I never realized how unpopular my opinions generally are...

[Sylphid]

On 17.4.2017 at 4:44 PM, Anacybele said:

I agree that that's not healthy, but I don't remember doing this either (except in this thread's OP, I suppose). But if I have, as with those other things Florete mentioned, it was never my intent. I always want to have a more positive outlook.

It's simply an impression I've got from what I've seen you post on the forums. For all I know I could be completely wrong about that.

 

10 hours ago, Anacybele said:

10 hours ago, Florete said:

If your concern is to "win" an argument, you've already lost.

I didn't mean it that literally...

For the record, when you say stuff like "you're not going to change my opinion" when someone tells you why they disagree with you, the impression you give is that you want to "win" an argument or discussion, regardless of your intention (I've seen you do this few times, most recently in that discussion about Tiki's accent in Heroes I think). Changing your opinion isn't always the other person's goal. Usually they just want to talk with you, hoping to understand your viewpoint / make you understand theirs (which is different from making you agree with them).

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Sylphid said:

It's simply an impression I've got from what I've seen you post on the forums. For all I know I could be completely wrong about that.

 

For the record, when you say stuff like "you're not going to change my opinion" when someone tells you why they disagree with you, the impression you give is that you want to "win" an argument or discussion, regardless of your intention (I've seen you do this few times, most recently in that discussion about Tiki's accent in Heroes I think). Changing your opinion isn't always the other person's goal. Usually they just want to talk with you, hoping to understand your viewpoint / make you understand theirs (which is different from making you agree with them).

I know I say that sometimes, and let me explain. When I do, I feel like the other person is trying to force their opinion on me and get me to agree with them. I've had people actually do this to me in the past and I don't like it at all, so it makes me defensive. I'm sorry I never elaborated on this before, I guess it was just never clear enough. If no one was actually trying to force their opinion on me, then that's fine. It just came off that way to me.

[Skfoos]

(newbie popping up)

In terms of general advice, there's nothing much I can add, but in terms of understanding how people react, I want to point this out: 

3 hours ago, Anacybele said:

I apologize for misinterpretations when I can, it's just that sometimes, I don't get how the interpretation came about at all. Though I guess I should still just apologize and leave it at that anyway.

This implies (or at least I got from this) narrow-mindedness, which can be a primary reason for why arguments between you and others happen. You may think others will see your words the way you intended, but it's entirely possible that they view it in a way you never expected them to. It's helpful to look at your own words and see how others might view your words, even in ways that you never intended. It's not always foolproof, but it should help reduce the amount of conflicts that you run into. And since I'm assuming you're going to stay in this forum, understanding how people here take your words can alert you to his/her point of view, making future posts come with less misunderstandings. Even assuming the other is right (temporarily) when you know he/she is not can help in the process of knowing where the other is coming from- you really have to give others the benefit of the doubt to understand their points of view.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Reloaded

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Reloaded said:

(newbie popping up)

In terms of general advice, there's nothing much I can add, but in terms of understanding how people react, I want to point this out: 

This implies (or at least I got from this) narrow-mindedness, which can be a primary reason for why arguments between you and others happen. You may think others will see your words the way you intended, but it's entirely possible that they view it in a way you never expected them to. It's helpful to look at your own words and see how others might view your words, even in ways that you never intended. It's not always foolproof, but it should help reduce the amount of conflicts that you run into. And since I'm assuming you're going to stay in this forum, understanding how people take your words can alert you to his/her point of view, making future posts come with less misunderstandings. Even assuming the other is right (temporarily) when you know he/she is not can help in the process of knowing where the other is coming from- you really have to give others the benefit of the doubt to understand their points of view.

I can't say for sure how others will view my words though, because obviously, people can't read minds... So I'm not sure how exactly to do what you're saying?

[Dylan Corona]

49 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I can't say for sure how others will view my words though, because obviously, people can't read minds... So I'm not sure how exactly to do what you're saying?

Think of it like this. When I type out a reply or a post or anything, really. I take a second and re-read my words. I think about all the ways they could be interrupted. I do this even more so during a debate kind of post. I do this so I don't sound like I'm coming off as rude or mean or angry. Worst comes to worst, if I can't make it sound good, I just don't post it. Or if I have to, I add jokes or "hahas" places. In writing it's very hard to understands ones meaning or intent.  

