Arts: Yeah or nay?

[Corrobin]

Do you like the basic idea and/or implementation behind Arts?

[PeaceRibbon]

I normally forget they're there.

You can imagine how nice it is to have my first run be Normal Casual. 

Edited May 24, 2017 by PeaceRibbon
spelling error

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

I liked em. They were a good substitute for random proc skills imo, and create room for strategy and coordination. One thing I abused throughout most of the game was having Catria chip safely with Hit and Run or Long Arch with an Iron Lance, then have Palla quickly dispose of the weakened enemy with Tempest Lance from Steel Lance. Shove and Swap from the Shields are occasionally useful, but I didn't really use Shields that much to begin with.

Some of the Arts feel too situational or are just useless most of the time (cough Silver Lance), but usually it's because the weapon itself is already quite strong. It's a bit lame, but it's fair. Then there are the ones that are too OP, like the Royal Sword's Twin Lions.

The Saunion is weird, though. Why give a Lance that has no 1-range (and therefore mostly no EP) Swap and Defensive?

Edited May 24, 2017 by SatsumaFSoysoy

[property of nuvelle]

They're cool and bring something new to the table. I prefer modern skills though and would like if they stuck with the current skill system.

[Stopwatch]

I like weapon arts more than the skill systems from Awakening/Fates.

Having to spend HP to use them (and magic too) adds a cool risk/reward element. The risk being less health, the reward being the ability to hit even on disadvantageous terrain or heavy damage.

At first I was disappointed that you couldn't keep even one skill from weapons you were using before, but I prefer having to pick the best/your favorite combination of weapon and art instead of choosing your perfect skill and class setup and then reclassing/breeding for it.

That's another reason I like weapon arts. They helped kill child units as a game mechanic for this game and (hopefully) the next ones as well.

oh who am i kidding. if they go away forever, the series will die again.

[Armagon]

I don't use Arts too often, but there's much more strategy to them than crossing your fingers and hoping Luna activates.

[Suavegoose260]

I only used tempest lance and double lion consistently and curved shot to pick off enemies in cover, other than those three, i forgot that arts where a thing most of the time actually.

[Reflex]

Arts are basically mandatory on hard mode. If nothing else, having +20-30 extra hit is absurdly needed against enemies, and later skills basically do enough damage that trade off the ability to double like Rhomphaia and the Royal Sword's brave effect.

[Tsak]

Arts are pretty essential in some scenarios. Like curved shot for the finish of chip damage on a spellcaster, or Double lions to let Alm cleanly kill an enemy with no retaliation. Also that Rapier skill that lets hits that will kill always hit. That skill is legit amazing

[SoulWeaver]

I liked how simple Arts has made Echoes feel for me - I don't have to dig in and grind like mad to get the perfect Skill setup, which is good and means replaying will in theory not be tedious. Frankly, a lot of Echoes has been really great, even though I initially thought I'd get bugged by the whole only one item thing or the Spells cost HP thing.

1 hour ago, Stopwatch said:

I like weapon arts more than the skill systems from Awakening/Fates.

Having to spend HP to use them (and magic too) adds a cool risk/reward element. The risk being less health, the reward being the ability to hit even on disadvantageous terrain or heavy damage.

At first I was disappointed that you couldn't keep even one skill from weapons you were using before, but I prefer having to pick the best/your favorite combination of weapon and art instead of choosing your perfect skill and class setup and then reclassing/breeding for it.

That's another reason I like weapon arts. They helped kill child units as a game mechanic for this game and (hopefully) the next ones as well.

oh who am i kidding. if they go away forever, the series will die again.

I doubt they'll keep Weapon Arts for other remakes, as it seems to me to be something only Gaiden would've done anyways. Hopefully they do come up with unique ways to make other remakes special in their own ways. As for 2 Gen games, I think they'll leave them out for a little to let everyone start missing them and/or wait to see if the series starts to die, and then they'll drop Re:Genealogy on us when it starts to slow down and suck us all back in with the overpowered children again.

[King Marth 64]

It was a good addition in Echoes: Shadows of Valentia, they appeared to be useful if you have any characters that needed to beat a stronger opponent like Necrodragons, Fiends, Desaix, Slayde, and much more. I did have Kamui used Subdue with the Steel Sword equipped on a Mila's Servant in Mila's Ordeals that made alot of massive damaged to the Mila's Servant dragon since I did have Celica's team was nearly whipped out by that fiend and Celica was near at death in Casual Mode. And I did have Clive used Armor Crusher to bring more damage on Desaix since he is a tough Baron in Act 3.

[Lord_Grima]

I like them because I enjoy playing JRPG's like Dragon Quest, so having a character with a base attack and then special abilities in Fire Emblem works for me. Some Arts aren't as good as others, but you have to pick and chose if you want a better weapon for stats, or a weapon for the Arts. It adds more to the strategy!

[SuperIb]

I honestly used them a fair amount because a lot of them gave bonuses to hit which was very handy in some situations. Especially for Archers. I think I prefer them over skills.

