E3 Gameplay

[Azz]

Just now, KongDude said:

Okay I just thought about it. I keep forgetting about Awakening saving the series and all that stuff due to the negativity that also floats around it.

Yeah, for something allegedly saved the series, a lot of people really don't like it.

@Anacybele I guess I may have overemphasized how much more newcomers there were to veterans. And while yes, I'm sure that a lot of newcomers do like older characters like Ike, Roy and Lyn, but you also got to take into account that most newcomers still would say they prefer Awakening/Fates characters to them because most of them probably haven't touched a Tellius game since they are so hard to come by and Binding Blade is Japan only, so most people would only know them from Smash and the little personality Awakening and Fates gave them (And that's if they bought the DLC and amiibo). I can't say much in terms of Lyn, Hector, Eirika or Ephraim since you can get theirs games relatively easily thanks to the eShop, but even with that in consideration, I still would say most newcomers would say they prefer Awakneing and Fates characters and most wouldn't bat an eye at the exclusion of classic characters.

Also, no, I'm not saying these guys shouldn't be excluded, I'm just saying, from a marketing standpoint, including more current and popular characters (Remember in the Heroes pole you like to refer to, 28 of the characters in the top 40 were Awakneing and Fates characters) would make more sense, and also leave room for a potential sequel, which would include more characters and would help Nintendo make more buck.

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, Azz said:

Also, no, I'm not saying these guys shouldn't be excluded, I'm just saying, from a marketing standpoint, including more current and popular characters (Remember in the Heroes pole you like to refer to, 28 of the characters in the top 40 were Awakneing and Fates characters) would make more sense, and also leave room for a potential sequel, which would include more characters and would help Nintendo make more buck.

If we're talking about the Heroes poll, Several non-3DS characters made the top ten, and the two winners were non-3DS characters. So to say that people don't love them as much as Awakening/Fates characters is kind of incorrect.

[Arthur97]

1 minute ago, Azz said:

Yeah, for something allegedly saved the series, a lot of people really don't like it.

There's no alledgedly about it. And most of the people that hate it are older fans. Tellius fans seem particularly resentful.

[property of nuvelle]

3 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

There's no alledgedly about it. And most of the people that hate it are older fans. Tellius fans seem particularly resentful.

I mean, why would a new fan hate Awakening? Also, is there really any indication that it's mostly Tellius fans?

[Azz]

6 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

If we're talking about the Heroes poll, Several non-3DS characters made the top ten, and the two winners were non-3DS characters. So to say that people don't love them as much as Awakening/Fates characters is kind of incorrect.

6 non-3DS male characters (Two of which were Ike so realistically only 5 should of) and 3 non-3DS female characters made the top 10 in their gendered category. From a numbers point of view, that's not a lot.

Also, when I said people don't love them as much as 3DS characters, I was specifically referring to newcomers, not the general FE fanbase.

Another thing. The Heroes poll was severally flawed so it really can't be taken too seriously (And yes, it was a bit hypocritical of me to bring it up, but despite its flaws, it still helps my point).

[Anacybele]

4 minutes ago, Azz said:

6 non-3DS male characters (Two of which were Ike so realistically only 5 should of) and 3 non-3DS female characters made the top 10 in their gendered category. From a numbers point of view, that's not a lot.

Also, when I said people don't love them as much as 3DS characters, I was specifically referring to newcomers, not the general FE fanbase.

Another thing. The Heroes poll was severally flawed so it really can't be taken too seriously (And yes, it was a bit hypocritical of me to bring it up, but despite its flaws, it still helps my point).

Despite its flaws, I believe it helps my point too then.

And yeah, who ever said only Tellius fans hate Awakening?

Edited June 15, 2017 by Anacybele

[Arthur97]

10 minutes ago, KongDude said:

I mean, why would a new fan hate Awakening? Also, is there really any indication that it's mostly Tellius fans?

More of an observation. A lot of people who really harp on Awakening seem to like Tellius the most. Maybe they think it should have been the turning point of the series. Who knows?

[property of nuvelle]

Just now, Arthur97 said:

More of an observation. A lot of people who really harp on Awakening seem to like Tellius the most. Maybe they think it should have been the turning point of the series. Who knows?

