Spoiler Free Discussion Thread

[Blaze The Great]

All I have to say is that if any of Azura, Marx, Sakura, Leon, Camilla, or Hinoka die, I'm going to be very, VERY upset. Seriously, I'm really drawn to the Royals of the game, especially these six.

[TheCaptain]

Quick (non-spoilery) question for anyone who has seen/played the game already: Without going into detail, is recruitment just having the main lord talk to the character like in Awakening, or is it more complex like older games?

Edited June 27, 2015 by TheCaptain

[Azz]

Quick (non-spoilery) question for anyone who has seen/played the game already: Without going into detail, is recruitment just having the main lord talk to the character like in Awakening, or is it more complex like older games?

Yes, for the most part Kamui is the one recruiting.However there is very little recruiting since many join before or after chapters.

[xcel]

Yes, for the most part Kamui is the one recruiting.However there is very little recruiting since many join before or after chapters.

This is a little disappointing. Part of what made FE great was trying to figure out how to recruit certain characters without getting them killed or my units killed when using them as bait. Recruiting Amelia and Joshua come to mind from Sacred Stones.

Edited June 27, 2015 by xcel

[BlueL]

For those of us who are wondering about the story and whether they were serious about the theme of "choices:"

Apparently, besides the major choice between Hoshido and Nohr, there are actually a lot of places on both routes

where your actions can determine how the rest of the story plays out.

Most of them aren't really "choices," though, as they are more along the lines of old-time gaiden chapter

requirements. I.e. If you clear the chapter within a certain number of turns, X will happen whereas Y will

happen if you don't. Or, if you get the support level between certain units high enough by a certain chapter then

you get a small benefit. Those kinds of things.

I like the return of gaiden-like chapters but I'm not fond of needing to have units reach a certain level of support unless they give you clues. I'm hoping this game is lacking in things like in FE7 where certain chapter choices were determined by 2 random unit's experience total.

EDIT: I meant random as in "why do these select units exp determine the factor deciding which chapter version you get", not random as in a "random group of units EXP being higher than the other determines which chapter version you get."

Poor wording on my part, thanks for the correction Blaze the Great.

Anybody planning on doing a "blind" playthrough the first time around? I think it's inevitable by now that everyone knows there are character deaths in the game. I don't intend to look up conditions on how to prevent these deaths which are just delusions by people who can't accept deaths but just play and see what will happen, both first times in Birthright and Conquest.

Part of me wants to look up everything ahead of time to save everybody, but that would just spoil the story. But I probably will look up the gaiden chapter requirements since they tend to be vague. But I'd only look it up on a per chapter basis, not ahead of time

Doesn't anybody here aside from me feel that character deaths adds to the story and development? I actually prayed that there would be character deaths in this game when it was announced, to actually get the feeling that this is WAR. Sure, you can have no-death run to get supports and get to know the characters, but in my headcanon, people have to DIE. Quoting Sun Tzu: "It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on."

I mean it does, but it's so annoying to lose a key unit forever or long stretches of the game so it's slightly annoying. Like right now I'm playing an RPG where the only real healer/debuffer got kidnapped so for about 2 dungeons I had to rely on much, much inferior healers and could only cure statuses with items.

Yep. To me, everyone is a lord, and if they die, it's game over. Gotta restart.

This. I let someone die on PoR and have never stopped regretting it.

I could say playing on classic creates tension/suspense to try harder or that a no-reset run on classic gives better feeling of accomplishment.

But while true, those would be excuses to cover the real reason: I started playing FE when casual wasn't a thing, and am so used to resetting it's become a reflex. I reset even on casual. So why not play classic? It sounds grander too.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Edited June 28, 2015 by BlueL

[Blaze The Great]

I like the return of gaiden-like chapters but I'm not fond of needing to have units reach a certain level of support unless they give you clues. I'm hoping this game is lacking in things like in FE7 where certain chapter choices were determined by 2 random unit's experience total.

Just as a quick note, that actually wasn't random. Four-Fanged Offense was determined by the combined level of your lords. If: Eliwood+Hector+Lyn total levels<50, you get Lloyd version. If they were above 50, you get Linus. With Pale Flower of Darkness, if your Hero Crest users (Raven, Guy, Dorcas, Bartre) were higher-leveled overall than your Guiding Ring users (Erk, Lucius, Serra, Priscilla), you would get Jerme's map. If vice versa, you would get Kenneth's.

