Arena Discussion Thread (inc. Assault)

[DehNutCase]

31 minutes ago, Clogon said:

+/-1 is total BST between 4* +10 and 5* +5. I do not know of any char (of the ones I am planning to invest in) that has +2 BST outside of +/-4 Boon/Bane. For example 5* +5 Cherche only has +1 HP over her 4* +10 counterpart. If she has a SPD boon, then she will also get +1 SPD since it is a +4 boon.

If you have a list of specific chars in mind, please share it. I would like to keep note of them so that I don't invest into their 4* +10 version. Thanks in advance!

Donnel has 2 stats +3 and 3 stats +2, that means 4* +6 has the same BST as 5* +0.

Most characters have 1 stat +3 and 4 stats +2 from going from 4* to 5*, this means a 4* +5 will have 1 less stats than a 5* +0 for most characters---more if, like Donnel, their stats happen to hit a high growth tier from promotion. This is mostly the 'trainee' units. (But not limited to them, Gwen and Draug are also like this.) Conversely, units like Jagen actually have less benefits from going to 5* over being 4*, due to lower growth rate across the board. Jagen is 4 stats +2 and 1 stat +1. [Stat grains from promotion is a factor of growth rates---the same reason why inside the same unit type there's BST differences.]

 

Also: 5* +0 Cordelia has better match-ups than 4* + 10 if the 4* +10 doesn't have Brave-lance+. (+Atk, L&D 3, nothing else relevant). With Brave-lance+, 5* Cordelia matches 4* +10 at 4 merges. And I'm sure other units have similar results. (Cherche with +Atk, DB3, Brave Axe+ has similar results: 4* +10 gets 98 wins, 5* +1 gets 97 wins, 5* +4 gets 98 wins.)

Raven with Luna and L&D has a similar story. Raven 4* +10 with +Atk and Brave Axe is slightly better than 5* +0 with Brave Axe+, but only marginally (about 1 or 2 matchups) better than Raven 5* +1, and worse than Raven 5* + 2. Raven 4* +10 with Brave Axe+ has near identical match-ups to 5* +4.

 

Basically, if the unit prefers their starting weapon, using a 4* +10 just gimps them like crazy considering you have to spend a 5* and 11 copies of the unit to make them superior to a 5* with minimal merges. And once the 5* obtains 4 merges, they reach parity and can soon pull ahead.

Of course, discussing L&D builds are kind of a joke regarding 4* +10s, no one's going to cough up 20k feathers to give a 4* +10 L&D 3---since the same 20k is another +merge for a 5*---so 4* +10s should suffer even more compared to 5*s.

Edited May 23, 2017 by DehNutCase

[Clogon]

35 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

Donnel has 2 stats +3 and 3 stats +2, that means 4* +6 has the same BST as 5* +0.

Most characters have 1 stat +3 and 4 stats +2 from going from 4* to 5*, this means a 4* +5 will have 1 less stats than a 5* +0 for most characters---more if, like Donnel, their stats happen to hit a high growth tier from promotion. This is mostly the 'trainee' units. (But not limited to them, Gwen and Draug are also like this.) Conversely, units like Jagen actually have less benefits from going to 5* over being 4*, due to lower growth rate across the board. Jagen is 4 stats +2 and 1 stat +1. [Stat grains from promotion is a factor of growth rates---the same reason why inside the same unit type there's BST differences.]

 

Also: 5* +0 Cordelia has better match-ups than 4* + 10 if the 4* +10 doesn't have Brave-lance+. (+Atk, L&D 3, nothing else relevant). With Brave-lance+, 5* Cordelia matches 4* +10 at 4 merges. And I'm sure other units have similar results. (Cherche with +Atk, DB3, Brave Axe+ has similar results: 4* +10 gets 98 wins, 5* +1 gets 97 wins, 5* +4 gets 98 wins.)

Raven with Luna and L&D has a similar story. Raven 4* +10 with +Atk and Brave Axe is slightly better than 5* +0 with Brave Axe+, but only marginally (about 1 or 2 matchups) better than Raven 5* +1, and worse than Raven 5* + 2. Raven 4* +10 with Brave Axe+ has near identical match-ups to 5* +4.

 

Basically, if the unit prefers their starting weapon, using a 4* +10 just gimps them like crazy considering you have to spend a 5* and 11 copies of the unit to make them superior to a 5* with minimal merges. And once the 5* obtains 4 merges, they reach parity and can soon pull ahead.

Of course, discussing L&D builds are kind of a joke regarding 4* +10s, no one's going to cough up 20k feathers to give a 4* +10 L&D 3---since the same 20k is another +merge for a 5*---so 4* +10s should suffer even more compared to 5*s.

