How classes work in Echoes

[Hoshidokoala]

As a newbie to the series (since Awakening), I've always loved the diversity of class systems, but I'm completely in the dark about Echoes' class systems, their promotions and which ones are better than others, apart from knowing that they have a lot less classes than in the more recent games. I just want to know how the class system works in Echoes, can units reclass and which promotions are optimal. Thanks :)

[nhaer042]

Classes work in a similar way to Radiant dawn with several of them having third tier promotions rather than branching ones. 

[May]

No reclasses unless they are of the Mercenary line. 

Sadly... Classes that are not villager or Mercenary stay as their base class and promotions do not branch out like Awakening or Fates. 

I still think it's a really good way to find some uniqueness in each unit though. Fates made it worse by introducing buying skills and marriage seals. I have never played Gaiden before but I am excited play Echoes to really experience each unit or at least a majority of them.

[tomm363]

If i remember the only units that can "reclass" are the mercenaries (and that is if only they leave the dread fighter promotion to villager in echoes).

[King Marth 64]

There's Third Tier classes in Gaiden such as Dread Fighters (the same classes appeared in Awakening and Fates that will promote from Myrmidons in Gaiden), Gold Knights (they also appeared in Radiant Dawn), Barons, and Bow Knights (the same class that appeared in Tellius series as 1st Tiers, Awakening and Fates as 2nd Tiers for Mercenaries and Archers for Awakening/Outlaws for Fates). Gaiden (including Echoes: Shadows of Valentia) and Radiant Dawn were the only Fire Emblem games that have 3rd Tier classes, they are the third promoted classes that can promoted from the 2nd Tiers class. Also, there's Witches (the same ones that appeared in Fates DLC) that are treated as enemy only classes in the original game, but I am not exactly too sure if we'll get Witches to be playable in the remake?

[TDAWS_MP132]

This diagram is a pretty decent explanation of how classes work in gaiden. Note that some a few player classes are absent, this diagram only details classes that the villagers can become.

[VincentASM]

I'm curious if Sages can promote in this game. Archsage would be an obvious choice.

[Azz]

Prepare for long post and possible spoilers.

Spoiler

Main lord classes are Alm's Fighter class and Celica's Priestess class.

Fighter uses Sword and Promotes to Hero in an event which uses Swords and Bows. Priestess uses Swords and Magic and is the promoted class of Mage for female. Celica can promote to Princess which is pretty much identical to Priestess except it is exclusive to Celica.

Then there is Villager which uses Swords only. Male Villagers can promote to Cavaliers, Soldiers, Mercenaries, Archers and Mages. Female Villagers seem to promote into different classes. They can promote at level 3.

Cavaliers are horseback units. They promote into Paladins and then Gold Knights. They uses Lances.

Soldiers are basically your armours. They promote into Knights and then Barons. They use Lances also.

Mercenaries are mixes between the classic Merc and Myrm depending on the characters growths. They promote into Myrmidons and Dread Fighters. Dread Fighter could promote into Villagers for some reason too. They use Swords.

Archers are same old same old except they have 1-3 range normally and 1-5 with a Bow equipped. They promote into Snipers and Bow Knights. Bow Knights gain a mount and also have 1-5 range normally without a Bow equipped. They use Bows (Obviously).

All these above classes promote at levels 7 then 10. Dread Fighters can go back to Villager at level 10.

Then we have Mage. They are different depending on the gender. Male Mages promote to Sages at level 12 while Female Mages promote to Priestess at level 20. Mages and Sages just use Magic and Priestesses use Swords with Magic like I previously mentioned. Sages restore 5 HP every turn also.

Clerics are what you would think. They use healing magic but they also have Nosferatu to do damage and gain Seraphim on promotion. They promote to Saints at level 12. They restore 5 HP to all adjacent allies every turn.

Finally we have Pegasus Knights. They use Lances and are flying so they can cross all terrain easily like in other games. They promote at level 12 into Falcon Knights the most broken class in the game as they can do what is the equivalent of the Slayer skill for Bishops from Sacred Stones.

This is all assuming that the same features are the same as Gaiden.

[Tamanoir]

You don't get promotional bonuses the same way as in other game. Instead, your character stats (except Res) are compared to the class's base stats, and if they are inferior, they will be increased to the base stats. (For example, Ruka have 4 in Tec and Speed, and Armour's bases are 2, so they won't raise. However by the time of promotion, he will have , for example, 25HP, and Armour's base HP is 34, so he'll gain 9HP to get up to the base. (same for Def and Power)

So that means that this system combined with units' low growth means it's generally better to promote ASAP.

[TDAWS_MP132]

I feel like as far as possible additions go, archsage would be nice, but the largest change that I think should be made is female mage promotion time. Maybe standardize it to 12 like the other 2 tier only classes. The promotion to priestess is good, but it isn't so good that it should wait to 20.  

