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12 minutes ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

To address the Lucina Falchion thingyCywrB_gVEAQRmjt.thumb.jpg.1f7a88ff46289b8e9080978fa875800f.jpg

Granted it should be taken with a grain of salt, because localization stuff.

This screen is taken before Marth has children, though, and presumably Marth has children with Shiida after FE12 ends (and they can also wield Falchion).

So when Malledus says "You are Anri's last male descendant, the only one who can wield Falchion." he's referring to that particular point in time, not that Marth will be the only one to wield Falchion for the rest of time. So Lucina being able to use Falchion doesn't contradict this at all.

Edited by NinjaMonkey

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1 minute ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

It's entirely possible that the Falchion is a Baldur thing, but it's unlikely.

Kinda off topic, but I like to think of Marth having Baldur blood, Merric having Sety blood, and Hardin having Nova or Dain blood.

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1 minute ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

Kinda off topic, but I like to think of Marth having Baldur blood, Merric having Sety blood, and Hardin having Nova or Dain blood.

Before we even approach the suggestion, there is a damn reason they redesigned Falchion in 11/12 to NOT look like Tyrfing.

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1 hour ago, NinjaMonkey said:

This screen is taken before Marth has children, though, and presumably Marth has children with Shiida after FE12 ends (and they can also wield Falchion).

So when Malledus says "You are Anri's last male descendant, the only one who can wield Falchion." he's referring to that particular point in time, not that Marth will be the only one to wield Falchion for the rest of time. So Lucina being able to use Falchion doesn't contradict this at all.

The point is that if female relatives of Anri could use the Falchion at this point in time then Elice should be able to use it as well. And yet she can't.

1 hour ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Before we even approach the suggestion, there is a damn reason they redesigned Falchion in 11/12 to NOT look like Tyrfing.

Also, this would require the traces of the Holy Blood to last in their carrier bloodlines for over a 1000 years. Surely I don't need to explain why that won't happen.

Edited by RedEyedDrake

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Just now, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Before we even approach the suggestion, there is a damn reason they redesigned Falchion in 11/12 to NOT look like Tyrfing.

This is very true. It was subtle though, as the only real difference is the hilt. I never really thought it looked that much like the Tyrfing though, cause the Tyrfing has a green base.

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7 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

Once again, order of magnitude. You're talking about the "completely regular people ignoring the laws of physics" brand of ignoring real life logic.

Admittedly I don't have the source on hand, but wasn't it mentioned somewhere in Awakening that the geographical changes (which looking at the two maps side-by-side, mostly seem to be that the ocean level lowered in some areas, creating islands and connections that didn't exist prior) were due to Grima's destructive rampage?

Edited by AzureSen

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To be honest, you guys are making some very good points. My perspective has shifted a little. Though I still don't like to think of it as canon, cause I'm a filthy Archanea fangirl.

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1 hour ago, AzureSen said:

Admittedly I'm don't have the source on hand, but wasn't it mentioned somewhere in Awakening that the geographical changes (which looking at the two maps side-by-side, mostly seem to be that the ocean level lowered in some areas, creating islands and connections that didn't exist prior) were due to Grima's destructive rampage?

Don't know. But if it was then there would undoubtedly HAVE to be more to this than just the purely physical rampage itself. Because if it IS supposed to be purely the physical rampage itself then this goes into the the territory of "cartoon physics".

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2 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

The point is that if female relatives of Anri could use the Falchion at this point in time then Elice should be able to use it as well. And yet she can't.

This isn't entirely true even if it does come back positive on the male only thing (Someone get to work on a japanese text dump of FE11)

Falchion is incredibly picky, even among the same generation, as Lucina's support convos with siblings and I believe Owain show.

It might have just simply flipped Elice the middle finger and told her to piss off.

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1 hour ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

This isn't entirely true even if it does come back positive on the male only thing (Someone get to work on a japanese text dump of FE11)

Falchion is incredibly picky, even among the same generation, as Lucina's support convos with siblings and I believe Owain show.

It might have just simply flipped Elice the middle finger and told her to piss off.

The Falchion's pre-Awakening and post Awakening mechanics are apples and oranges and you really shouldn't try to use one set of them to indicate something about the other set.

Edited by RedEyedDrake

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6 minutes ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

To be honest, you guys are making some very good points. My perspective has shifted a little. Though I still don't like to think of it as canon, cause I'm a filthy Archanea fangirl.

Awakening has a few questionable things but it's far from the plothole ridden abomination people want to make it out to be.

Some of them are even 8-4's fuckups. Naesala the Evil Swan King and the evil swans who burned down Serenes Forest is probably the most attrocious mistranslation I have ever seen.

It's consistent with Jugdral and Archanea, and really the only questionable territory we get into is it's insistent continuity with Tellius and Fates, but those are explainable if you put a timeline of events together.

 

3 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

The Falchion's pre-Awakening and post Awakening mechanics are apples and oranges and you really shouldn't try to use one set of them to indicate something about the other set.

I'm actually insinuating they might be the same (Insofar as "Worthiness" is concerned) and you're potentially just misinterpreting one era of it

Edited by Hero of the Fire Emblems

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4 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

The point is that if female relatives of Anri could use the Falchion at this point in time then Elice should be able to use it as well. And yet she can't.

