Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Tree said:

You don't have reposition, swap, etc. I guess. Do you have any escape route units? It is a positioning skill that is often forgotten about and can work well with flyers.

No, like I said, I ran out of fodder for those.

Escape Route is not a positioning skill. It's a B skill.

[Johann]

11 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Ryoma can take a hit from the dagger, Elincia can't. But like I said, the green horse mage always stays out of range because of the stupid horse cav pulling him back.

Hmmm ok, I see, the issue is that the green horse is moving in before Ursula. In all my tests just now, Ursula was moving in first and getting drawn back, while the green guy would move in after, leaving him in range for whoever took the dagger hit. There's a way we can trick the AI to changing that priority so Ursula goes first, and if Clair can jump in next to Ryoma, she'd have a clean shot at Ursula after Ryoma kills the green guy (assuming he can, though I imagine he'd have Glimmer ready). We've just gotta figure out what makes that happen...

edit: Upon actually looking at Clair's stats, I'm not sure she has enough Atk to kill Ursula in one hit. Ursula's also probably going to be too fast since she'll have Goad Cavalry from the sword guy, so Clair would need a way to bring her Spd up to 44 on her turn to double Ursula. I'll have to rethink this a bit.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Johann

[Tree]

4 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Escape Route is not a positioning skill. It's a B skill.

Yes, it is a B skill, not an assist skill. But some B skills are used for positioning (drag back, lunge, etc.).

Clair with wing spear is basically a blue Caeda, so that's probably one to use if you have a 5* one already (you mentioned not having enough feathers). You'll also need enough resources (200 divine dew) for the wing spear upgrade. Without wing spear she is probably not the best choice for this.

[Johann]

1 minute ago, Tree said:

Yes, it is a B skill, not an assist skill. But some B skills are used for positioning (drag back, lunge, etc.).

Clair with wing spear is basically a blue Caeda, so that's probably one to use if you have a 5* one already (you mentioned not having enough feathers). You'll also need enough resources (200 divine dew) for the wing spear upgrade. Without wing spear she is probably not the best choice for this.

She wouldn't need the refine, Rhomphaia at base offers what she'd need. More likely that Clair needs something like Darting Blow to actually double Ursula, who has way too much HP for Clair to one shot.

[Anacybele]

Clair wouldn't survive the green horse mage though. Gerome can one-shot Ursula, but then he gets creamed by the green horse mage too, if not the sword cav.

Like I said, not being allowed to lose units is extremely hindering.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Anacybele

[redlight]

@AnacybeleIt's not a clear, but I've got something figured out. I apologise if the post comes off as messy or confusing. If you don't have a spare fortify fliers or it on anyone at all then you can just ignore this post. I just don't have the resources and the units to finish it, but maybe you can. You don't need any of the units in question aside from Ryoma to fulfill the turn 1 tanking, but you do need other units to finish the job with wings of mercy. Again, doesn't have to be Caeda, Elincia or Tana. These are just units I have holding buffs. Most importantly, Ryoma needs summoner support rank C and distant defense 3 seal. Also, you'll need all of the buffs I listed in the video.

Here is the turn 1 plan: https://vimeo.com/281863950

My Ryoma is +spd -res, but you just need to replace Elincia's seal slot with hone spd if your's has +atk. As for Tana and Caeda, they're just for buffs. However if you have a 5 star Clair and Palla, have both use wings of mercy. Heck, have the fourth flier also have wings of mercy just in case. Clair with Rhomphaia for the red sword cavalier and Palla with Ruby Sword to take on the green armor. Clair needs to be in the same position as Tana in the 2nd turn to receive fortify fliers. She also needs atk smoke 3 in her seal slot to inflict an atk debuff on the dagger user in order to survive.

[Johann]

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

Clair wouldn't survive the green horse mage though. Gerome can one-shot Ursula, but then he gets creamed by the green horse mage too, if not the sword cav.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around why the green cavalry is going first, since I can never seem to get him to go first in my tests. Whats your team and what do they do in turn 1? I wanna see if I can recreate his going first and determine if there's something you can change to mix up that priority. If we can get him to go after Ursula, he'd be in attacking range, with Ursula next to him, potentially giving you a way to take both of them out in one turn.

[Tree]

7 minutes ago, Johann said:

She wouldn't need the refine, Rhomphaia at base offers what she'd need. More likely that Clair needs something like Darting Blow to actually double Ursula, who has way too much HP for Clair to one shot.

