Maaka Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Weekly scores: T21 Arena score: 3,817 - Rank 166/1449 (/4833) AA score: 5,294 - Rank 427 Pretty crazy score this week thanks to L!Azura being a bonus unit. Finally get to see the benefit of having a higher merged legendary hero, though really only in regular arena since she is a bonus unit. Was definitely painful trying to get kills with L!Azura, but I didn't need all of them thanks to the blessing score inflation. In AA, my +10 Florina scores just barely under +5 L!Azura during water seasons, so that wasn't much different than my normal score. Hopefully I can save up enough orbs to +10 her on the March legendary banner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkAlf Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Nicely done, @Maaka! Nice to have a merged legendary! Good luck in March! My scores and ranks for this last season: Arena: 3,735, rank 1,272/16,849 (promoting to T21, so the yo-yo continues!) AA: 5,219 (personal high), rank 3,123 (OUCH) I only gave L!Azura 11 bonus kills; it's very difficult for her to beat a lot of units without chipping away very slowly. But at least she didn't need 20/20. Relaxation week coming! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rinco Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 I thought this week would be with Beast units as bonus and switched my summoner support from Sharena to Nailah. At least I got safely in Tier 21 last season and I can take it easy this week, so I won't need the stats on Sharena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 I am on Tier 21. This Season is my demotion season. I will not try to get a high score, or do all 5 battles in the same day. Three today, the others two tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRay Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 I just used up all my ladders today. I cannot kill things fast enough even with Blade tomes. I cannot use FV!F!Robin to carry the team either since she is no longer a bonus unit (she immediately died when I sent her in against a Surtr). Maybe I can try Sharena instead of FV!F!Robin since I gave her Distant Counter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mampfoid Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 18 hours ago, Maaka said: Weekly scores: T21 Arena score: 3,817 - Rank 166/1449 (/4833) AA score: 5,294 - Rank 427 Wow, insane rank, congrats! 15 hours ago, DarkAlf said: Nicely done, @Maaka! Nice to have a merged legendary! Good luck in March! My scores and ranks for this last season: Arena: 3,735, rank 1,272/16,849 (promoting to T21, so the yo-yo continues!) AA: 5,219 (personal high), rank 3,123 (OUCH)! Ouch, that was close. Congrats to your personal high! 52 minutes ago, XRay said: I just used up all my ladders today. . Ouch, that hurts on the first day (know that feeling). Understandable that you posted in the wrong topic. ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRay Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, mampfoid said: Understandable that you posted in the wrong topic. ;-) I probably should not have played PvP modes so early in the morning. — — — — — — — I got my Arena Assault run done for the week, and on the first try too. I just wanted to get it over with and not wait until later in the week. Although I still encountered like 3 VS!Azuras, I was super lucky in that the maps she appeared in made her super vulnerable and easy to bait. Edited January 15, 2019 by XRay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I got a amazing score this Arena Season: 1,817. I did pretty well, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rezzy Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 A score of 3715 is rank 2507/3156 to move back into Tier 21. Not sure if that will be enough or not. Azura is a good support unit, but a pain to get kills with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diovani Bressan Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) I am planning to go with Naesala on the next arena season. Lloyd could be a good pick too, but I don't have his weapon refined. I would like to use Tibarn or Nailah, but i didn't have luck with the beast banner (4 pity breaker, and none of them were a focus unit). Edited January 21, 2019 by Diovani Bressan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster480 Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Hey everyone, I've just signed up here specifically to talk about some bugs I have recently found in arena. I wonder if they have changed the mechanics or if maybe these bugs aren't so widespread.... I usually can reach Tier 19 even with this miscalculated damage but unfortunately after that I can no longer win in arena due to these issues.. As everyone knows damage is calculated with Atk (with the weapon triangle) - Def (or res)... but in the last months I have noticed in arena that the enemy often has heros that have random unseen amounts of atk power or defense/res. The best example I can remember to give occured the other day when my entire team was killed by a Felicia... My