What is your unpopular Fire Emblem opinion?

[Ether]

Just now, Florina's #1 Fan said:

That... is possible? I don't even want to think about that.

It would be seriously repulsive, possibly enough for me to not want to play the game, if they took my statement that way :(

Honestly, I want a tomboy female lead. Like a lord Dorothy or something, one that isn't busty, isn't overly attractive, and isn't the irritating "I want to talk out our feelings" female trope that hates violence, one that would defy the beauty standard all the females seem to be held to and doesn't wear a bikini in the summer DLC and isn't used for annoying fanservice. I even think it'd be cool if for once, the lead was okay with fighting, and maybe had more of an issue when not fighting, like a war hero that doesn't know how to readjust to a normal life, or has never been good at anything but combat.

I think he means they wouldn't actually have a developed character as in a good personality and backstory, just more 'developed' cleavage. Ugh.

Still better than Beefy McManGuy #942 tbh.

Here's another unpopular opinion then, I suppose. Sexuality and fanservice isn't inherently bad character design, and Camilla's only real problems are that she's meant to be your sister figure and that the game's cameraman likes her more than most people. You can talk about impractical armour and riding clothes and all that, but it's been a series staple since forever and focusing in on Camilla for it is silly at best. Caeda rode a pegasus in a miniskirt in FE1 ffs, Camilla is not the root of all evil.

[SoulWeaver]

 

6 minutes ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

That... is possible? I don't even want to think about that.

It would be seriously repulsive, possibly enough for me to not want to play the game, if they took my statement that way :(

Honestly, I want a tomboy female lead. Like a lord Dorothy or something, one that isn't busty, isn't overly attractive, and isn't the irritating "I want to talk out our feelings" female trope that hates violence, one that would defy the beauty standard all the females seem to be held to and doesn't wear a bikini in the summer DLC and isn't used for annoying fanservice. I even think it'd be cool if for once, the lead was okay with fighting, and maybe had more of an issue when not fighting, like a war hero that doesn't know how to readjust to a normal life, or has never been good at anything but combat.

He means they wouldn't actually have a developed character as in a good personality and backstory, just more 'developed' cleavage.

I believe they're not that dumb, but…you can never be too careful with game devs. Frankly, if they did that, I'd probably just do what I assume like 75% of us did with Awakening - bench the main Lord as soon as possible and use the Units we like.

Now that I think about it, they have kept their female Lords rather on the flat side since the beginning of time, though in some cases like Lyn it makes sense. Wonder if it's just Japan being Japan or if there's some other reason behind it.

14 minutes ago, Slumber said:

He just exists to say things a caricature of Genghis Khan would say.

Wait, so vegetarianism is that kind of thing? That quote is my favorite part of Walhart, though I also did like his willingness to admit he may have been wrong in the Supports.

2 minutes ago, Ether said:

Still better than Beefy McManGuy #942 tbh.

Here's another unpopular opinion then, I suppose. Sexuality and fanservice isn't inherently bad character design, and Camilla's only real problems are that she's meant to be your sister figure and that the game's cameraman likes her more than most people. You can talk about impractical armour and riding clothes and all that, but it's been a series staple since forever and focusing in on Camilla for it is silly at best. Caeda rode a pegasus in a miniskirt in FE1 ffs, Camilla is not the root of all evil.

Depends on the Beefy McManGuy - I'd play a game with a Gregor- or Henry-style male Lord for the change of pace. It mostly just bugged me that all the male Lords are pretty much cookie-cutter. Chrom is the closest I've seen to a break off the archetype, and that's literally only because he's the most likely to break things in the army - most Lord characters aren't like that.

I would say my main problem with Camilla wasn't the outfit - though I didn't appreciate her complete lack of pants/skirts - it was that they had so much potential to actually EXPLAIN why she was the way she was and they dropped the ball big time.

My issue with her outfit - and the outfits of several other characters, lest you think this exclusively a Camilla-bash - stems from the fact that I have several young(we're talking 14 at the oldest) cousins who like to watch me play games, and I don't particularly want to have to explain to their parents why I'm playing a game with a character dressed like that around the 8- and 9-year-olds. It's also very frustrating to say in other areas of the internet that I like her and then have to clarify because everyone starts jumping on me about how they didn't know I liek da gams fo da hoes.

[Von Ithipathachai]

20 minutes ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

That... is possible? I don't even want to think about that.

Honestly, I want a tomboy female lead. Like a lord Dorothy or something, one that isn't busty, isn't overly attractive, and isn't the irritating "I want to talk out our feelings" female trope that hates violence, one that would defy the beauty standard all the females seem to be held to and doesn't wear a bikini in the summer DLC and isn't used for annoying fanservice. I even think it'd be cool if for once, the lead was okay with fighting, and maybe had more of an issue when not fighting, like a war hero that doesn't know how to readjust to a normal life, or has never been good at anything but combat.

I think he means they wouldn't actually have a developed character as in a good personality and backstory, just more 'developed' cleavage. Ugh.

