Pokémon "cheating" and a proposal

[Lord Glenn]

(WARNING, LONG POST - SOMEWHAT SERIOUS DISCUSSION-ESQUE)

I was going through my daily pass of gaming sites today when I came across this article: http://kotaku.com/so-many-pokemon-cheaters-entered-online-tournament-1176444879

tl;dr summary: People competing in the Global Showdown tournament "cheated". (And I'm forced to put that in quotations because no gaming site can do a damn bit of journalism and actually get clarification as to what degree of "cheating" took place*.) Over 1500 people, that is, with the majority falling into the oldest age bracket. (*More on this in a moment.)

Obviously, you'd be incredible naive if you didn't think that there was anything going on. With the popularity of battle simluation places like Smogon, the fact that people are using third party applications and websites to engineer "perfect" Pokémon shouldn't be a surprise. Now, in regards to the actual article, it doesn't specify whether the engineering that was caught during the competition was of a ridiculously exaggerated nature (i.e. Pokémon with stat values that they (or no one else for that matter) should be able to attain or having moves that are not legally attainable or not obtained from a distribution event) or simply an extention of the simulation methodology - that is, creating a team full of combatants with perfect IV values, max level, and desired their moves, natures, and EVs without putting any actual effort into it.

Now, I think we can all agree that the former doesn't need to be covered at all - it's stupid, plain and simple. The latter is where things get dicey and why I started to think about this issue and, ultimately, am posting this topic.

For starters, let it be known that I am not entirely opposed to the concept of what goes on at Smogon, etc. If people want to develop and practice strategy in a controlled environment where they can test teams and compete to see who is the best at doing so, by all means, let them. Applying the same principles and taking a shortcut to do so in the actual games for actual competitive use, on the other hand, is taking it a bit far, IMHO. That isn't to say that I don't understand the "why" of the matter, which I'm sure can vary from person to person - some might do it because they don't have the time to raise an entire team, others might do it because they think that having to go through the painstaking process of en masse breeding and grinding because Game Freak doesn't want to get in line with modern times is stupid, etc.

In my eyes, however, I liken it to the current ongoing issue in professional athletics over the use of steroids in competition. Some people play the right way and only rely on their actual ability and practice. Others circumvent all of that and falsely elevate their status. But, for most spectators, the dark thought always seems to creep in that secretly, everyone is probably using steroids anyway, so it's a level playing field. While I'll still have that thought from time to time, I honestly can't believe that every single player is dirty - there has to be someone that's clean - and that's where the extended metaphor comes back to the topic at hand. There have got to be competition players that compete and don't have fully spec'd-out teams that are of simulation quality (or even ones that spend weeks or more to complete the task in-game), and that renders them at a disadvantage against the other players, especially since outside tools are the deciding factor here.

Basically, in layman's terms, so long as one person is competing fairly, the people that just poof their perfect teams into existence for competition are, for all intents and purposes, cheating.

BUT!

This whole situation got me thinking today while I was at work. With X/Y starting to expand how transparent the underlying mechanics actually are (notably right now in regards to EVs), perhaps there's a solution to this predicament that could make everyone happy and potentially even discourage the usage of outside tools for perfection's sake. (Obviously, Game Freak is too oblivious outside of their own little bubble, so this is wishful thinking, but hopefully wishful thinking that can evolve into a meaningful discussion. That is, I highly doubt that any of these comments and suggestions would ever be implemented in a timely fashion by the series's caretaker - maybe if we're lucky, they'll add something like this by 2028.)

As a frustrated semi-fan of the series (to the point that I'm honestly sick of the fact that outside of each generations' mechanics changes, the overall game that I first played in the 90s is fundamentally the same exact thing that still is today - but hey, that's Nintendo in a nutshell, isn't it?), I easily understand the call for Game Freak to get with the times, in more ways than one. I certainly don't have the time or drive to pointlessly grind through boring wild encounters to raise up additional teams of Pokémon when the games don't provide incentive to do so, let alone a more efficient or interesting means of doing it. This also does not even factor in the time required to breed out higher IV values in desired stats, natures, or abilities.

