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Skill Inheritance Discussion.


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3 minutes ago, BANRYU said:

Okay so. Life-and-Death and Quick Riposte are, as I think most people know, 5* only for the third level. CAN you get away with running the lower levels of it? Specifically I was planning to run LaD2 on my neutral-attack Nino (Spd+/Def-) alongside Desperation and whatever proc I decide on, and QR1 on a!Tiki to allow her to double-counterattack at full health (dealing with Takumis and whatnot) until I'm able to get ahold of a Lon'qu to give her Vantage.

I guess two other questions I have are 1) who Nino wants to be able to reliably get rid of so I know whether I can afford LaD2 over 3, and 2) how to do calcs lol. Don't wanna have to keep harassing people over this but not sure where to start.

For Life and Death, you want to specifically check your match-ups against the opponents you need that character to check.

Quick Riposte you can definitely run at level 1 if either (1) you don't need it to activate more than once per run or (2) the character takes high enough damage on a typical hit to knock them under the level 2 or 3 threshold to begin with.

 

Nino wants most of all to handle Linde. Other than that, start by looking at the blue and green units that your team currently has trouble with (e.g. Julia, Ephraim, etc.) and work from there.

Calcs aren't particularly difficult, just tedious. Here's the simplified version:

  1. Start with your base Atk and add all bonuses from skills (including weapon) and buffs and debuffs.
  2. If your weapon is effective against the opponent's, multiply by 1.5 and round down.
  3. If your weapon has weapon triangle advantage, multiply by 1.2 plus the Triangle Adept bonus (0.1, 0.15, or 0.2) and round down. If your weapon has weapon triangle disadvantage, multiply by 0.8 minus the Triangle Adept bonus and round up.
    1. Gem weapons count as 0.2 for the Triangle Adept bonus.
    2. Use the highest Triangle Adept bonus among both participants. They don't stack.
  4. Subtract the opponent's Def or Res including all bonuses from skills and buffs and debuffs. If the result is negative, leave it negative for now.
  5. If an offensive special skill activated, add that damage now. Round down.
    1. For Dragon Gaze, Dragon Fang, and Draconic Aura, use the Atk after applying skills and buffs, but before effective damage and weapon triangle advantage (i.e. from the end of step 1).
    2. For skills that scale off of Def and Res, include all buffs (including Blow skills if they are active).
    3. For Night Sky, Glimmer, and Astra, use the current damage from the end of step 4.
  6. If a defensive special skill activated, subtract that damage now. Round up.
  7. If the result is negative, it is now zero.

Note: The pattern for which direction to round is

  • If you are adding damage, round down.
  • If you are subtracting damage, round up.

 

I just realized I need to test if the bonus Atk from the Blade spells is counted for the special skills that scale off of Atk. I'm almost certain it does.

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22 hours ago, OKigen said:

Hey guys, what is a good skill for -atk +def Eirika? Her main purpose is to buff the team and tank some hits that Linde can't take, though I need her occasionally to kill green too.

And why we are at this... Is it a good idea to give Linde either vantage + fury or desperation + fury? Just thinking Fury may help trigger those skills earlier and may save Linde's life.

Bump... any suggetion for Eirika?

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3 minutes ago, OKigen said:

Bump... any suggetion for Eirika?

If Eirika's main purpose is to buff and tank, I'd recommend giving her Fury in her A-slot or at least some form of defense (like Def +3 or HP +5). Drag Back and Hone Spd are fine for her B and C skills. For her assist, I'd give her Rally Def/Res (whichever buff the rest of your team doesn't cover / whichever you need more) to further cement her niche as a support. Her special should probably be defensive since she's mainly support, so something like Escutcheon/Sacred Cowl.

As for Linde, I think Fury + Desperation is better for her since she has the high speed to take advantage of Desperation on player phase. 

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39 minutes ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

If Eirika's main purpose is to buff and tank, I'd recommend giving her Fury in her A-slot or at least some form of defense (like Def +3 or HP +5). Drag Back and Hone Spd are fine for her B and C skills. For her assist, I'd give her Rally Def/Res (whichever buff the rest of your team doesn't cover / whichever you need more) to further cement her niche as a support. Her special should probably be defensive since she's mainly support, so something like Escutcheon/Sacred Cowl.

@OKigen Just a quick addendum to say that it's worth noting that there is some flexibility between the Hone and the Rally, as the stats they can boost could potentially be interchangeable, giving you some flexibility on what to inherit from whom. 