When I used Caeda, I needed all the help I could get including the special charges. I guess the cavalry and armor effectiveness is enough here?

[Johann]

1 minute ago, Tree said:

When I used Caeda, I needed all the help I could get including the special charges. I guess the cavalry and armor effectiveness is enough here?

It can be, depending on how much Atk and Spd the unit has. Caeda and Clair both have really low Atk, but it's very much possible to have them both do enough to not require a special (against Ursula herself, Clair fairs better since there's no triangle penalty).

[Anacybele]

14 minutes ago, Johann said:

I'm still trying to wrap my head around why the green cavalry is going first, since I can never seem to get him to go first in my tests. Whats your team and what do they do in turn 1? I wanna see if I can recreate his going first and determine if there's something you can change to mix up that priority. If we can get him to go after Ursula, he'd be in attacking range, with Ursula next to him, potentially giving you a way to take both of them out in one turn.

I've been trying a whole bunch of things and team combinations. Not just one in particular.

I guess there's just nothing I can fucking do because I lack skill fodder and flying dancers and shit. And I shouldn't NEED all of that when I have so many 5 star fliers with a bunch of SI already. This is why I think some of these battles are too stupidly difficult and should allow you to lose units.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Anacybele

[Johann]

Just now, Anacybele said:

I've been trying a whole bunch of things and team combinations. Not just one in particular.

I just tried it now with Legendary Robin as a substitute for Ryoma, and I think I see what's happening-- countering the thief makes the axe armor warp in next to him, the green guy moves in and gets drawn back by the sword guy, and then Ursula hides behind the wall. Is this what happens when you do that with Ryoma?

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, Johann said:

I just tried it now with Legendary Robin as a substitute for Ryoma, and I think I see what's happening-- countering the thief makes the axe armor warp in next to him, the green guy moves in and gets drawn back by the sword guy, and then Ursula hides behind the wall. Is this what happens when you do that with Ryoma?

Pretty much. Except the armor never warps because Ryoma kills the thief.

I didn't level up legendary Robin though. I hate her.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Anacybele

[Tactician_Iris]

50 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

No, like I said, I ran out of fodder for those.

Escape Route is not a positioning skill. It's a B skill.

Hm. I just realised something -  if your L!Ryoma has Reposition (you only mentioned that neither of your Hinokas didn't) then there might be another option that might make the strat I posted work, Smite.

With that in mind, you wouldn't happen to have an Effie or a Bartre to fodder off Smite to WoF!Hinoka?

If you do, she can position her regular self where she needs to go so she can Flier Formation teleport to Gerome.

(She still needs to hit the speed threshold to actually quad Ursula)

Edited July 26, 2018 by Tactician_Iris

[Johann]

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Pretty much. Except the armor never warps because Ryoma kills the thief.

I didn't level up legendary Robin though. I hate her.

Ah, so he's fast enough to just kill that thief? That's interesting. And don't worry, you won't need Robin, I only mentioned her cuz she's my only DC flier that I could run the tests with.

Trying it now (again using Robin cuz that's all I have), I see how this is playing out differently because he's killing the Thief. If the Thief lives, the armor warps over, and Ursula actually retreats up one space from her starting point, instead of moving in closer like you're seeing. I would say you have a few potential options worth trying:

Option 1) Give Ryoma Distant Def 3 seal (assuming you have it) and if possible, someone else has Fortify Fliers to make him hardier. With enough Res, he'll be ok to take hits from the ranged attackers, including Ursula. From this setup, you could either have him counter kill the Thief and position in a way to counter both the green cavalry mage and Ursula, or go right into a spot to counter Ursula at the very beginning. I'm not sure how it would play out from here but killing Ursula and the other mage is usually the most important thing to do in this fight.

Option 2) Alter Ryoma's skills and buffs so that he doesn't kill the Thief. From there, Ursula will position herself further away, and you can position Ryoma in a spot where only the green mage can hit him. Everyone else on the team would have to pull back, and someone would have to take a hit from the top dagger guy. Again I don't know how this would play out, but it would at least remove the green mage and put Ursula very far from you.

[silverserpent]

@Anacybele do you have Rhomphaia on Clair? L!Ryoma should be able to handle the thief easily. If Clair has her prf, she should be able to take out Ursula and the red cav since she has the Res to shrug off Ursula's attacks. I think you put that you had H!Nowi? Use her to take out the green armor and then you can use another unit to assassinate the top ninja.