Sorry if that seemed like I was nitpicking, just felt like explaining that to you. I have a serious problem about doing stuff like that, lol.

[Bovinian]

Just as a quick note, that actually wasn't random. Four-Fanged Offense was determined by the combined level of your lords. If: Eliwood+Hector+Lyn total levels<50, you get Lloyd version. If they were above 50, you get Linus. With Pale Flower of Darkness, if your Hero Crest users (Raven, Guy, Dorcas, Bartre) were higher-leveled overall than your Guiding Ring users (Erk, Lucius, Serra, Priscilla), you would get Jerme's map. If vice versa, you would get Kenneth's.

Sorry if that seemed like I was nitpicking, just felt like explaining that to you. I have a serious problem about doing stuff like that, lol.

...I'm pretty sure by "random" he meant "why did IS randomly choose these units for the requirement when they have nothing to do with the boss/recruitable character in question", especially when there are no hints in the game that allude to said requirements. Not that the game literally chooses characters at random and looks at their levels/experience.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Bovinian

[BlueL]

Just as a quick note, that actually wasn't random. Four-Fanged Offense was determined by the combined level of your lords. If: Eliwood+Hector+Lyn total levels<50, you get Lloyd version. If they were above 50, you get Linus. With Pale Flower of Darkness, if your Hero Crest users (Raven, Guy, Dorcas, Bartre) were higher-leveled overall than your Guiding Ring users (Erk, Lucius, Serra, Priscilla), you would get Jerme's map. If vice versa, you would get Kenneth's.

Sorry if that seemed like I was nitpicking, just felt like explaining that to you. I have a serious problem about doing stuff like that, lol.

No you're fine, that was actually my error. I'm knew it was that certain units combined exp determined what version of Pale Flowers of Darkness and 4 fanged offense you got, I just never realized till you're post what their common thread was. I'm guess they just went with the first 4 hero crest users and the first 4 guiding ring users. Or maybe Canas got excluded for being from a bonus chapter.

I don't understand why Linus' path is when your Lords are over 50 and Lloyd's are if your below 50. In-game I think big brother Lloyd was stronger (story-wise) so you think it'd be reversed. At least in retrospect for Pale Flowers of Darkness you can see you get the magic boss if those select magic units have a higher level. But...

EDIT:

...I'm pretty sure by "random" he meant "why did IS randomly choose these units for the requirement when they have nothing to do with the boss/recruitable character in question", especially when there are no hints in the game that allude to said requirements. Not that the game literally chooses characters at random and looks at their levels/experience.

Yea, that was exactly what I meant. He just said it better.

Edited June 28, 2015 by BlueL

[Blaze The Great]

Ahh, I see. My bad. But yeah, there was virtually no rhyme or reason to how they came up with that (I guess you get a magical boss with higher magical units and a physical boss with higher physical units?). It is a mystery.

[Laie]

...Uhm. Which part of Awakening are we talking here? Because, not knowing how to approach them other than Frederick, the first few chapters of Awakening Lunatic seemed just shy of impossible to me. Later chapters were much easier, but then... I used a tiny handful of characters and deliberately chose the best of them.

I don't mind a good challenge, but for my first playthrough, I'd like to feel I can use whoever I want. And as much as I enjoyed Shadow Dragon H5... that was a bit more than I want for my first time through Fates.

I would say most of the stages so far are on par with the first few chapters of Awakening lunatic in terms of brutality,and much more dynamic(map mechanics,weapons,skills etc.),while still leaves enough room that allows you to run a full cast of characters,using mostly anyone you see fit,unless they are left on the bench for too long then it may be too hard for them to catch up.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Laie

[Blaze The Great]

Are you talking Nohr Normal or Nohr Hard? If Hard, not really surprised. If Normal, hot dang.

[eclipse]

For those of us who are wondering about the story and whether they were serious about the theme of "choices:"

Apparently, besides the major choice between Hoshido and Nohr, there are actually a lot of places on both routes

where your actions can determine how the rest of the story plays out.

Most of them aren't really "choices," though, as they are more along the lines of old-time gaiden chapter

requirements. I.e. If you clear the chapter within a certain number of turns, X will happen whereas Y will

happen if you don't. Or, if you get the support level between certain units high enough by a certain chapter then

you get a small benefit. Those kinds of things.

Oh my gosh, this is amazing! I would've liked a dialogue choice or two, as well, but this will suffice as well!

