

You say "interesting", I say "irredeemably awful".

FOW gives us irritating, unpleasant and downright nerve-wracking guesswork.

Status Staffs and Stone give us horrible luck-basedness (as opposed to good luck-basedness... which is already a controversial thing).

Lockpicks give us a terrible and unnecessary limit on the capabilities of an already screwed over class. BTW, did Thieves break the game in Tellius or Akaneia when they didn't need these? Nope.

Besides, those are, like, the only remotely challenging chapters in the game to begin with; if anything, I'd raise all other chapters to the difficulty of these four chapters rather than do the opposite.

I hate those chapters, and a lot of people hate the last two. Besides I already mentioned a buff to enemy stats and stuff for difficulty and these chapters did difficulty wrong anyway.

While increased staff EXP may not be that bad an idea (it is difficult to promote staff users in a timely fashion if you're aiming for Lv20 - although you could just make use of staves other than Heal or Mend and be done with it), a "huge" boost is unnecessary.

Fair enough, but that's not too huge anyway.

That's not balance, that's removing diversity between units. Female characters are more nimble and better with magic, while male characters tend to have better physical strength and defense. What's wrong with that?

It's fucking sexist! They can be "diverse" without bringing their plumbing into it.

Myrmidons don't need a Crt bonus. Just make enemies not suck, so that their huge Spd and Skl actually matters.

But it would be nice and it fits. Also, it goes with the diversity thing (and does it a lot better than that sexism bullshit) by giving them something before promotion that Mercs don't have. Mostly, I just don't see the problem.

While archers could do with better offense, giving them a Crt bonus seems out of place.

No it's not.

Assassins don't need a Crt bonus. Just make enemies tougher, so that their silencer skill actually has value.

Yes they do.

Super recruits already do have a Crt bonus.

I wasn't aware of that, do they really?

Super pupils don't need a Crt bonus, they have every offensive magic type available to use already.

Don't see the problem, sorry. And apparently having all three isn't good enough to offset Staffs anyway...

Replacing Pierce with a Crt bonus just because Pierce pisses you off is not balance, it's removing variety. Although Pierce is somewhat broken, I guess...

Not all variety is good variety

Warriors don't need the same movement type as berserkers; they have bows. Make bows more useful (for example by making 1-2-range weapons like javelins or hand axes worse) and that'll be enough of an advantage.

Yes they do. And no, Bows won't be enough.

In fact, mercenaries' current promotion choices seem pretty reasonably balanced to me - a horse and a somewhat useless secondary weapon type, or no horse, but the awesomeness that is axes?

Fair enough but I really hate Merc to Ranger, that's the main thing.

someone who hates brigands becoming a brigand makes no sense whatsoever.

Fair enough, I just

and a light magic class becoming a dark magic class no matter what makes absolutely no sense.

Good thing it wasn't a light magic class then!

If anything, I'd lower the other classes' new weapon ranks to what they were in FE6/7 (that being E in most cases). What do you have your specialists for if someone else basically makes them obsolete upon promotion?

1) It won't make them obsolete.

2) Generals need their high ranks and GKs need higher ranks than Paladins as an incentive to use them. E Bows is not good enough for Warriors, at all, EVER!

that's "I don't like using a class the way it's meant to be used".

Dancers could fight in Akaneia and Jugdral, do you have a problem with that?

Besides, there's a problem with their animation if you have them attack that can cause the game to freeze.

Fair enough then, thanks. Didn't someone get past that though?

FE6 didn't boost your Hit and Crt for those S ranks, though. FE8 does.

Then I could take that out, and it's not like that's a big deal anyway.

Giving the player the ability to obtain multiple S ranks is unnecessary if you ask me.

And I disagree.

Besides, if you have to choose one weapon to S-rank, but have multiple units of that class, that add least keeps a tiny bit of diversity between them if you have them choose different weapons to S-rank.

Unnecessary diversity.

I don't think swords or bows need to be buffed - making light swords buyable and giving enemies non-crappy Avd would easily fix swords, and making lances' and axes' 1-2-range options less good, as well as 2-range attacks more useful in player phase (by making enemies more dangerous, for example), would probably fix bows.

Fair enough.

What's wrong with blades as they currently are? I can see why one might want to change the silver blade a bit, but I honestly don't see the issue with the steel and iron blades.

They're too heavy for anyone but Mercs and don't offer a lot in return.

What's the point of it being a devil weapon if it cannot backfire?

Good thing it can backfire! The only way it won't is if the user has 21 or more Luck. This would put more value on Luck (well, only for certain units but Luck needs everything it can get, it would seem...).

Light magic already has the advantage of guaranteed WTA against monster magic users.

And that's the only thing it has on them. Not all monsters are magic users.

Gilliam doesn't need to be able to OHKO every axe user ever to be useful - simply make his tankiness more practical (for example by making enemies more dangerous).

