How is Ike the strongest ever, again?

[maybe]

he killed god

but seriously, aside from that, you have to consider just because it's something that people say, doesn't mean it's true

ike is said to be "the strongest hero" presumably cause he killed god

that doesn't mean he is actually "the strongest hero"

a reputation isn't always completely true

[fangpoint333]

I always took it as Ike being the in the middle of two giant continent spanning wars and winning gave him more chance to grow than the other main characters who only do one at best. Ashera being more powerful than the other final bosses only adds to that.

[Salamud]

2 minutes ago, dragonlordsd said:

But that's the thing isn't it? He "spars with some of the Laguz Kings" but all of them are stronger than him. So are we not counting them as heroes? I mean, if so, fine, you're probably right, but it's a weird statement.

What RD shows points to Ike being on the level of the Laguz Kings (defeating Zelgius, his boss talk with Deghinsea, him getting the honor of Yune's blessing). 

[Junkhead]

On 25/4/2017 at 11:40 PM, unique said:

he killed god

but seriously, aside from that, you have to consider just because it's something that people say, doesn't mean it's true

ike is said to be "the strongest hero" presumably cause he killed god

that doesn't mean he is actually "the strongest hero"

a reputation isn't always completely true

okay this is a really good point. Actually contributes to my idea that people take the whole "killed a god" thing too literally. 

[Lyrai]

I call Ike as a great character because of his status and character development, especially in PoR. In that game, we see Ike coming from the rock bottom to the top of the world. He's a simple mercenary turned into a lord and a hero. He's a kind person no matter what, and he is just the type of person I'd love in a heartbeat, makes me feel like I want to stay by his side, supporting him in anything he do, not as a fellow mercenary, but as a loyal follower and a friend.

Marth indeed has the same vibe, but he is a prince, so he is not as approachable as Ike, even considering Marth's personality.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Lyrai

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Ike is the only Lord whose power is actually one of their main characteristics

 

Marth's power comes from implication(he dueled Hardin with Gradivus who is on par with Camus. Camus is unimaginably strong, so the same can be said for Hardin and Marth)

Alm is definitely hyped as much as Ike if Heroes is anything to go with

Seliph and Leif is characterized by being superman and underdog respectively with Holy Blood, but they were never defined by their power(although this is kinda funny because one of the gameplay intention of FE5 is to show the disparity between Leif and common person, so its not like Leif is weak or anything)

Roy is specifically said to be inexperienced in combat due to his young age, that being said Binding Blade Roy is the strongest lord since Binding Blade is very OP story wise

Eliwood is the strongest of the 3 FE7 Lord at his old age.... which isn't the Lord!Eliwood so yeah

Ephraim is self explanatory. Eirika is another personality Lord

Ike led the GM and is renowned for his swordmanship

Chrom is said to be pretty strong

Then Corrin is just a Dragon, which is stupid common at this point

 

Theres really only 4 choice for Lord who you can turn into "The strongest ever" at this point, and the easiest of them all is definitely Ike. For Fire Emblem as a whole, Anri is the only character who can be the strongest, but i doubt the writer even remember who the fuck is Anri at this point

[Anacybele]

As others said, Ike came the closest to single-handedly defeating a god, and this was right after he took on other major threats in the Black Knight and Dheginsea as well as Lekain. Chrom also mentions in Awakening that he "felled thousands" which I doubt other lords did, because that's a hugeass number for an FE world warrior.

Also, he surpassed the previous strongest fighter in Tellius, his own father. These are reasons enough to believe he could be the strongest hero period. Though whether that is technically actually true hasn't really been proved.

I like to believe it to be true tho. :3

4 minutes ago, Lyrai said:

I call Ike as a great character because of his status and character development, especially in PoR. In that game, we see Ike coming from the rock bottom to the top of the world. He's a simple mercenary turned into a lord and a hero. He's a kind person no matter what, and he is just the type of person I'd love in a heartbeat, makes me feel like I want to stay by his side, supporting him in anything he do.

