What might be the next "Echoes" game?

[Book Bro]

I've thought about this and I have a hard time making up my mind on when exactly the next remake would even come out. 

I don't really see a remake coming out on the Switch before a brand new entry, but I do think they'd save FE4 remake for the Switch. So if they decide FE4 is next then I expect it for 2020 at the earliest. Theoretically, FE6 could be remade for the 3DS if it released within the next two years, as it would be easier to remake and less risky since Roy means guaranteed sales, but the fate of the 3DS is unclear so I have no idea if that's realistic. 

[The Geek]

2 hours ago, Veronica Sawyer said:

If FE4 gets an Echoes version, I wouldn't be surprised if Eldigan and Ishtar or some characters along those lines were recruitable a la New Mystery Michalis. Not able to have kids, mind you, but recruitable.

Well Eldigan already has a kid in Gen 2 and Ishtar is in Gen 2 herself so I don't think adding kids would really be a thing.

I could maybe see them adding some more girls to Gen 1 so that not so many guys end up forever alone and so that the player avatar the game will obviously have can marry them

[Slumber]

I'm almost certain that if they Echo-ize BB, they'll rework it with BS, and more or less roll it into one game.

Since so many characters in BB are directly related to BS(Whether it be because they're children or siblings or something along those lines), and there are 0 canon pairings, I could see them essentially making BS "gen 1" and BB "gen 2".

That said, I'd also like to see them actually roll a lot of Thracia into Genealogy(I think the Galzus/Rivough storyline being expanded upon in gen 1 would help give Isaach, a country that gets really no focus, more of a place in the story), if not outright merge those two games together in their own right in some fashion.

[Sylphid]

Voted Genealogy, but considering how unexpected Gaiden was my unofficial vote goes to BS Fire Emblem.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Sylphid

[Magical Glace]

1 hour ago, Sylphid said:

Voted Genealogy, but considering how unexpected Gaiden was my unofficial vote goes to BS Fire Emblem.

BS FE was remade as part of FE12, though.

And it was only 4 maps long.

[Interdimensional Observer]

8 hours ago, Slumber said:

I'm almost certain that if they Echo-ize BB, they'll rework it with BS, and more or less roll it into one game.

Since so many characters in BB are directly related to BS(Whether it be because they're children or siblings or something along those lines), and there are 0 canon pairings, I could see them essentially making BS "gen 1" and BB "gen 2".

That said, I'd also like to see them actually roll a lot of Thracia into Genealogy(I think the Galzus/Rivough storyline being expanded upon in gen 1 would help give Isaach, a country that gets really no focus, more of a place in the story), if not outright merge those two games together in their own right in some fashion.

First, the only parents in BlazBlade are: Hector, Eliwood, Nino, Rebecca and their consorts, and Hawkeye, Canas, Rath, and Bartre & Karla and Pent & Louise. Lucius is probably the bishop who took care of Raigh, Lugh, and Chad.

That really isn't a lot, and BK and PL are already decided, Hawkeye's wife is presumably dead or at home, Canas's is the same, while Rath only has Lyn as a choice. And it isn't like we could do anything with Lucius.

Second, the generations mechanic works in FE4 because the plot of the two generations is two halves of the same narrative. Very little connects FE7's and FE6's plots, only Athos's tossed in prophecy and the Bern episode. Nergal has nada to do with FE6.

As for Thracia and Genealogy, have you seen the mechanics of the two games? Getting them to mesh would be bizarre and difficult, particularly once Seliph comes to Leif's rescue. That said I am the number one supporter of making Saias replace Palmark and have him give Seliph the Tyrfing and then become playable thereafter (with Final Valflame use). Also, I'd have zero issues with Lief getting a green bubble of Linoan, Marita and some other characters for C7, and that this assortment of characters would reappear in villages or castles or something for character conversations thereafter.

Make two separate Jugdral remakes, but better interconnect the games to an extent when doing it.

[Shadow Mir]

9 hours ago, Slumber said:

I'm almost certain that if they Echo-ize BB, they'll rework it with BS, and more or less roll it into one game.

Since so many characters in BB are directly related to BS(Whether it be because they're children or siblings or something along those lines), and there are 0 canon pairings, I could see them essentially making BS "gen 1" and BB "gen 2".

