Why is Silas so popular here?

[Time the Crestfallen]

Silas is just kind of there for me, since there isn't really anything about him I find interesting. I like the archetype of Silas' character (i.e. the normal guy without any major baggage compared to everyone else), but the archetype lives or dies by what else they have aside from being the normal guy. All Silas really has going for him aside from that is that he's besties with Kamui, a role that I find suits Jakob, Felicia or Azura more than him.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Phillius

[BANRYU]

I feel like Silas might have been of a bit better character if he more reserved about wanting to be Corrin's BFF, with otherwise the same basic personality (which I think is just fine). IE, if he were initially more reserved and serious toward Corrin after the initial 'hey bro/girl u remember me?' and then 'No? Oh... OK nbd', with supports exposing his possible hurt feelings toward that, having Corrin and Silas rediscover their friendship, and then wind up close and become casual once again. I think that could have been a lot more natural-feeling.

Because I wouldn't say that I DISlike Silas, but I don't particularly like him specifically for that reason, the whole 'self-proclaimed bff' thing. It makes him feel clingy and/or out of touch, not an appealing character aspect even as a character flaw.

Edited March 30, 2016 by BANRYU

[Shadow Knight]

He was my go to unit besides myself in all three paths. His great Str and Def growths make him very useful plus his personal skill is great considering the avatar is required on every map.

Dude was my right hand man along with Xander

[Vere]

He's just extremely caring to a fault. He's my favorite male and reminds me of my own best friend. So maybe I'm biased. And I agree on Silas being a white knight. He's just a little too devouted. But a lot of the retainers were made to be that way. Beruka and Hana are some examples (although there's are also proffesion-wise for when they met their noble).

And although I played all paths, I hate Takumi. He's an annoying child in one and slightly less annoying in the others. Ryoma and Hinoka did what they could after Corrin was taken. Sakura wasnt even born yet but still cared about Corrin. Takumi is the only sibling who didnt like Corrin whatsoever. He's only beaten by Hinata simply because I hate Hinata's design.

[JasonsOrigin]

"A lot of Japanese people" feels like a stretch because in another forum someone said something like this too but about Ike's declining popularity coinciding with his new buffed up appearance for Smash Bros.. We found out soon that "alot" was only about 12 dissenting people in a Japanese forum.

Anyway, I find that it's usually the people who yearn for eccentricity in characters that tend not to appreciate someone like Silas, Stahl, or Kellam as much as I can and it appears to be true here as well.

But why do I like him?

Self-proclaimed childhood best friend? check.

Seems too normal/boring? check.

Sports a similar hairstyle to mine? check.

Overall, a good bro? check.

I usually bring him as my right hand man to kill off bosses. I partner with him and let him tank all the enemies near the bosses with Seal Str, Def, Spd, Luna, and Renewal and then switch back to Corrin when all that is left is the boss.

I do find his support with Elise leaning on disappointing but I'll blame it on the writing and I don't like the idea of them together at all anyway. I thought the best Silas support was with Ryoma because I got to see more insight on how much Corrin means to him and that Silas wasn't always the warm and open person he is now. I was also really touched by the blood vow they made. I'm a bit disappointed that Silas cannot support with more male characters, the other royals most especially.

[Blade]

Silas to me is like bread, its plain, which pretty much explains his personality. His self proclaimed BFF thing justifies how avatar worshipping is at a fault in Fates, and it's pretty much his other trait as far as I've read in his supports.

I don't like him, he's just not that interesting to me.

[RidellCrimea]

I liked him at first because of his voice and the BFF thing, which is kinda cute the first time he mentions it, but in the many following times he brought it up, it just wears off really quickly to the point where it becomes rather annoying. I haven't seen anything special in his supports that makes me like him either.

[soranauta]

I didn't mind him that much until he became too HP and Defense screwed that he died in two hits even after promotion. Like c'mon Silas, at least Azura dodges.