Edit: Ah, right...forget these quests were on infernal so I forgot the green cav mage. Hmm...it should still work, but I can't suitably test it out for you, unfortunately. Clair's one of my favorites and I've built her to be a Mage Killer, regardless of color.

Edited July 26, 2018 by silverserpent

[kirauza343]

@Anacybele

We have quite a few fliers in common, so I took a look at it with mine and managed it with Tana, Nowi, Myrrh, and Elincia (and with minimum assist skills!)

Tana needs to hit at least 51 speed between buffs/goads/spurs, but that's not too hard to hit between Fury, Hone Fliers from Nowi (who comes with it), a speed+ seal, and a goad from Elincia (alternatively you can swap at least one of those out for a speed refined weapon if you don't use her prf). Wings of Mercy 2 should be sufficient. Mine does have reposition, but really it just saves you a turn at the end so it's not necessary.

Nowi just needs dagger breaker (and dagger breaker 1 will suffice), moonbow, and a little extra attack to be able to one round the dagger user. She uses reposition, but she comes with it so that shouldn't be a problem.

Myrrh needs close defense to help deal with the sword cavalier (and luckily there's a seal for that) plus any level of quick riposte (though you can probably work around that if you don't have any sources of it since Tana will already have WoM and can help out). Her A and C slots are open for whatever you want, and her c slot in particular can help your Nowi if she's having issues securing the kill.

Elincia really just needs lunge so that Tana can do her teleporting properly. Mine currently has Galeforce but it wasn't necessary. Flier formation is also nice for positioning at the end, but there's a seal for that.

Your units' natures might mess with things a bit, but hopefully this'll be helpful!

 

[Anacybele]

48 minutes ago, Johann said:

Ah, so he's fast enough to just kill that thief? That's interesting. And don't worry, you won't need Robin, I only mentioned her cuz she's my only DC flier that I could run the tests with.

Trying it now (again using Robin cuz that's all I have), I see how this is playing out differently because he's killing the Thief. If the Thief lives, the armor warps over, and Ursula actually retreats up one space from her starting point, instead of moving in closer like you're seeing. I would say you have a few potential options worth trying:

Option 1) Give Ryoma Distant Def 3 seal (assuming you have it) and if possible, someone else has Fortify Fliers to make him hardier. With enough Res, he'll be ok to take hits from the ranged attackers, including Ursula. From this setup, you could either have him counter kill the Thief and position in a way to counter both the green cavalry mage and Ursula, or go right into a spot to counter Ursula at the very beginning. I'm not sure how it would play out from here but killing Ursula and the other mage is usually the most important thing to do in this fight.

Option 2) Alter Ryoma's skills and buffs so that he doesn't kill the Thief. From there, Ursula will position herself further away, and you can position Ryoma in a spot where only the green mage can hit him. Everyone else on the team would have to pull back, and someone would have to take a hit from the top dagger guy. Again I don't know how this would play out, but it would at least remove the green mage and put Ursula very far from you.

No, I put the QR seal on him so he could kill him. He can't kill the thief without it.

Gerome has Fortify Fliers, so that is an option.

It sounds like option 2 would be my best bet here out of what you're saying.

38 minutes ago, silverserpent said:

@Anacybele do you have Rhomphaia on Clair? L!Ryoma should be able to handle the thief easily. If Clair has her prf, she should be able to take out Ursula and the red cav since she has the Res to shrug off Ursula's attacks. I think you put that you had H!Nowi? Use her to take out the green armor and then you can use another unit to assassinate the top ninja.

Edit: Ah, right...forget these quests were on infernal so I forgot the green cav mage. Hmm...it should still work, but I can't suitably test it out for you, unfortunately. Clair's one of my favorites and I've built her to be a Mage Killer, regardless of color.

Yeah, in fact, I just gave it the unique refine. And sure, go ahead and test that.

22 minutes ago, kirauza343 said:

@Anacybele

We have quite a few fliers in common, so I took a look at it with mine and managed it with Tana, Nowi, Myrrh, and Elincia (and with minimum assist skills!)

Tana needs to hit at least 51 speed between buffs/goads/spurs, but that's not too hard to hit between Fury, Hone Fliers from Nowi (who comes with it), a speed+ seal, and a goad from Elincia (alternatively you can swap at least one of those out for a speed refined weapon if you don't use her prf). Wings of Mercy 2 should be sufficient. Mine does have reposition, but really it just saves you a turn at the end so it's not necessary.