[FallenVanguard]

I prefer the Arts system over RNG skills. I'd much rather sacrifice some hp for a big plus rather than rely on rng to pull an Astra or some such out, even if it can only happen on my turn and doubling isn't a thing if you do so.

[Lord Raymond]

They are really necessary on classic/hard, and extremely fun to use as well. Some are really amazing like Tigerstance (add the skill stat as extra damage. This is an extra 20 damage usually for only 8 HP). Double Lion is absolutely awesome. And the killer bow's Hunter Barrage is my favorite. Two attacks in a row, around 60% critical, 85-100 accuracy. This destroys almost anything in the game, as long as your archer has at least a somewhat decent attack stat.

[Azz]

I like them, but I don't use them much, even on my current hard/classic run.

I find that if I do use them, they are more so used as the final blow.

[Lord Raymond]

8 hours ago, SuperIb said:

I honestly used them a fair amount because a lot of them gave bonuses to hit which was very handy in some situations. Especially for Archers. I think I prefer them over skills.

Same. I used Ward Arrow a bunch just for the boosted accuracy.

[Thane]

It's an amazing idea and I really want to see it in future games. However, I feel like they can be tweaked a little bit. For example, the basic Arts aren't that good on faster characters, at least in my experience. I also feel like there should be some way of retaining an Art even when switching weapons - I'm not saying all the Arts you learn should stick with you permanently in their current form, but it feels weird unlocking a good skill and then having to move away from it once you get a better weapon. For example, would it really be so bad if Silque could retain Swap when given a good ring to substitute that Leather Shield?

Edited May 24, 2017 by Thane

[Lord Raymond]

Just now, Thane said:

It's an amazing idea and I really want to see it in future games. However, I feel like they can be tweaked a little bit. For example, the basic Arts aren't that good on faster characters, at least in my experience. I also feel like there should be some way of retaining an Art even when switching weapons - I'm not saying all the Arts you learn should stick with you permanently in their current form, but it feels weird unlocking a good skill and then having to move away from it once you get a better weapon. For example, would it really be so bad if Silque could retain Swap when given a good ring to substitute that Leather Shield?

While that seems good, you could grind and give every single one of your characters swap by giving around the leather shield. You could have every person have the same 10 skills. This would break the game almost as hard as Pair-Up. The skills are balanced out by the need to keep the item in your inventory.

[Thane]

1 minute ago, Lord Raymond said:

While that seems good, you could grind and give every single one of your characters swap by giving around the leather shield. You could have every person have the same 10 skills. This would break the game almost as hard as Pair-Up. The skills are balanced out by the need to keep the item in your inventory.

I did mention the fact that they should't stick with you permanently in their current form; obviously some balancing would have to be done.

[Stopwatch]

27 minutes ago, Lord Raymond said:

This would break the game almost as hard as Pair-Up. The skills are balanced out by the need to keep the item in your inventory.

I'll say again how I like making a choice between weapons for Mt or for Arts. But the fact that it's a no-brainer sometimes is kind of a bummer. I'm convinced that Zweihänder is just about the best sword in the game, but to be fair I haven't gotten any of the legendary ones.

[Alkaid]

I basically never use them and often forget they're even there. Because you can't double when using arts it's also often superior for me to just use a regular attack instead, and even on slower characters it's rarely enough of a jump in damage for me to care. I think they're a neat idea, but don't really feel like they come into play much. Could also be a mix of the game being easy and them being underpowered, in most cases, which makes them not feel like much of a factor when making combat decisions. I prefer the current proc skill system, even though it has its flaws too.

[Reflex]

The accuracy in this game is so low on hard that I can't imagine you take 15x2 70% hit over 25 guaranteed unless you feel lucky or use Mila's Turnwheel to test rng.

34 minutes ago, Stopwatch said:

I'll say again how I like making a choice between weapons for Mt or for Arts. But the fact that it's a no-brainer sometimes is kind of a bummer. I'm convinced that Zweihänder is just about the best sword in the game, but to be fair I haven't gotten any of the legendary ones.

Rhomphaia might be better because Clair or Matilda becomes a mobile god of one-shotting with their high speed, though the downside is losing out on the ridersbane on counterattacks.

[Stopwatch]

6 hours ago, Reflex said:

The accuracy in this game is so low on hard that I can't imagine you take 15x2 70% hit over 25 guaranteed unless you feel lucky or use Mila's Turnwheel to test rng.

Rhomphaia might be better because Clair or Matilda becomes a mobile god of one-shotting with their high speed, though the downside is losing out on the ridersbane on counterattacks.

I'm aware of Rhomphaia, that's why I said sword. Dragonhaze also ends lives. 

[nhaer042]

I like Curved Shot and Heavy Draw mainly because it helps the archers' lackluster accuracy. Other than that, I don't find a lot of use for them too.  A shame really, because I like the idea behind skills being tied to weapons.