We're talking about his strength as a warrior though, not his character. Even though I do agree here.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Anacybele

[Lyrai]

Just now, Anacybele said:

We're talking about his strength as a warrior though, not his character. Even though I do agree here.

In terms of strength, well... here's what I think:

There's no doubt that he's one of the strongest. This is due to Greil's swordplay. Marth doesn't have any sort of "inherited swordplay" while Ike clearly has one. Ike has very good stats for his unpromoted form, and his animation is amazing all across the board, making us players feel badass for having Ike. This is not felt with Marth, or not as strong against Sigurd. His battle animations plays a big part in picturing this one. His swings have substance. We feel our blood boiling when we face off against the Black Knight. This feeling is unique in FE.

Then, once he wields the heavy Ragnell, he went from badass to totally badass, because now he doesn't have to worry about ranged enemies anymore. You feel pretty much unbeatable in terms of power (except for the final bosses). Then in RD, in the final chapters, Ike's might and power would truly be tested, and that only adds to the satisfaction of beating up people with your Ragnell.

[Armagon]

Yeah, Ike's feats listed here are a legitmate reason for him to he called the strongest Lord. The only other Lord who has killed an actual God was Corrin.

I personally would argue that, at least in the God-slaying department, Corrin's feat of killing Anankos is more impressive. Both Corrin and Ike used divine weapons but Ike needed that extra boost from Yune, whereas Corrin simply needed the Omega Yato. 

I could be wrong on this part but I think Anankos is also more powerful than Ashera. I mean, Anankos has time-travel, dimension-crossing, and black hole powers. And of course, Dragon's Vein. Meanwhile, all Ashera really did was turn people into stone. But i've never played Tellius so i could be wrong about Ashera.

15 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Chrom also mentions in Awakening that he "felled thousands" which I doubt other lords did, because that's a hugeass number for an FE world warrior.

I'm pretty sure that's just a history exaggaration.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Armagon

[Junkhead]

Lore hype reminds me a lot of this one example in Teen Wolf, where the main character is stated to have taken out this amazing big bad (many, many, many maaany times stronger) on his own right, when they didn't even fight in the first place.

Conclusion: Lore hype exaggeration and popularity.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Soul~!

[Sunwoo]

5 minutes ago, Armagon said:

I personally would argue that, at least in the God-slaying department, Corrin's feat of killing Anankos is more impressive. Both Corrin and Ike used divine weapons but Ike needed that extra boost from Yune, whereas Corrin simply needed the Omega Yato.

Corrin needed Azura's song.

[CtrlAltSandwich]

I'd take the question literally and explain the answer as such;

Ike is described as "The Strongest Hero" based on brute physical strength alone. I very much doubt that he is objectively the most powerful hero in Fire Emblem's history [Despite him being nearly unbeatable once you slap Ragnell on him], as the manner in which he wields his weapon relies heavily on brute strength. Just look at his attack animations, no matter how much Ashunera/Ashera [Something something lore] blesses a weapon, I highly doubt that it's easy to literally create shockwaves so strong and precise they can pierce a dragon's scales. The only real technique we see Ike use in combat is his whole Aether blade toss combo when the aforementioned skill triggers, otherwise, it's just relatively simple large, very telegraphed, incredibly deadly slashes and the like [Excluding shockwaves].

Furthermore, this can be evidenced by how Ike is portrayed in titles he features in. For instance, take his appearance in the Smash Bros. franchise, a very slow fighter who telegraphs his attacks in advance, but with attacks so powerful that any character in the game [Ike included] are damaged immensly from just a few swings. Once again, his attacks are relatively straightforward, with the exceptions being his dash, the whole fire eruption [Which is caused by him ramming Ragnell into the ground hard enough to break the earth's crust and make liquid flame come out], and of course, as previously mentioned, Aether. However, take note that due to his immense strength, Ike is among the game's slowest characters in both appearances.

