Is there any real reason to play the DS remakes over Mystery of the Emblem?

[GreatSaiyaman]

What exactly are all of the differences? (besides obviously changing the graphics and sound)

I know New Mystery let's you make your own character, but didn't Shadow Dragon do something lame like locking characters to certain maps only accessable by having a certain amount of dead units? Plus there is class changing (I'm not a fan - it defeats the point).

Was there anything else? What did you guys think of the different versions? Which would you recommend?

I know I personally just can't stand the DS version's attempt at 3D. It's fugly. Sprites all the way.

Is there any super compelling reason anyone would ever want to play the DS versions of either book over just playing both on the SFC?

[Jedi]

The DS games added multiple difficulty levels, which spice the games up greatly. Reclass also added some new layers to leveling up and tactics.

If you want legitimately the hardest FE it would be 12 on Lunatic. Awakenings pales in comparison in terms of difficulty since its luck based in its first few chapters. 12 requires you have a team of trained veterans over just one or two op units.

[Draco]

Only reason I can think of is if you don't like MU.

[momogeek2141]

It's good if you want a good challenge. I don't know much about shadow dragon, but New Mystery is a great game to play. The avatar is good, the growth rates are good, and the rng isn't a pathetic jerk. The game can easily be beaten without class changing on the easier modes, and in FE3 some characters can't promote. FE12 Lunatic is ridiculous, and FE3 is fairly easy. IMO, FE12>FE3.

[Ϲharlie]

The 3D graphics in the DS games are probably "fugly" because they don't exist. The DS have no 3D graphics at all.

Anyhow, there are definitely reasons to play the DS games over the SNES version. Mystery of the Emblem has not aged very well. The SNES interface is very slow and clumsy, and that alone would be enough for me to consider the remakes superior. Book 1 is not a particularly good remake, either. Five chapters from the original along with several characters were cut. As for New Mystery of the Emblem, there's a lot more than just being able to make your own character. A considerable amount of story content was added. In addition, both games have additional difficulty settings, giving them much more replayability than the originals (which are quite easy).

Honestly the question should be whether or not there are any compelling reasons to play the SNES version. :\

[GreatSaiyaman]

Only reason I can think of is if you don't like MU.

Of course I like the idea of MU. But is that worth suffering through fugly graphics?

One thing I really hated about what little of Mystery I played was that I had to have the animations on just to see what my level ups were. So not having to deal with that would be nice.

Did they change the plot a lot?

[Ishi]

Actually I'd sooner play FE 11 over FE 3 book one but not FE 12 over book two some have better traits.

[GreatSaiyaman]

The 3D graphics in the DS games are probably "fugly" because they don't exist. The DS have no 3D graphics at all.

Anyhow, there are definitely reasons to play the DS games over the SNES version. Mystery of the Emblem has not aged very well. The SNES interface is very slow and clumsy, and that alone would be enough for me to consider the remakes superior. Book 1 is not a particularly good remake, either. Five chapters from the original along with several characters were cut. As for New Mystery of the Emblem, there's a lot more than just being able to make your own character. A considerable amount of story content was added. In addition, both games have additional difficulty settings, giving them much more replayability than the originals (which are quite easy).

Honestly the question should be whether or not there are any compelling reasons to play the SNES version. :\

You knew what I meant and you know it. Instead of using sprites, they used... whatever it is "technically" called that they used. (which just so happens to have a "third dimension" whether or not it jumps out of the screen at you like the 3DS is apparently supposed to - and even if you want to argue that it is certainly more 3D than sprites) But regardless of what it was called and who is or isn't being a smartass - the DS graphics suck.

And I'm not denying that Mystery has aged pretty badly - especially since the latter two games on the same system make it look so bad. It has absolutely aged terribly. I'm simply asking what all exactly was changed, and at the end of the day, which is the definitive version?

I only asked because Shadow Dragon got terrible reviews, and I'm not a fan of the DS remake's graphics anyway.

[TheEnd]

New Mystery is a great remake and we did a decent job translating it, go play it

I know New Mystery let's you make your own character, but didn't Shadow Dragon do something lame like locking characters to certain maps only accessable by having a certain amount of dead units?

Shadow Dragon's terrible paralogue system only involve new characters, so you won't be missing any of the original content by skipping them. Or you could offer blood sacrifices, I don't know. No real supports anyway, might as well go for a change of pace there.