Because Elice can't use Swords in FE1, and the Falchion was most likely coded to only be usable by Lords in FE11. Chalk it up to gameplay and story not matching up, because that still doesn't answer why Gharnef thought he could use Falchion against Medeus without Marth.

1 minute ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Some of them are even 8-4's fuckups. Naesala the Evil Swan King and the evil swans who burned down Serenes Forest is probably the most attrocious mistranslation I have ever seen.

That wasn't even a mistranslation, they purposefully changed several references to other FE games in the translation for some reason.

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1 hour ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

I'm actually insinuating they might be the same and you're just misinterpreting one set

The two sets are explicitly contradictory on most points, though.

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To note something that's actually against the point I was originally arguing: Naga

Naga ends his existence after he puts Tiki to sleep. But we see Naga in Awakening as a female. The only logical explanation I can think of is that Nagi takes Naga's place. Medeus does refer to her as Naga's reincarnation.

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23 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

The point is that if female relatives of Anri could use the Falchion at this point in time then Elice should be able to use it as well. And yet she can't.

She doesn't have the dominant blue hair gene that her brother, Chrom and Lucina all have, that's why. Perhaps blue hair is what is needed to wield the Falchion in the first place.

Edited by NinjaMonkey

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Just now, IcyHeroGamer said:

To note something that's actually against the point I was originally arguing: Naga

Naga ends his existence after he puts Tiki to sleep. But we see Naga in Awakening as a female. The only logical explanation I can think of is that Nagi takes Naga's place. Medeus does refer to her as Naga's reincarnation.

Not only that, her Japanese end title is literally "Avatar of the Divine Dragon King" and she's listed as NAGA in the code, not Nagi.

The change from a to i isn't fooling one damn person.

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1 hour ago, AzureSen said:

because that still doesn't answer why Gharnef thought he could use Falchion against Medeus without Marth..

Why are you assuming that he thought that he could use the Falchion against Medeus without Marth? What did you think he wanted Elice to actually use the Aum Staff for?

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Just now, IcyHeroGamer said:

To note something that's actually against the point I was originally arguing: Naga

Naga ends his existence after he puts Tiki to sleep. But we see Naga in Awakening as a female. The only logical explanation I can think of is that Nagi takes Naga's place. Medeus does refer to her as Naga's reincarnation.

Well, given that Tiki becomes Naga in the Future Past when Awakening Naga is killed, the idea that Naga's reincarnation can replace himself isn't too far-fetched.

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2 minutes ago, RedEyedDrake said:

Why are you assuming that he thought that he could use the Falchion against Medeus without Marth? What did you think he wanted Elice to actually use the Aum Staff for?

Because they straight up say Gharnef is "using Falchion as leverage over Medeus" to try and control him.

He is straight up stated to think he can control Falchion. And this is before he and Marth cross paths; not to mention Aum just revives the person normally so he's not trying to make Marth into a zombie or anything if you're suggesting that. Aum seems more likely a selfish thing in case somehow Imhullu fails.

Edited by Hero of the Fire Emblems

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On the subject of the Falchion, I just remembered that there do exist multiple Falchions. Nagi provides Marth with a less powerful one. So presumably that's one of her fangs? She could have made another, but constructing it differently, for the one in Awakening.

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1 hour ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Because they straight up say Gharnef is "using Falchion as leverage over Medeus" to try and control him.

He is straight up stated to think he can control Falchion.

...No? He is trying to have leverage against Medeus by keeping humanity's best shot of killing Medeus on his own invulnerable person. Where does it say that he is trying to "control Falchion" itself?

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1 minute ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

On the subject of the Falchion, I just remembered that there do exist multiple Falchions. Nagi provides Marth with a less powerful one. So presumably that's one of her fangs? She could have made another, but constructing it differently, for the one in Awakening.

It's said to be the selfsame one that Marth uses, iirc, and Chrom says only a single one exists- Nagi's existence in 11 seems non canonical to the timeline of 12 and 13.

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Just now, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

It's said to be the selfsame one that Marth uses, iirc, and Chrom says only a single one exists- Nagi's existence in 11 seems non canonical to the timeline of 12 and 13.

Oh shoot, you're right, cause Marth says he doesn't recognize her.

However, the point of multiple Falchions still stands.

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1 minute ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Because they straight up say Gharnef is "using Falchion as leverage over Medeus" to try and control him.

He is straight up stated to think he can control Falchion.

This, pretty much. So either he doesn't know how Falchion works, or he's planning to use Elise against Medeus. And for that matter, what does he even need Aum for anyway? He can apparently rip out his own soul and put it in the Darksphere and have a bunch of evil priests revive his body, so what he would want with it is a mystery.

2 minutes ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

On the subject of the Falchion, I just remembered that there do exist multiple Falchions. Nagi provides Marth with a less powerful one. So presumably that's one of her fangs? She could have made another, but constructing it differently, for the one in Awakening.

That chapter is explicitly said to take place in an alternate universe, so presumably it's that universe's Falchion (and Nagi giving him that Falchion is explicitly non-canon anyway).

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1 minute ago, IcyHeroGamer said:

Oh shoot, you're right, cause Marth says he doesn't recognize her.

However, the point of multiple Falchions still stands.

The possibility of it stands, but Chrom still acts like Falchion is a singular sword and is appalled by Lucina having a second one.

Unless he's referring to that specific Falchion being one of a kind, idk

Edited by Hero of the Fire Emblems

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