Fair enough. Perhaps an Axreaver or something though, I don't want him fucked over by Axeland in the beginning. Alternatively I could put less Axe users in the beginning, one of the two.

Simply increase her base level to something reasonable and be done with it.

Meh, okay, maybe. Not much to say about this one.

Dude, that thing is already broken as heck with just 50 uses. Not being able to continue using Myrrh in the creature campaign is meh, but do we really need any more roflstomp in this game? If you really must continue using her, simply add buyable dragonstones to one of the secret shops on the world map (as you can't access them during the main game) and be done with it. Make them expensive.

Heh, maybe. Fair enough but I don't like the idea of her being rendered useless in the main campaign if she runs out.

What's wrong with them as they currently are? Angelic robes are vastly better than everything else, but other than that I don't see any issues.

Well, for one thing the staboosters that boost "lesser" stats are often passed over or don't actually fix the problem for someone who has a proper problem with them. Mostly the first one in this game though, admittedly.

A lot of peopel sell the Goddess Icon, but maybe they wouldn't if it gave more Luck? Or maybe it would but at least it might be worth something.

That's not gonna stop him from roflstomping the game. His bases are the issue, not his growths.

Fair enough.

Dude, he's supposed to have bad Spd. He's a freaking armor knight. Make him a bit tankier, make said tankiness more needed and you've got a solid unit.

Fair enough, but it doesn't need to be as low as it is.

Marisa may be terrible, but making her better than Joshua in everything isn't "balance", it's "I like Marisa better than Joshua, so let's make her ridiculous".

No, it's "Let's give something to Marisa so she can make up for Joshua's enormous availability lead.". I'll admit that might be overkill but she does need noticeably better stats, availability is worth a lot in this one.

Their stats are decent enough. Maybe give Dozla 2 more Spd and Syrene a bit more HP, but other than that I don't see the issue with them.

I disagree. I think they'll need more than that.

Her growths are decent enough, there's no reason to buff those. A higher base level with accordingly adjusted bases will make her usable just fine.

Fair enough.

Tethys' stats are great (especially considering she's an unpromoted unit), what's your problem?

I meant to say OFFENSIVE stats. I thought she had no STR or SKL in the original because she couldn't attack, but she can now so she'll need those.

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I'd LP this. With commentary.

Also you won't be able to do some of this, especially not if you're too lazy to find links to FEditor.

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Also you won't be able to do some of this, especially not if you're too lazy to find links to FEditor.

Fair enough.

And I never said that, in fact I said the opposite, I was willing to look for them, I just didn't at that point in time.

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Not gonna play because there is about 2 classes I can accept Seth in (General is not one of them) and I don't like many of the changes made (which has already been addressed by other people so talking about it more is redundant), but I will applaud you for removing cap differences between m/f. I always thought that limiting them is pretty pointless when you already have bases/growth do the separation for you by character and further differentiation within a class based on gender is just so unnecessary. Esp. in the case of FE6 where Dorothy's str greatly surpasses Wolt's if both are trained. Not that they'll ever hit it unless you go super slow since shitty bases and all and 20/20 is pretty hard to get but you get what I mean. The con difference makes sense, but I'd just leave it at a 1 difference and no more. And some can be character-based.

I think the female tag should just be used on the pegasi and magical cavalry for the 20 - aid thing. Pegasi is around the same size as horses, but wings take up space and they have to deal with extra force to lift people off the ground so they should have less. Wyverns and Dragons are bigger than horses, but same argument with wings so they can have the same as warhorses. The mage horse differentiation is mainly a balance thing since someone like Lute who's 6 con as a MK will have 19 aid if you give her the male formula, and male magi aren't that much bigger to have 20-con hurt their rescue much. That way it's differentiated by mount and it won't hurt the rescues of say, female paladins (Isa after a bajilion body rings come to mind in FE7 since I don't use Amelia) much while keeping Peg rescue not utterly ridiculous.

Edited by Luminescent Blade

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While increased staff EXP may not be that bad an idea (it is difficult to promote staff users in a timely fashion if you're aiming for Lv20 - although you could just make use of staves other than Heal or Mend and be done with it),

Even with the use of other staves it's very difficult for them to approach the level of dedicated combat units. I think that FEDS staff exp is good enough; DoF went too far by adding a flat +10 exp.

That's not balance, that's removing diversity between units. Female characters are more nimble and better with magic, while male characters tend to have better physical strength and defense. What's wrong with that?

Crash is hardly the first to complain about different stat caps. And really, if there's going to be a difference between male and female units, it could be reflected in their bases and growths, rather than their caps.

Super pupils don't need a Crt bonus, they have every offensive magic type available to use already.

Super Pupil is quite frankly, one of the worst promotion options in the game. No staves and poor CON, in exchange for what; useless light magic? Or semi-useless dark magic? I guess if light magic and dark magic are going to be useful, it might be OP, but I doubt it.