Edited April 18, 2017 by Dylan Corona

[Anacybele]

22 minutes ago, Dylan Corona said:

Think of it like this. When I type out a reply or a post or anything, really. I take a second and re-read my words. I think about all the ways they could be interrupted. I do this even more so during a debate kind of post. I do this so I don't sound like I'm coming off as rude or mean or angry. Worst comes to worst, if I can't make it sound good, I just don't post it. Or if I have to, I add jokes or "hahas" places. In writing it's very hard to understands ones meaning or intent.  

Yeah, I suppose this is all one can do, really. Thanks.

[Dylan Corona]

32 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Yeah, I suppose this is all one can do, really. Thanks.

Yeah, I know it's not easy, trust me haha. But it really is what people have to do sometimes. I'm a published comic book writer, and the company that publishes my stuff reminded me that I had to do that, since most of the time to sell my product, I have to sell myself. And no one want's to read someones work, if they think you are a jerk haha. So, while it's hard sometimes, it really is the best way to do things.

[Anacybele]

4 minutes ago, Dylan Corona said:

Yeah, I know it's not easy, trust me haha. But it really is what people have to do sometimes. I'm a published comic book writer, and the company that publishes my stuff reminded me that I had to do that, since most of the time to sell my product, I have to sell myself. And no one want's to read someones work, if they think you are a jerk haha. So, while it's hard sometimes, it really is the best way to do things.

Yeah, I guess. And you've published stuff? Awesome! I hope it's made you good money!

[Dylan Corona]

Just now, Anacybele said:

Yeah, I guess. And you've published stuff? Awesome! I hope it's made you good money!

Not, much, but enough haha. Sales have been good so far. Don't go into a creative job for the money though, fair warning lol. I just like getting the numbers back and knowing that people are reading my stuff. Thanks though, I know you write, so I'm sure you will get there at some point. Just don't give up and keep working :). If that's what you want to do, I mean haha.

[Anacybele]

Just now, Dylan Corona said:

Not, much, but enough haha. Sales have been good so far. Don't go into a creative job for the money though, fair warning lol. I just like getting the numbers back and knowing that people are reading my stuff. Thanks though, I know you write, so I'm sure you will get there at some point. Just don't give up and keep working :). If that's what you want to do, I mean haha.

Oh, of course. I do write, but I don't know if I'll be published. I'm more looking for a graphics design career for the creativity part. I do hope it makes me nice money, but I'll probably have a part time side job as well as a financial cushion of sorts.

[Dylan Corona]

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

Oh, of course. I do write, but I don't know if I'll be published. I'm more looking for a graphics design career for the creativity part. I do hope it makes me nice money, but I'll probably have a part time side job as well as a financial cushion of sorts.

That's a good idea, I'm a Law Student too. Figured Law would make me enough money to keep my writing going haha. Smart thinking, Ana. 

But anyways, that's off topic. Feel free to PM me if you want to chat more. 

 

But on topic, yeah, I tend to only like unpopular things too, but I just try to get my friends into it, and if that doesn't work, oh well haha. You shouldn't like or dislike something cause of someone else. Though, hobbies in common and trying new things are good for any friendship or relationship, so keeping an open mind is a good thing. Just my two cents.

[Anacybele]

52 minutes ago, Dylan Corona said:

That's a good idea, I'm a Law Student too. Figured Law would make me enough money to keep my writing going haha. Smart thinking, Ana. 

But anyways, that's off topic. Feel free to PM me if you want to chat more. 

 

But on topic, yeah, I tend to only like unpopular things too, but I just try to get my friends into it, and if that doesn't work, oh well haha. You shouldn't like or dislike something cause of someone else. Though, hobbies in common and trying new things are good for any friendship or relationship, so keeping an open mind is a good thing. Just my two cents.

Yeah, it is off topic. :P

Oh, of course, you're absolutely right. Having interests and hobbies in common is awesome for a relationship.

[eclipse]

15 hours ago, Anacybele said:

I know I say that sometimes, and let me explain. When I do, I feel like the other person is trying to force their opinion on me and get me to agree with them. I've had people actually do this to me in the past and I don't like it at all, so it makes me defensive. I'm sorry I never elaborated on this before, I guess it was just never clear enough. If no one was actually trying to force their opinion on me, then that's fine. It just came off that way to me.