Lastly, let's look at Ike's unique skill in FE: Heroes, Heavy Blade. Heavy Blade, contrary to what its name suggests, does not lower Ike's speed in exchange for an increase in attack, instead, it has it where if Ike's attack stat is higher than his foe's [Which it will be in most non-Effie circumstances, due to Ragnell's 16 might and his presumably high attack stat], his special cooldown is reduced by 1. Once again, rewarding Ike for using raw, brute strength, rather than speed.

In conclusion, Ike is, in all likelihood, not objectively the best hero [Unless Nintendo decides to make him Ryoma 2.0], but instead, the hero who has the most raw, physical strength.

[fangpoint333]

10 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Yeah, Ike's feats listed here are a legitmate reason for him to he called the strongest Lord. The only other Lord who has killed an actual God was Corrin.

I personally would argue that, at least in the God-slaying department, Corrin's feat of killing Anankos is more impressive. Both Corrin and Ike used divine weapons but Ike needed that extra boost from Yune, whereas Corrin simply needed the Omega Yato. 

I could be wrong on this part but I think Anankos is also more powerful than Ashera. I mean, Anankos has time-travel, dimension-crossing, and black hole powers. And of course, Dragon's Vein. Meanwhile, all Ashera really did was turn people into stone. But i've never played Tellius so i could be wrong about Ashera.

Ashera is one half of a complete goddess who was noted for wiping out every other continent with a deluge. I would assume that Ashera is at least more than half that powerful since she's stronger than her other half at that point in time.

[Armagon]

16 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

Corrin needed Azura's song.

Azura's song didn't really do anything though.

8 minutes ago, fangpoint333 said:

Ashera is one half of a complete goddess who was noted for wiping out every other continent with a deluge. I would assume that Ashera is at least more than half that powerful since she's stronger than her other half at that point in time.

That is true. I forgot Ashera and Yune used to be one. Although i will say that causing a great flood that wipes out nearly all of the world isn't that impressive. That's one of the more basic powers a God can have. But then again, Ashera was just one half of a God. Whatever Ashera and Yune's complete form is could possibly be stronger to Anankos. 

[Tamanoir]

1 hour ago, JSND said:

Ike is the only Lord whose power is actually one of their main characteristics

 

Marth's power comes from implication(he dueled Hardin with Gradivus who is on par with Camus. Camus is unimaginably strong, so the same can be said for Hardin and Marth)

Alm is definitely hyped as much as Ike if Heroes is anything to go with

Seliph and Leif is characterized by being superman and underdog respectively with Holy Blood, but they were never defined by their power(although this is kinda funny because one of the gameplay intention of FE5 is to show the disparity between Leif and common person, so its not like Leif is weak or anything)

Roy is specifically said to be inexperienced in combat due to his young age, that being said Binding Blade Roy is the strongest lord since Binding Blade is very OP story wise

Eliwood is the strongest of the 3 FE7 Lord at his old age.... which isn't the Lord!Eliwood so yeah

Ephraim is self explanatory. Eirika is another personality Lord

Ike led the GM and is renowned for his swordmanship

Chrom is said to be pretty strong

Then Corrin is just a Dragon, which is stupid common at this point

 

Theres really only 4 choice for Lord who you can turn into "The strongest ever" at this point, and the easiest of them all is definitely Ike. For Fire Emblem as a whole, Anri is the only character who can be the strongest, but i doubt the writer even remember who the fuck is Anri at this point

Don't forget the Ettard. No special ability or anything. It's just too heavy to be wielded by anyone else.

Alm also killed a god (we could compare Micaiah and Celica's implications in doing so, if we want to get technical, but he's as much a God Slayer as Ike is.) I think he has the best shot at taking Ike's title

Hector is also mainly defined by his strength, but didn't do anything that meaningfull with it (Defeating a simple Dragon with Eliwood, Lyn and Athos.)

