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Arena Discussion Thread (inc. Assault)


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24 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Future Vision must be getting people.

It's getting me all right.  Just spent nearly two hours on failed AA runs thanks to Future Vision horse shit.  Forget Brave Lyn -- L!Lucina is so much worse.  Can't even bait her safely without TA green mages because lol no color-bowbreakers and 46+ Spd on initiation. 

AA is fucked. 

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52 minutes ago, Hawk King said:

Holy shit, I had 2 defense wins before I switched L!Lucina onto my defense team, and I have gotten 5 already with her on it. Future Vision must be getting people.

I'm sitting here with 4 wins already myself running Minerva, Spring Camilla, Legendary Lucina, and Priscilla as my defense team.

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Future Vision sure hasn't gotten me any defense wins yet, though that might have to do with the fact that my defense team is Lucina Emblem ("Marth" being the one excluded). Though on the other hand, Future Vision failed to trip me up too. Granted, I only drew legendary Lucina three times across my Arena run and my AA run (where at least four out of the seven teams had F!Grima instead), with no dancers being involved in any of those three encounters either. But hey, I normally get screwed over the second refreshing shenanigans come into play in a given match so I'll take it.

Arena Score (Tier 20): 3,722; team of +10 Soleil, +10 Knight Paragon Cordelia, +10 Klein, and +0 Legendary Lucina (who scored all 20 KOs)
AA Score: 5,145; was surprisingly deathless on my first attempt

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I've seen a ton of Lucinas today too, but oddly not one of them actually used Future Vision. Even without moving first, they've just been moving up normally. Not that I'm complaining, but it was kind of weird since I expected jank that never came.

I did lose a couple AA matches to them though, since I tried to see if Camilla could tank a fully buffed +10 one without Iote's, and the answer turned out to be no. She can tank the infernal LHB Lucina easily, but a roided arena one was too much. Bow effectiveness > color advantage.

I did fine with AA matches otherwise, though damn I had to reroll a lot before the game would stop lowballing me for match value. It did the same thing for regular arena too, much more so than usual. My max value is 750 in AA, but it kept giving me 736-38 ones most of the time. I settled with a streak of mostly 742 valued ones. I actually had some fun when I could finally get on with the matches, since I tested out some newly-built units like Walhart and Selena and that was pretty fun. Also confirmed my Summer Elincia can indeed kill +10 Nowi easily, though Grima and Myrrh wasn't happening.

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4 hours ago, wizzard of soz said:

a streamer i watch was joking about how with the new system whales would stack blues on their defense teams to keep down all the F2P's using Alfonse as their bonus ? 

 

is frustrating though how it's pretty luck of the draw unless you have a bonus unit with super coverage. stat-stacking could be good strat, grind SS, give Fury, and with the bonus stats that's +9 total...give 'em the good 'ol outstat...

he'd have 60/34/41/31 statline and with his Brazen refine active 67/34/48/31, plus whatever stat refine you give him. slap on Desperation Brash Assault combo with a 20-24 damage Bonfire and damn. works well with Fury too. but that's way too much investment for myself and probably a lot of people /looks meaningfully at my 3* Alfonse and 4k feathers, no dew

And he was completely right! I wasn't happy to see a team with L!Lucina, Nowi, Effie, Hardin at +10. At that point I said "fuck it" and instead of trying to use Alfonse I just put Sheena on a Def tile and let those suckers suicide against her. 

That build sounds very strong, sadly I don't have the resources for giving him that kind of build and even if I had them I started working on other projects so the Askr trio is really down on the Divine Dew priority list. Not to mention that I refuse to change my SS from Eirika, changing that to follow the meta would be like betraying myself.

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3 hours ago, Tybrosion said:

Arena Score (Tier 20): 3,722; team of +10 Soleil, +10 Knight Paragon Cordelia, +10 Klein, and +0 Legendary Lucina (who scored all 20 KOs)
AA Score: 5,145; was surprisingly deathless on my first attempt

Wow, how did you manage to give all kills to Lucina? Mine killed 2-3 per match, I meet too many greens (can't confirm the all blue theory). 

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1 minute ago, mampfoid said:

Wow, how did you manage to give all kills to Lucina? Mine killed 2-3 per match, I meet too many greens (can't confirm the all blue theory). 

I mainly just had my Cordelia (who runs Firesweep) whittle the greens and other bulky units down to the point where Lucy could finish them. 