[Sire]

I would like to use Silas, but in my playthroughs he constantly falls off compared to my other characters. (Although, I probably should just promote him earlier instead of trying 20/x with him).

I enjoy the childhood friend trope (and the voice actor gives me callbacks to Kid Icarus), but I have not delved into his character to see his other qualities.

[Sentinel07]

I normally like the childhood friends trope but Silas is so obsessed with Corrin in some cases that it's borderline creepy. This game's d***-riding on Corrin often ranges from kind of cute (Hinoka, Elise) to completely creepy (Camilla, Silas).

The fact that he became a knight solely just so he could see Corrin again also rubs me the wrong way. I would liked it much more if he became a knight for the greater good, with reuniting with Corrin being a nice side effect.

I dislike this whole trope the Japanese seem to like in certain games where characters will have a life decision based on one person. Heck, in this same game, Effie becomes a knight solely because of Elise.

But yeah, him and Azura are pretty much the "boring" tier for the character cast in this game for me.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Sentinel07

[Azure Sen]

I used to like Silas, but getting all of his supports really soured my opinion on him. His supports with Camilla and Elise are creepy and border on him wanting to be Corrin, his supports with Orochi, Hana, Kagero, Rinkah and Azura have him come off as a judgmental jerk and other than that and his obsession with Corrin he's really bland. The fact that he's turned out to be a late bloomer or not very good on all three of my games doesn't help either.

Edited March 30, 2016 by AzureSen

[Water Mage]

I used to like Silas, but getting all of his supports really soured my opinion on him. His supports with Camilla and Elise are creepy and border on him wanting to be Corrin, his supports with Orochi, Hana, Kagero, Rinkah and Azura have him come off as a judgmental jerk and other than that and his obsession with Corrin he's really bland. The fact that he's turned out to be a late bloomer or not very good on all three of my games doesn't help either.

I'm going to defend Silas here, when it comes to some of these supports.

When the subject is Kagero's art, almost everyone is harsh and judgemental to her, not just Silas. The only person who doesn't critize Kagero's art harshly is Orochi.

And when the subject is Rinkah's solitary attitude, just like Kagero, everyone critical towards Rinkah, not just Silas.

So it's rather unfair to Silas to judge him because of those supports, since other characters acts the same way as him when it comes to Kagero and Rinkah.

In his support with Hana, she is judgemental towards him as well, and she is judgemental towards a lot of people, such as Corrin and Subaki. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, Silas's support with Effie is very similar, the only difference is that Effie is the only one being a judgemental.

[Nym]

Silas is a special case for me.

I really like his voice actor but Silas is nothing special. I have Nothing against his ''childhood friends'' stuff.

But there also one thing that is really sad for Silas: outside of the early chapters, he's not that useful.

Especially since Peri and XANDER exist.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Nym

[Jedi]

I would like to use Silas, but in my playthroughs he constantly falls off compared to my other characters.

This is a running gag with most of my pals on this site and I, we always talk about how Silas starts solid then just drops like a rock (This goes for like all 3 routes generally too lmao)

"Oh who did you bench?" "Silas" "Shoulda known"

Edited March 30, 2016 by Jedi

[Loki Laufeyson]

The more supports of his i read and unlock, the less and less i like him. He bothers me. Hes judgmental, manipulative, and entitled. Gee...sounds familiar. I actually like him much less now than i did when i originally posted in this thread. Sophie is literally the only reason i use him. Sophie is so cute...

[saisymbolic]

I'm going to defend Silas here, when it comes to some of these supports.

When the subject is Kagero's art, almost everyone is harsh and judgemental to her, not just Silas. The only person who doesn't critize Kagero's art harshly is Orochi.

And when the subject is Rinkah's solitary attitude, just like Kagero, everyone critical towards Rinkah, not just Silas.

So it's rather unfair to Silas to judge him because of those supports, since other characters acts the same way as him when it comes to Kagero and Rinkah.