If anything, I'd lower the other classes' new weapon ranks to what they were in FE6/7 (that being E in most cases).

And in FE6/7, secondary weapon types were useless except in a few cases.

What do you have your specialists for if someone else basically makes them obsolete upon promotion?

If you think that D Rank Axes is going to make Garcia obsolete, you're stupid. D ranks can't use Killers, or Reavers, or Silvers, or the all-important S Rank weapons.

What's the point? Allowing archers to make melee attacks is completely out-of-character

I'm not really sure how it's out of Neimi or Innes' character for them to make melee attacks. After all, Neimi can already make melee attacks as a Ranger.

What's the point? Light magic already has the advantage of guaranteed WTA against monster magic users.

Uh, so what? Having WTA against gorgons isn't really that great; the extra avoid is nice, but it's unlikely to make the difference between ORKO and 2RKO. Certainly, Sage is currently inferior to Mage Knight, so it would be nice for Light magic to be more meaningful.

What's the point?

I don't know if you noticed, but Marisa is a shit character and needs a buff. Don't tell me you think Marisa is good as she is?

Dude, that thing is already broken as heck with just 50 uses.

Myrrh isn't broken, sorry.

What's wrong with them as they currently are? Angelic robes are vastly better than everything else, but other than that I don't see any issues.

They... really aren't?

That's not gonna stop him from roflstomping the game. His bases are the issue, not his growths.

Uh, in dondon's playthrough even though Seth was still good, he did falter against midgame bosses and promoted enemies. This Seth is going to be worse, since he won't have the benefit of 8 move.

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Not gonna play because there is about 2 classes I can accept Seth in

Paladin and Archer (F), right?

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Or we can just combine Archer F and pole Dancer

I was actually thinking Dragonknight(yay more broken why the fuck not FE8 is already a cakewalk so more broken is just gonna make hilarious roflstomp more hilarious) but I honestly just didn't remember to think of ArcherF and Dancer while I was also typing my hw at the same time so 4 classes total :M

Even with the use of other staves it's very difficult for them to approach the level of dedicated combat units. I think that FEDS staff exp is good enough; DoF went too far by adding a flat +10 exp.

We changed that back anyway

Edited by Luminescent Blade

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LET'S DO WHAT THAT OTHER GUY DID

(except different)

• Removing FOW, Status Staffs, Stone and Lockpicks because I hate them.

Look, chief, I'm sorry if you're butthurt. "Because I hate them" isn't a good reason to do things, ever. You can come up with good reasons to remove lockpicks (except then you have to make rogues non-redundant or something) but "because I hate them" is NOT a good reason. I am calling this POINT #1 from now on, and will mention it again.

• Some chapters will be made a little easier (5, 6, 11B and 14B mostly.).

Sure, whatever. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with 6 without FoW and I don't think 5 is exceptionally difficult (and I didn't think they were on my first play) but apparently I'm a genius. Also, if this is a balance overhaul (which it is) you should not be pointing to specific chapters yet. Overhaul the balance, see how things fall, THEN tweak chapters to suit your needs. 5 might end up just being a lolfest once you're done implementing everything else.

• Staff EXP increased hugely, to DS levels or beyond.

Because...why? If the answer is "because I don't like healers not fighting", POINT #1. If you're not playing SUPER OPTIMAL EFFICIENCY MODE -E- it's not hard to get any healer (even l'arachel) to 10 and promote them. I could see maybe 10 Heal, 15 Mend and follow a trend like that but "hugely" increasing leads one to a situation where your healers outstrip everybody else vastly. And that's just as not-fun as your healers getting outstripped.

• Gender stuff: I will give all female classes with a male counterpart (i.e. Myrmidon) the same CON as the male version and both versions will have the same caps, taking the higher ones of each gender (i.e. Swordmaster has the male STR cap and the female RES cap). Also, enemies will be unisex. Also, either giving female mounties the male mountie Aid formula or giving both the infantry Aid formula.

Sure, fine, homogenize shit. I think it's dumb, you're going to call me a sexist pig, I'm going to call you a daft cunt, there we just had that entire argument and you didn't have to bother.

And if you're going to fully unsexistify this, give us female everything there's a male version of and male everything there's a female version of. Don't halfass it.

• Armors have 5 MOV, Generals have 6 MOV, Great Knights and Assassins have 7 MOV and Rogues have 8 MOV.

Half: sure, whatever. I'd up the basic footsoldiers (Myrms, maybe Archers) to 6 so that Armors are still slower than unencumbered soldiers (because that makes sense) but 4 MOV is painful. Rogue at 8 MOV though? What? Rennac can run as fast as any given horse or pegasus? If you want to help Rogue mobility, lower their terrain penalties drastically to represent their light kit or osmethne.