That said, I'd also like to see them actually roll a lot of Thracia into Genealogy(I think the Galzus/Rivough storyline being expanded upon in gen 1 would help give Isaach, a country that gets really no focus, more of a place in the story), if not outright merge those two games together in their own right in some fashion.

I don't know about that last one - I say they're too different for that. Connecting the Elibe games wouldn't work either.

[The Malign Knight]

10 hours ago, The Geek said:

I could maybe see them adding some more girls to Gen 1 so that not so many guys end up forever alone and so that the player avatar the game will obviously have can marry them

 But will they truly add an avatar in the FE4 remake? After all, SoV stayed faithful to the OG Gaiden and didn't have an avatar, so I doubt that they won't do the same with FE4 imho

[Slumber]

2 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

First, the only parents in BlazBlade are: Hector, Eliwood, Nino, Rebecca and their consorts, and Hawkeye, Canas, Rath, and Bartre & Karla and Pent & Louise. Lucius is probably the bishop who took care of Raigh, Lugh, and Chad.

That really isn't a lot, and BK and PL are already decided, Hawkeye's wife is presumably dead or at home, Canas's is the same, while Rath only has Lyn as a choice. And it isn't like we could do anything with Lucius.

Second, the generations mechanic works in FE4 because the plot of the two generations is two halves of the same narrative. Very little connects FE7's and FE6's plots, only Athos's tossed in prophecy and the Bern episode. Nergal has nada to do with FE6.

As for Thracia and Genealogy, have you seen the mechanics of the two games? Getting them to mesh would be bizarre and difficult, particularly once Seliph comes to Leif's rescue. That said I am the number one supporter of making Saias replace Palmark and have him give Seliph the Tyrfing and then become playable thereafter (with Final Valflame use). Also, I'd have zero issues with Lief getting a green bubble of Linoan, Marita and some other characters for C7, and that this assortment of characters would reappear in villages or castles or something for character conversations thereafter.

Make two separate Jugdral remakes, but better interconnect the games to an extent when doing it.

Roughly a quarter of FE6's cast is related to FE7's cast. I'd say that that is quite a lot. Even if you don't want to count the children, who make up 11 units, there's Geese, Geitz's brother, Niime and Dayan, Canas' mother and Rath's father, and Bartre, Marcus and Karel, who are just returning characters. This brings the total up to about 1/3 of the army. 

I'm not saying it's a good idea, but it's an idea I could see happening. IS hasn't made a straight up remake, nearly 1:1 faithful remake since SD, and even that had a number of new mechanics. But New Mystery and Shadows both have a number of mechanics that are series standards. I can't see them just giving BB a new coat of paint and saying "Well, there's nothing else we need to do here!". There is stuff they could do to make BB basically a "gen 2". Remember, not all of the characters you recruit in gen 2 of FE4 were these custom children that you made. Seliph, Julia, Oifey, Finn, Iuchar/Iucharbra, Aless, Leif, Altena and Hannibal are all fixed characters. While that is about the inverse of the amount of kids in FE6, there are a number of things IS could do to a BB/BS remake that wouldn't be that drastic compared to remakes of FE2 and 3 to make a second gen seem a little more fitting.

And while BB and BS aren't that connected, they're still connected. BS is about stopping Nergal from opening the Dragon Gate and bringing dragons to Elibe. BB is dealing with Zephiel, who is corrupted by the events of BS, and then finding out, oh shit, turns out dragons besides Ninian and Nils made it to Elibe. Gen 1 and gen 2 of FE4 aren't super connected at first glance, either. Gen 1 is about dealing with countries who have suddenly become more and more unruly, and you don't really find out until the last two chapters that it's because of a mysterious shadow cult. Gen 2 is dealing with said shadow cult. 

I also don't really mean "rolling Thracia and Genealogy into one game" as "You play up to Genealogy chapter 7, suddenly play Thracia, then go back to playing Genealogy with all of the Thracia characters" or anything like that(Orsin would make Genealogy way too easy). I just mean they'd be packaged as one, and there'd be more connections between the two(Like the Rivough/Galzus story I mentioned). Plus, I think a Thracia remake would be a hard sell on its own. "You've already played Genealogy and saved all of Jugdral from Julius and Manfroy. Now play the side story of the beta lord for half of the game as he liberates one country from Manfroy's puppet!" Shadows of Valentina gets leeway for being set on an entirely different continent and not really crossing over with FE1/3 besides one character showing up. Thracia doesn't really get that. It's hard to sell a more personal, smaller journey AFTER you just beat the massive, grand, world-saving story. 