In his support with Hana, she is judgemental towards him as well, and she is judgemental towards a lot of people, such as Corrin and Subaki. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, Silas's support with Effie is very similar, the only difference is that Effie is the only one being a judgemental.

Odin doesn't judge Kagero's art, either. In fact, he steals it because he thinks it's so great. Sort of. Quite honestly, a lot of the characters can come off as douchbags in certain supports. Effie and Hana are two that sort of stood out to me, for some reason, as being a bit blunt, maybe?

Funny. Silas ended up as my best cavalier. The one that got benched was Peri.

Edited March 30, 2016 by SaiSymbolic

[Ebony]

The more supports of his i read and unlock, the less and less i like him. He bothers me. Hes judgmental, manipulative, and entitled. Gee...sounds familiar. I actually like him much less now than i did when i originally posted in this thread. Sophie is literally the only reason i use him. Sophie is so cute...

Same. Sophie is awesome.

At least she ended with a cool mom in this game. (Hana)

(ps sorry Hana lmao)

[JasonsOrigin]

Hes judgmental, manipulative, and entitled.

I may have a strong bias toward Silas but I will not defend him here. He's okay and nice most of the time but when he meets certain people that trigger his judgmental behavior I can understand perfectly why people do not take too kindly to him. I think he can be like that because of the fact that he's of noble blood and bearing—it's in the nature of the noble class to feel entitled to many things, manipulate to their advantage, and judge others they feel need to be judged.

This makes him much more human to me and even more easy to appreciate as a character because he's really just like any of us and we can all be jerks at any given time when triggered.

[Thor Odinson]

I think--and speaking as someone who really don't like Silas, I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that he has this flaw. Having flaws isn't the issue.

I dislike him because his particular flaw is one that rubs me wrong. I do like that he's often called out on his behavior. It's just the way his flaw manifests really grates on me, so I don't enjoy reading about him. JP!Silas x Hana is actually what pushed it over the line---although the English supports improved it and made it a lot less onesided (the JP supports really wanted to suck Silas's dick and defenestrated Hana's character in doing so)--I still don't like that support anyway, but I can say it got better, the impression is already there, and it's very hard to change from that.

But I also don't view him having that flaw as a bad thing in itself. Just flawed characters have flaws, and some flaws will make people react differently than others. In this case, the way his pushy, highly confrontational manifestation of his judgement in conjunction with lack of other traits that particularly appeals to me makes him a character very difficult for me to enjoy reading about.

Plus a lot of his supports that rub me the wrong way are with characters I like more than him. Including one of my absolute favorite characters. So that didn't help.

Edited March 31, 2016 by Thor Odinson

[JasonsOrigin]

Does the database include Japanese support conversations? I'd like to see the JPSilas x Hana one.

Edit:

I went saw the English support with Hana and yeah that definitely sounds like it's coming from his noble bearing. He was totally looking down on her.

Edited March 31, 2016 by JasonsOrigin

[Thor Odinson]

Does the database include Japanese support conversations? I'd like to see the JPSilas x Hana one.

it doesn't, but i have a link to a translation here

Basically my gripe with it is that Hana's canonically very strong and is consistent within all her other supports and dialogue--but for some reasons completely underperform in this support for the sake of making Silas "look good". The English changed it so it made her look like she has an off day instead, which feels a lot less like character assassination than the JP version. They still lack chemistry, but at least it didn't come at the cost at being completely inconsistent with everything else that's established of her.

[JasonsOrigin]

I read it and yeah it's not very good. In this instance it seems like the problem was with the writer focusing too much on Silas and forgetting about Hana's capabilities. We already know how capable Silas is because he became a knight just with the hope of seeing Corrin again—he knew he had to be good. There was no need to downplay another character just for this. All that resulted in this support is a poor showcasing of both characters.

I guess I shouldn't be too disappointed with the writers. As bad as some of the supports can be this game really has a lot of characters and many of them have to be benched. I suppose it would be easy to get lost with all the supports that must be written by a deadline just to let us see how the characters got along.