That's not necessarily the point, but the way Ike uses his strength is also interresting. He's less ruthless than Alm or Hector (unless the BK s mentioned), and only uses it for a cause he think is right.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I doubt anybody that played Tellius is particularly adamant about this. They just like Ike and the games for normal reasons. And if God killing makes you strong then damn, it's depressing to think JRPG protagonists like Tidus are stronger than Marth. Also, Anankos and Grima definitely match Ashera if not surpass her, come on now.

[Interdimensional Observer]

1 minute ago, Gustavos said:

Also, Anankos and Grima definitely match Ashera if not surpass her, come on now.

Even if this is the case, and I have to acknowledge this, I at the same time rage internally against it.

Grima is a badly developed villain. Evil Fell Dragon rar! Ashera ain't a goddess of development either- but at least she has Lehran and Degh as underlings. Whereas Grima has Vali-barf! (I loathe him.) And Lady "complete my Paralogue and watch as I rAversa all my character development!"

Anankos it seems is just IS chucking trite ideas and buckets upon buckets of power onto an unnecessary villain to make it seem like a good one. Wrong! No amount of ridiculous power could make him good.

[Slumber]

13 minutes ago, Gustavos said:

I doubt anybody that played Tellius is particularly adamant about this. They just like Ike and the games for normal reasons. And if God killing makes you strong then damn, it's depressing to think JRPG protagonists like Tidus are stronger than Marth. Also, Anankos and Grima definitely match Ashera if not surpass her, come on now.

Tidus is WAAAAAAAAY stronger than Marth. As shitty and lame as Tidus is, the scale of the games are way different.

And Grima isn't anywhere near Ashera. For all the crazy shit Anankos is capable of, Grima didn't even do a fraction of that. Grima pretty much just was big and flew around.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Even if this is the case, and I have to acknowledge this, I at the same time rage internally against it.

Grima is a badly developed villain. Evil Fell Dragon rar! Ashera ain't a goddess of development either- but at least she has Lehran and Degh as underlings. Whereas Grima has Vali-barf! (I loathe him.) And Lady "complete my Paralogue and watch as I rAversa all my character development!"

Anankos it seems is just IS chucking trite ideas and buckets upon buckets of power onto an unnecessary villain to make it seem like a good one. Wrong! No amount of ridiculous power could make him good.

Yeah, and Doomsday kills Superman. I hate that such a lame, left field villain got the honor before Lex Luthor or any other DC heavy, but you're gonna encounter some bad canon.

2 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Tidus is WAAAAAAAAY stronger than Marth. As shitty and lame as Tidus is, the scale of the games are way different.

He's a high school jock that struggles to start a fire. His girlfriend has all the power.

[Slumber]

Just now, Gustavos said:

Yeah, and Doomsday kills Superman. I hate that such a lame, left field villain got the honor before Lex Luthor or any other DC heavy, but you're gonna encounter some bad canon.

He's a high school jock that struggles to start a fire. His girlfriend has all the power.

Yeah, but he also kicks a ball hard enough to destroy ghosts.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Yeah Marth only fought an Evil Emperor who is as powerful as a man who can solo an entire battalion and slays a dragon, and slays an Evil Dragon Overlord

 

Tidus fought fucking Sin

 

Binding Blade Roy is at the hilarious upper scale of Fire Emblem characters power wise but he would be somewhat tame in Final Fantasy and all their bullshit. I guess Roy is at home in FF6, since thats where his power level lies in

Edited April 26, 2017 by JSND

[fangpoint333]

As much as we love this series, the characters here are relatively weak compared to most other JRPGs.

Grima's biggest feat besides being big and strong is that he can create Risen. Ashera can also create zombies so that's nothing special. Anankos is probably stronger just going by what we've seen, we don't actually know the full span of Asheruna's power so she might be stronger. Back when Naga was the main god people wouldn't have expected Naga to have time travel powers. I wouldn't be surprised if they gave her other powers to pull out as the plot demands. 