[Melissa]

Promotion is location-based and the unit has to be a certain level

[Leif]

Well, it was confirmed that Mae promoted into a Priestess like Celica in the Famitsu article, so if we are going to be getting third-tier classes for casters, then they would have to make different third tier class for Sage and Priestess. Archsage for Sage and ... I don't know... Mage Fighter for Priestesses (since they wield swords).

I don't think Dread Fighters will promote back to villagers since that would only make the characters belonging to the Mercenary and Villager classes broken. They most likely removed that exploit. 

[TDAWS_MP132]

28 minutes ago, Leif said:

I don't think Dread Fighters will promote back to villagers since that would only make the characters belonging to the Mercenary and Villager classes broken. They most likely removed that exploit. 

I agree. I think they'll either go all the way and allow all 5 potential villager options to loop to villager, or none at all.

[B.Leu]

1 hour ago, Azz said:

Prepare for long post and possible spoilers.

  Reveal hidden contents

Main lord classes are Alm's Fighter class and Celica's Priestess class.

Fighter uses Sword and Promotes to Hero in an event which uses Swords and Bows. Priestess uses Swords and Magic and is the promoted class of Mage for female. Celica can promote to Princess which is pretty much identical to Priestess except it is exclusive to Celica.

Then there is Villager which uses Swords only. Male Villagers can promote to Cavaliers, Soldiers, Mercenaries, Archers and Mages. Female Villagers seem to promote into different classes. They can promote at level 3.

Cavaliers are horseback units. They promote into Paladins and then Gold Knights. They uses Lances.

Soldiers are basically your armours. They promote into Knights and then Barons. They use Lances also.

Mercenaries are mixes between the classic Merc and Myrm depending on the characters growths. They promote into Myrmidons and Dread Fighters. Dread Fighter could promote into Villagers for some reason too. They use Swords.

Archers are same old same old except they have 1-3 range normally and 1-5 with a Bow equipped. They promote into Snipers and Bow Knights. Bow Knights gain a mount and also have 1-5 range normally without a Bow equipped. They use Bows (Obviously).

All these above classes promote at levels 7 then 10. Dread Fighters can go back to Villager at level 10.

Then we have Mage. They are different depending on the gender. Male Mages promote to Sages at level 12 while Female Mages promote to Priestess at level 20. Mages and Sages just use Magic and Priestesses use Swords with Magic like I previously mentioned. Sages restore 5 HP every turn also.

Clerics are what you would think. They use healing magic but they also have Nosferatu to do damage and gain Seraphim on promotion. They promote to Saints at level 12. They restore 5 HP to all adjacent allies every turn.

Finally we have Pegasus Knights. They use Lances and are flying so they can cross all terrain easily like in other games. They promote at level 12 into Falcon Knights the most broken class in the game as they can do what is the equivalent of the Slayer skill for Bishops from Sacred Stones.

This is all assuming that the same features are the same as Gaiden.

RIP pegasi who transform intro dragons. Dracoknight were too cool for this world.
Myrm is a promoted class, that's really surprising.

1 hour ago, Tamanoir said:

So that means that this system combined with units' low growth means it's generally better to promote ASAP.

So it's basically like Shining Force then ? I'm fine with that.
Goodness, I can't wait to test the class system !

[King Marth 64]

I kinda think about it, I wondered if we can get Saints to move from 2nd Tier as 3rd Tier since Saints were 3rd Tiers in Radiant Dawn and add maybe a Bishop class between Clerics and Saints. And Arch Sage should better be added as a 3rd Tier for Sages along with Seraph Knights from Falcon Knights in Echoes as well.

And also, I do wanted to see 1st tier male healers gets added and I wondered if those Priest classes will be changed back to Curates like in the Archanea series since Celica has the Priestess class and female Mages can promote to the Priestess classes? And I do wanted to see if we can get Branch Class Promotion just like in The Sacred Stones, Awakening, and Fates gets added for Echoes other than Villager.

And also, Alm and Celica do need a 3rd Tier class in this remake since Ike and Micaiah did have their own 3rd Tier classes in Radiant Dawn.

Edited March 28, 2017 by King Marth 64

[Tamanoir]

1 minute ago, King Marth 64 said:

I kinda think about it, I wondered if we can get Saints to move from 2nd Tier as 3rd Tier since Saints were 3rd Tiers in Radiant Dawn and add maybe a Bishop class between Clerics and Saints. And Arch Sage should better be added as a 3rd Tier for Sages along with Seraph Knights from Falcon Knights in Echoes as well.

And also, I do wanted to see 1st tier male healers gets added and I wondered if those Priest classes will be changed back to Curates like in the Archanea series since Celica has the Priestess class and female Mages can promote to the Priestess classes? And I do wanted to see if we can get Branch Class Promotion just like in The Sacred Stones, Awakening, and Fates gets added for Echoes other than Villager.

