Would you fix the Voting Gauntlet? If so, how?

[Kiran]

20 minutes ago, SlipperySlippy said:

Not really, Minerva scored lower than even Beruka on the CYL poll, yet quite easily beat Cordelia who was one of the most popular females.

No, Minerva and Beruka scored the same amount. I'm more surprised that Beruka lost to Subaki. But since these characters are ranked pretty low, its actually easier for them to turn the tables. Subaki probably won due to being the only male contestant, being an overall better unit then Beruka, being a free unit (more availability and more people with him at lv1 to cheese the battles), and gaining some fame from those GHB videos.  As for Minerva scoring more then Cordelia, well consider which side the gauntlet they were both on. Cordelia was up against Camilla, the obvious winner. While Minerva was on the other side of the bracket. There are more variables if you are going to consider across battles like that, but the overall majority of independent battles followed the CYL with the upset being 1 per voting gauntlet. 

[Cute Chao]

I think my biggest want to 'fix' the gauntlet is to take it back so the sides fight against each other first and then the two finalists then fight. It wasn't really much of a pegs vs wyverns when the two finalists were both wyverns, imo. That was a big peeve for me - although I know that wasn't the real purpose of this thread. I hope they change it back for the future -.-

[TheWill]

51 minutes ago, Kiran said:

No, Minerva and Beruka scored the same amount. I'm more surprised that Beruka lost to Subaki. But since these characters are ranked pretty low, its actually easier for them to turn the tables. Subaki probably won due to being the only male contestant, being an overall better unit then Beruka, being a free unit (more availability and more people with him at lv1 to cheese the battles), and gaining some fame from those GHB videos.  As for Minerva scoring more then Cordelia, well consider which side the gauntlet they were both on. Cordelia was up against Camilla, the obvious winner. While Minerva was on the other side of the bracket. There are more variables if you are going to consider across battles like that, but the overall majority of independent battles followed the CYL with the upset being 1 per voting gauntlet. 

Oops, I was meant to say Minerva was as low as Beruka, who scored the lowest amount of votes in the Voting Gauntlet. Either way, I do contend that you can't accurately use the Choose Your Legend poll as a measure of accuracy. The 'Choose Your Legend' poll is simply inaccurate past gauging the primarily most popular Fire Emblem characters. The main reason for this is because limited data was collected from voters preferences and voters could also vote once each day which is more of a measure of user dedication rather than popularity. With the sheer number of characters in Fire Emblem, a preferential voting system would've provided a much more accurate representation of the overall characters popularity, at least in relation to the way the Voting Gauntlet is executed. Thus, characters like Minerva who seems iconic as the first wyvern rider, would've likely scored higher.

The lines for a characters popularity within the Choose Your Legend poll honestly become blurred past a certain threshold. For example, Nino scored 39th place in the popularity poll whilst Eliwood scored 36th. If you had a popularity poll between the two to see who was more popular, you'd have a difficult time judging who is actually more popular between the two, despite the CYL poll indicating that it is Eliwood. The most notable examples are Ephraim beating Chrom and Minerva beating Cordelia, however there are many more examples of the Voting Gauntlets inaccuracy. Another example would be Palla beating both Subaki and Beruka, despite losing to both of them quite considerably even with the total from all three of her entries taken into account (she had a combined total of 1316 votes across three different games). 

There are a few influences, as you mentioned. Cordelia fans may have banwagoned on the Camilla train because Camilla was obviously going to win the gauntlet. Between characters prior to Awakening/Fates, I think the vote discrepancy is much more likely attributed towards the fanbase split between 'original' and 'newcomer' fans. Hence why Ephraim also beat Chrom by a fairly large margin, despite losing in total votes quite considerably in the 'Choose Your Legend' poll. This is likely similar with Minerva. The older generation of Fire Emblem fans who dislike the newer games obviously wouldn't vote for the Awakening/Fates characters obviously would rather support Ephraim or Eirika over the Awakening or Fates characters, even if Ephraim or Eirika aren't near even in their top ten favourites. 