Edited March 31, 2016 by JasonsOrigin

[Thor Odinson]

Honestly if they reach a compromise between GBA and Modern FE support pool size (some limits, but bigger than that of GBA's, no Kamuisexuals, and more nonromantic possbilities) I'd be pretty happy. Less supports to write---while it won't guarantee that every support would be quality(since not every GBA support is quality, either), would at least cut down on the amount some really egregiously bad supports due to utterly forced interactions.

However, my opinion of Silas isn't based on JP Silas/Hana alone, but rather the collection of my reactions to his supports starting from a neutral opinion of him when I've read none, to a steady decline with most of his supports. JP Silas/Hana is just what really dropped the ball. One bad support isn't enough to make me dislike characters on its own.

Edited March 31, 2016 by Thor Odinson

[Azure Sen]

I'm going to defend Silas here, when it comes to some of these supports.

When the subject is Kagero's art, almost everyone is harsh and judgemental to her, not just Silas. The only person who doesn't critize Kagero's art harshly is Orochi.

And when the subject is Rinkah's solitary attitude, just like Kagero, everyone critical towards Rinkah, not just Silas.

So it's rather unfair to Silas to judge him because of those supports, since other characters acts the same way as him when it comes to Kagero and Rinkah.

In his support with Hana, she is judgemental towards him as well, and she is judgemental towards a lot of people, such as Corrin and Subaki. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, Silas's support with Effie is very similar, the only difference is that Effie is the only one being a judgemental.

• Silas is the only one who outright insults her and spends their entire support chain doing so, and is the only one who doesn't eventually admit that her style of art is perfectly fine as it is. In their A Support, literally the only good thing he can say about her art compared to his own horrible art is that hers has "artistic intent," which is tantamount to saying "hey, you didn't mean to be horrible, but you are."
• Silas criticizes Hana out of nowhere, insults Sakura for no reason, and insists that Hana's devotion to Sakura can't possibly be anywhere near as strong as his devotion to Corrin is. I think it's perfectly understandable that Hana would want to give Silas a taste of his own medicine.
• None of the other people Rinkah had supports with tricked Rinkah into playing a children's game under the guise of a "form of battle" to teach her a lesson like she's a child.
• Having gone back and reread it, the Effie/Silas support is basically shilling Silas, and Effie kind of had a point in that support. Effie was a street urchin while Silas was a noble, and she had to work much harder to become a knight and eventually become Elise's retainer.
• I also forgot Silas/Felcica, where he brings up a completely unsubstantiated and insulting rumor to her without first checking to see if the rumor was true, though at least in this one he recognizes that he messed up and tries to make it up to Felicia.

I think--and speaking as someone who really don't like Silas, I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that he has this flaw. Having flaws isn't the issue.

I dislike him because his particular flaw is one that rubs me wrong. I do like that he's often called out on his behavior. It's just the way his flaw manifests really grates on me, so I don't enjoy reading about him. JP!Silas x Hana is actually what pushed it over the line---although the English supports improved it and made it a lot less onesided (the JP supports really wanted to suck Silas's dick and defenestrated Hana's character in doing so)--I still don't like that support anyway, but I can say it got better, the impression is already there, and it's very hard to change from that.

But I also don't view him having that flaw as a bad thing in itself. Just flawed characters have flaws, and some flaws will make people react differently than others. In this case, the way his pushy, highly confrontational manifestation of his judgement in conjunction with lack of other traits that particularly appeals to me makes him a character very difficult for me to enjoy reading about.

Plus a lot of his supports that rub me the wrong way are with characters I like more than him. Including one of my absolute favorite characters. So that didn't help.

