Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[bethany81707]

9 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

How about that Def Ploy BLyn tho? I feel bad about how good it is so I'm not making that build lmao.

Wait, really? If Def Ploy is a 240 C Skill, I should probably give it to my Lyn so I can have a better 240 C Skill than Atk Smoke. (Finally, she's changing one of her defaults!)

Pity it won't help her on the defence team. Well, it'll help her, but the other three are green magic-users. (Fae, Boey, and Deirdre this season, Inigo last).

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

10 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

i havent even touched my BLyn sometimes i forgot i even have one

Horses already broken without her, eh?

3 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

@SatsumaFSoysoy Have i mentioned CDR is dumb?

• Black Knight, Sinister General gains 4 defense by getting attacked [Steady Breath].
• Sigurd, Holy Knight attacks. 12 damage dealt. Opponent gains a special cooldown charge [Steady Breath].
  Black Knight, Sinister General HP: 48 → 36
• Black Knight, Sinister General counter-attacks. Resolve combat as if opponent suffered a 80% defense/resistance reduction [Black Luna]. 41 damage dealt.
  Sigurd, Holy Knight HP: 41 → 0

CDR is dumb

Oh, I know ALL about this man. That's not even Wrath BK lmao.

Speaking of Sigurd, he's kinda dumb too. With +Spd -Res, Fury, Moonbow, and then a Hone Cav, he gets kinda close to Swift Sparrow Roy's offensive power, BUT he is fucking RIDICULOUS to kill with Hone Cav on him. Some Blues even suicide into him. Quadruple +6 Blarblade Olwen can't kill him, nor can Ursula. He is making Swordbreaker Reinhardt an actual build instead of a meme.

8 minutes ago, phineas81707 said:

...Looking at these matches, I'd gladly take a neutral Elena- she runs both these fights too close to take a defensive bane, even with her terrible Defence.

Yeah, she's treading on really thin ice. Any less of one stat and she'd be picking up a bunch of losses. She barely lives Fury Ryoma, too.

3 minutes ago, phineas81707 said:

Wait, really? If Def Ploy is a 240 C Skill, I should probably give it to my Lyn so I can have a better 240 C Skill than Atk Smoke. (Finally, she's changing one of her defaults!)

Pity it won't help her on the defence team. Well, it'll help her, but the other three are green magic-users. (Fae, Boey, and Deirdre this season, Inigo last).

Yes, really. Neutral Mulagir Brave Lyn with the Res +3 seal can Ploy other neutral Brave Lyns for an easier time one-shotting them, and also breaks Nowi. She can also kill Ravens that don't run Bowbreaker (a lot of Raven users like Cecilia and Spring Camilla have users who still choose to carry Green Tomebreaker etc.) with Def Ploy. Basically it's good af.

[Vaximillian]

@phineas81707: I not only remember you having stated her name before, I also remember Ike’s mum having been in the CYL poll.

[Infinite Dreams]

Oooh, new special maps.  Need those orbs.  <3

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

6 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

Horses already broken without her, eh?

Nah because Brave Roy is a hilariously broken unit, slot 2 is insta winilia, and slot 3 is built in Goad Cav so i don't see reason to build her even then

Edited October 21, 2017 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[Silent shifter]

Now with a new developer maps, I am starting to struggle once again.

[DehNutCase]

5 hours ago, LuxSpes said:

I was planning not to pull from the Ayra banner, but then I realized that I really need some red skill fodder, namely Eirika, Roy and Hinata. And the TT banner is probably the best banner to pull reds from right now. I might end up spending some of my TT orbs on it after tall. And apparently the game shot up in the sales ranking so apparently the whales took the bait, so it's not like F2P protesting will change their mind on how scummy the whole thing was now.

He'd end that sentence by saying. "By the way, I removed your credit information. We both know it's better for you that way" 

@DehNutCase

The reason I find the Ayra situation problematic is not because she's not free. It's because she's :

1. the first new summonable unit to not be announced and featured in a trailer 
2. the first new unit to be put on a banner with old characters
3. the first new unit to break the usual pattern of new units only being introduced every two weeks in dedicated banners
4. the only infantry melee unit to have more than 47 BST at level 1, which when combined with her CYL growths, preference weapon and preference special makes her a clear upgrade to the vast majority of sword infantry units in the game. 