• Class skills: Myrmidon, Archer, Assassin, Super Recruit and Super Pupil have the same critical bonus as Swordmaster and Berserker, though Archers would lose it from going Ranger and Myrmidons could lose it from going Hero (more on that in a bit). I might even replace Pierce with that same crit bonus (I still haven't gotten over Saleh getting Pierced by Valter and dying in my first playthrough. :cry:). Warriors have the same terrain-crossing capabilities as Berserkers. Thieves and Assassins Pick the same way Rogues do in vanilla and Assassins can Steal the normal way. If at all possible I'd like to give Rogues the ability to Steal any enquipped thing (disregarding the Speed and "must be an item, not a weapon" restrictions) but that could require ASM.

Take away the unpromoted critical bonus. That should be only on promotion for Sniper/Sin. Pierce is fine as is - Saleh would have just gotten crit and died to Valter in that same scenario and again, POINT #1. Warriors having the waterwalk means Warriors > Berzerkers unconditionally. This is balance? Assassins need to have a disadvantage compared to Rogues; if both can Pick and Assassins can Lethalize Rogues become utterly redundant and That's Not Balance. Rogues stealing equipped things is ...just ...why. Half the enemies in the game (the Slayable half) have weapons that would just break the game if you could Steal them (dark bishop moulder legit lol) or Rogues would still be < Assassins because there's nothing to steal except Irons for most of the game. That's Not Balance.

• Promotion changes: I might remove Merc to Ranger because I find it depressing, if I do I'll either leave Hero as the only choice or replace it with Merc to Swordmaster. I WILL replace Super Journeyman with Journeyman to Brigand (same promotion choices as Pirate but uses Hero Crests and of course has different CON and terrain-crossing compared to Pirate, like usual). I might replace Super Pupil and Super Recruit with Monk and Wyvern Rider (respectively). Priest to Druid or Summoner as a third option, Myrmidon to Hero as a third option (though I would have to grab the Hero F sprite from FE6 for Marisa).

Merc/Ranger removal: POINT #1. I don't care that you don't find it unproductive; you should always have a reason for doing things beyond "I feel like it." I will hammer this into you as much as is necessary.

Journeyman to Brigand is asinine from a canon standpoint and pointless from a gameplay standpoint (oooh it's a pirate with like an extra con and no waterwalk?). Not that Super Journeyman is the epitome of good, but adding Brigand is just daft.

Super Pupil to Monk is just ...why. Again, same as the above one. Super Recruit to Wyvern Rider?

Priest to Druid/Summoner is just stupid from every logical standpoint. I'm sorry.

Myrmidon to Hero is ...also pretty daft but not as bad as every one of your other ones.

• General has C in all its weapon types, GK has D in all its weapon types, Warriors have D Bows, Hero MIGHT have E Axes but I'm very unsure about it. Might give Wyvern Lords Axes instead of Swords but that could be tricky.

Again, why?

• Give Recruit (2) high Speed and give Pupil (2) Anima/Light or Anima/Light/Dark, if I keep them.

Don't budget for fixing things that you're on the fence about removing; either plan to remove them or plan to fix them. It's inefficient to do both instead of tackling "should they exist". Also, how do you propose to give Recruit (2) high Speed? Give her like a 6-point promotion upgrade?

• Super Trainees don't have to be unlocked, if they're actually kept.

Sure, whatever, who really cares.

• Dancers have E Light because I don't like having them unable to fight.

Okay, this one. For the love of fuck, why? If you're going to give them weapons at all, just give them the classic FE Dancer weapon (it's swords - you may not have known) and be done with it. They're supposed to be shitty fighters, that's why they're support units. Since I suspect it's your whole reasoning (you practically said it), POINT #1.

• I'd optimally like to change the way magic swords work and let people get unlimited S ranks (like FE6) but that could be tricky.

1: Change magic swords how, exactly?

2: Why multiple Ses? S actually matters in this game for things (the hit bonus representing a true mastery or osmethne) so you want units who can ...just master all weapons? Why? It's not like you're limited in picking WHICH weapon your units master unlike, say, FE10.

• General buffs to Light, Dark, Swords and Bows.

• Steel Swords and Steel Bows will give 2 WEXP.

• Steel Axe will be D rank.

ok whatever

• Short Bow will be 1-2 range. May or may not make Nidhogg 1-2 range too.

Lots of people float this idea around, so whatever. Not like it hasn't been said before.

• Blades will get enhanced Might/Hit with lower Weight and 3 WEXP for all of them.

So Blades are, what, Swords+? It sounds like they have no appreciable downsides compared to Swords anymore (let's make their positives more positive and their negatives less negative!). That's Not Balance.

• Devil Axe will be a bit lighter and very accurate (Akaneia style!) and I'd like to change its backfire formula to (21 - Luck)%, WITHOUT THE THING THAT PREVENTS IT BECOMING 0%!

Yeah, a Devil Axe that never backfires! Wait, what?