Edited April 12, 2017 by SlipperySlippy

[Kiran]

7 minutes ago, SlipperySlippy said:

Oops, I was meant to say Minerva was as low as Beruka, who scored the lowest amount of votes in the Voting Gauntlet. Either way, I do contend that you can't accurately use the Choose Your Legend poll as a measure of accuracy. The 'Choose Your Legend' poll is simply inaccurate past gauging the primarily most popular Fire Emblem characters. The main reason for this is because limited data was collected from voters preferences and voters could also vote once each day which is more of a measure of user dedication rather than popularity. With the sheer number of characters in Fire Emblem, a preferential voting system would've provided a much more accurate representation of the overall characters popularity, at least in relation to the way the Voting Gauntlet is executed. Thus, characters like Minerva who seems iconic as the first wyvern rider, would've likely scored higher.

The lines for a characters popularity within the Choose Your Legend poll honestly become blurred past a certain threshold. For example, Nino scored 39th place in the popularity poll whilst Eliwood scored 36th. If you had a popularity poll between the two to see who was more popular, you'd have a difficult time judging who is actually more popular between the two, despite the CYL poll indicating that it is Eliwood. The most notable examples are Ephraim beating Chrom and Minerva beating Cordelia, however there are many more examples of the Voting Gauntlets inaccuracy. Another example would be Palla beating both Subaki and Beruka, despite losing to both of them quite considerably even with the total from all three of her entries taken into account (she had a combined total of 1316 votes across three different games). 

There are a few influences, as you mentioned. Cordelia fans may have banwagoned on the Camilla train because Camilla was obviously going to win the gauntlet. Between characters prior to Awakening/Fates, I think the vote discrepancy is much more likely attributed towards the fanbase split between 'original' and 'newcomer' fans. Hence why Ephraim also beat Chrom by a fairly large margin, despite losing in total votes quite considerably in the 'Choose Your Legend' poll. This is likely similar with Minerva. The older generation of Fire Emblem fans who dislike the newer games obviously wouldn't vote for the Awakening/Fates characters obviously would rather support Ephraim or Eirika over the Awakening or Fates characters, even if Ephraim or Eirika aren't near even in their top ten favourites. 

But is the voting gauntlet also not the same type of poll? You can battle once every 30min. Thus the same user dedication factor comes into play. As for the Chrom vs Ephraim battle, I would say that they were actually extremely close. The difference was 24.9 million but that's only 0.7% difference in votes. I would say that a large reason Chrom lost was because of the Awakening fanbase being split in favor of Lucina and because Ephraim had a focus banner before. Those 10% extra points might have pushed Chrom over the threshold. 

But I'm not saying the CYL poll makes a clear and cut case for the voting gauntlet results. Its a great base on where the units lie on the popularity contest. The main inadequacy of the CYL poll comparing with the voting gauntlet is the sheer number of characters compared to the voting gauntlet. This is where a bit of speculation comes in, where you have to be able to tell based on the other units competing in the gauntlet how the rest of the votes will fall. I agree with the old/new fanbase split. Probably why Minerva and Palla got higher results. 

But the main problem is that IS brackets the units in such a way that we know who will win each round and should use the CYL poll as a better guideline so that results aren't immediately obvious. 

[TheWill]

2 minutes ago, Kiran said:

But is the voting gauntlet also not the same type of poll? You can battle once every 30min. Thus the same user dedication factor comes into play. As for the Chrom vs Ephraim battle, I would say that they were actually extremely close. The difference was 24.9 million but that's only 0.7% difference in votes. I would say that a large reason Chrom lost was because of the Awakening fanbase being split in favor of Lucina and because Ephraim had a focus banner before. Those 10% extra points might have pushed Chrom over the threshold. 

But I'm not saying the CYL poll makes a clear and cut case for the voting gauntlet results. Its a great base on where the units lie on the popularity contest. The main inadequacy of the CYL poll comparing with the voting gauntlet is the sheer number of characters compared to the voting gauntlet. This is where a bit of speculation comes in, where you have to be able to tell based on the other units competing in the gauntlet how the rest of the votes will fall. I agree with the old/new fanbase split. Probably why Minerva and Palla got higher results. 

But the main problem is that IS brackets the units in such a way that we know who will win each round and should use the CYL poll as a better guideline so that results aren't immediately obvious. 