Thanks!

[Whistle]

new def tiles maps in arena are up . u guys like it ?:D

 

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

Wow, I already got two Defense wins. I hope it's because they got screwed by Ragnarok.

[ruruo]

Moved up from Tier 12 to 15. Going to aim for 17 this season.  I think it's possible, with Xander promoted I can run a full team of 5*s which I haven't done in a long time. Facing 690+ points battles are sometimes absolutely terrifying x'D (so many Lv.40+) 

 

[Vaximillian]

First I had a death on the zigzag fort map, then a Horse Emblem team trampled over me on the diagonal mountains map. Okay, I said. Let’s try it again.

I had a clear on the zigzag fort map. Then I was done with my today’s swords.

End of story.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

4 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

First I had a death on the zigzag fort map, then a Horse Emblem team trampled over me on the diagonal mountains map. Okay, I said. Let’s try it again.

I had a clear on the zigzag fort map. Then I was done with my today’s swords.

End of story.

I got the lava one twice, it was great. Hopefully I keep getting that free win.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

1 hour ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

The new lava map is legit free money because everyone runs mages. All you have to do is stick your mage counter on the corresponding defense tile.

I advanced to Tier 18, but I have no idea if I can stay in it. I don't really expect to go to 19. With +2 Celica, +2 Lucina, +1 Azura and someone else, I think I can scrape a score that's around 4850, or closer to 4900? Probably not enough, but we'll see.

I'm doing +2 Celica, +1 Azura, Julia and Reinhardt for my safe run right now.

 

I appears that staying in Tier 18 or 19 is not an option. You either move up or down, period. I expect to get kicked out since I can't even approach the scores you can.

 

26 minutes ago, Whistle said:

new def tiles maps in arena are up . u guys like it ?:D

 

Only did the free swords for now. Got the zig-zag map twice and that was dicey due to proximity, but AI manipulation still works rather well here. Lava map's practically a gimme. Just looking at the images of the other maps, the boat looks super awful. The square of foots seems like whatever, as it's not much different from a similar setup in the last defense-tile-map rotation. The one with the mountains is maybe a bit concerning because I think separating the enemy team when they're clumped into a 2x2 is gonna be potentially messy. Gonna have to see when I get it, though.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

3 minutes ago, Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi said:

I appears that staying in Tier 18 or 19 is not an option. You either move up or down, period. I expect to get kicked out since I can't even approach the scores you can.

Huh, wow. That's rough. I guess 17~18 is where I'll be most of the time until I get more merges, then.

Edited May 23, 2017 by SatsumaFSoysoy

[Whistle]

notice they add like 3-4 maps around . Feel great :D

[Fei Mao]

2 hours ago, Korath88 said:

Legit fuck that one map with alternating pairs of walls and defense tiles. That map is awful as the enemy always gets to their defense tiles on turn 1, not to mention the game's tendency to dump Reinhardt teams on that map.

Had one death on the last match. Going to have to try again, but not today. Today is clearly not a good day for me in the arena. The sheer amount of bullshit I ran into in the past hour is staggering.

 

Yeah I agree especially on the lava map, cav teams can run you down faster, dancer AI becomes more unpredictable and a lot of other shit.

I should've taken a break just as you did, but I couldn't calm down so I burned all my 10 remaining crest just to end up with a one death run.


 

Spoiler

It probably might just be me, but Arena is just too stressful and not as enjoyable lately, having to maintain a deathless every week just for a chance to promote or remain in your current tier just really brings you down. I really need to rethink my strategy or just take a damn break. If I only didn't mess up that one match this would've been deathless, I doubt this score will hold in tier 17 so I might be demoted. After this crappy day in the arena there was a silver lining, the game gave me a 5* Lilina which a character that I wanted so at least I ended up with something good today.

@MrSmokestack The team that you suggested today did have their shining moments, just that I played like crap and kept getting Kagero killed, so I replaced her with Felicia since I needed someone bulkier to handle mages on these new maps. I think I'll just work on Cecillia or Anna since I need someone to take out Reinhardts more safely, thanks again for the help.

Edited May 23, 2017 by Fei Mao

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

FUCK

THAT 

DIAGONAL

MOUNTAIN

MAP

 

 

Got my deathless for the week with a healthy score but the last game is kinda epic so im going to post that later

 

Eliwood carried this week run so hard. The first time i had Ursula not getting 90% of my kills

Edited May 23, 2017 by JSND

[Vaximillian]

22 minutes ago, Whistle said:

notice they add like 3-4 maps around . Feel great :D

They actually added five maps per rotation:

 

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

3 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

They actually added five maps per rotation:

 

That triple L map mountain map is so dumb

[Vaximillian]

3 minutes ago, JSND said:

That triple L map mountain map is so dumb

You mean double? Yeah, it’s opposite-corners-start-before-revamping-grade bad.