• General weight reduction for tomes, so that Light is lighter than Anima, Dark doesn't cripple everyone and S rank tomes aren't stupidly impractical.

ok whatever as long as it actually matters unlike the games where tome weight is < most magician's CON.

• All Light tomes have the same monster bonus as Ivaldi, but none of them override Slayer.

Jesus, no. Suddenly Artur is dishing 1RKOs on any monster ever. This is a wretched idea unless you intend to make Light suck against human enemies, and even then it's still a really shitty idea because Creature Campaign.

• Shamshir will be upgraded in every stat (including 60 uses) and made a personal weapon for Marisa. Gilliam will get a personal Axeslayer (it is to the Axereaver as the Swordslayer is to the Swordreaver). L'arachel will get a personal Staff (bright pink, higher use Mend with a massive EXP gain and 1-2 range).

Why not just buff them appropriately, rather than having super weapons? It makes a hell of a lot more sense.

• Dragonstone will DEFINITELY have infinite uses, and MIGHT have 1-2 range.

Probably the worst idea in the whole bunch. Do you realize that after a few levels Myrrh 1RKOs everything? Do you really want players to have an infinite use 1-range 1RKO-everything-and-never-die flying machine? That's Not Balance.

If you're really butthurt about not getting to use Myrrh forever just make Dragonstones Secret Shop fodder.

• Different bonuses for statboosters.

Ooh, you've hit a point (the point is that luck sucks). Except, you're fixing it wrong. People would still probably vendor the Goddess Icon if it gave +5 LCK because Luck still sucks. 2 Luck, 5 Luck, 7 Luck, it still sucks. Fix Luck, the statboosters are fine.

• Many are indirectly buffed or nerfed by the aforementioned changes.

no shit, you don't say?

• Seth is now a General with the same bases (with the exceptions of A Axes but 0 Luck) but very low growths (15% HP, 10% STR/DEF/SPD, 5% everything else).

HEY EVERYBODY CRASH HATES JEIGANS

wow isn't that a surprise

And if your response is "that's what jeigans are SUPPOSED to be" kindly fuck off.

• Neimi now has high offensive bases and marginally better defensive ones.

I approve.

• Lute has higher bases.

Why does Lute have higher bases?

• The trainees have higher bases and growths (Ross slightly so, Ewan and Amelia EXTREMELY so) and they all will have VERY Luck (including 100%+ for all three of them).

Luck still sucks, dude. Also, if you give them higher bases, they're going to be ...regular Tier 1 units with higher growths and extra levels to grow? That's Not Balance.

• Gilliam has somewhat higher stats (mainly Speed).

Do you not understand what an Armor Knight is?

• Marisa has MUCH higher stats (still starting at a lower level than Josh but with bases that beat him at a higher level and better growths than him in literally everything).

Oh so you're buffing Marisa a lot AND giving her a PRF weapon. That's a good, balanced idea.

/sarcasm

wait why am i turning sarcasm off i'll probably need it again

• Dozla and Syrene having halfway decent stats.

Sure, they need it.

• L'arachel with higher bases, growths and starting level (Yep, I'm BUFFING her!).

And a PRF weapon. See Marisa. And higher Staff XP (much higher!) so she promotes faster and

• Tethys with exsitent stats.

She's a Dancer.

• Knoll having better stats.

ok he needs it

OVERALL:

Think, dude. I think I provided enough up there that you won't just say "OH INTEG HATES THIS BECAUSE IT'S BY ME" but half of your changes are seriously illogical, a third are just retarded and the remaining are just shit people have said before.

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Also, Dancers doubling something via magic will freeze the game unless you turn battle animations for them off via the options menu.

Or modify the animation.

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• Seth is now a General with the same bases (with the exceptions of A Axes but 0 Luck) but very low growths (15% HP, 10% STR/DEF/SPD, 5% everything else).

...And he's still the best unit in the game. Possibly after Franz, now.

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...And he's still the best unit in the game. Possibly after Franz, now.

Well Duessel is in the running as well now due to the 7 move Great Knights will have.

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HEY EVERYBODY CRASH HATES JEIGANS

wow isn't that a surprise

And if your response is "that's what jeigans are SUPPOSED to be" kindly fuck off.

Yeah, Seth is SUPPOSED to ruin FE8.

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Woah man Crash you have to do this. FE8 was super hard to begin with, you must make it easier!

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And if you're going to fully unsexistify this, give us female everything there's a male version of and male everything there's a female version of. Don't halfass it.

Way to be demanding. Crash would have to come up with new animations and more than a few new characters in order to have female summoners, soldiers, brigands, berserkers, warriors, pupils, journeymen, fighters, warriors, pirates, priests, and male recruits, pegasus knights, falcoknights, troubadours, clerics, valkyries.

Warriors having the waterwalk means Warriors > Berzerkers unconditionally.

How so? Berserkers still have a critical boost and more speed on promotion.