All of which are extremely bad precedents for the game in general and they would still be problematic if Arden had been the one snuck on the TT banner (though it's likely less people would have reacted to it since he's not a pretty waifu), but I want to focus on the first 3 points more.

I would have been A-OK if they had announced a new banner that came out on the 30th and featured her alongside other units from FE4. Sure, I would have still found it strange that they broke the trend that units teased but not announced in trailers turned out to be TT or GHB rewards, but I would have understood it. Her appearing with no warning 3 days after the WoHW banner on a banner with Eldigan and Lachesis is breaks 3 trends, which is not good for the players, but very good for IS.

Till now, the devs had been commendably transparent regarding new units, we never got surprised and the usual trend of new units coming every two weeks allowed people to plan their orbs use and their budget for the game. The only thing transparent about Ayra being added to the game this way is that it's a blatant cash grab. Yes, FEH is a gacha game, but this level of greed and lack of transparency had never been seen before. You might say they were foolish, but for a lot of people, FEH is their first gacha game and they'd started to expect certain things from IS. Namely, that any new summonable unit would be announced before their inclusion and that they'd be featured on banners with new units.

Those expectations being trampled seemingly in the name of greed is what a lot of players are denouncing, not that the big bad IS stole their promised free waifu. Sure, Ayra being the first unit to defy the trend of teased units turning out to be free is a bummer, but it would have stung much less if she'd been released 2 weeks from now on a proper banner instead of being featured with Lachesis and Eldigan, 2 units that have been in the game for 8 months and are pretty mediocre when compared to more recent unit (Lachesis is a healer and her brother is overshadowed by Xander, B!Roy and now Sigurd). And I think a lot of people would have been ok with her being featured on the WoHW banner and having an overall lower chance of appearing since Sigurd spooking you is much less frustrating than Eldigan doing it, especially when considering how good Sigurd is and how much he outclasses Eldigan. (Not to mention that the TT banner is a worse TT banner than the WoHW banner since the later has three 40% bonus unit while the TT banner proper only has one)

Sigurd and Ayra getting the CYL treatment is a whole other problematic can of worms, but I feel like they're less problematic that the predatory behavior this banner showed.

The best excuse for it I've seen is that IS wanted the bonus units for the TT to be all gen 1 FE4 units, but they realized that if they put Ayra on the WoHW banner, they'd only have 2 units left for the TT banner. So instead they decided to put Ayra on the TT banner and have two 3 unit banners and they decided to give Sigurd and Ayra the CYL treatment because they're from the game that has been away from the spotlight the longest out of any FE game and they wanted to generate some hype about them. Their complete lack of transparency regarding Ayra however makes me unwilling to give them a pass even if that were their intention, though I'm more open toward accepting the second part to excuse her heightened BST and powerful preference skills. 

1, That's fair (I mostly don't keep up so much with announcements---I do like watching trailers for theorycraft, of course, but I'm also fine with only learning about a unit when a banner pops up).

2, I feel like this bit doesn't matter so much as long as the odds work out: Yeah, the Ayra banner is worse for full rolls than her being on an all new unit banner, but it's still a damn amazing banner for sniping. Like, if I were pulling for Ayra I wouldn't care if she's on a banner with 3 new units or 2 old units, because I'd be sniping her color for her rather than full pulls. What I'd really care about would be the odds of getting her per pull, which is better in a small banner. (And a 3 unit banner with 2 units sharing a color is damn amazing in terms of 5* count if you snipe, hence why I'm fine with the current situation.)

Her being in the Sigurd banner would mean almost as much 5*s when sniping reds, but gives up the ability to snipe for each individually. (Personally I'd snipe Sigurd if I'd snipe anyone, because Sigurd is a trainee horse with great spread, but that's just because I value mobility a lot.)

3, Also fair. (Again, I really don't keep up with that kind of thing---don't really pay attention how often new units are released.)

4, This is actually a problem, yeah, given that Ayra's clearly power-creeped. Mind, I don't even mind this part that much because what makes a unit good isn't just their BST and spread, because that only determines matchups---again my valuing mobility coming in. To me it feels more like Infantry, being a weak unit type, is simply being slightly buffed so that they can compete with cavalry.