Nowi just needs dagger breaker (and dagger breaker 1 will suffice), moonbow, and a little extra attack to be able to one round the dagger user. She uses reposition, but she comes with it so that shouldn't be a problem.

Myrrh needs close defense to help deal with the sword cavalier (and luckily there's a seal for that) plus any level of quick riposte (though you can probably work around that if you don't have any sources of it since Tana will already have WoM and can help out). Her A and C slots are open for whatever you want, and her c slot in particular can help your Nowi if she's having issues securing the kill.

Elincia really just needs lunge so that Tana can do her teleporting properly. Mine currently has Galeforce but it wasn't necessary. Flier formation is also nice for positioning at the end, but there's a seal for that.

Your units' natures might mess with things a bit, but hopefully this'll be helpful!

 

I don't have Daggerbreaker fodder, sorry. I haven't seen a Kagero in forever. I don't have any QR fodder either. Man, I'm realizing now just how unlucky I've been lately in pulling good fodder units.

[kirauza343]

16 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I don't have Daggerbreaker fodder, sorry. I haven't seen a Kagero in forever. I don't have any QR fodder either. Man, I'm realizing now just how unlucky I've been lately in pulling good fodder units.

The Quick Riposte seal might be enough for Nowi, but you would 100% need Myrrh to have Hone Fliers or Goad fliers if you still want to one round him (and even that may not be quite enough, though if you have a +atk or speed Nowi by chance you might be able to make it work...really you just need some way for her to not be doubled while still having the power to kill him). Quick Riposte on Myrrh should be able to be replaced by swordbreaker (really dealing with that guy who have a lot of flexibility on since he's one of the last two units).

Edit: You may need to do life and death 3 plus quick riposte on Nowi plus a goad fliers from Myrrh. With the fortify from Elincia she can survive exactly one hit from the dagger unit and should be able to one round him. That might mess up some of the other positioning though. If none of this works though I recommend waiting until you get some better fodder, that or build up F!Grima because she's a great choice for dealing with these dagger units.

Edited July 26, 2018 by kirauza343

[Tactician_Iris]

2 hours ago, Anacybele said:

No, like I said, I ran out of fodder for those.

Escape Route is not a positioning skill. It's a B skill.

 

1 hour ago, Tactician_Iris said:

Hm. I just realised something -  if your L!Ryoma has Reposition (you only mentioned that neither of your Hinokas didn't) then there might be another option that might make the strat I posted work, Smite.

With that in mind, you wouldn't happen to have an Effie or a Bartre to fodder off Smite to WoF!Hinoka?

If you do, she can position her regular self where she needs to go so she can Flier Formation teleport to Gerome.

(She still needs to hit the speed threshold to actually quad Ursula)

Hm thinking further, which of your fliers has position skills (and which ones)?

After some testing I realised that besides Smite working out as a replacement for Reposition on WoF!Hinoka, it's also possible to use Halloween!Nowi instead of WoF!Hinoka to begin with.

[Anacybele]

24 minutes ago, kirauza343 said:

The Quick Riposte seal might be enough for Nowi, but you would 100% need Myrrh to have Hone Fliers or Goad fliers if you still want to one round him (and even that may not be quite enough, though if you have a +atk or speed Nowi by chance you might be able to make it work...really you just need some way for her to not be doubled while still having the power to kill him). Quick Riposte on Myrrh should be able to be replaced by swordbreaker (really dealing with that guy who have a lot of flexibility on since he's one of the last two units).

Edit: You may need to do life and death 3 plus quick riposte on Nowi plus a goad fliers from Myrrh. With the fortify from Elincia she can survive exactly one hit from the dagger unit and should be able to one round him. That might mess up some of the other positioning though. If none of this works though I recommend waiting until you get some better fodder, that or build up F!Grima because she's a great choice for dealing with these dagger units.

And Goad/Fortify Fliers is fodder I haven't pulled in a long while too. Ugh. I guess I really do have to keep fucking waiting... This is ridiculous.

13 minutes ago, Tactician_Iris said:

Hm thinking further, which of your fliers has position skills (and which ones)?

After some testing I realised that besides Smite working out as a replacement for Reposition on WoF!Hinoka, it's also possible to use Halloween!Nowi instead of WoF!Hinoka to begin with.

Let's see...