Plus there is class changing (I'm not a fan - it defeats the point).

If you don't like class swapping, don't use it. Simple.

I know I personally just can't stand the DS version's attempt at 3D. It's fugly. Sprites all the way.

If you can deal with FE3's graphics, there's no way you won't be able to deal with FE11/12's.

Did they change the plot a lot?

If anything, Shadow Dragon was criticized for not changing enough.

FE12 mostly adds base conversations. The main story is mostly unaltered - MU is Marth's shadow, so unlike FE13 he has no plotline of his own.

[Icarusu]

Only reason I can think of is if you don't like MU.

[TheEnd]

I'm simply asking what all exactly was changed, and at the end of the day, which is the definitive version?

I only asked because Shadow Dragon got terrible reviews, and I'm not a fan of the DS remake's graphics anyway.

The DS versions are the definitive ones.

Let's see what New Mystery changed:

- The orb shard system (they're more like FE4's rings instead of FE5's scrolls);

- MU;

- Prologue and paralogue chapters, with new content and a side plot that doesn't really affect how the main story plays out;

- The four BSFE episodes, plus a couple (free, unlockable with a proper save file) DLC chapters following the same style;

- Far more recruitable characters (most of them FE1 characters who didn't reappear in book 2, or FE11's new recruitables);

- Base conversations (a little character development for everyone);

- Class swapping;

- Class caps, instead of the everyone-caps-at-20 system, which obviously changes the game balance;

- Manakete transformation follows the series' default, instead of FE3's system.

That's what I can remember.

Shadow Dragon picked up a 20-years-old game, updated its engine and pretty much called it a day. It almost didn't expand the story or improve characterization at all, except for the short prologue. It's no wonder people thought it was lackluster.

[eclipse]

I can't see how anyone would prefer the SNES graphics over the DS ones. ;/

Everyone forgot about forging (both games) and the base arena (FE12). Both of these things alter strategies!

Other differences that I saw:

- More items in FE11 and FE12 (several items were changed, too. . .Mercurius comes to mind)

- Certain classes didn't exist in the SNES games (HI NAVARRE)

- Dismounting does not exist in the DS games

- No more "X did N amount of damage!"

. . .plus a bunch of things that the modern games introduced (like the weapon triangle). So unless you're a die-hard old-style fan, I can't see why you'd shy away from the remakes. Don't knock it before you try it and all!

[GreatSaiyaman]

The DS versions are the definitive ones.

Let's see what New Mystery changed:

- The orb shard system (they're more like FE4's rings instead of FE5's scrolls);

- MU;

- Prologue and paralogue chapters, with new content and a side plot that doesn't really affect how the main story plays out;

- The four BSFE episodes, plus a couple (free, unlockable with a proper save file) DLC chapters following the same style;

- Far more recruitable characters (most of them FE1 characters who didn't reappear in book 2, or FE11's new recruitables);

- Base conversations (a little character development for everyone);

- Class swapping;

- Class caps, instead of the everyone-caps-at-20 system, which obviously changes the game balance;

- Manakete transformation follows the series' default, instead of FE3's system.

That's what I can remember.

Shadow Dragon picked up a 20-years-old game, updated its engine and pretty much called it a day. It almost didn't expand the story or improve characterization at all, except for the short prologue. It's no wonder people thought it was lackluster.

Well it sounds like they really half assed Shadow Dragon... (It's too bad... couldn't they have at least added a support system?) But New Mystery sounds incredibly fun! I'll have to give them another shot, hopefully they won't run too slow.

...Well, after I'm done playing through the Phoenix Wright games. - I just beat the first one yesterday, and it was a blast! However, I am significantly less impressed with the bonus case you get at the end (That annoying girl is annoying - I want Maya back - Plus it's annoying having to check the evidence for more evidence after not having to do that for literally the entire game), and so I'm considering just skipping that and going straight for the second one.

...And what is this about Manaketes?

Edited November 11, 2014 by GreatSaiyaman

[eclipse]

From what I've read, the manakete transformation system in FE3 involved staying transformed for some amount of turns, as opposed to transforming when they were in battle.

And Shadow Dragon does have a support system, even if it's mostly invisible.