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Question: If I wanted to have "Triangle Adept" for Lucina do I have to replace her "Defiant Speed" since they're both in "Category A"? & if I did can I upgrade Triangle any further? Sorry if this was asked b4, but I don't want to go through 30's worth of pages to look through it.

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11 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

Question: If I wanted to have "Triangle Adept" for Lucina do I have to replace her "Defiant Speed" since they're both in "Category A"? & if I did can I upgrade Triangle any further? Sorry if this was asked b4, but I don't want to go through 30's worth of pages to look through it.

You can only have one equipped at a time, just like how you can only have one Defiant Speed skill equipped at a time.

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10 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

Question: If I wanted to have "Triangle Adept" for Lucina do I have to replace her "Defiant Speed" since they're both in "Category A"? & if I did can I upgrade Triangle any further? Sorry if this was asked b4, but I don't want to go through 30's worth of pages to look through it.

You can't have both because you can look only have one A skill just like the rest. If you give Lucina someone with t-adept 3 she will get all three levels. But the other person must be able to inherit all three levels in order to give it to her. For example:

Roy has T-adept 3 at 4 stars so if you give Lucia all three levels of t-adept she can get all of them

Selena has t-adept 2 at 4 stars so you can only pass t-adept 2

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15 minutes ago, OKigen said:

Uhm... how does fury help with defense? She will receive 3 - 6 less damage thanks to +3 def/res but isn't that net off by the 6 dmg penalty?

It will help you against against things that would otherwise one-shot you. Fury 3 will do 6 damage to you, but it will never let you go below one HP. Besides that, it might also keep you from getting doubled because of the +3 SPD it gives.

Edited by Birdy
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19 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

Question: If I wanted to have "Triangle Adept" for Lucina do I have to replace her "Defiant Speed" since they're both in "Category A"? & if I did can I upgrade Triangle any further? Sorry if this was asked b4, but I don't want to go through 30's worth of pages to look through it.

If you think of Defiant Spd 1, Defiant Spd 2, and Defiant Spd 3 as three different skills (because they are three different skills), then adding Triangle Adept 1 to her skill pool behaves no differently.

 

3 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

I see, but I can upgrade Triangle Adept if I give her a "Triangle Adept lvl.1" or is it permanently lvl 1?

You need to transfer that level of the skill in order to learn it. If you only transfer Triangle Adept 1, you're stuck with only that. If you transfer Triangle Adept 1 and Triangle Adept 2, you can learn both, but cannot learn Triangle Adept 3 until you transfer it.

Edited by Ice Dragon
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1 hour ago, Birdy said:

It will help you against against things that would otherwise one-shot you. Fury 3 will do 6 damage to you, but it will never let you go below one HP. Besides that, it might also keep you from getting doubled because of the +3 SPD it gives.

Thanks. Just had Fury on her and looked great, she can comfortably tank Linde now (not that she needs to lol). 

I'll try to give her vantage some time later to take advantage of that fury damage but need feather to upgrade lon'qu first.

EDIT: gosh just finished upgrading Eirika and immediately pulled another one. She must love me...

Edited by OKigen
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47 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

If you think of Defiant Spd 1, Defiant Spd 2, and Defiant Spd 3 as three different skills (because they are three different skills), then adding Triangle Adept 1 to her skill pool behaves no differently.

 

You need to transfer that level of the skill in order to learn it. If you only transfer Triangle Adept 1, you're stuck with only that. If you transfer Triangle Adept 1 and Triangle Adept 2, you can learn both, but cannot learn Triangle Adept 3 until you transfer it.

 

Ye God, that sounds so much trouble/hassle to get through.:blink: Perhaps it is best to not touch this system after all. :unsure:

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1 minute ago, Zangetsu said:

Ye God, that sounds so much trouble/hassle to get through.:blink: Perhaps it is best to not touch this system after all. :unsure:

Inheritance is basically just adding skills to the list of skills a character can learn. Simple as that.

If you don't add the third tier skill to the list, then the character can't learn it until you do.

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So I have all the green mages at 4* (and Julia at 5*) including 4 Nino. I'm keeping the one with the best IV for promotion, and the rest can be skill fodders. Should I give a Blade tome to someone? My Cecilia is +Att and hardly served well by the anti-grey tome. There's also Merric (although mine is -Att which is meh) and FRobin (alternatively I could feed FRobin my spare Cecilia since I lack a MRobin??). Should I just not bother and just give Draw Back to a lot of people (I think Klein at least will like a Draw Back)?