By the way, I wonder one thing. I finished a early chapter and (in case)

(snip)

In a spoiler-free thread, WE DO NOT SPOIL THINGS, full stop. Don't do this again (this goes to anyone reading the topic and considering such a post).

I apologize, and even though it's an early-game chapter, we explicitly formed this thread so stuff like that doesn't come in. As it happens, I know the answer to your question and will PM it to you.

You're awesome.

I imagine this will add a lot of artificial difficulty. If better endings are often the result of shorter battles, for instance, then it might encourage me to play much more aggressively then I would otherwise.

It depends.

In FE7, it made for some interesting choices (farm the bajillion reinforcements in Victory or Death, or get a gaiden chapter). In FE12, you had to turtle your way through a chapter to miss the turn count.

This is still better than FE11's suicide tactics.

Anybody planning on doing a "blind" playthrough the first time around? I think it's inevitable by now that everyone knows there are character deaths in the game. I don't intend to look up conditions on how to prevent these deaths which are just delusions by people who can't accept deaths but just play and see what will happen, both first times in Birthright and Conquest.

I'll make it as blind as possible, but a couple of plot points were already spoiled for me. ;/

Yeah, even though I saw titles referring to character deaths, I already suspected that was going to be a thing, especially with what Shin, the writer, said about his goal to make players cry. So, it comes to no surprise to me.

In regards to a "blind" run, one part of me wants to do it, but the perfectionist in me wants to get the best ending possible. I guess the happy compromise would be to read every, single line of dialogue, critically. I hope these conditions are not super vague or random. I want to be rewarded for reading the entire script.

I will do this Long Live the Queen-style: First run is purely blind, second one is on Casual for the maximum number of save slots.

Earnest question here, and I'm sure it has come up elsewhere many times, but can anyone briefly explain why you would play classic now that casual exists if you plan to simply reset the game? People who play classic and just let it play out obviously are more hardcore than some of us. (I can't do it! Gotta save everyone!)

I don't have a problem with it, I just wonder what people's personal reasons are. Is it like self-inflicted punishment?

It's pressure, perfectionism, and the fact that I started on the GBA games. I can play Casual, but it doesn't feel the same.

EDIT: And this is a thank-you from Yours Truly for handling things fairly well in this thread. Give yourselves a pat on the back, and keep it up!

Edited June 28, 2015 by eclipse

[Laie]

Are you talking Nohr Normal or Nohr Hard? If Hard, not really surprised. If Normal, hot dang.

Nohr hard,glad I didn't start with lunatic as I originally planned,it would take forever to beat the game.

Tho some of my friends did mention that they still found Nohr normal to be quite challenging at times.

Now all i am thinking outside of playing the game is planning on my Nohr lunatic run,but guess I should do a Hoshido lunatic first. :p

[Captain Karnage]

By the way, I wonder one thing. I finished a early chapter and (in case)

spoiler

THAT'S A SPOILER WROTE IN A SPOILER TAG, BUT APPARENTLY I NEED TO WROTE IT IN CAPS

would you please delete the contents in your spoiler so those passing by wont be tempted to open it.

THIS IS A SPOILER FREE ZONE FOR A REASON

Edited June 28, 2015 by Captain Karnage

[Taka-kun]

would you please delete the contents in your spoiler so those passing by wont be tempted to open it.

THIS IS A SPOILER FREE ZONE FOR A REASON

Yes, the temptation is the worst, even if the spoiler is hidden. Most forget the feature that you can tag what your spoiler is about so there is no way to know what's underneath. I have been spoiled some stuffs already because I looked in the wrong threads and I simply cannot unknow.

[Nébulya]

Well, what's the point of repeating again and again to not spoil here, I've already given my apologies. And even If I did spoil, they're no reason to be such things like that people, so stop writing in caps.

@Captain Karnage: Well, I don't care if you're tempted by opening it, I've edited my post. If you open it, that's not my fault now, unless you don't have a good english.

So now, please move to another subject, because it is becoming a bit annoying. Thanks.

[Taka-kun]

Well, what's the point of repeating again and again to not spoil here, I've already given my apologies. And even If I did spoil, they're no reason to be such things like that people, so stop writing in caps.

@Captain Karnage: Well, I don't care if you're tempted by opening it, I've edited my post. If you open it, that's not my fault now, unless you don't have a good english.

So now, please move to another subject, because it is becoming a bit annoying. Thanks.

Apologies, I did not mean it as a slight. Realized that it was not the best wording of me.