This is balance? Assassins need to have a disadvantage compared to Rogues; if both can Pick and Assassins can Lethalize Rogues become utterly redundant and That's Not Balance.

Rogues have 1 more move. That's a pretty significant gap!

Rogues stealing equipped things is ...just ...why. Half the enemies in the game (the Slayable half) have weapons that would just break the game if you could Steal them (dark bishop moulder legit lol) or Rogues would still be < Assassins because there's nothing to steal except Irons for most of the game. That's Not Balance.

Well, Crash has already said that Stone will be removed from the game. It would be pretty silly to have rogues be capable of stealing Rotten Claws though!

Merc/Ranger removal: POINT #1. I don't care that you don't find it unproductive; you should always have a reason for doing things beyond "I feel like it." I will hammer this into you as much as is necessary.

Journeyman to Brigand is asinine from a canon standpoint and pointless from a gameplay standpoint (oooh it's a pirate with like an extra con and no waterwalk?).

Well, the distinction between Pirate and Fighter is already pretty fine. It's 1 point of CON and waterwalk...

Ross as a Mercenary would be cooler I think.

Super Pupil to Monk is just ...why. Again, same as the above one.

I like the idea, personally. It has a certain symmetry; Ewan can pick between Dark, Anima and Light. It's not like Shaman!Ewan ever made that much sense in the first place...

So Blades are, what, Swords+? It sounds like they have no appreciable downsides compared to Swords anymore (let's make their positives more positive and their negatives less negative!). That's Not Balance.

They're less common and more expensive, and require a higher rank to wield. Like Silver Swords or something.

Jesus, no. Suddenly Artur is dishing 1RKOs on any monster ever.

How is that different from before...?

Probably the worst idea in the whole bunch. Do you realize that after a few levels Myrrh 1RKOs everything? Do you really want players to have an infinite use 1-range 1RKO-everything-and-never-die flying machine? That's Not Balance.

It's not like Myrrh will reasonably run out of dragonstone uses in the main game anyway! I don't think that Myrrh is broken with 50 uses, so why should she be broken with infinite?

Ooh, you've hit a point (the point is that luck sucks). Except, you're fixing it wrong. People would still probably vendor the Goddess Icon if it gave +5 LCK because Luck still sucks.

I wouldn't. +5 luck is pretty significant.

2 Luck, 5 Luck, 7 Luck, it still sucks. Fix Luck, the statboosters are fine.

Luck doesn't need "fixing".

HEY EVERYBODY CRASH HATES JEIGANS

wow isn't that a surprise

And if your response is "that's what jeigans are SUPPOSED to be" kindly fuck off.

So... Jeigans are supposed to be capable of soloing the game?

Maybe you should take a look at Jagen and Arran, because yeah, some Jeigans ARE supposed to be like that!

Why does Lute have higher bases?

Because she's a bad unit right now who isn't worth using for anything other than a staffbot.

Luck still sucks, dude.

Uh, it really doesn't?

Also, if you give them higher bases, they're going to be ...regular Tier 1 units with higher growths and extra levels to grow? That's Not Balance.

Crash only said their bases and growths would be improved on what they currently are. So I'm imagining that they'd have growths on par with normal tier 1 units, and bases such that they're not at risk of being ORKOed in their first chapter.

Do you not understand what an Armor Knight is?

hey look it's draug meg gatrie tauroneo

all armours with good growths and nobody threw a hissy fit and nobody's cat died

Oh so you're buffing Marisa a lot AND giving her a PRF weapon. That's a good, balanced idea.

yeah because marisa is already such a powerhouse

/sarcasm

She's a Dancer.

I remind you that of all the dancers in FE more than half have been able to wield weapons. If anything, GBA Dancers are the exception, not the rule.

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Way to be demanding. Crash would have to come up with new animations and more than a few new characters in order to have female summoners, soldiers, brigands, berserkers, warriors, pupils, journeymen, fighters, warriors, pirates, priests, and male recruits, pegasus knights, falcoknights, troubadours, clerics, valkyries.

Point granted. That was a bit of hyperbole, ill-targeted.

How so? Berserkers still have a critical boost and more speed on promotion.

tbh I forgot about the critical boost. As it stands, though, Berzerkers have a whopping +1 SPD on promotion. I hardly find that worth nothing.

You could say that they have better caps and yeah, I'd agree.

Rogues have 1 more move. That's a pretty significant gap!

This is Crash, Annie. MOV is overrated, remember?

Well, Crash has already said that Stone will be removed from the game. It would be pretty silly to have rogues be capable of stealing Rotten Claws though!

Fair point on Stone, but Demon Surge and whatnot would all still be Stealable. Or, more pertinently, Shadowshot would be. He could rebalance them to have uses, but I still think it's a poor idea all told.

Well, the distinction between Pirate and Fighter is already pretty fine. It's 1 point of CON and waterwalk...