I also see the value in having teams consisting of only simulation-style setups, as then some randomness is removed from the contest - it comes down to the player's decisions (EVs and moves) and skills (anticipation, deduction, reasoning, comprehension, etc.) along with slight amounts of luck (move accuracy, secondary effect chances, and criticals) to determine the victor instead of the RNG Gods giving your desired Pokemon a max IV in a terrible stat and a 5 in its most important stat, making it statistically inferior. (Of course, this introduces the possibility of an even more pronounced focus on "cookie cutter builds", but if Game Freak actually had someone worth their salt on their staff to do balancing, perhaps this wouldn't be as much of an issue.)

This flip side to this value is knowing that the series has inherently adopted the philosophy that if you were to catch two different Caterpies, their starting stats and IVs will ultimately mean that their final stats will possess some variance from each other. I'm always a fan of a little bit of realism being injected into a game if it still allows the game to be fun and enjoyable, so the fact that the game creatures somewhat mimic the real world in that most beings are unique (even if the differences are extremely tiny) is honestly a great mechanic... for part of the overall game.

The single player, non-"competitive" portion of the game (i.e. the copy/paste'd outline of bullet points that every single main series game follows to a 'T') is a great place for maintaining random IVs - it lets each player have a different experience as they go through the game or even lets the same player go through it in a different manner on a second playthrough or on another cartridge (using a different team, using a same Pokémon in the team, but will have different ending stats and maybe even a different nature, etc.). If you hadn't guessed by now, though, my proposal is to completely forget about IVs during any competitive segments of the game or online; that is, simply apply a normalized set of IVs (31s across the board) when the game auto-levels the Pokémon to Lv. 50 or 100 and apply the actual EVs that that Pokémon attained on top like normal.

If such a large number of players are going these routes to make competitives teams, it seems natural to simply level the playing field by default for any situation that would apply to this (places like the Battle Tower, Viridian Trainer House, and especially online battles, etc.) and then revert the IVs back to what they were when transitioning back the single player content. Then, if you want to play competitively, you have one less opaque mechanic that you have to worry about, leaving the player to have to focus on EVs and what moves they want their Pokémon to have, while still allowing the randomness of IVs to exist during the content that the less-competitively inclined will focus on. This does somewhat obsolete the newer mechanics that Game Freak has added to help pass IVs down, but should you want to improve your in-game team's IVs via breeding, you could still do that.

Or, perhaps I'm overthinking things and the people who aren't "cheating" are simply idiots who themselves should get with the times and just do what everyone else seems to be doing.

[Knife]

TL:DR

But it's just a game, so let them cheat if they want. And for those bawwing about the cheaters, it's just a game.

[SaurianGuy]

So max out IVs if the player battles online, make grinding more interesting, make the rng less random and keep everything else the same?

Although people are probably going to cheat anyway even if everything gets streamlined/improved because it's easier and less time consuming.

[Baldrick]

You could have two divisions. The first where you encourage "steroid abuse" by allowing players to build a team from scratch, setting EVs, IVs, abilities and so on. (I guess this is how Smogon and other online battle simulators work already?) The second based on "natural ability and training", where you can enter in-game teams, where teams are checked and disqualified if they have any illegal qualities.

[Phoenix Wright]

TL:DR

But it's just a game, so let them cheat if they want. And for those bawwing about the cheaters, it's just a game.

when a game is competitive, cheaters shouldn't be allowed. do you also think athletes should use steroids?

i think GF should get rid of IVs. it's a dumb system that's completely luck-based and ONLY holds weight in competitive play. why exist at all?