Moving on, what does people here look forward to in the game, story-wise and/or gameplay-wise?

Personally, I want to see more of Kamui's character. So far, he seems like goody two-shoes but I want to see that change. It would be nice if his character changed depending on the route and that the supports for each side would reflect that. I remember in Tactics Ogre, a real old game now, the main character would do different kinds of action depending on which side he did. In one route, he gave the middle finger to anyone who were willing to compromise for their goals. In another, he did amoral things for the sake of the greater good.

[Nébulya]

Well, I played the game and what I was looking for, like more objective than Awakening is wonderful. And they're many things too, sadly I can't understand Japanese.

But it would be logic to say that his character is changing? But maybe not. I played Tactics Ogre Let Us Cling Together (the remake) and it was a very good game.

But I can say that Nohr on Hard is far more difficult than Lunatic from Awakening from me. Or that's just me being tired when I played? x) But some chapters have ONE good strategy to finish it. I had many game over on some.

Because they're more enemies, maybe with less good stats, but the fact that they can dual attack is adding difficulty too. It's already better than Awakening at chapter 5 for me!

[Leif]

Well, I played the game and what I was looking for, like more objective than Awakening is wonderful. And they're many things too, sadly I can't understand Japanese.

But it would be logic to say that his character is changing? But maybe not. I played Tactics Ogre Let Us Cling Together (the remake) and it was a very good game.

But I can say that Nohr on Hard is far more difficult than Lunatic from Awakening from me. Or that's just me being tired when I played? x) But some chapters have ONE good strategy to finish it. I had many game over on some.

Because they're more enemies, maybe with less good stats, but the fact that they can dual attack is adding difficulty too. It's already better than Awakening at chapter 5 for me!

Since I decided to start with Nohr, I am SO starting on normal. Thanks for the heads up. I haven't played FE in a long time, and I will be super rusty.

I tried Awakening's Lunatic and I struggled in the early chapters so much. It's scary to think that Hard mode Nohr is the equivalent of Awakening's Lunatic. O_O

[SageOfAnys]

Well, I played the game and what I was looking for, like more objective than Awakening is wonderful. And they're many things too, sadly I can't understand Japanese.

But it would be logic to say that his character is changing? But maybe not. I played Tactics Ogre Let Us Cling Together (the remake) and it was a very good game.

But I can say that Nohr on Hard is far more difficult than Lunatic from Awakening from me. Or that's just me being tired when I played? x) But some chapters have ONE good strategy to finish it. I had many game over on some.

Because they're more enemies, maybe with less good stats, but the fact that they can dual attack is adding difficulty too. It's already better than Awakening at chapter 5 for me!

...Whelp, thank goodness I'm starting on Normal in Nohr. Lunatic is only somewhat easy if you played it before and know what to do, and even then, you gotta hope you aren't RNG-screwed.

[xcel]

Well, I played the game and what I was looking for, like more objective than Awakening is wonderful. And they're many things too, sadly I can't understand Japanese.

But it would be logic to say that his character is changing? But maybe not. I played Tactics Ogre Let Us Cling Together (the remake) and it was a very good game.

But I can say that Nohr on Hard is far more difficult than Lunatic from Awakening from me. Or that's just me being tired when I played? x) But some chapters have ONE good strategy to finish it. I had many game over on some.

Because they're more enemies, maybe with less good stats, but the fact that they can dual attack is adding difficulty too. It's already better than Awakening at chapter 5 for me!

Nohr Hard is > Awakening Lunatic?

This is getting exciting. Bring it on.

[Auroros]

Soooo wait a second... If...

Nohr's hard --> Awakenings Lunatic...

Awakenings lunatic+ --> Nohr's Lunatic (?)...

Nohr's lunatic+ (if existing) --> Apotheosis (?)...?

Dang...

Oh, and just as a question: Is the transition from normal to hard a bit more lenient? I've had a hard time going from normal to hard in awakening (Mainly because I always do too much at once, though :/, though. Not benching all I don't want to currently use + getting all supports I want to get on that run - grinding = stupid :/).

And would someone mind to compare difficulty from nohr normal to another title in the series? Like, say, New mystery's normal mode (When not lol !BeserkMU rofl stomping and teleskipping everything but still getting every optional objective.)? Because that game wasn't exactly hard, but not easy either and I want to have a rough estimate for what I will get myself into.