I agree Ephraim's victory was mainly due to a lot of Chrom fans were split between Lucina. I guess in a similar vein, one may argue that Eirika would have taken away from Ephraim voters, however the difference would still be quite large. Anyhow, everything you said I do agree with. The voting gauntlets lose any sense of competition or interest when characters such as Lucina or Camilla are placed. I suppose Fates fans who voted for Camilla may have moved to Beruka/Subaki to provide more competition with Minerva and Palla if Camilla wasn't included, at the very least it would've made things more interesting. Although really, the first voting gauntlet with Lucina should've provided enough feedback to fix the second gauntlet, yet they made the same "mistake". I wouldn't be surprised if they intentionally want someone to beat all others, but I do think it'd be more entertaining without. Whilst there's no excuse in the first gauntlet as Lissa would've been more fitting than Lucina, I don't think there were any other wyverns available in the game other than Camilla. Excluding the GHB units, of course. If we had Miledy or someone to represent as a spear wyvern, it would've been better. 

Maybe they're trying to avoid a situation where only unpopular characters are in a voting gauntlet? For example, an archer vs. assassin gauntlet with Setsuna, Jeorge, Rebecca, Niles vs. Matthew, Felicia, Jaffar and Saizo. Without checking the CYL results, it could potentially be an interesting voting gauntlet, but I don't think any of the units are particularly enticing to pull on during the banners for the gauntlet. 

[Vaximillian]

3 minutes ago, SlipperySlippy said:

If we had Miledy or someone to represent as a spear wyvern, it would've been better. 

gib jugdral nao

No seriously, Altena, Arion, or Travant (in decreasing order of importance and playability) should be added in the game, like, really soon.

[Cute Chao]

1 hour ago, Vaximillian said:

gib jugdral nao

No seriously, Altena, Arion, or Travant (in decreasing order of importance and playability) should be added in the game, like, really soon.

I would definitely love Arion to be added to the game :D

And Heath <3. He was all about the lances, if I recall, since I think wyvern riders only had lances until they promoted in fe7? I could be incredibly wrong, since it's been a while since I played it.

Too late for this gauntlet, though :( Hopefully it'll be more balanced next gauntlet, finally.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

15 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

I would definitely love Arion to be added to the game :D

And Heath <3. He was all about the lances, if I recall, since I think wyvern riders only had lances until they promoted in fe7? I could be incredibly wrong, since it's been a while since I played it.

Too late for this gauntlet, though :( Hopefully it'll be more balanced next gauntlet, finally.

Yes Lance and Sword in FE7 iirc

[Cute Chao]

13 minutes ago, JSND said:

Yes Lance and Sword in FE7 iirc

Oddly, I was picturing Vaida with an axe, so I couldn't get that out of my head xD

I think it's the same for FE8 and FE6, too, right? I don't recall Cormag with an axe (another unit this game needs because Cormag <3)

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

3 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

Oddly, I was picturing Vaida with an axe, so I couldn't get that out of my head xD

I think it's the same for FE8 and FE6, too, right? I don't recall Cormag with an axe (another unit this game needs because Cormag <3)

IIRC yeah, i remember FE8 Wyvern being able to wield Lance and Sword. IIRC they had promotion to Wyvern that give Sword, and the other is Lance locked but you get pierce

 

And i actually pictured Axe Vaida too, and then i remembered "OH SHIT SHE COULD USE BRAVE SWORD"

[Thor Odinson]

Axe would be quite fitting for Vaida.

But consider (and will probably never be implemented): Uber Spear Vaida

[tanuki]

Rather than the 30 minute wait between battles, I wish they would just give you a set amount of battles you can fight in a day.    I don't have cell phone service where I work and I don't text and drive so I am behind at least 12 hours every day making the wait between battles longer would make the limited time many of us have to play even worse.   I'm sure many people who work have the same problem.

[Extrasolar]

Like a few people said earlier, my immediate solution would be to oust the mega-popular characters, especially when less-popular characters are competing. I think it would be far more interesting and intense when the armies are anywhere close to one another in standing, rather than the roflstomp that was Lucina vs. everyone else.

Some people have suggested hiding the score/figures during the competition, but imo that wouldn't really help, unless you're talking the final round between the mega-popular characters, and even then, it's not hard to hazard a guess which would win. (The Lucina win everyone saw coming from miles, and while Cordelia and Camilla are both extremely popular, I pretty much knew Camilla would run away with the win for reasons that I do not want to elaborate on...)