Yeah, I agree, I have no problem with Silas being a flawed character. The problem is for me is that a( the script still wants him to be the only sane man, which fails because he's obsessed with Corrin in a way that rivals Camilla and Jakob, and b( the script really wants us to see him a Stahl-esque super-nice person who is very understanding despite these moments of jerkassery (or maybe even don't consider what he's doing wrong, given how some of those supports resolve themselves), except instead of doing what Awakening did and show us Stahl being kind and understanding with all of his support options, they had Silas spend several supports (and I do mean several--the supports that I've mentioned total about 1/3 of his supports) being a jerk.

I may have a strong bias toward Silas but I will not defend him here. He's okay and nice most of the time but when he meets certain people that trigger his judgmental behavior I can understand perfectly why people do not take too kindly to him. I think he can be like that because of the fact that he's of noble blood and bearing—it's in the nature of the noble class to feel entitled to many things, manipulate to their advantage, and judge others they feel need to be judged.

This makes him much more human to me and even more easy to appreciate as a character because he's really just like any of us and we can all be jerks at any given time when triggered.

Honestly, Silas's behavior reversed from what I'd expect in that case. Most of the characters he's rude/creepy to are women of noble standing or an equivalent--Kagero, Orochi, and Hana are of noble birth, Rinkah is the daughter of the leader of one of Hoshido's allies, Felicia is the daughter of the leader of one of Nohr's vassals, and Camilla, Azura, Elise and Sakura are all princesses. And while I don't particularly like them, he's much less judgmental and rude in his supports with Mozu and Charlotte, and arguably two of the supports that put him in the best light are with Beruka and Nyx, both commoners.

[JasonsOrigin]

Honestly, Silas's behavior reversed from what I'd expect in that case. Most of the characters he's rude/creepy to are women of noble standing or an equivalent--Kagero, Orochi, and Hana are of noble birth, Rinkah is the daughter of the leader of one of Hoshido's allies, Felicia is the daughter of the leader of one of Nohr's vassals, and Camilla, Azura, Elise and Sakura are all princesses. And while I don't particularly like them, he's much less judgmental and rude in his supports with Mozu and Charlotte, and arguably two of the supports that put him in the best light are with Beruka and Nyx, both commoners.

This makes some sense to me. From what I've gathered from other forms of media and bits of history is that it's actually very common for the upper class to mistreat other upper class people. But realistically they would do it discreetly, behind each other's backs or very, very passive aggressively through backhanded dialogue. In Fates' case though it's out in the open because this is just how the support system works.

His otherwise more pleasant supports with the characters you mentioned lead me to conclude that Silas may harbor a rather low opinion of the higher class despite being born into it. This could be because he wasn't aloud to see Corrin anymore and was even about to be executed for taking Corrin out of confinement—the fact that Silas is a Scorpio helps to cement this because it's difficult for Scorpios to forget painful events in which they feel deeply wronged. So it could be understood that his unfair judgement and treatment of the mentioned characters may be him projecting the pain of having been judged, sentenced, and treated harshly by those of equal or higher standing than him.

Honestly if they reach a compromise between GBA and Modern FE support pool size (some limits, but bigger than that of GBA's, no Kamuisexuals, and more nonromantic possbilities) I'd be pretty happy. Less supports to write---while it won't guarantee that every support would be quality(since not every GBA support is quality, either), would at least cut down on the amount some really egregiously bad supports due to utterly forced interactions.

I agree with shrinking the support size for the hope of quality (but I also want length). What I want is for the writers to sit down and think deeply about the characters they're writing supports for and consider all of what makes the characters them before letting them interact with each other. In too many supports I got the feeling the writers weren't very serious and didn't mean for them to be taken seriously (I.E. Soleil x Foleo) but it didn't turn out that way for most of the fans. We took it all seriously because we're serious about Fire Emblem and raged about it.

I have no problem with characters acting like jerks to certain others because I can appreciate certain Jerk tropes myself but let me know why in higher ranks—give me insight—give me character—because with the support system as it is allowing for characters to mistreat others with no real basis and then falling in love with them within four instances does not make for an enjoyable read. It just makes them look bad with poor chemistry even if we're able to piece together the "whys" ourselves.