current team for arena is Lyn + 3 + (Summoner pair Rank S) , Tailtiu +10, Frederick +10, Raigh +10... Felicia had 39 Res and 30 Def and 40 spd and 39 dmg. Attacking her with my Lyn (41 spd before SP2) results in her doubling lyn and lyn being killed (even though my Lyn has 47 HP and Felicia only has around 42 Atk)... Both my Tailtiu (50 Atk) and my Raigh (54 Atk) hit her for zero and she doubled both of them aswell... Frederick only hit her for 14 (53 Atk).... she was then able to also kill Frederick (52 HP) with one double hit (43 Def w/ Distant Def)... If i go play arena at any time I can reproduce these problems with basically any match.... sometimes these problems are reversed and one hero of mine might specifically hit way harder than they should. I've searched up and down the net without any results ever turning up discussing this. So I finally decided to look for a forum with a FEH section to try to discuss this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyCheez3K Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Jimster480 said: Hey everyone, I've just signed up here specifically to talk about some bugs I have recently found in arena. I wonder if they have changed the mechanics or if maybe these bugs aren't so widespread.... I usually can reach Tier 19 even with this miscalculated damage but unfortunately after that I can no longer win in arena due to these issues.. As everyone knows damage is calculated with Atk (with the weapon triangle) - Def (or res)... but in the last months I have noticed in arena that the enemy often has heros that have random unseen amounts of atk power or defense/res. The best example I can remember to give occured the other day when my entire team was killed by a Felicia... My current team for arena is Lyn + 3 + (Summoner pair Rank S) , Tailtiu +10, Frederick +10, Raigh +10... Felicia had 39 Res and 30 Def and 40 spd and 39 dmg. Attacking her with my Lyn (41 spd before SP2) results in her doubling lyn and lyn being killed (even though my Lyn has 47 HP and Felicia only has around 42 Atk)... Both my Tailtiu (50 Atk) and my Raigh (54 Atk) hit her for zero and she doubled both of them aswell... Frederick only hit her for 14 (53 Atk).... she was then able to also kill Frederick (52 HP) with one double hit (43 Def w/ Distant Def)... If i go play arena at any time I can reproduce these problems with basically any match.... sometimes these problems are reversed and one hero of mine might specifically hit way harder than they should. I've searched up and down the net without any results ever turning up discussing this. So I finally decided to look for a forum with a FEH section to try to discuss this. I'm pretty sure you aren't experiencing bugs, but just a lack of information. Read the skills on how they work (Felicia in your example targets whatever stat is lower between Def and Res if she is equipped with her personal weapon, killing Freddy and his low Res with ease), always look aroung for "unseen" aura buffs, like Drive skills, or stances/blow skills. Never forget about Specials, that can boost/reduce attack power significantly, like res-dependent Iceberg for Felicia, who rocks a lot of Res, making her hit like a truck when it triggers, etc. In short, look at everything that influences combat, and if you don't understand predictions after your assumptions (when pulling a unit to attack without letting go, resulting in a "combat forecast" at the top) then you'd need to get used to the gameplay elements more. Edited January 21, 2019 by MonkeyCheez3K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maaka Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Weekly scores: T21 arena score: 3,826 - rank 92/1463 (/4877 total) AA score: 5,296 - rank 262 Getting bonus kills with L!Azura was definitely annoying, but the legendary boost made such a huge difference. Got my highest score to date in regular arena this week. A bit sad that L!Azura will no longer be a bonus unit, but it was fun while it lasted. Hopefully Naesala performs well next week in terms of bonus kills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkAlf Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 My scores: Arena (T21): 3,709, rank 2,654/4,877 - demotion week, so no real effort to try to stay AA: Score: 5,220 (personal high!), rank 2,853 - first time ever achieving Top 3,000!! I know it's a weak-scoring combo with Water/Wind, but it feels great to break into Top 3K in AA after coming close for several weeks! @Maaka Congrats on your high score in arena! Good luck with Naesala! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster480 Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 On 1/20/2019 at 11:33 PM, MonkeyCheez3K said: I'm pretty sure you aren't experiencing bugs, but just a lack of information. Read the skills on how they work (Felicia in your example targets whatever stat is lower between Def and Res if she is equipped with her personal weapon, killing Freddy and his low Res with ease), always look aroung for "unseen" aura buffs, like Drive skills, or stances/blow skills. Never forget about Specials, that can boost/reduce attack power significantly, like res-dependent Iceberg for Felicia, who rocks a lot of Res, making her hit like a truck when it triggers, etc. In short, look at everything that influences combat, and if you don't understand predictions after your assumptions (when pulling a unit to attack without letting go, resulting in a "combat forecast" at the top) then you'd need to get used to the gameplay elements more. I'm sorry man but I have a deep understanding of how to play this game. I have been playing since a few months after launch so... to claim that I simply didn't read the skills is pretty ludicrous. So I have prepared a nice set of screenshots for everyone to take a look at. These screenshots prove that not only do the bugs exist but that they are basically reproducible instantly in arena. https://photos.app.goo.gl/Q1SNpeXzDURaHG3u5 Now if you look at the first 7 images you will see a situation where the enemy has just 1 unit remaining (thus removing any arguments of "buffs") and I have 3 units remaining. Gwendolyn has 45 Def and 41 res w/ Berkuts Lance+ (+7 Res on my atk). My tailtiu has 52 atk and my lyn has 50 atk + Swift Sparrow 2 (54 effective atk).. Both units as shown in the screenshots hit Gwendolyn for 0. 41 +7 = 48... 52-48 = 4 (4 dmg is lost) 54 atk on Lyn - 45 Def on Gwendolyn = 9 (9 dmg is lost) When Lyn hits Gwendolyn with her Ulti (Moonbow) she hits for 21 dmg. Now 48 - 30% (14.2) = 34 52 Atk - 34 Res = 18... +10 (tome of thoron) = 28? Now if moonbow doesn't calculate based on total res (48) by rather by 41 and then adds the 7 in the end... the damage would be 27 instead of 21. ( Gwendolyn 41 - 30% = 28 Res +7 = 35 Res, Tailtiu 52 Atk + 10Dmg Tome (62 Eff atk?) = 27 dmg If Tome of thoron doesn't always give +10 Dmg on special (its hard to know from the text alone, and I just literally applied this skill last night) then the dmg would be 17 / 18 but its still 21 (which still doesn't add up). Now if you go to the second set of images (the next match) I took screenshots of each unit on the field to show that there were no aura buffs or other field buffs present. You can see that Raigh (54 atk before 20% triangle adv) hits Fae for 5 damage. Fae has 36 Res +4 (Warding Breath) +6 (Distant def) = 46 Res 54 + 20% = ~12 which is 66 Atk - 46 Res = 20 Dmg... Instead Fae takes 5 (15 dmg reduction?) You then see Lyn which does 10 Dmg only (54 Eff atk) vs 34 Def here (again 20 dmg but taking 10 this time) and Fae would hit Lyn for 30 (which is correct considering my Lyn's 21 Res). You then see a debuffed Raigh (49 atk) hitting Fae for 0 (49 + 20% = 58-59) - 46 res = 12-13 Dmg (instead damage is 0, magical 12-13 dmg reduction). Next up is Frederick; 53 Atk (Debuffed to 48) who hits Fae (28 Def) for 12 only.... (13 dmg reduction again) while fae hits for the full amount.... You see Lyn again hitting Fae for only 17 dmg when Fae has 23 def + 6 (distant def) = 29 Eff and Lyn has 54 atk... thats 25 Dmg (and a random 8 damage reduction to make it only 17). Then enter Nowi... Nowi has 37 Def + 6 (Close Def) = 43 and Federick has 53 Atk... Frederick also has his Ulti up (Luna)... Somehow Frederick hits Nowi for 27 in the picture when.... 53 + 20% = 64 - 43 - 50% = 18... 64 - 22 = 46... The proposed dmg (before Ulti) is 2.... which makes no sense when you factor 43 Effective Def on Nowi vs 64 Eff attack on Frederick... Thats 21 and not 2. At the same time Tailtiu would hit Nowi for 24 twice... But Nowi is debuffed to 22 res (26 Eff). In this case Nowi has only 2 dmg reduction (taking 24 instead of 26)... but the math still does not add up. Finally there is Tiki... 28 res taking only 26 Dmg from Tailtiu (44 dmg total after ulti's fire back and forth) when she has 32 res vs Tailtiu 52 atk + 20% = 62 Atk... so this is once again 4 Dmg reduction coming from nowhere (as if the Warding breath is activating multiple times) where Tiki hits Tailtiu for 18 (41 - 23 = 18). And back to Nowi you now see that Lyn hits Nowi for 8... when Nowi is debuffed to 32 def and Lyn has 54 eff atk... that should be 22 dmg and not 8. Lastly you see Tailtiu hitting a Debuffed Tiki (27 Eff res) for 39 Dmg.... In this case the roles are reversed as, 52 + 20% = 62 and 27 eff res = 35 Dmg... Somehow Tailtiu pulls out an additional 4 dmg per hit against Tiki. (which does sometimes happen after all the other units on their team are dead, in the cases when this bug happens from the beginning of the match). These math problems usually change up per turn and also based around how many units the enemy has left. Sometimes it occurs only when 1 unit is left (as shown in the first set of pictures), sometimes it happens from the start (as shown in the second set of pictures) and the damage reduction isn't always static per unit or per turn or anything... Its just all over the boards. I wish I could put all the pictures into the post for you guys to be able to see it easier... but I'm only allowed 10 total megs for the whole post. I know that both my brother and my best friend who play this game, encounter the same problems in arena on their accounts... so I