It's true, so why would we have another class that's mostly the same as the two that are already there, especially if it entails the same (?) promotion options as one of the other two?

Ross as a Mercenary would be cooler I think.

I wholeheartedly concur.

I like the idea, personally. It has a certain symmetry; Ewan can pick between Dark, Anima and Light. It's not like Shaman!Ewan ever made that much sense in the first place...

Honestly, I think Ewan's promotion path is just a huge load of fuck as it stands, so I guess Monk wouldn't make as much difference as I seem to think.

They're less common and more expensive, and require a higher rank to wield. Like Silver Swords or something.

Yes, but they're a whole *class* of Silver Swords with hierarchy. Sure, as it stands, Blades sorta blow overall but I'd rather see something good done with them rather than "make them a higher tier of swords".

How is that different from before...?

Um, what? Pre-promotion, Artur most certainly isn't 1RKOing all monsters. Once he hits Bishop, the change would be irrelevant because he'd have Slayer. The only thing it would do, I guess, would be to make Saleh ...even more better?

It's not like Myrrh will reasonably run out of dragonstone uses in the main game anyway! I don't think that Myrrh is broken with 50 uses, so why should she be broken with infinite?

Because Myrrh becomes essentially invincible once she has levels? I grant you, it really only matters if we care at all about the Creature Campaign (I managed to burn through Myrrh's 50 once. ever.) but if we're only doing it for the main campaign and fuck CC why change it to infinite?

I wouldn't. +5 luck is pretty significant.

Luck doesn't need "fixing".

Uh, it really doesn't?

That was a pretty terrible example, I'll be honest. But besides increasing the +2 LCK to something bigger, what else needs changed about statboosters? That was more the point.

So... Jeigans are supposed to be capable of soloing the game?

No, but he's nerfing Seth into oblivion mostly out of spite - or at least that's what it looks like. Hell, I could be wrong.

Maybe you should take a look at Jagen and Arran, because yeah, some Jeigans ARE supposed to be like that!

I didn't say that was untrue, I said it didn't *matter*. I'm sorry if I'd rather not see a game explicitly balanced around archetypes.

Because she's a bad unit right now who isn't worth using for anything other than a staffbot.

Fair.

Crash only said their bases and growths would be improved on what they currently are. So I'm imagining that they'd have growths on par with normal tier 1 units, and bases such that they're not at risk of being ORKOed in their first chapter.

• The trainees have higher bases and growths (Ross slightly so, Ewan and Amelia EXTREMELY so) and they all will have VERY Luck (including 100%+ for all three of them).

Maybe I just bought into the hyperbole. /shrug

hey look it's draug meg gatrie tauroneo

all armours with good growths and nobody threw a hissy fit and nobody's cat died

EDIT: I presumed FE11!Draug here and FE10!Gat/T-Ron.

Draug has a 40% SPD growth. It's better than Gilliam's 30, but it isn't tremendous.

Meg is terrible.

Gatrie is just amazing like that.

Tauroneo's a fair point.

That's also 4 armors (3 from the same game) out of how many?

Anyhow, I'm not throwing a fit about improving Gilliam of all things. I think he could stand to use more STR and SKL rather than SPD - keep him slowish.

yeah because marisa is already such a powerhouse

/sarcasm

yeah marisa's awful now but I think he's going way overboard with PRF weapons here.

I remind you that of all the dancers in FE more than half have been able to wield weapons. If anything, GBA Dancers are the exception, not the rule.

I remind you that that quote was about Tethys' stats, not her ability to fight. Sylvia's fighting stats are pretty damned awful too.

And I still think that Light Magic for Dancers is an awful idea, which is why I suggested Swords like all those other Dancers you mentioned.

EDIT2: Wait, hang on. Doing a quick count by character:

Feena, Sylvia, Leen, Laylea, Lara, Feena again could equip weapons

Lalam, Elphin, Ninian, Nils, Reyson, Leanne, Rafiel could not equip weapons

By game:

FE3, 4, 5, 12 could

FE6, 7, 8, 9, 10 couldn't

Even by generation (SNES/DS could, GBA/3D couldn't) it's a half split. Where are you getting more than half? Are you only counting literal dancers?

EDIT3: Or are you counting the Cards as weapons for Reyson/Leanne/Rafiel, even though it's not technically equipping weapons?

Edited by Integrity

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I rebalanced all the Blade weapons for FEPS, actually. I only ever used Iron Blade in GBA FE and the others were ridiculously hard to obtain.