Meaning it's actually Sigurd who's the bigger problem for me, because he's a power-creeped horse. (The fact that he's a melee horse means that I'm also fine with him, though, since it's really Tomes and Cavalry being the two major overpowered unit types.)

 

Another reason I'm fine with this split is also because I'm fine with Eldigan, oddly enough. I like Alfonse a lot, and only partly because he's a bonus unit every 3 seasons, a tanky red with low speed but good bulk and atk is very nice, and Eldigan is Alfonse on a horse, with a very nice starting skill set. Sure, he's out classed by Sigurd, but the fact that it's cheaper to pull Eldigan or Ayra than Sigurd means that his quality drop is made up for in the quantity increase. (And if I actually wanted Sigurd I'd just snipe his color---I'm currently prioritizing grabbing more dancers, though.)

Basically, this banner doesn't feel like a 'cash grab' to me because, after I run the math, it's actually better, orbs wise, to have the split than not to have the split.

 

Non-split advantage:

Before pulling Ayra or Sigurd, better odds per orb.

On a banner with other new units, meaning full pulls are much more likely to produce new 5*s.

Split advantage:

After pulling either, better odds per orb.

More 5*s per orb in general.

 

Non-split disadvantage:

After pulling Ayra or Sigurd odds become significantly worse, because you can't jump to a separate banner.

Sniping is better than full pulls math-wise, meaning full pulls shouldn't be done regardless.

Split Disadvantage:

Only Sigurd can be individually sniped, Ayra will always be next to Eldigan. (Odds are still better than sharing a color with Sigurd, however.)

Full pulls are worse (because Lachesis).

 

The problem with Ayra being with other new units is that it's only a benefit if you do full rolls, which are horrendous from a mathematical perspective, hence why I don't get people's preference for it. Being on a 3 unit banner is good, being on a 3 unit banner with another unit of the same color is amazing for increasing 5* odds while rolling, at the cost of being spooked by the other 5*. This is only bad if Eldigan is nearly worthless for the puller, because the odds don't actually drop that much compared to Ayra being by herself in red. (A lot of the Eldigan 'spooks' are from red 5* pulls you simply wouldn't have gotten otherwise. The Eldigan that pops up isn't replacing Ayra, it's replacing a random 3-4* red.)

 

Edit: @Kaden The above is basically why I don't understand why Ayra being with old units is a problem, since the odds of getting her is actually better this way. That is, you'd spend less orbs rolling for her, and, while rolling for her, you get more random 5*s. (Red's 5* odds should be around 12% per orb in her banner.)

...Well, that's a lie, I completely understand that people are bad at math.

It's just that, the obvious thing to do for IS isn't to act 'nicer' or less 'money-grabby.' It's to be more money-grabby, except hide it behind maths. They can simply release 5 or 6 unit banners that are actually hilariously terrible in terms of orb spent vs. units obtained, yet everyone will be fine with it, even though they're actually getting less units per orb, meaning they need to spend orbs.

 

Basically, I prefer:

Being nice, looking mean over being mean, looking nice.

Edited October 21, 2017 by DehNutCase

[bethany81707]

Just now, Vaximillian said:

@phineas81707: I not only remember you having stated her name before, I also remember Ike’s mum having been in the CYL poll.

Yeah, that's... in one of my old stories, she was the daughter of Ike, named after his mother. She's, if I can say this with a straight face, even more of a hothead than Ike- she outright believes she can get by in fights with just her ridiculously high speed and dodging ability.

(I also voted for Elena in the CYL. I was only mostly joking when I did so.)

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

5 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

1, That's fair (I mostly don't keep up so much with announcements---I do like watching trailers for theorycraft, of course, but I'm also fine with only learning about a unit when a banner pops up).

2, I feel like this bit doesn't matter so much as long as the odds work out: Yeah, the Ayra banner is worse for full rolls than her being on an all new unit banner, but it's still a damn amazing banner for sniping. Like, if I were pulling for Ayra I wouldn't care if she's on a banner with 3 new units or 2 old units, because I'd be sniping her color for her rather than full pulls. What I'd really care about would be the odds of getting her per pull, which is better in a small banner. (And a 3 unit banner with 2 units sharing a color is damn amazing in terms of 5* count if you snipe, hence why I'm fine with the current situation.)