I just see a large number of older fans really. Also, you're generalizing lot's of people with your previous statement. It really isn't fair to assume all Tellius fans are against Awakening.

[Anacybele]

1 minute ago, KongDude said:

I just see a large number of older fans really. Also, you're generalizing lot's of people with your previous statement. It really isn't fair to assume all Tellius fans are against Awakening.

This. I'm a huge Tellius fan that doesn't hate Awakening. I don't LOVE Awakening, but I don't hate it either. It's more just eh to me these days.

[Book Bro]

8 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

More of an observation. A lot of people who really harp on Awakening seem to like Tellius the most. Maybe they think it should have been the turning point of the series. Who knows?

I know that as a Tellius fan my dislike of Awakening isn't based on "it wasn't more of the same". It's largely because the story and characters did nothing for me. 

I liked Fates a lot, for the record. 

[Arthur97]

12 minutes ago, KongDude said:

I just see a large number of older fans really. Also, you're generalizing lot's of people with your previous statement. It really isn't fair to assume all Tellius fans are against Awakening.

As I said, it was just an observation and is in no way definitive for all of them, but it's just that it seems to be a trend.

As for all the plot and character complaints, the plot was essentially the same Fire Emblem plot that we usually get and most FE characters are fairly shallow, their defining character traits just sometimes gives them the illussion of depth.

In the end, it's okay not to like something, but all the hate for Awakening is excessive.

Edited June 15, 2017 by Arthur97

[property of nuvelle]

5 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

As I said, it was just an observation and is in no way definitive for all of them, but it's just that it seems to be a trend.

As for all the plot and character complaints, the plot was essentially the same Fire Emblem plot that we usually get and most FE characters are fairly shallow, their defining character traits just sometimes gives them the illussion of depth.

I guess it's a trend among you then. It isn't a good idea to use personal trends as facts though.

[HK Motendra]

18 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Despite its flaws, I believe it helps my point too then.

A few individual exceptions, I don't think are enough to support you, unfortunately. For instance, if you were to go off of a higher and fairer pool, like say, the top 100, both Awakening and Fates combined make up 60 of those, leaving 40 to be divided minimally between 10 games; two of which (understandably) didn't have any placements that you can guess why, and the highest from any of these individual past games was 9, coming from Blazing Sword.

2 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

As for all the plot and character complaints, the plot was essentially the same Fire Emblem plot that we usually get and most FE characters are fairly shallow, their defining character traits just sometimes gives them the illusion of depth.

Regarding this, its less so of the "illusion of depth" and more so of which and how many characters are better rounded and more dimensional. At least, thats from my own observations. I don't really like to delve into those and prefer to appreciate characters for what they are than for everything they don't live up to

[Anacybele]

5 minutes ago, Motendra said:

A few individual exceptions, I don't think are enough to support you, unfortunately.

Nah, I disagree.

[Arthur97]

4 minutes ago, KongDude said:

I guess it's a trend among you then. It isn't a good idea to use personal trends as facts though.

Never said it was a fact, just an observation.

I mean, there are probably plenty of people who like both, but it does seem to be a trend.

2 minutes ago, Motendra said:

A few individual exceptions, I don't think are enough to support you, unfortunately. For instance, if you were to go off of a higher and fairer pool, like say, the top 100, both Awakening and Fates combined make up 60 of those, leaving 40 to be divided minimally between 10 games; two of which (understandably) didn't have any placements that you can guess why, and the highest from any of these individual past games was 9, coming from Blazing Sword.

Regarding this, its less so of the "illusion of depth" and more so of which and how many characters are better rounded and more dimensional. At least, thats from my own observations. I don't really like to delve into those and prefer to appreciate characters for what they are than for everything they don't live up to

A healthy outlook even if I say most are pretty flat.

[May]

The only way for the older characters to get more noticed is to have the older titles renewed... Like it's that obvious, and nothing else can change it. I mean barely any newcomers paid attention to Gaiden characters until Echoes was announced... IS is just doing what's more economically sound, and it'd be great to have a few characters from older series, but I just don't find it realistic.

[HK Motendra]

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

Nah, I disagree.