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Havent had a problem in Normal Arena against Lucina becaus B!Ike and Saizo can take her down easy. I will have to see for AA... I think each of my main Teams has an answer for her, but it really depends how i can bait her reliably. But I also havent encounterd the combo of Lucina + ranged Cavalry unit so far. And I prolly wont see that combo for AA either, because double ranged units get phased pretty fast when you start AA with 3 Armored units and an Infantry unit all +10 merged. Well scrap that its Earth or wind... so i have to run with Team gunnthra or Team Ephraim or Team Robin, which means no triple merged Armorers for AA lulz ._.

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I had the bad luck of running into 710 very frequently. I can go up to the early 720s, but for some reason around 80% were 710 with everything else being slightly higher like 712 or 716. I spent around 15+ dul crests just to see if I was just having bad luck and something good would come with the next sword

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20 minutes ago, Tybrosion said:

I mainly just had my Cordelia (who runs Firesweep) whittle the greens and other bulky units down to the point where Lucy could finish them. 

Perhaps I'll have to give mine FSL as well at one point. I don't think those 5-10 points made the difference to stay in tier 20, but perhaps when I finish my merges. 

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Well my defense win is kind of poor. 290 something. I guess the person played through even after losing a unit to me?

Anyways I am kinda enjoying new arena for the moment. Yeah I wasn't able to score enough to stay in T20, let alone advance, so far. But I enjoy changing up units I enjoy. And more importantly I seem to be in the same general range rank wise as my full fire team manages. So it looks like I am back to being able to play with whatever as long as I make sure bonus units get the as many kills as possible. That said I have had to do a bit too much with my non-bonus units. Freddy does fine, but Roderick is only half assedly built right now. I think I need to go and give him some better skills. I am not even sure what his boon bane is. I think he was +ATK though(looks up - Yeah +ATK/-RES). He currently runs Firesweep|Rally DEF/RES|Luna|Darting Blow|Drag Back|Drive Defense. That is basically his starting kit. . . isn't it? I suppose I could put Life and Death on him. But he has missed doubles even with Darting. I really think I need to hunt down a +SPD variant of him. I don't really want to run Al this season even if he would fill the red slot for these two(but he would drive down score so much due to lack of merges) so I could spend those 20k feathers on Rod instead. Scratch that idea. The only +SPD I have ever pulled is apparently -ATK. Go me?

 

Still I my point is I can't help but think so far that all the moaning may have been a bit overblown. Then again we are barely into the week, so . . .

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The struggle is real.
I have 3,722 Points and my Rank is 1,729. Honestly I don't know if I am save. Depends on how furious it gets. With some luck I could get up to 3.734 Points or more. I will try it. 
In worst case. Next week should be easier anyway. 

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On 8/15/2018 at 9:54 PM, Usana said:

Well my defense win is kind of poor. 290 something. I guess the person played through even after losing a unit to me?

Check your defense team has a bonus unit. There's no such thing as partial victory, you either completely kill them or they surrender.

 

Quote

Still I my point is I can't help but think so far that all the moaning may have been a bit overblown. Then again we are barely into the week, so . . .

I wouldn't say it's a matter of difficulty competing that's driving most of the complaints. It's the extra tedium of having to force-feed kills that makes arena even more of a chore than it was previously, and the disappointment of not actually getting to use your best painstakingly built units to actually kill things. After all, most players will probably end up with a similar number of bonus points a week as each other. The only difference is that each and every one of them had to put in more effort because of the redesign, extra effort that brings no extra reward.

Edited by Humanoid
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20 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

Check your defense team has a bonus unit. There's no such thing as partial victory, you either completely kill them or they surrender.

First thing I did. I have had Arvis on the team since the beginning of the week(as soon as I got home from work I swapped out Mae for him). No defense wins had been accrued at that point so it wasn't before I had a bonus unit on the team(unless that screen takes forever to update).

20 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

I wouldn't say it's a matter of difficulty competing that's driving most of the complaints. It's the extra tedium of having to force-feed kills that makes arena even more of a chore than it was previously, and the disappointment of not actually getting to use your best painstakingly built units to actually kill things. After all, most players will probably end up with a similar number of bonus points a week as each other. The only difference is that each and every one of them had to put in more effort because of the redesign, extra effort that brings no extra reward.

I would say Arena before this is more of a chore. Can only use a single core, can't vary your teams. Unless you got the money to blow on dozens of +10s at 5* of course. I have actually skipped a week fairly recently simply because I couldn't work up the gusto to go through the same old all over again. This gives me a fair bit more flexibility so far in team building so I can enjoy diverse teams again. Or at least it appears to be doing that so far this week. We'll see if that still holds true next week when I am actually trying to climb. That said a really bad set of bonus units could easily sour one on this. I can easily see that. Freddy and Rod though are fun enough to play around with.