[Whistle]

3 minutes ago, Vaximillian said:

You mean double? Yeah, it’s opposite-corners-start-before-revamping-grade bad.

i act like that map lol. I fly right through it or block with heavy meatshield :D

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

5 minutes ago, Whistle said:

i act like that map lol. I fly right through it or block with heavy meatshield :D

I can see that. Flier kinda breaks that map, which ironically make them easy food at the same time

 

Azura is that squad on the other hand Rofl

[Okigen]

Wait a min... Tier 18 is Hoshidan noble? Does that mean Tier 19 is Norh noble then?

If so I'm so happy that it will be my permanent tier.

[Kiran]

Curse the diagonal mountain map and the boat map. I had to face armor emblem + dancer on the boat map, which usually is fine.... EXCEPT THERE'S NO ROOM TO MOVE. So now I have one win out of my three swords. At least it was on the last battle of the day...

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

My 7th battle

 

  

 

No seriously

Its almost a full Primal Mega Wishiwashi Armor Emblem. Only thing missing is 4 Ward Armor lol

 

 

REKT

 

REPOSITION OP

Draug got one shot SeemsGood

MARQUES ELIWOOD THE GREATEST KNIGHT OF ALL LYCIA

ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTE

 

Tl;dr "Reposition is busted" @Arcanite

 

 

Hopefully this is enough for this week lol

Edited May 23, 2017 by JSND

[Arcanite]

5 minutes ago, JSND said:

Tl;dr "Reposition is busted" @Arcanite

LOL

They had a full armor emblem team, and still had 0 switch ins to reposition

That ain't a quarter of the game,

It ain't half the game,

not even 5/8's of the game,

Spoiler

THATS THE WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLE Game

Spoiler

*Effie with distant counter*

*Ursula still kills her*

That is not a counter

 

 

[LordFrigid]

5090 is Rank 29 at 6am PDT 5/23 in T18. I ended up going with Celica over Alfonse, and it was kinda good, and kinda bad. On the one hand, Celica can do things! On the other hand...

Teams faced:

Spoiler

Welcome to no-challenge land, where all of your enemies have a Special that will never activate!

At least I have the cav team battles to look forward to. Once I sufficiently expand Elise's Quilt of Sorrow I'll probably play around with other comps just for the heck of it. At least I'll be using Sharena next season, so I won't have to face teams like those, tier ranking be darned.

Edited May 23, 2017 by LordFrigid

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

9 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

LOL

They had a full armor emblem team, and still had 0 switch ins to reposition

That ain't a quarter of the game,

It ain't half the game,

not even 5/8's of the game,

  Reveal hidden contents

THATS THE WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLE Game

  Reveal hidden contents

*Effie with distant counter*

*Ursula still kills her*

That is not a counter

 

 

Hector got one shot

"That Vantage didn't matter!"

Ursula activates Threaten Res

"Put em on a timer"

[MrSmokestack]

4 hours ago, Fei Mao said:

@MrSmokestack The team that you suggested today did have their shining moments, just that I played like crap and kept getting Kagero killed, so I replaced her with Felicia since I needed someone bulkier to handle mages on these new maps. I think I'll just work on Cecillia or Anna since I need someone to take out Reinhardts more safely, thanks again for the help.

Congrats on your Lilina. As an aside, putting in a good word for Celica gave me some good fortune too. Finally started doing pulls on the new focus and got her in my second summon :x Genny pls come home to me I didn't even want Celica

I haven't played the new maps yet because Echoes, but here:

I assume you don't have Vantage then? Or are you seeing more mounted mages than infantry ones? Kagero shouldn't have any issues dealing with them once she gets low, but alas.

I'd honestly recommend just taking a break if you're getting tilted. I'm pretty much the same way in getting nothing accomplished the instant I start getting frustrated at something. You need a level head for these matches because they can legit get stressful especially if it's Horse Emblem on defense tiles...

@JSND Reposition is busted. I miss having Hana and Lucina on my arena team.

Edited May 23, 2017 by MrSmokestack

[LuxSpes]

I managed to get a score of 4826 with the same team I used last week, but the path to getting there was much more tedious because of the maps. I didn't have much trouble with the diagonal mountain map, but the lava and boat map cost me multiple run. 

Don't know if I'll try to get a higher score. I'm nearly certain I'm falling back to tier 17 anyway. I'd probably need to become a monstrous whale in order to go to tier 19.