Iron Sword:

Rank: E

Uses: 45

Wgt: 5

Atk: 5

Hit: 90

Crit: 0

Exp per use: 1

Iron Blade:

Rank: D

Uses: 35

Wgt: 6

Atk: 7

Hit: 80

Crit: 5

Exp per use: 2

Steel Sword:

Rank: D

Uses: 30

Wgt: 8

Atk: 9

Hit: 75

Crit: 0

Exp per use: 1

Steel Blade:

Rank: C

Uses: 25

Wgt: 10

Atk: 11

Hit: 70

Crit: 10

Exp per use: 2

Silver Sword:

Rank: B

Uses: 20

Wgt: 12

Atk: 13

Hit: 80

Crit: 0

Exp per use: 2

Silver Blade:

Rank: A

Uses: 15

Wgt: 14

Atk: 17

Hit: 70

Crit: 15

Exp per use: 3

In this manner, Blades are more expensive, but give pretty good weapon experience, deal much more damage, and have slight crit chances as well. To balance out their power, they'll also be a bit more expensive, but I haven't balanced prices yet.

Feel free to use it as a template, if you like.

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Um, what? Pre-promotion, Artur most certainly isn't 1RKOing all monsters. Once he hits Bishop, the change would be irrelevant because he'd have Slayer. The only thing it would do, I guess, would be to make Saleh ...even more better?

I guess it only really makes a difference in Chapter 4...

Saleh ORKOes most midgame monsters already. The only difference is now that he can OHKO with Purge.

Because Myrrh becomes essentially invincible once she has levels? I grant you, it really only matters if we care at all about the Creature Campaign (I managed to burn through Myrrh's 50 once. ever.) but if we're only doing it for the main campaign and fuck CC why change it to infinite?

Because this is crash's hack and if he wants to care about CC he can?

That was a pretty terrible example, I'll be honest. But besides increasing the +2 LCK to something bigger, what else needs changed about statboosters? That was more the point.

Well, there's also Secret Books and Talismans, which I'd imagine would be buffed to +3 or +4 each.

No, but he's nerfing Seth into oblivion mostly out of spite - or at least that's what it looks like. Hell, I could be wrong.

If he was nerfing characters he hated, where is the L'arachel nerf? I think that of all the character nerfs one could make, a nerf for Seth is the most obvious and the last thing that anyone should complain about.

I didn't say that was untrue, I said it didn't *matter*. I'm sorry if I'd rather not see a game explicitly balanced around archetypes.

Does it matter? Crash is clearly the kind of dude that operates off feelings instead of thinking rationally, but most of his feelings in this situation seem to be in the correct direction: nerf Seth, buff trainees.

That's also 4 armors (3 from the same game) out of how many?

Anyhow, I'm not throwing a fit about improving Gilliam of all things. I think he could stand to use more STR and SKL rather than SPD - keep him slowish.

Fair enough.

yeah marisa's awful now but I think he's going way overboard with PRF weapons here.

Perhaps.

I remind you that that quote was about Tethys' stats, not her ability to fight. Sylvia's fighting stats are pretty damned awful too.

And I still think that Light Magic for Dancers is an awful idea, which is why I suggested Swords like all those other Dancers you mentioned.

Fair enough, but there's not much point in giving Tethys any weapon if she'll still have virtually no strength or skill.

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I guess it only really makes a difference in Chapter 4...

Saleh ORKOes most midgame monsters already. The only difference is now that he can OHKO with Purge.

On my inspection, yeah, I think you're right on that one.

Because this is crash's hack and if he wants to care about CC he can?

But if he doesn't care about CC there's no point in making Myrrh's Dragonstone infinite and if he does then making Myrrh's Dragonstone infinite (or, God help us, 1-2 range) is a bad idea. Maybe I shouldn't care about the "pointless" changes.

Well, there's also Secret Books and Talismans, which I'd imagine would be buffed to +3 or +4 each.

Secret Books would have to be to keep them in line with Goddess Icons. Talismans ...I never had a problem with Talismans being +2 RES, but maybe.

If he was nerfing characters he hated, where is the L'arachel nerf? I think that of all the character nerfs one could make, a nerf for Seth is the most obvious and the last thing that anyone should complain about.

He doesn't hate L'Arachel for some reason. I don't get it, really.

That said, I'm not objecting to a Seth nerf. God knows the guy could use it. I'm objecting to the fact that he's nerfing him way further into the ground than he really needs to be, either because he's Seth (in which case I disagree) or because he's a Jeigan and "should be that way" (in which case I disagree).

Does it matter? Crash is clearly the kind of dude that operates off feelings instead of thinking rationally, but most of his feelings in this situation seem to be in the correct direction: nerf Seth, buff trainees.

And I'd like to see it be done in some more imaginative way than "make trainees like est, make seth like jeigan."

Maybe I expect too much of the kid.

Fair enough, but there's not much point in giving Tethys any weapon if she'll still have virtually no strength or skill.

If he gives her Light Magic, she's getting effective bonus on monsters since this is CrashFE, do remember. She'd be a decent fighter against monsters and a pretty shitty one against humans. If he gave her decent stats on top of that, she'd be a better anti-monster fighter than some of your actual fighters.

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