Edited April 14, 2017 by Slumber

[Shogus00]

Genealogy or Binding Blade. I imagine with IS deciding to go with Gaiden for first remake they are going to do them in order but it's totally possible that this is test to see if the series would work and they might go Binding for Roy popularity. But I'm hoping for Genealogy for my boy Finn. 

[Orange Juice]

10 hours ago, Slumber said:

 

And while BB and BS aren't that connected, they're still connected. BS is about stopping Nergal from opening the Dragon Gate and bringing dragons to Elibe. BB is dealing with Zephiel, who is corrupted by the events of BS, and then finding out, oh shit, turns out dragons besides Ninian and Nils made it to Elibe.

I'd actually argue that FE6 and FE5 have a few more connections, albeit if you squint hard enough. The magic that Nergal uses to extract Quintessence and make Morphs is said to be ancient magic of draconic origin. found in Arcadia iirc. Morphs are artificially created beings with no real emotion. War Dragons, from FE6, are also artificial beings created by Idunn, who also have no emotions. It's entirely possible that War Dragons are created through much the same method as Morphs, but there's nothing that really confirms that. 

Anyway, there's my two cents on that argument. I still don't really think that they'd remake FE7 and FE6 as the same game, but if they did they could probably use the above to link it together. If anything, a condensed section regarding the events of FE7, Nergal, and the Morphs might make good DLC for a hypothetical FE6 remake. Personally, though, I'm jumping on the bandwagon and betting that FE4 would be the next Echoes remake. 

[Interdimensional Observer]

Alternatively, you could advertise it in Fates-like fashion. Do you want the macrocosmic story, or the microcosmic? 

@Slumber Your idea isn't bad, but it'd be something of flow-interrupter for Genealogy. Bundling the two games in a single game card/DL and on the main menu letting you decide straight from the get go which you want to play (with the game you're currently playing advertising the other game at the appropriate moments) would be a little better I think.

Also, you're right that there are more connections in characters between 6&7 than I had let on, and that we can connect the games in more ways than just kid breeding. I myself would love on Ilia route, if you wedded Nino to Jaffar, having Raigh or Lugh can visit a stray house where you find Nino, who has been in sorrow there ever since Jaffar was killed. Plus, a 1-battle scenic visit to Valor which unlocks playable Nils or something with a EliwoodxNinian support would also be wonderful. Maybe even throw in Erk as the guardian of Clarine or something (but not playable- Binding is already bloated in roster size- balance the current one instead). Rath could be explained in a lone conversation as having nobly led the defense against Bern, only to die and leave his father in charge of things.

[LFM]

Hoping for FE4. Haven't played it (yet) but I hear good stories that it is one of the best FE games out there.

[Slumber]

7 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Alternatively, you could advertise it in Fates-like fashion. Do you want the macrocosmic story, or the microcosmic? 

@Slumber Your idea isn't bad, but it'd be something of flow-interrupter for Genealogy. Bundling the two games in a single game card/DL and on the main menu letting you decide straight from the get go which you want to play (with the game you're currently playing advertising the other game at the appropriate moments) would be a little better I think.

Also, you're right that there are more connections in characters between 6&7 than I had let on, and that we can connect the games in more ways than just kid breeding. I myself would love on Ilia route, if you wedded Nino to Jaffar, having Raigh or Lugh can visit a stray house where you find Nino, who has been in sorrow there ever since Jaffar was killed. Plus, a 1-battle scenic visit to Valor which unlocks playable Nils or something with a EliwoodxNinian support would also be wonderful. Maybe even throw in Erk as the guardian of Clarine or something (but not playable- Binding is already bloated in roster size- balance the current one instead). Rath could be explained in a lone conversation as having nobly led the defense against Bern, only to die and leave his father in charge of things.

IS seems to be getting more ambitious, so it's always a possibility for these kinds of things. I would hope that if they ever do this kind of thing, they do it a bit more elegantly than just mashing the two games together and giving characters like Roy and Raigh different growth rates to fit their mother/father. Something like you're suggesting could add a lot to the game, where specific events only happen if specific characters hook up in BS.