[GreatSaiyaman]

From what I've read, the manakete transformation system in FE3 involved staying transformed for some amount of turns, as opposed to transforming when they were in battle.

And Shadow Dragon does have a support system, even if it's mostly invisible.

Oh.

And I meant with actual support conversations and stuff.

[The Geek]

Shadow Dragon and New Mystery move much faster and have better UI. Also, this may just be me, but I don't particularly like playing FE with a keyboard.

[eclipse]

Oh.

And I meant with actual support conversations and stuff.

There's two things in Shadow Dragon that aren't necessarily related.

1. Actual supports - quite a few characters have these. Some of them make sense (Marth/Caeda), others completely mystify me. These give out the support bonuses to hit and the like.

2. Side convos - certain characters have these, too. These are for flavor, and don't offer any other bonuses. For example, Caeda can talk to Ogma. They're far more limited than actual supports.

I'm pretty sure this isn't what you had in mind, but that's what Shadow Dragon has to offer. It's not much, but it's better than nothing!

[sirmola]

You knew what I meant and you know it. Instead of using sprites, they used... whatever it is "technically" called that they used. (which just so happens to have a "third dimension" whether or not it jumps out of the screen at you like the 3DS is apparently supposed to - and even if you want to argue that it is certainly more 3D than sprites) But regardless of what it was called and who is or isn't being a smartass - the DS graphics suck.

And I'm not denying that Mystery has aged pretty badly - especially since the latter two games on the same system make it look so bad. It has absolutely aged terribly. I'm simply asking what all exactly was changed, and at the end of the day, which is the definitive version?

I only asked because Shadow Dragon got terrible reviews, and I'm not a fan of the DS remake's graphics anyway.

honestly, i say shadow dragon just because fe3 cut a lot of content from fe1 that shadow dragon restored. (to the tune of 5 chapters and a ton of characters). they added a prolog on normal that's nice. The gaiden chapters are stupid, but none of that content is in fe3 anyway, that's a net zero. As for the graphics, you can always turn off animations (thcnecaly, the graphics are prerendered like donkey kong country, not 3d) And i think fe3's graphics are worse anyway. As for dialog, shadow dragon has more better dialog than fe3. People are just annoyed that even more was not added. As for fe12, they fixed everything wrong with shadow dragon but the graphics (and they even tweaked those a bit.)

[Fruity Insanity]

FE12 Lunatic Reverse master race.

Seriously, though.

I loved FE12, even if I was too impatient and ended up importing the game before TE and the rest of them finished translating the game.

It's definitely more of an improvement over FE11.

As for FE1 and FE3, though, I can't tell, to be quite honest, as I've never played them...

The Start to skip turn option in the DS games alone are a good reason to play them. ~o3o~

[Shin]

Truth be told, I dislike FE12. Whilst mechanically it's an improvement, I won't deny FE3 is rather dated, I dislike the inflated growth rates and inclusion of the MU subplot. There's also the fact FE3 was my first FE title, so that might just be nostalgia-vision.

[RJWalker]

I only asked because Shadow Dragon got terrible reviews, and I'm not a fan of the DS remake's graphics anyway.

Where have you been looking? Shadow Dragon has glowing reviews on most sites.

[Parrhesia]

They're better than FE3 and don't feel horribly, horribly dated. Reclass is an optional feature and by no means necessary to complete the game, and the only sidequest-locked characters are ones that FE1 didn't have. It also has some characters and chapters FE3 Book 1 lacked for that matter.

[Irysa]

Play Shadow Dragon because the script is fucking amazing.

[GreatSaiyaman]

Where have you been looking? Shadow Dragon has glowing reviews on most sites.

Gamefaqs (http://www.gamefaqs.com/ds/943695-fire-emblem-shadow-dragon/reviews)

In all fairness though, a lot of those are good/great scores, but when a game has that many awful scores, you gotta wonder. (Hence me coming to a dedicated Fire Emblem site for opinions)

[Jedi]

Gamefaqs (http://www.gamefaqs.com/ds/943695-fire-emblem-shadow-dragon/reviews)

In all fairness though, a lot of those are good/great scores, but when a game has that many awful scores, you gotta wonder. (Hence me coming to a dedicated Fire Emblem site for opinions)

Looking at Gamefaqs scores is like asking IGN for a fair review. Aka not very accurate.