Then do tell me how, cause the single leg that you're standing on isn't helping you right now. I can pull up exact numbers if that'll help illustrate. Out of that 100, Awakening had 25; Fates with the largest, had 35. Tellius, without counting duplicates, had 7. Considering the fact that it has the largest cast of any one singular game (95) that looks very poorly on your account. Ya see, the problem with basing off popularity, at least in FE's case, is that even though there are definitely past characters that are popular, there's little to no cohesion between them or that could even be created. If you had to pick one, however, Elibe is the closest with 14 characters in a span of two games, but with a cast sum of 118, thats like applying to Harvard with anything less than a 2.75 GPA (an approximation, but you get my point)

Hypothetically speaking, think of how exactly that would work out: a fair share of carefully picked, cohesive characters hailing from 3 games, and then you have the odd balls who are there just because. What place would, say, Nephnee, Mia, or even Ike have in whatever it is they're trying to do if they were the sole person who came from Tellius in this game? Or how about Sophia, Dorcas or Roy to represent Elibe by themselves?They'd be no better than Priam in Awakening whose sole purpose seems to be fan-service to Ike and probably should never have even been a thing. 

And this is all based on the flawed CYL poll

Edited June 16, 2017 by Motendra

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, Motendra said:

Then do tell me how, cause the single leg that you're standing on isn't helping you right now. I can pull up exact numbers if that'll help illustrate. Out of that 100, Awakening had 25; Fates with the largest, had 35. Tellius, without counting duplicates, had 7. Considering the fact that it has the largest cast of any one singular game (95) that looks very poorly on your account. Ya see, the problem with basing off popularity, at least in FE's case, is that even though there are definitely past characters that are popular, there's little to no cohesion between them or that could even be created. If you had to pick one, however, Elibe is the closest with 14 characters in a span of two games, but with a cast sum of 118, thats like applying to Harvard with anything less than a 2.75 GPA (an approximation, but you get my point)

Hypothetically speaking, think of how exactly that would work out: a fair share of carefully picked, cohesive characters hailing from 3 games, and then you have the odd balls who are there just because. What place would, say, Nephnee, or even Ike have in whatever it is they're trying to do if they were the sole person who came from Tellius in this game? They'd be no better than Priam in Awakening whose sole purpose seems to be fan-service to Ike and probably should never have even been a thing. 

And this is all based on the flawed CYL poll

I've already said all I need to. The poll winners were non-3DS characters and the bottom line is they and some other non-3DS characters still scored very high. I'm not arguing against many of the high scoring characters being 3DS. That IS true. I'm just saying that there are still plenty of non-3DS ones way up there in popularity too. And yes, the poll is flawed anyway.

[HK Motendra]

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I've already said all I need to. The poll winners were non-3DS characters and the bottom line is they and some other non-3DS characters still scored very high. I'm not arguing against many of the high scoring characters being 3DS. That IS true. I'm just saying that there are still plenty of non-3DS ones way up there in popularity too. And yes, the poll is flawed anyway.

I know that. What I'm saying is that 40 isn't "plenty" when they're scattered so badly as they are. Far from it, I'm afraid

Edited June 16, 2017 by Motendra

[The DanMan]

Apparently on the more recent stream they mentioned that Koei came up with the roster, choosing characters who they felt best represented certain classes and playstyles-- with IS only making a few changes.

So, expect some oddballs and salt.

[Thany]

Best represent a class huh? I wonder who would best represent an armor class. I would laugh if it turned out to be kellum.

[Azz]

1 minute ago, The DanMan said:

Apparently on the more recent stream they mentioned that Koei came up with the roster, choosing characters who they felt best represented certain classes and playstyles-- with IS only making a few changes.

So, expect some oddballs and salt.

I got my bread ready for all the salt.

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, The DanMan said:

Apparently on the more recent stream they mentioned that Koei came up with the roster, choosing characters who they felt best represented certain classes and playstyles-- with IS only making a few changes.

So, expect some oddballs and salt.

I would say to that "who better represents the mercenary style than Ike?" But I can't get my hopes up too high, of course...

[Mysterique Sign]

3 hours ago, lloebet said:

I don't see the point in giving Lucina her own character slot since in every game she shares with Marth they are given the same abilities.

Except in Fates...and Codename Steam...and Awakening

But yeah, all of them

[Thany]

1 minute ago, Mysterique Sign said:

Except in Fates...and Codename Steam...and Awakening

But yeah, all of them

this is what happens when you only base your knowlage off of smash bros XD