Edited April 15, 2017 by Slumber

[Sylphid]

On 14.4.2017 at 1:57 PM, Glaceon Mage said:

BS FE was remade as part of FE12, though.

And it was only 4 maps long.

I was only jesting, though.

Though I only knew one of these facts, so thanks!

[SullyMcGully]

FE4. Binding Blade could use a remake and Western release, sure, but when it comes to actual gameplay mechanics, it's not very different from the newer games. I see the Echoes series as being IS's way of testing out old concepts on the newer fans. With SoV, they're experimenting with explorable dungeons and villages, different character interactions, and alternate weapon and skill systems. A Genealogy remake could show off that game's iconic giant maps, love system, and storytelling. Then, depending on how players react to these differences, they could be further implemented in future FE games. 

If FE4 does become the next remake, I would expect it to be the last FE game to be released on the 3DS, before focusing on the GBA games in what could potentially be a completely different subseries. I don't see much of a future for Thracia, except maybe as DLC for this hypothetical FE4 remake.

[AnnetheCatDetective]

I mean, all I want is to be able to play through all of the Tellius arc on my DS... but yeah, I'm sure they'll go in order and I'll have to wait for it.

[Armagon]

If they are going in release-date order, FE4 is the next one. It all depends on how well SoV does though. I'm sure SoV will do well enough but if enough people end up not liking the more unique mechanics of older Fire Emblem, then IS may end up skipping FE4. I'm not entiely sure how the casual audiance would react to the largest maps in the series.

An FE4 remake would be great though, even though i'm not really a big Jugdral fan. 

 

That being said, I personally would rather see a Binding Blade remake. I'm......actually still kinda surprised it hasn't happened yet. Out of all the potential remakes of pre-FE7 Fire Emblem, Binding Blade is the safest one because Roy. One thing I can see them doing in a Binding Blade remake is letting players know how to unlock the side-chapters. Some of the side-chapter unlock requirments are a little bit tricky, as people may not know there is a turn limit. Or they may end up killing Douglas in Ch.16, thus, preventing them from getting to Ch.16x. So having a little message box appear saying "to unlock *insert side-chapter here*, complete the chapter with *insert requirments here*. 

I can also see them giving the Sword of Seals unlimited durability. I would say the same about the other Legendary Weapons but considering you get them frequently enough (assuming you unlock them), it'd be quite easy to beat the game with 8 unlimited durabilty Legendary Weapons. 

One thing i see both an FE4 and FE6 remake doing is adding new characters. Shadow Dragon did it, New Mystery did it, and Shadows of Valentia did it. Who knows, maybe an FE6 remake will let you recruit Al, Tiana, and Gant, as opposed to just letting you get their weapons in the original. Though i suppose having those three in the game will change the plot a bit, but SoV shows that IS is willing to rewrite stories, although the original Gaiden only had like 30 lines of dialouge so it makes sense why the story was rewritten.

[JJ48]

55 minutes ago, Armagon said:

If they are going in release-date order, FE4 is the next one. It all depends on how well SoV does though. I'm sure SoV will do well enough but if enough people end up not liking the more unique mechanics of older Fire Emblem, then IS may end up skipping FE4. I'm not entiely sure how the casual audiance would react to the largest maps in the series.

An FE4 remake would be great though, even though i'm not really a big Jugdral fan. 

 

That being said, I personally would rather see a Binding Blade remake. I'm......actually still kinda surprised it hasn't happened yet. Out of all the potential remakes of pre-FE7 Fire Emblem, Binding Blade is the safest one because Roy. One thing I can see them doing in a Binding Blade remake is letting players know how to unlock the side-chapters. Some of the side-chapter unlock requirments are a little bit tricky, as people may not know there is a turn limit. Or they may end up killing Douglas in Ch.16, thus, preventing them from getting to Ch.16x. So having a little message box appear saying "to unlock *insert side-chapter here*, complete the chapter with *insert requirments here*. 

I can also see them giving the Sword of Seals unlimited durability. I would say the same about the other Legendary Weapons but considering you get them frequently enough (assuming you unlock them), it'd be quite easy to beat the game with 8 unlimited durabilty Legendary Weapons. 