This is a competitive mindset, in which you go up against someone else.  When people disagree, it's not necessarily to start a fight/get you to change your mind.  Sometimes, it's simply to add another view to the thread.

The minute you think that someone is trying to change your views, take your hands off of the keyboard, and ask yourself "why do I think the other person is forcing their opinion on me?"

[Augestein]

Good point with what Eclipse said. People aren't necessarily trying to change your opinion, but rather, they are trying to express why their opinion may have some merit as well. There's a statement that I've once heard that has stuck with me for almost forever because I like it so much "argue like you're right, listen like you're wrong."

I personally enjoy hearing other people's opinions on things as it adds a new flavor to my own thoughts and sometimes can serve as a gateway to even better / more interesting thoughts. The only time I actually start getting irritated / upset now when people argue / discuss things with me, is if the person doesn't even attempt to discuss the subject at hand, but would rather simply bash their opponent. And in cases like that, I usually just end up leaving the topic. 

I can think of one thing Eclipse said for instance in Fates that I don't agree with-- the subject of Peri as a character, but I do like the spin on the purpose of Peri and her interpretation of it. 

Also Ana, don't forget that people's opinions are a strange beast. You might like something now, but that doesn't mean that 10 years from now you'll still like it. Or vice versa. I used to really love anime when I was younger, but as I've gotten older, I've become less and less partial to it. Only a select few manage to even jog my interests nowadays. 

[Anacybele]

Hm. Yeah, you both make sense. I really ought to ask myself why I think people are trying to force their opinions on me. But then what about when it's the other way around, and people are accusing me of trying to do that to them? I would never intentionally do such a thing, but I would like to know (politely) if I'm being a bit too forceful and if so, I'll back off.

I'm seriously done saying things like "but I don't see where I did this" and stuff, because now I'm like "if people are telling me I'm doing certain things and I find myself saying that as often as I do, then maybe there really IS an issue on my end here." It doesn't help anything, even if I would like to understand where the other person is coming from on my actions. I just want to be like "okay, fine, sorry, didn't mean for it to come out that way" and be done instead of derailing threads and whatnot...

Edited April 19, 2017 by Anacybele

[Arcanite]

30 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

But then what about when it's the other way around, and people are accusing me of trying to do that to them?

Don't come on too strong and make for absolute certain, that it is only YOUR opinion. this way they can't say that you're forcing them to do anything. As long as you make it clear that it is only what you think, you'll be fine.

And also, make sure you say "I respectfully disagree with you" and try not to use any hostile words either. Someone mentioned this already but don't say "(blank) sucks!". Say "I don't really like (blank) too much". And like I said before, adding a little comedy tends to lighten the tone of your "speech".

Every letter, Every word, Every punctuation mark matters. So try to come up with a different vocabulary for the Internet than IRL, because it is hard to convey attitude, personality, and tone on the Internet.

Spoiler

I don't post the same way I talk for a reason HEH. Also why I don't even curse. Sometimes it could be interpreted as "Angry", especially since most people curse to add emphasis to what they're saying e̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶o̶u̶g̶h̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶ ̶b̶i̶l̶l̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶o̶t̶h̶e̶r̶ ̶h̶i̶l̶a̶r̶i̶o̶u̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶s̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶s̶a̶y̶

 

[Anacybele]

Just now, Arcanite said:

Don't come on too strong and make for absolute certain, that it is only YOUR opinion. this way they can't say that you're forcing them to do anything. As long as you make it clear that it is only what you think, you'll be fine.

And also, make sure you say "I respectfully disagree with you" and try not to use any hostile words either. Someone mentioned this already but don't say "(blank) sucks!". Say "I don't really like (blank) too much". And like I said before, adding a little comedy tends to lighten the tone of your "speech".

Every letter, Every word, Every punctuation mark matters. So try to come up with a different vocabulary for the Internet than IRL, because it is hard to convey attitude, personality, and tone on the Internet.

  Reveal hidden contents

I don't post the same way I talk for a reason HEH. Also why I don't even curse. Sometimes it could be interpreted as "Angry", especially since most people curse to add emphasis to what they're saying e̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶o̶u̶g̶h̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶ ̶b̶i̶l̶l̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶o̶t̶h̶e̶r̶ ̶h̶i̶l̶a̶r̶i̶o̶u̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶s̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶s̶a̶y̶

 

Yeah, good points, and I feel like I already try to do them, guess I need to be clearer.