20 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Even if this is the case, and I have to acknowledge this, I at the same time rage internally against it.

Grima is a badly developed villain. Evil Fell Dragon rar! Ashera ain't a goddess of development either- but at least she has Lehran and Degh as underlings. Whereas Grima has Vali-barf! (I loathe him.) And Lady "complete my Paralogue and watch as I rAversa all my character development!"

Anankos it seems is just IS chucking trite ideas and buckets upon buckets of power onto an unnecessary villain to make it seem like a good one. Wrong! No amount of ridiculous power could make him good.

 

This bothers me as well. The world building between the Tellius and the worlds of FE Awakening and Fates just don't compare. Anankos' powers are just silly and don't really seem like powers an actual deity would have but rather just the most overpowered stuff they could come up with which if used by anyone with half a brain would be able to crush the protagonists in an instant.

Edited April 26, 2017 by fangpoint333
New posts were created while I was creating my reply.

[Slumber]

19 minutes ago, JSND said:

Yeah Marth only fought an Evil Emperor who is as powerful as a man who can solo an entire battalion and slays a dragon, and slays an Evil Dragon Overlord

 

Tidus fought fucking Sin

 

Binding Blade Roy is at the hilarious upper scale of Fire Emblem characters power wise but he would be somewhat tame in Final Fantasy and all their bullshit. I guess Roy is at home in FF6, since thats where his power level lies in

Even Sin in the grand scheme of things isn't that powerful for an FF villain.

Sin - Giant immortal sky whale that threatens the world every 10 years. Basically a suped up Grima.

Compare to

Those stupid things in FFXIII - Actually Gods, with the final boss from LR being the closest thing to the Abrahamic God the series has gotten.

Kuja and Necron - The former actually destroyed an entire world, while the latter is the personification of death itself.

Kefka - God of Magic, absorbed the power of all the Espers, was this close to destroying the world.

Exdeath - A tree with the power to manipulate space and could basically open black holes at will. Likely would have destroyed the world if left alone.

Ultemecia - A sorceress that could completely manipulate time and space, nearly destroyed all existence.

Zeromus - The strengthened, hateful spirit of a nigh-invulnerable telepathic alien.

Even Sephiroth, who's pretty weak in the grand scheme of things, was capable of summoning Meteor, which would have destroyed the world quite easily.

FE is probably closest to Ivalice. But even there, they slay dragons pretty casually.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Slumber

[Slumber]

DAMMIT

Edited April 26, 2017 by Slumber

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

3 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Even Sin in the grand scheme of things isn't that powerful for an FF villain.

Sin - Giant immortal sky whale that threatens the world every 10 years.

Compare to

Those stupid things in FFXIII - Actually Gods, with the final boss from LR being the closest thing to the Abrahamic God the series has gotten.

Kuja and Necron - The former actually destroyed an entire world, while the latter is the personification of death itself.

Kefka - God of Magic, absorbed the power of all the Espers, was this close to destroying the world.

Exdeath - A tree with the power to manipulate space and could basically open black holes at will. Likely would have destroyed the world if left alone.

Ultemecia - A sorceress that could completely manipulate time and space, nearly destroyed all existence.

Zeromus - The strengthened, hateful spirit of a nigh-invulnerable telepathic alien.

Even Sephiroth, who's pretty weak in the grand scheme of things, was capable of summoning Meteor, which would have destroyed the world quite easily.

FE is probably closest to Ivalice. But even there, they slay dragons pretty casually.

 

Dragons in FE are pretty stupid though

 

To actually defeat Dragons in FE, FE6 cast went so far to distort the reality to do it.

A mere blood infusion of Divine Dragon tribe manage to turn a normal human into a War God who can singlehandedly solo an army. This same blood is distorted by breeding over generations, and the same blood still had the same level of effect. This is fairly comparable to FF6's magicite thingy

Anankos is technically a Dragon.... and god knows how much bullshit power he had

 

But yeah FF is stupid strong

 

 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2017 by JSND