Her being in the Sigurd banner would mean almost as much 5*s when sniping reds, but gives up the ability to snipe for each individually. (Personally I'd snipe Sigurd if I'd snipe anyone, because Sigurd is a trainee horse with great spread, but that's just because I value mobility a lot.)

3, Also fair. (Again, I really don't keep up with that kind of thing---don't really pay attention how often new units are released.)

4, This is actually a problem, yeah, given that Ayra's clearly power-creeped. Mind, I don't even mind this part that much because what makes a unit good isn't just their BST and spread, because that only determines matchups---again my valuing mobility coming in. To me it feels more like Infantry, being a weak unit type, is simply being slightly buffed so that they can compete with cavalry.

Meaning it's actually Sigurd who's the bigger problem for me, because he's a power-creeped horse. (The fact that he's a melee horse means that I'm also fine with him, though, since it's really Tomes and Cavalry being the two major overpowered unit types.)

 

Another reason I'm fine with this split is also because I'm fine with Eldigan, oddly enough. I like Alfonse a lot, and only partly because he's a bonus unit every 3 seasons, a tanky red with low speed but good bulk and atk is very nice, and Eldigan is Alfonse on a horse, with a very nice starting skill set. Sure, he's out classed by Sigurd, but the fact that it's cheaper to pull Eldigan or Ayra than Sigurd means that his quality drop is made up for in the quantity increase. (And if I actually wanted Sigurd I'd just snipe his color---I'm currently prioritizing grabbing more dancers, though.)

Basically, this banner doesn't feel like a 'cash grab' to me because, after I run the math, it's actually better, orbs wise, to have the split than not to have the split.

 

Non-split advantage:

Before pulling Ayra or Sigurd, better odds per orb.

On a banner with other new units, meaning full pulls are much more likely to produce new 5*s.

Split advantage:

After pulling either, better odds per orb.

More 5*s per orb in general.

 

Non-split disadvantage:

After pulling Ayra or Sigurd odds become significantly worse, because you can't jump to a separate banner.

Sniping is better than full pulls math-wise, meaning full pulls shouldn't be done regardless.

Split Disadvantage:

Only Sigurd can be individually sniped, Ayra will always be next to Eldigan. (Odds are still better than sharing a color with Sigurd, however.)

Full pulls are worse (because Lachesis).

 

The problem with Ayra being with other new units is that it's only a benefit if you do full rolls, which are horrendous from a mathematical perspective, hence why I don't get people's preference for it. Being on a 3 unit banner is good, being on a 3 unit banner with another unit of the same color is amazing for increasing 5* odds while rolling, at the cost of being spooked by the other 5*. This is only bad if Eldigan is nearly worthless for the puller, because the odds don't actually drop that much compared to Ayra being by herself in red. (A lot of the Eldigan 'spooks' are from red 5* pulls you simply wouldn't have gotten otherwise. The Eldigan that pops up isn't replacing Ayra, it's replacing a random 3-4* red.)

What i don't get is why Eldigan is framed as a worthless unit all of a sudden tbh because even now i think he's still damn good, but then again i worships CD manipulation too much

[Vaximillian]

2 minutes ago, phineas81707 said:

Yeah, that's... in one of my old stories, she was the daughter of Ike…

With Sothe, I hope?

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I read "Mk1" as "Mkv". They WOULD ask him to design some maps. Then he would show us how to beat it with a 3 star team of Donnel, two olivia, and a weapon-less stahl. 

[bethany81707]

1 minute ago, Vaximillian said:

With Sothe, I hope?

Mia. (The Wo Dao is hers.)

Though, as a bit of a developer in-joke, Sothe's kid and Ike's other kid switched names at some point. So I suppose you can say Ike is the father of Sothe's daughter.

[Sunwoo]

Is +HP -spd Seth salvageable ;/

[Infinite Dreams]

Well, those maps were quite fun!  I'm at 21 orbs now, so it's pulling time~ 

[MonkeyCheez3K]

Hurray, 2 extra orbs today! (13 down the drain with three worthless 3* units), it's almost as if this day didn't happen XD

[bethany81707]

Just now, MonkeyCheez3K said:

Hurray, 2 extra orbs today! (13 down the drain with three worthless 3* units), it's almost as if this day didn't happen XD

...I can relate.