Actually FalcoKnight, and Sage are already Tier 3 unit. What is missing isn't really a 3rd Tier, it's a 1st Tier for those classes (or a 2nd in between Mage and Sage Pegasus and Falco.)

The Lords are quite Cleraly Tier 2 units after all.

Saints are a little different, but the same logic ould applies to them.

[King Marth 64]

21 minutes ago, Tamanoir said:

Actually FalcoKnight, and Sage are already Tier 3 unit. What is missing isn't really a 3rd Tier, it's a 1st Tier for those classes (or a 2nd in between Mage and Sage Pegasus and Falco.)

The Lords are quite Cleraly Tier 2 units after all.

Saints are a little different, but the same logic ould applies to them.

Falcon Knights and Sages are actually 2nd Tiers. I do remember Pegasus Knights, Clerics, Mages, Fighter, and Priestess (Celica's) are the only playable class lines that did not got a 3rd Tier in the original game.

Edited March 28, 2017 by King Marth 64

[Azz]

15 minutes ago, King Marth 64 said:

Falcon Knights and Sages are actually 2nd Tiers. I do remember Pegasus Knights, Clerics, Mages, Fighter, and Priestess (Celica's) are the only playable class lines that did not got a 3rd Tier.

The thing with these classes is that their power levels equate to that of a third tier class. Also all of these classes had certain niches too such as Falcon Knights having the Slayer skill, Saints healing 5 HP to adjacent allies, Sages healing 5 HP to them selves and then Hero and Priestess having two weapon types. They really don;t need third tiers.

[Tamanoir]

2 hours ago, B.Leu said:

RIP pegasi who transform intro dragons. Dracoknight were too cool for this world.
Myrm is a promoted class, that's really surprising.

So it's basically like Shining Force then ? I'm fine with that.
Goodness, I can't wait to test the class system !

Funnily enough, despite their appearance and special skill, they are litterally Dragon Knights in this game (they get the same Base Stats of the Ennemy Dragons, that is high HP and Def bonus on promotion (40HP, 12Def).)

[Iridium]

4 hours ago, Megapikman132 said:

This diagram is a pretty decent explanation of how classes work in gaiden. Note that some a few player classes are absent, this diagram only details classes that the villagers can become.

This is a pretty good starting point. You can treat Gaiden as having eight playable class lines. Four of these have three tiers and promote at levels 7 and then 10, and the other four have two tiers and promote at level 12. Male Villagers are essentially a zeroth tier that can promote into any of the five classes on the above list, and we don't know what female Villagers can promote into.

• Soldier line: Soldier, Knight, and Baron. Emphasis on physical bulk.
• Archer line: Archer, Sniper, and Bow Knight. Emphasis on long-range attacks.
• Cavalier line: Cavalier, Paladin, and Gold Knight. Emphasis on movement range.
• Mercenary line: Mercenary, Myrmidon, and Dread Fighter. Emphasis on speed and resistance.
• Male Mage line: Mage and Sage. Emphasis on magical strength.
• Female Mage line: Mage and Priestess. Can wield a sword for self-defense. As a special exception, this class promotes at level 20.
• Pegasus Knight line: Pegasus Knight and Falcon Knight. Emphasis on monster slaying.
• Cleric line: Cleric and Saint. Emphasis on healing and support magic.

Celica is a special Priestess who can promote into a Princess. Alm has a unique 'Fighter' class that combines the best parts of Soldier and Mercenary, and promotes to gain Bows and thus the best part of Archer too.

Edited March 28, 2017 by Iridium

[Hoshidokoala]

4 hours ago, Megapikman132 said:

This diagram is a pretty decent explanation of how classes work in gaiden. Note that some a few player classes are absent, this diagram only details classes that the villagers can become.

Don't we see Leon as a level 1 Sniper in some of the Pax footage from 2 weeks ago, if my mind serves me correctly? Does that imply that the characters start over with levels once they promote?

[Azz]

6 minutes ago, Hoshidokoala said:

Don't we see Leon as a level 1 Sniper in some of the Pax footage from 2 weeks ago, if my mind serves me correctly? Does that imply that the characters start over with levels once they promote?

Yes. When a unit promotes their level resets to 1.

[Hoshidokoala]

10 minutes ago, Azz said:

Yes. When a unit promotes their level resets to 1.

Ok, I wasn't sure with the diagram if they carried on keeping their levels or not

[Emperor Hardin]

In the original, the Soldier line doesn't gain movement on promotion, meaning they'll have 4 movement for the whole game. This is partially mitigated by Alm's route units that can use warps which works like any other spell in the game. You'll have to transfer a unit for Cellica's party to get a warp user.

Edited March 28, 2017 by Emperor Hardin