One thing i see both an FE4 and FE6 remake doing is adding new characters. Shadow Dragon did it, New Mystery did it, and Shadows of Valentia did it. Who knows, maybe an FE6 remake will let you recruit Al, Tiana, and Gant, as opposed to just letting you get their weapons in the original. Though i suppose having those three in the game will change the plot a bit, but SoV shows that IS is willing to rewrite stories, although the original Gaiden only had like 30 lines of dialouge so it makes sense why the story was rewritten.

Did FE6 actually track all the support dialogues you'd unlocked like FE7 and later did?  I don't recall seeing it, and that would be a nice feature, too.

[Armagon]

46 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

Did FE6 actually track all the support dialogues you'd unlocked like FE7 and later did?  I don't recall seeing it, and that would be a nice feature, too.

Yeah, the Support Log wasn't a thing until Blazing Blade. So a Binding Blade remake would definitly have it. They'll also probably get rid of the "5-Supports per character per playthrough" rule as well. 

They'll probably let Roy-Support with one of his potential wives because of that. By that, i mean, for the ending. Not S-Supports in the way Awakening and Fates did it. So like, Roy S-Supporting Lilina gets you the ending where Lilina marries Roy.

[Magical Glace]

If they add anyone to FE6's playables, I hope it's Rebecca.

We never got any interaction with her and Wolt/Roy, and I would like to see some tbh.  

[MaskedAmpharos]

I'm just expecting them to go in chronological order honestly.

FE1, 2, and 3 have all gotten remakes, so it only makes logical sense to me that 4 would be next. 

More than that though, I'm honestly really hoping Genealogy is next because I've been meaning to experience it for a while but have been hesitant to get into it because of the archaic graphics and UI. I'll probably still end up playing it either way, but I'm really, really looking forward to seeing it revamped.

That said, I'd honestly be happy with literally any of the older games they go with, so I'm content to just sit back and wait to see what happens. 

[Thinks Their Own Way]

I voted for Genealogy mainly because of Julia to be honest. She is my favourite unit in Heroes (team captain), so I would love to play the game she appears in without an emulator with a translation patch.

[Tolvir]

Genealogy tbh. I think they are going to focus on the titles that never released in the West as a way of briniging them over for us to finally experience them officially, while throwing a bone at the same time to the older fans in Japan.

I think the game wouldnt have any issues with being localized and receiving a T rating either. I looked at the story and game after hearing so much about it being so dark and gritty. It really isnt that bad at all, definitely no Game of Thrones or Witcher. Its not like we are dealing with crazed rulers, raping and pillaging, people being executed in the streets, slaughter of innocents, etc. At least nothing shown "on screen" in that regard. So it could achieve a T rating without a problem. and some of the incest stuff could probably be changed pretty easily. If not, we still have Game of Thrones having incest and no one really went all pitchfork and torches over that one. I think Genealogy would be fine.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Tolvir

[Slumber]

12 hours ago, Tolvir said:

Genealogy tbh. I think they are going to focus on the titles that never released in the West as a way of briniging them over for us to finally experience them officially, while throwing a bone at the same time to the older fans in Japan.

I think the game wouldnt have any issues with being localized and receiving a T rating either. I looked at the story and game after hearing so much about it being so dark and gritty. It really isnt that bad at all, definitely no Game of Thrones or Witcher. Its not like we are dealing with crazed rulers, raping and pillaging, people being executed in the streets, slaughter of innocents, etc. At least nothing shown "on screen" in that regard. So it could achieve a T rating without a problem. and some of the incest stuff could probably be changed pretty easily. If not, we still have Game of Thrones having incest and no one really went all pitchfork and torches over that one. I think Genealogy would be fine.

 

I mean, ignoring all of the incest that people typically jump to when saying "Man, FE4 would NEVER get localized!", the main character's wife is brainwashed and forced to be breeding stock by the main antagonist(Who is also her brother) of gen 1. Plus, it's pretty heavily implied that Lene is raped during her imprisonment by a random tertiary villain, and you see this develop IN the chapter you recruit her. Then there's stuff like Sylvia being 14 and trying to seduce Claude(Again, heavily implied to be her older brother) by telling him how "experienced" she is.

And there are crazed rulers causing genocide. The Lopto Sect's main way of giving Loptyr power is by rounding up and sacrificing nearly every young child across the continent. Thracia gets a lot more into this part than Genealogy, but it's still there.

FE4 isn't grimdark Game of Thrones or anything, but it's far darker than anything Nintendo's ever brought to the west.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Slumber