That said to make it so that you don't feel like you can't use your favorites for anything but support it would be nice if they capped the bonus to twice per match or something. That way non-bonus units can do something other than support without hurting your score. That would still achieve the Goal of making players actually use the bonus unit rather than just tacking it on.

Edited by Usana
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28 minutes ago, Usana said:

First thing I did. I have had Arvis on the team since the beginning of the week(as soon as I got home from work I swapped out Mae for him). No defense wins had been accrued at that point so it wasn't before I had a bonus unit on the team(unless that screen takes forever to update).

Did you do a fight after changing the defense team? It doesn't update until you do something else so the team on your phone gets synced with the server.

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That should count for changing teams.

An alternative explanation is someone started their AA/Arena run with less than 4 units, which grants a partial defense victory score.

(ex: they go in with 2 units instead of 4 and then lose against you, so you receive a 290 score instead of a 580)

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I really hate Future Lucina and her stupid Future Sight, myself. She's ruined a few actual arena runs.

How many points do we get for getting a kill on a bonus unit? I've died so many times having to try horrible tactics to feed kills to my bonus unit and I would rather play as I normally do... but also really don't want to drop a tier from 18 to 17 >.<

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13 hours ago, Alexmender said:

And he was completely right! I wasn't happy to see a team with L!Lucina, Nowi, Effie, Hardin at +10. At that point I said "fuck it" and instead of trying to use Alfonse I just put Sheena on a Def tile and let those suckers suicide against her. 

That build sounds very strong, sadly I don't have the resources for giving him that kind of build and even if I had them I started working on other projects so the Askr trio is really down on the Divine Dew priority list. Not to mention that I refuse to change my SS from Eirika, changing that to follow the meta would be like betraying myself.

Hehe, the Sheena slaughter must've been satisfying at least

I totally feel you, and i'm not that invested in arena to want to funnel away resources that could go to projects i actually care about. Changing SS just for arena is indeed Betrayal *Takumi voice*

 

15 hours ago, Alkaid said:

Also confirmed my Summer Elincia can indeed kill +10 Nowi easily, though Grima and Myrrh wasn't happening.

Geez...glad i promoted villain Takumi recently because my Elincia is -Atk...no way in hell...

 

Hm yeah i feel fear about Lucina and the worst part is the AI is very inconsistent about how it uses Future Vision from what i've seen in her map and GQ. Not like dancers which are more predictable

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27 minutes ago, wizzard of soz said:

Hm yeah i feel fear about Lucina and the worst part is the AI is very inconsistent about how it uses Future Vision from what i've seen in her map and GQ. Not like dancers which are more predictable

As best as I know, the AI should treat Future Vision exactly as it would treat Swap. The difficulty comes from the fact that players are generally not used to needing to predict the usage of mobility Assist skills because Swap, Draw Back, and Reposition are not immediately threatening to the player, but Future Vision is.

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Finally finished a good run. Managed to hit 3751 score thanks to Frederick's massive attack and some crazy debuffing. Rank 620 as of the time of this post, so hopefully it gets me into tier 21. So glad I ended up going for my 4*+9 Frederick instead of just using Alfonse. The slaying hammer makes such a massive difference on 740+ matches. Managed to get 18/20 kills with him.

Using def ploy on my Nowi and attack tactic on Cordelia, Frederick can one-shot Zelgius if he doesn't have steady breath. Those that I couldn't quite take out, Nowi was able to chip down to 5 or so hp and survive the black luna. Young Summer Tiki caused a few problems, but most of them match my Cordelia's speed and I was able to chip them down enough for Frederick.

Definitely love Frederick a lot more now.

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I tried swapping Sigurd out for Nanna, and tried to give all kills to Lucina. Worked great. Nanna had Candlelight, so she could disarm foes after grinding them down, for Lucina to pick off. Now to do this with more fishing. I scored poorly enough that I was seeing Eirika/Nino/Alfonse teams.

The alt had a hard time. Dancers everywhere. I had to bring mine out. 19/20 kills, but one death, and I'm on the edge of falling to 17.

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Is doing well in Arena really worth it at a certain point? I never saw much of a competitive value in it. Most of my reasoning is just wanting to fight better characters. I'm struggling to make T20 and actually find myself having to climb back up from T18 if I don't. You know there's something wrong when you have to sacrifice actual performance (skills like Reposition over double Rallies, Aether over something else, DC, etc.) as well as actual characters (most mages and Dancers), etc. I'm not saying those kind of characters can't make it, but Dancers pretty much narrow down to Olivia (if you're F2P), and the only mages I like just so happen to be 5*-exclusive (and their merges don't make a massive difference either way).

The sum of it, I find myself having to sacrifice actual performance and team composition just to apease to scoring. I just try to stay as high as I can so I can net a few feathers.

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