And yeah, I don't swear much either. I typically only do it if I'm frustrated or to make a more accurate point about a certain event or action (as in a sentence I made in the NHL thread that reads "he got suspended for his bullshit, yay!").

[BEST TRYNDAMERE PLAYER]

Unpopular opinions are fantastic - it creates variety. You keep doing you

[Rapier]

Someone probably said this before me (my chronic laziness stops me from doing what any decent person would), but the problem doesn't seem to be on your opinions, but on how close you hold them and how personal you get when your opinions don't sustain themselves favorably when exteriorized. It seems to be that personal approach that is giving you discomfort.

I mean, it's normal to be attached to your opinions and to take critics personally when it is something you hold dear, but when you take it far enough to be bothered when someone disagrees with you or get into a conflict because of divergent opinions, then there is a problem. By the way, I'm not saying you do those things; those are just examples and I used the word "you" as a "language vice" of sorts. Anyway, the issue seems to be the emotional attachment.

I'm not going to say that you shouldn't care about others' opinions and not feel... competitive(?)... when you do find yourself in a discussion, because you can't really control the way you feel and it takes time and experience to increase your tolerance to those feelings. Instead, avoiding those situations through foresight might help. If you know you're entering a topic and thinking of posting about something that is very personal to you and that people might argue against (because that's what discussions are for), think twice before posting and ask yourself if you can "handle the heat". If you do and it starts going down a bad path, think if you should just leave it at that before it gets worse. It generally isn't worth continuing. Know yourself and your limits and try not to go farther.

Now, if you feel bad because you feel that your opinions are not well structured or that you're making far too many logical errors, then developping your critical thinking might help. That only counts for objective affirmations, though. Things like "I find Ike beautiful" or "I like X" don't count because subjective things are not worth discussing, they're a subject of taste (YOUR taste, in fact) and tastes can not be held objectively for discussions.

[shadowofchaos]

On 4/19/2017 at 9:39 AM, Arcanite said:

Don't come on too strong and make for absolute certain, that it is only YOUR opinion. this way they can't say that you're forcing them to do anything. As long as you make it clear that it is only what you think, you'll be fine.

And also, make sure you say "I respectfully disagree with you" and try not to use any hostile words either. Someone mentioned this already but don't say "(blank) sucks!". Say "I don't really like (blank) too much". And like I said before, adding a little comedy tends to lighten the tone of your "speech".

Every letter, Every word, Every punctuation mark matters. So try to come up with a different vocabulary for the Internet than IRL, because it is hard to convey attitude, personality, and tone on the Internet.

  Hide contents

I don't post the same way I talk for a reason HEH. Also why I don't even curse. Sometimes it could be interpreted as "Angry", especially since most people curse to add emphasis to what they're saying e̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶o̶u̶g̶h̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶a̶ ̶b̶i̶l̶l̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶o̶t̶h̶e̶r̶ ̶h̶i̶l̶a̶r̶i̶o̶u̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶s̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶s̶a̶y̶

 

Separating gameplay evaluations and personal tastes also helps. She does not have enough experience to state all encompassing statements such as "this unit is useless" without providing calculations. Most people in this forum would gladly discuss gameplay evaluations if one were to provide calculations and such.

No one can, or should say "your tastes are inferior" to those things you mentioned in the OP. Because those are subjective. The second you say something about unit value for gameplay in a Fire Emblem forum, you walk into a different battlefield where your opinions can and will be shot down by objective analysis.

Edited May 7, 2017 by shadowofchaos

[Anacybele]

1 hour ago, shadowofchaos said:

No one can, or should say "your tastes are inferior" to those things you mentioned in the OP. Because those are subjective. The second you say something about unit value for gameplay in a Fire Emblem forum, you walk into a different battlefield where your opinions can and will be shot down by objective analysis.

Sure learned that the hard way, didn't I...

[Camus The Dark Knight]

I have a lot of unpopular opinions since I often view stuff with complete disregard for the feelings of myself or others (They get in the way imo). That's when it comes to stuff in life or political talk. When it comes to entertainment like movies and games and such, I have some. The biggest off the top of my head is I like the Star Wars prequels. The original trilogy is much better, but I still enjoy the prequels.