wonder how widespread the issue is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyCheez3K Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 3 hours ago, Jimster480 said: I'm sorry man but I have a deep understanding of how to play this game. Snip I don't have the motivation to put up all the numbers and calculate, and I'm not going to be an asshole about it. Someone who likes doing these precise calculations can help out here. I will just state that when a unit is on a defense tile (the rocky terrain Gwendy is on in one half of the first example for the supposed 4 damage lost from Tailtiu), the defensive properties of units are buffed, something around a 30% difference somewhere, I believe, never really cared for the exact numbers. As for Tailtiu attacking Tiki on regular terrain, I don't know where the discrepancy comes from, but I still doubt it being a bug. I'm going to be honest, I also don't care atm. If a prediction doesn't go my way, I vaguely try to figure out where the problem lies (influences everywhere these days, especially in Aether Raids and Grand Conquest) and just apply a different approach. Even if I don't get the issue at hand, I still realize that I just lack information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maaka Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 @Jimster480 Quote I will just state that when a unit is on a defense tile (the rocky terrain Gwendy is on in one half of the first example for the supposed 4 damage lost from Tailtiu), the defensive properties of units are buffed, something around a 30% difference somewhere, I believe, never really cared for the exact numbers. As for Tailtiu attacking Tiki on regular terrain, I don't know where the discrepancy comes from, but I still doubt it being a bug. I'm going to be honest, I also don't care atm. If a prediction doesn't go my way, I vaguely try to figure out where the problem lies (influences everywhere these days, especially in Aether Raids and Grand Conquest) and just apply a different approach. Even if I don't get the issue at hand, I still realize that I just lack information. As Monkey stated here, there are special map tiles called defensive terrain: https://feheroes.gamepedia.com/Defensive_terrain. As noted in the link, these provide a damage reduction of 30% of the occupying unit's defense or resistance. Note this does not add to the defense/resistance of the unit, it's just pure damage reduction based on their defense or resistance stat (whichever is being used to calculate damage at the time). This is important because specials that do damage based on defense or resistance, like moonbow, will NOT do extra damage to units on a defensive tile, as it doesn't provide any bonus to the defensive stats themselves, it just reduces damage. Quote When Lyn hits Gwendolyn with her Ulti (Moonbow) she hits for 21 dmg. Now 48 - 30% (14.2) = 34 52 Atk - 34 Res = 18... +10 (tome of thoron) = 28? Now if moonbow doesn't calculate based on total res (48) by rather by 41 and then adds the 7 in the end... the damage would be 27 instead of 21. ( Gwendolyn 41 - 30% = 28 Res +7 = 35 Res, Tailtiu 52 Atk + 10Dmg Tome (62 Eff atk?) = 27 dmg If Tome of thoron doesn't always give +10 Dmg on special (its hard to know from the text alone, and I just literally applied this skill last night) then the dmg would be 17 / 18 but its still 21 (which still doesn't add up). For this match-up, you calculated the moonbow damage incorrectly. Gwendolyn only has 36 RES, but gains +7 RES from Berkut's lance when attacked, making it 43. 43 * 30% = 12.9 (rounded down to 12). So it would be 52 atk - 43 res = 9 + 12 from moonbow = 21 damage. The Tome of Thoron only applies the +10 damage when Tailtiu's HP is less than or equal to 75%. Quote Lastly you see Tailtiu hitting a Debuffed Tiki (27 Eff res) for 39 Dmg.... In this case the roles are reversed as, 52 + 20% = 62 and 27 eff res = 35 Dmg... Somehow Tailtiu pulls out an additional 4 dmg per hit against Tiki. (which does sometimes happen after all the other units on their team are dead, in the cases when this bug happens from the beginning of the match). As far as this match-up goes, Tiki has 23 eff RES, so 39 damage would be correct. I'm assuming you thought it was 27 because of steady breath, but steady breath gives +4 DEF when a foe initiates combat, not RES. The other ones all seem to be based on defensive tile damage reduction, so you can calculate those out yourself. Also, another thing to note is that damage calculations generally round numbers down at every step, such as the moonbow example doing 12.9 extra damage, but rounding down to 12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Javi Blizz Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 Got 3695 today with Naesala, which probably means that I'll need to do another run to be safe at T20. I miss you, Surtr weeks T.T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrom-ulent Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 Arena: Lloyd season - and I remembered I had a spare Ylgr manual, as well as feathers and grails to give him one more