[Bovinian]

Eh, I'd be skeptical about definitively deciding that Nohr Hard is harder than Awakening Lunatic. An FE game always seems a bit harder than it really is when you're playing the game blind for the first time, especially if you have a lot of experience with whatever it is you're comparing it to. I first went into Radiant Dawn Normal mode after having had a lot of experience with Awakening Lunatic, and remember thinking the early Dawn Brigade chapters were almost as difficult as Awakening Lunatic. Obviously I know now that's not the case, because now I have some knowledge of what works and what doesn't. Most people who dove into Lunatic on their very first playthrough of Awakening would probably not have been able to get past the first few chapters.

Also there's the whole people not understanding Japanese thing, which could make it slightly harder to formulate strategies at a glance if it takes longer to process things like what weapons enemies are holding, and what options you have available yourself.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Bovinian

[Nébulya]

Well, I've played every Fire Emblem, except Gaiden. (tearing saga too but i don't count it)

And I've never had any difficulty to clear a chapter, but here man..Chapter 5 was very difficult to me, I had more than 8 game over before clearing it. it can be easier, but this is a random thing.

And I did not cleared the chapter 8. (I was using a 2DS with Rxtools..And when I restarted it, the firmware was updated, but in a couple of days, I will tell you more about things you want to know)

I didn't mean to say that this is more difficult than Lunatic Awakening, because in Awakening, it was the enemies who had ridiculous stats, skills, etc..

But here, the enemies have correct stats, but this is more the question of: -Which character can kill this unit, which weapons do i need without being killed after and who has support with me,..

And this is more difficult to clear a chapter, you need to do it a couple of times before understanding how to beat it. Unless I was drunk, Fire Emblem if is more strategic, more balanced so more difficult in a way.

Because in Awakening, like I said, stats and skills were ridiculous, the first chapters it was with Frederick only, and after that, it was easy.

But in every way, I prefer this new game over Awakening!

[eclipse]

Well, what's the point of repeating again and again to not spoil here, I've already given my apologies. And even If I did spoil, they're no reason to be such things like that people, so stop writing in caps.

@Captain Karnage: Well, I don't care if you're tempted by opening it, I've edited my post. If you open it, that's not my fault now, unless you don't have a good english.

So now, please move to another subject, because it is becoming a bit annoying. Thanks.

No. What you posted went directly against what this thread stood for, and removing it on your own would've been more than sufficient.

However, I think your post is an excellent example as to what not to post, so as a compromise, I put something in the spoiler description that should both deter people who don't want to be spoiled.

...Whelp, thank goodness I'm starting on Normal in Nohr. Lunatic is only somewhat easy if you played it before and know what to do, and even then, you gotta hope you aren't RNG-screwed.

Awakening Lunatic was FUN if you were like me and went -Res. It made certain asset/flaw combinations less than ideal, though. Early game was brutal, but after that hump, it became bearable for a bit.

Nohr Hard is > Awakening Lunatic?

This is getting exciting. Bring it on.

Awakening's Lunatic was stat inflation with some extra enemies. Fates took out many of the things that made Awakening's low-manning strategies viable. Whether Nohr Hard is harder than Lunatic will be something for me to decide. Gut tells me that it'll take time for me to become accustomed to the new battle system and weapon penalties, but I think I can leverage each weapon's weakness to my advantage (somehow).

Well, I've played every Fire Emblem, except Gaiden. (tearing saga too but i don't count it)

And I've never had any difficulty to clear a chapter, but here man..Chapter 5 was very difficult to me, I had more than 8 game over before clearing it. it can be easier, but this is a random thing.

And I did not cleared the chapter 8. (I was using a 2DS with Rxtools..And when I restarted it, the firmware was updated, but in a couple of days, I will tell you more about things you want to know)

I didn't mean to say that this is more difficult than Lunatic Awakening, because in Awakening, it was the enemies who had ridiculous stats, skills, etc..

But here, the enemies have correct stats, but this is more the question of: -Which character can kill this unit, which weapons do i need without being killed after and who has support with me,..

And this is more difficult to clear a chapter, you need to do it a couple of times before understanding how to beat it. Unless I was drunk, Fire Emblem if is more strategic, more balanced so more difficult in a way.

Because in Awakening, like I said, stats and skills were ridiculous, the first chapters it was with Frederick only, and after that, it was easy.

But in every way, I prefer this new game over Awakening!

This illustrates my point. I think it's a matter of rethinking how things are approached - once that's done, it sounds like Nohr Hard will be what I play when I want something to keep my mind active.