EVs can stay. have two divisions like huck finn said. or wipe the EVs that pokemon have when entering a tournament.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Phoenix Wright

[Samias]

I think the IVs play an important part in Pokemon, but I think the ability to get Pokemon with good IVs should be easier. I know Gamefreak has been trying, implementing things like passing IVs with the Power series of items, but I think there should be more of a guarantee that the children will continually become better than their parents. Right now, progress is pretty nebulous despite being able to control ability and nature easily. That way, the people who are perfectionists will still have something to do, but it also makes it easier for the layperson to become involved in competitive Pokemon without thinking they need to cheat to be competitive.

[Phoenix Wright]

why do find IVs important?

[Samias]

Variation in IVs generates Hidden Powers. It would be nice if the variance in IVs was lessened to make it so Hidden Power was always useful and not potentially bad, but in some cases people rely on Hidden Power being at 60 power and not 70 in addition to finding the ideal type. Right now a random value of 0-31 for all the different stats is pretty extreme. I guess you could make Hidden Power completely random but it's kind of cool to see how it grows in base power based on the overall natural strength of your Pokemon too.

[viyut]

The only way to make these competitions fair is to make people battle with rental pokemon.

And by rental pokemon i mean you can choose any pokemon you'd like, from a list with all pokemon (bar the legends) included, not just six random ones. They should also all have max IV's on every stat (giving them zero IV's would also work). That way it would be completely fair to everyone.

[Icon of Sin]

As long as it remains within the limit of legal movesets, stats, etc., I wouldn't consider it cheating at all.

IVs are an abomination that should be either scrapped or be able to be modified directly in the game at the player's leisure, whether you want perfect 31 across the board, a few values off for a Hidden Power (something else I also hate) or a something different, such as a 0 Speed IV for Payback and Gyro Ball users and such. Besides, I'm sure treating IVs that way will significantly drop the number of those so called cheaters. Shouldn't be too hard to implement either since they already have EV raisers with vitamins and wings, and even Berries to substract EVs.

With the addition of the new Fairy type, IVs will have to be tinkered either way to make it a possible Hidden Power type.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Woodshooter

[Agro]

You could have two divisions. The first where you encourage "steroid abuse" by allowing players to build a team from scratch, setting EVs, IVs, abilities and so on. (I guess this is how Smogon and other online battle simulators work already?) The second based on "natural ability and training", where you can enter in-game teams, where teams are checked and disqualified if they have any illegal qualities.

This would be cool. As nice as it is to train your Pokemon from scratch and wait for them to get the exact features that you want them to have, it's just bloody tedious. It's not like having "cheat" Pokemon (i.e. Pokemon that still follow the rules, but would otherwise take a long time to create) guarantees you a victory anyway. You still have to be good at the game--essentially all it's doing is saving you hours and hours of pointless training and breeding. You still have to know how to make a good team, and guess your opponents moves, and how to use your Pokemon well.

I wouldn't liken it so much to steroid abuse. It would be more like if you played a sport wherein having more expensive equipment means you perform better, but you still need to be good to win. Like, rather than spend hours and hours trying to save up for that equipment, wouldn't it be easier to have someone sponsor you and buy it for you? i hope this makes sense

Edit: better yet, why not have a Pokemon division where you have to craft a team from scratch and have full control over their IVs/EVs? You could even raise the stakes and give the player a set amount of time to prepare a team. All the meanwhile each player is trying to predict what the other will do based on certain criteria/rules that you could set. It would be a different kind of game--one for elitists, pretty much--but if everyone is cheating, you may as well try to make the best of it, no?

Edited August 22, 2013 by Agro

[RJWalker]

With the addition of the new Fairy type, IVs will have to be tinkered either way to make it a possible Hidden Power type.

Hidden Power's mechanics will have to be changed, not IVs.

[Nobody]

I do RNG abuse using a pc program and discovering my card internal ID. I don't think that counts as cheating, though, since you don't have to do any anything to your cartridge, just put some info like the stats of a pokemon you've caught in a certain time and then changing the ds time to the one needed to get a perfect pokemon. I used to breed pokemon, but that takes too long, and RNG abusing I can get a pokemon with perfect IVs in like 5 minutes.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Nobody