Witch Nowi: Reposition and Swap
Legendary Ryoma: Reposition and Swap
Tana: Reposition
Clair: Reposition
Summer Corrin: Draw Back
Myrrh: Reposition
Palla: Reposition
Michalis: Swap
Gerome: Reposition

[Tactician_Iris]

34 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Let's see...

Witch Nowi: Reposition and Swap
Legendary Ryoma: Reposition and Swap
Tana: Reposition
Clair: Reposition
Summer Corrin: Draw Back
Myrrh: Reposition
Palla: Reposition
Michalis: Swap
Gerome: Reposition

Ah, that might be just what's needed^^

Since Halloween!Nowi has Hone Fliers as well, Hinoka might get away with a lower level of Darting Blow than I had on mine.

Final question, if I may, Hinoka's Boon/Bane - is her Spd at least neutral?

[Anacybele]

9 minutes ago, Tactician_Iris said:

Ah, that might be just what's needed^^

Since Halloween!Nowi has Hone Fliers as well, Hinoka might get away with a lower level of Darting Blow than I had on mine.

Final question, if I may, Hinoka's Boon/Bane - is her Spd at least neutral?

Really? There's hardly any room to use Reposition since all of those stupid walls exist.

Which Hinoka?

[Tactician_Iris]

15 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Really? There's hardly any room to use Reposition since all of those stupid walls exist.

Which Hinoka?

The regular one. ;)

Reposition is only used twice in my strat (and on the same turn), once so that Gerome can reach and kill the Green Mage Cav simultaneously debuff Ursula's Spd, and finally Hit'n Run north. The second time Reposition is used is so that Hinoka can use a Flier Formation seal (lvl 1 should suffice) to teleport next to Gerome and kill Ursula by quadding her with Brave Lance+.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Tactician_Iris
I need Coffee.

[Anacybele]

15 minutes ago, Tactician_Iris said:

The regular one. ;)

Reposition is only used twice in my strat (and on the same turn), once so that Gerome can reach and kill the Green Mage Cav simultaneously debuff Ursula's Spd, and finally Hit'n Run north. The second time Reposition is used is so that Hinoka can use a Flier Formation seal (lvl 1 should suffice) to teleport next to Gerome and kill Ursula by quadding her with Brave Lance+.

Oh, she's +HP, -Res. And I see.

[Tactician_Iris]

30 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Oh, she's +HP, -Res. And I see.

Ah, neutral Spd then, that should be sufficient to replicate my strat, but your Hinoka will need slightly more Spd buffs to quad Ursula than mine did (see below).

As far as Seals go you need to make sure of the following for a clear:

1: L!Ryoma kills the Thief on Turn 1. 

QR, Atk 3, seals should suffice since you have an Atk+ L!Ryoma, and he'll get buffed by Hinoka's Hone Fliers and Kestrel Stance. (Mine's also Atk+(HP- though - I mixed up my Ryoma's bane earlier)

2: Hinoka has Flier Formation 1. Since my seal is at level 3 I can't test level 1 anymore, but level 1 should suffice since Hinoka's HP is full when she's supposed to make use of it. 

3: Gerome has Smoke Spd 3. In order to get away with a lower leveled Smoke Spd than 3, you need to compensate by buffing/increasing Hinoka's speed. I'll detail the specifics below.

 

From my calculations these are possible combinations that will spell the necessary "Quad Hit" for Hinoka vs Ursula (Note: The Red Sword Cav can't Goad Ursula since he dragged back the Green Mage Cavalry in my strat):

 

Gerome + Smoke Spd 3 = Ursula's Spd is at 28 after he kills the Green Mage Cavalry.

Neutral Spd Hinoka with 27 Spd needs 6+ Spd (33) to quad in this case. A Hone Flier Buff from Halloween!Nowi is sufficient.

 

Gerome + Smoke Spd 2 = Ursula's Spd is 30 after debuff.

Neutral Spd Hinoka needs 8+ Spd to quad (35). Darting Blow 2 or Spd 2 and above + Hone Fliers from Halloween!Nowi will suffice. Alternatively, Gerome can equip a Spur Spd in his C skill slot to help Hinoka quad.

 

Gerome + Smoke Spd 1= Ursula's Spd is 32 after debuff.

Neutral Spd Hinoka needs 10+ Spd to quad Ursula (37). Darting Blow 3 and Hone Fliers will suffice. Regular Spd skill won't be enough on it's own - but if Gerome has a Spur Spd skill then that could patch things up.