[MonkeyCheez3K]

4 minutes ago, phineas81707 said:

...I can relate.

Gacha is fun, ain't it? Game won't give me my Olivia, I just know it (I know she is a bad unit and only semi-useful because she dances, but come on.... stupid seasonal unit BS stopping me from getting my waifu... grumble grumble.....)

Next 15 orbs when? XD

[bethany81707]

2 minutes ago, MonkeyCheez3K said:

Gacha is fun, ain't it? Game won't give me my Olivia, I just know it (I know she is a bad unit and only semi-useful because she dances, but come on.... stupid seasonal unit BS stopping me from getting my waifu... grumble grumble.....)

Next 15 orbs when? XD

I'm just grateful to know my 'you missed Elincia' luck is gone. (Though, in fodder terms, 3* Hinata and 4* Selena aren't that bad).

If Ayra isn't a freebie on the Tempest and I miss her as well... well, if I'm still around, that's probably a bunch of apology luck as well. Would that be more or less than Elincia?

[Zeo]

Those orbs gave me hope. Then I saw 2 colorless orbs in my FE4 pool and one of each other color. Left me with 11 orbs, could have saved but took a shot at Ayra so went over to the tempest banner (nothing good from the FE4 Banner btw). Not a single red orb. Green orb gave me Titania *4.

Now I have 3.75% on both the FE4 and Dancer banner with only a week left on both. Crap crap crap.

[Stroud]

I will charge until the last day. At least I want to see what's on Halloween banner. But I should pull for another merge for Deirdre as long as I can for arena core's sake. 
I must admit that I'm also temped to draw today. But I will scratch those orbs together and try not to play too much.
 

[Infinite Dreams]

24 minutes ago, MonkeyCheez3K said:

Gacha is fun, ain't it? Game won't give me my Olivia, I just know it (I know she is a bad unit and only semi-useful because she dances, but come on.... stupid seasonal unit BS stopping me from getting my waifu... grumble grumble.....)

Next 15 orbs when? XD

She is a dancer, so she can't be bad in my books!  (Having 7 of them sure helps with AA.)  Plus, she looks soooo pretty in her new art.    Hope you get her, fingers crossed for you!

[Vaximillian]

These developer maps are much fun. They show what one can achieve with inheritance, creativity, and luck.

Also Horse Emblem is cute, as it is supposed to be. Horse Emblem for life.

me getting another Rezzy and another Merric again is neither fun nor cute

Edited October 21, 2017 by Vaximillian

[MonkeyCheez3K]

1 minute ago, Infinite Dreams said:

She is a dancer, so she can't be bad in my books!  (Having 7 of them sure helps with AA.)  Plus, she looks soooo pretty in her new art.    Hope you get her, fingers crossed for you!

I cannot ignore that she is the worst of the dancers, though. On the other hand, I also cannot deny her usefulness in AA; maybe I'll try to make her super niche with some weird build.... IF I get her. There are few characters where I've told myself "yo, you need all versions of that character" and Olivia is one of them, so thanks for rooting for me. I'll need it.

[eclipse]

55 minutes ago, MonkeyCheez3K said:

I cannot ignore that she is the worst of the dancers, though. On the other hand, I also cannot deny her usefulness in AA; maybe I'll try to make her super niche with some weird build.... IF I get her. There are few characters where I've told myself "yo, you need all versions of that character" and Olivia is one of them, so thanks for rooting for me. I'll need it.

She's the purest support unit of the bunch. Debuffs/heals on attack, which makes way for the rest of your team to wreak havoc.

[mcsilas]

1 hour ago, MonkeyCheez3K said:

I cannot ignore that she is the worst of the dancers, though. On the other hand, I also cannot deny her usefulness in AA; maybe I'll try to make her super niche with some weird build.... IF I get her. There are few characters where I've told myself "yo, you need all versions of that character" and Olivia is one of them, so thanks for rooting for me. I'll need it.

Hey, I think PA!Olivia has the best design out of the bunch, and she actually beats Nohrzura!

The art is lovely and I just love her darker look. And she uses a fan for dancing and attacking! I always love fan weapon users!

Worth it to go through colourless hell just for her. I mean if I had more orbs of course, but I'd be delighted to get her even if she's a bad nature