merge. Sorcery Blade takes Lloyd to a new level, giving him adaptive damage to help his middling strength, on top of already receiving a boost for being near an infantry mage. For this season, that mage is Soren. He has Drive Def to help patch Lloyd's questionable defense, and QR3 to ensure L!Azuras are deleted before they start flinging buffed-up fliers and infantry at me. Usually his speed is sufficient to watersweep dragons. Fjorm and Caeda (Windsweep/Guidance/Phantom Speed) complete the team. I might just be staying in T21 this week with 3,754. That was a lot of L!Azuras Soren had to get rid of. I do think there will be a good amount of score deflation. There's no armor or armor-equivalent (L!Azura pre-built with B Duel Flying) bonus heroes, and it's an Anna season. If I do stay, it will help get rid of the sting of missing T19 in AR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrom-ulent Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 (edited) Galeforce... Edited January 23, 2019 by Chrom-ulent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster480 Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 11 hours ago, Maaka said: @Jimster480 As Monkey stated here, there are special map tiles called defensive terrain: https://feheroes.gamepedia.com/Defensive_terrain. As noted in the link, these provide a damage reduction of 30% of the occupying unit's defense or resistance. Note this does not add to the defense/resistance of the unit, it's just pure damage reduction based on their defense or resistance stat (whichever is being used to calculate damage at the time). This is important because specials that do damage based on defense or resistance, like moonbow, will NOT do extra damage to units on a defensive tile, as it doesn't provide any bonus to the defensive stats themselves, it just reduces damage. For this match-up, you calculated the moonbow damage incorrectly. Gwendolyn only has 36 RES, but gains +7 RES from Berkut's lance when attacked, making it 43. 43 * 30% = 12.9 (rounded down to 12). So it would be 52 atk - 43 res = 9 + 12 from moonbow = 21 damage. The Tome of Thoron only applies the +10 damage when Tailtiu's HP is less than or equal to 75%. As far as this match-up goes, Tiki has 23 eff RES, so 39 damage would be correct. I'm assuming you thought it was 27 because of steady breath, but steady breath gives +4 DEF when a foe initiates combat, not RES. The other ones all seem to be based on defensive tile damage reduction, so you can calculate those out yourself. Also, another thing to note is that damage calculations generally round numbers down at every step, such as the moonbow example doing 12.9 extra damage, but rounding down to 12. Awesome man! I never knew about these defensive tiles.... I will see if this ever occurs off of these tiles but the math does check out. I didn't realize either that every fraction would be rounded down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, Jimster480 said: I didn't realize either that every fraction would be rounded down. All fractions in this game are truncated except for the calculation of Aether cost, which is rounded up. However, this does require you to know how modifiers are calculated. In general, all modifiers are added to or subtracted from their base values as opposed to multiplied directly, meaning weapon triangle disadvantage is "20% of your Atk subtracted from your Atk" and not "80% of your Atk". The only exception to this is the staff damage modifier, which is "50% of your Atk" instead of "50% of your Atk subtracted from your Atk". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster480 Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 6 hours ago, Ice Dragon said: All fractions in this game are truncated except for the calculation of Aether cost, which is rounded up. However, this does require you to know how modifiers are calculated. In general, all modifiers are added to or subtracted from their base values as opposed to multiplied directly, meaning weapon triangle disadvantage is "20% of your Atk subtracted from your Atk" and not "80% of your Atk". The only exception to this is the staff damage modifier, which is "50% of your Atk" instead of "50% of your Atk subtracted from your Atk". Can you clarify further? 54 * 0.20 = 10.8 So 54 + 10 = 64? If its the other way around it would be 54 - 10 = 44? Is there something I am missing here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Dragon Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Jimster480 said: Can you clarify further? 54 * 0.20 = 10.8 So 54 + 10 = 64? If its the other way around it would be 54 - 10 = 44? Exactly. It's 54 − 10 = 44 and not 54 × 0.8 = 43.2 → 43. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster480 Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 23 hours ago, Ice Dragon said: Exactly. It's 54 − 10 = 44 and not 54 × 0.8 = 43.2 → 43. Ah alright, well I have always done it that way anyway. Its just how it was done in other games I played before this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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