...Sure, there's not exactly a lot of hype generated by the general playerbase should there be a gauntlet starring Raigh, Sophia, and the like. I guess more realistically, you could have mega blockbuster characters competing, but I'd say only against one another.

Maybe have a separate gauntlet based on popularity first? Lesser popular characters vs. lesser popular characters, and more popular characters vs. more popular characters.

Edited April 12, 2017 by Extrasolar

[Dr. Tarrasque]

How would I fix the voting gauntlet? I wouldn't because the entire thing is just dumb. I would replace it with something better.

[Ropeburn]

Stop making gauntlets with obvious winners. Why on earth you would put Camilla in the same gauntlet as characters like Subaki, Beruka and Palla is so bizarre to me (Not saying they're bad, but that they're not nearly as popular as Camilla) and shows a lack of awareness, despite them literally having a list of our favorite characters. 

Make some kind of "comeback" mechanic for teams that are losing by x2. Once I woke up the morning of Camilla vs Cordelia and saw that she already had an 8 million lead, I just gave up, because comebacks in this gauntlet just don't really happen. 

 

[TheWill]

18 hours ago, Cute Chao said:

I would definitely love Arion to be added to the game :D

And Heath <3. He was all about the lances, if I recall, since I think wyvern riders only had lances until they promoted in fe7? I could be incredibly wrong, since it's been a while since I played it.

Too late for this gauntlet, though :( Hopefully it'll be more balanced next gauntlet, finally.

Huh, that got me thinking...They'll probably make Heath or Zeiss a sword wyvern like they made Raven an axe user to allow for people to get a sword wyvern. I can see Cormag getting axes too

[Cute Chao]

2 minutes ago, SlipperySlippy said:

Huh, that got me thinking...They'll probably make Heath or Zeiss a sword wyvern like they made Raven an axe user to allow for people to get a sword wyvern. I can see Cormag getting axes too

For some reason, I can picture Cormag with a lance as much as I can picture Vaida. Must be something about blondes suiting axes xD

Ah, would love them to bring Cormag and Glen in. Was disappointed when siblings didn't continue, as I became hopeful lol

[TheWill]

6 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

For some reason, I can pictu tre Cormag with a lance as much as I can picture Vaida. Must be somethinim about blondes suiting axes xD

Ah, would love them to bring Cormag and Glen in. Was disappointed when siblings didn't continue, as I became hopeful lol

I can see Cormag getting axes because the only axe wyverns right now are female. I reckon Glenn would be last out of the Grado generals sadly. I think Selena would have priority but I think I am biased haha.

[Cute Chao]

Just now, SlipperySlippy said:

I can see Cormag getting axes because the only axe wyverns right now are female. I reckon Glenn would be last out of the Grado generals sadly. I think Selena would have priority but I think I am biased haha.

Narcian says hi xD

Duessal is the playable one, but that means nowt, considering Reinhardt was never playable even as a Tower person.

Glen x Selena otp xD I like them both. Maybe they'll be GHB's further down the line :D

[Vaximillian]

11 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

For some reason, I can picture Cormag with a lance as much as I can picture Vaida. Must be something about blondes suiting axes xD

Vaida is inseparable from her Überspear.

[TheWill]

8 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

Duessal is the playableGrado's one, but that means nowt, considering Reinhardt was never playable even as a Tower person.

Glen x Selena otp xD I like them both. Maybe they'll be GHB's further down the line :D

Narcien was definitely a fun surprise. I suppose he does appear the most out of the dragon generals though. Although I guess Valter appears the most from Grado's side? He lacks Narcien's more humourous personality though. Did people like Duessel? XD

I would like them to be GHBs too. Especially Selena. 

[KatarinaCS1]

The main thing I'd like to see reworked is the victor's bonus.  Right now the gauntlets feel more like a "who do you think will win" battle, rather than a "who do you want to win" battle.  I think the character who wins the gauntlet should get something special unique for them specifically, rather than a resource commonly used and obtainable elsewhere.

Alternate costumes would be great for me, say for instance that everyone who participates in the gauntlet would get a free version of the winner (regardless of the winner), but only of the person who actually wins.  This I feel would encourage people to support characters they like more (to try and get their special costume, instead of supporting a character you may not even like to get a few more feathers).