Edited by salinea
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@salinea

Cecilia likes the blade tome a lot, hone/fort cavalry buffs 2 stats at once for 6 rather than normal buffs of 1 stat for 4, so it doesn't take much for her to 1HKO people. (You don't need WTA against grays if you one shot them.)

IRRC Nino has one of the best stat spreads for an offensive infantry Tomer, however, so it's probably not worth passing her tome to anyone other than Cecilia.

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7 hours ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

I second Quick Riposte. 

Also, while Iote's Shield is his signature skill (so I can imagine not wanting to replace it), if you're in the higher Arena tiers where archers are basically nonexistent, I'd consider replacing that with Fury or some other A-skill that would help him more than Iote's Shield would. 

I don't have access to fury as I've never pulled a Hinata. I also dislike fury builds, so not an option either way.

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8 minutes ago, DehNutCase said:

@salinea

Cecilia likes the blade tome a lot, hone/fort cavalry buffs 2 stats at once for 6 rather than normal buffs of 1 stat for 4, so it doesn't take much for her to 1HKO people. (You don't need WTA against grays if you one shot them.)

IRRC Nino has one of the best stat spreads for an offensive infantry Tomer, however, so it's probably not worth passing her tome to anyone other than Cecilia.

Cool! Sadly I stupidly deleted all my free Gunters early in the game, but at least I have Jagen's Fortify Cavalry (twice, since i also put it on Frederick). And only 4 Cavalry 10th strata fights to complete *sighs* But hopefully that will suffice.

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Is giving Blaraven to Ursula a good idea? I'd give her Blarblade to her but I sent home all the Odins I pulled before I knew about inheritance. I have a 4* M!Robin with a +Res, -Atk nature that I could use for it.

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5 minutes ago, Robert of Normandy said:

Is giving Blaraven to Ursula a good idea? I'd give her Blarblade to her but I sent home all the Odins I pulled before I knew about inheritance. I have a 4* M!Robin with a +Res, -Atk nature that I could use for it.

Not really. Ursula is even less defensive than Cecilia, which will make her shit against Archers and Ninjas, and you don't exactly want to kill Healers with her, do you?

Edited by salinea
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28 minutes ago, salinea said:

Not really. Ursula is even less defensive than Cecilia, which will make her shit against Archers and Ninjas, and you don't exactly want to kill Healers with her, do you?

Triangle Adept can turn virtually anyone into a tank, though. Takumi's 46 Atk becomes a mere 9 damage against Ursula's otherwise poor 19 Def with Blarraven and Triangle Adept. Ursula returns fire for 38 damage, 2 HP short of killing neutral Takumi on the spot, which is 2 more damage than she would have done with Blarwolf and Death Blow 3.

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Is Reposition or Swap better for a Wall unit? I was leaning towards Reposition initially as it would put more distance between the friendly unit to the enemy, but I remember Swap will always be able to be executed no matter what compared to former skill. Then again Reposition could sometimes allow the Wall unit to save someone even if they couldn't tank that type of damage if they do it outside the enemies, attack range.

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9 minutes ago, ExpendableExtra said:

Is Reposition or Swap better for a Wall unit? I was leaning towards Reposition initially as it would put more distance between the friendly unit to the enemy, but I remember Swap will always be able to be executed no matter what compared to former skill. Then again Reposition could sometimes allow the Wall unit to save someone even if they couldn't tank that type of damage if they do it outside the enemies, attack range.

Honestly I think this is a really tough call as they definitely both have their uses, but unless the wall is universal (both physical and special) I think Swap might be the go-to here since it has applications for the unit's personal escape as much as it does assisting others. Reposition ONLY moves the targetted ally, not both them and the user. I think it depends on your purpose, since I can see Reposition being potentially highly useful for getting vulnerable units out of the firing line, but I think enough use of both is required to say for certain. 

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6 minutes ago, BANRYU said:

Honestly I think this is a really tough call as they definitely both have their uses, but unless the wall is universal (both physical and special) I think Swap might be the go-to here since it has applications for the unit's personal escape as much as it does assisting others. Reposition ONLY moves the targetted ally, not both them and the user. I think it depends on your purpose, since I can see Reposition being potentially highly useful for getting vulnerable units out of the firing line, but I think enough use of both is required to say for certain. 

Good point. I think I will go for Swap then. Maybe on another Wall unit like FCorrin, I will use Reposition on her and see how that goes.

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