I guess as long as the game doesn't shove the new female Lord's assets in my face like Camilla's, I wouldn't really care a whole lot.

That being said, I actually came up with my own Lord OC who's basically the Lord I fantasize about IS making.  A sort of rural/bandit Lord who fights with axes, but has super high Skill and Speed to compensate for her inaccurate weapon of choice.  This way we can have a Lord who can wield a non-Sword weapon and still reliably hit things.  It also helps if the early levels are full of the weak Lance-wielding Soldiers we all know and love.

[Florina's #1 Fan]

18 minutes ago, Ether said:

Still better than Beefy McManGuy #942 tbh.

Here's another unpopular opinion then, I suppose. Sexuality and fanservice isn't inherently bad character design, and Camilla's only real problems are that she's meant to be your sister figure and that the game's cameraman likes her more than most people. You can talk about impractical armour and riding clothes and all that, but it's been a series staple since forever and focusing in on Camilla for it is silly at best. Caeda rode a pegasus in a miniskirt in FE1 ffs, Camilla is not the root of all evil.

I like Camilla, but her design should be based not on fanservice, but the best outfit for the character. I worry sometimes that when IS designs characters, they think how best to hang the characters assets out before thinking about practicality and how it looks aesthetically (because really, Camilla's outfit isn't even that good looking, it kind of looks like it would be really uncomfortable). It isn't inherently bad design, but it is normally not good.

[Ether]

9 minutes ago, SoulWeaver said:

 

I believe they're not that dumb, but…you can never be too careful with game devs. Frankly, if they did that, I'd probably just do what I assume like 75% of us did with Awakening - bench the main Lord as soon as possible and use the Units we like.

Now that I think about it, they have kept their female Lords rather on the flat side since the beginning of time, though in some cases like Lyn it makes sense. Wonder if it's just Japan being Japan or if there's some other reason behind it.

Wait, so vegetarianism is that kind of thing? That quote is my favorite part of Walhart, though I also did like his willingness to admit he may have been wrong in the Supports.

Depends on the Beefy McManGuy - I'd play a game with a Gregor- or Henry-style male Lord for the change of pace. It mostly just bugged me that all the male Lords are pretty much cookie-cutter. Chrom is the closest I've seen to a break off the archetype, and that's literally only because he's the most likely to break things in the army - most Lord characters aren't like that.

I would say my main problem with Camilla wasn't the outfit - though I didn't appreciate her complete lack of pants/skirts - it was that they had so much potential to actually EXPLAIN why she was the way she was and they dropped the ball big time.

My issue with her outfit - and the outfits of several other characters, lest you think this exclusively a Camilla-bash - stems from the fact that I have several young(we're talking 14 at the oldest) cousins who like to watch me play games, and I don't particularly want to have to explain to their parents why I'm playing a game with a character dressed like that around the 8- and 9-year-olds. It's also very frustrating to say in other areas of the internet that I like her and then have to clarify because everyone starts jumping on me about how they didn't know I liek da gams fo da hoes.

I've gotten sick of them all to be honest, they'd be a change of pace, but I want the opportunity for someone like Micaiah or Celica to actually get to have their own story without being railroaded or overtaken half way through. A different kind of male lord would be a step in the right direction, but at this point I want a solo female lord on principle.

As for Camilla's lack of explanation, it's unfortunate to be certain, but I think it's a matter of perspective. We look at Camilla in an odd light because she's your sister, why is she dressed like that, etc, but to Camilla, she's just... Camilla. She isn't defined in universe by being Corrin's sister, that's just the lens we view her through. I'm sure she has her reasons, even if it's just being comfortable with her sexuality, which is perfectly fine even if most people cringe at the idea.

I can understand the trepidation over the young kids watching, but the game isn't intended for young children... the ESRB rating exists for a reason afterall. Teens these days are exposed to far worse in media anyway, so the T rating makes sense. I get wanting to be able to play with your cousins, but decrying a game for not conforming to an E rating that it doesn't have seems misguided, at least to me. Sadly, the internet is just bad that way. You can't like anything without having some sinister reason or another. People bash Lucina fans in similar ways and she's got little to no fanservice in her design. You can't win some fights.

 

[Florina's #1 Fan]

22 minutes ago, Ether said:

I can understand the trepidation over the young kids watching, but the game isn't intended for young children... the ESRB rating exists for a reason afterall. Teens these days are exposed to far worse in media anyway, so the T rating makes sense. I get wanting to be able to play with your cousins, but decrying a game for not conforming to an E rating that it doesn't have seems misguided, at least to me.

There's a difference between a rational use of revealing clothing and just doing it and making no sense of why. For example, Olivia most likely has the revealing clothing she does because she gets more attention that way as a dancer, which means she gets more money (I think she gets paid?), and it's most likely traditional dancer garb in Regna Ferox. Camilla, on the other hand, there's just no reason she states, it's just a casual thing, which is totally silly. You'd think her brothers would at least be a little disturbed by their sisters' breasts hanging out in front of them, but no, it's just a normal clothing choice. Right.

And "teens deal with worse stuff" is not justification to be unnecessary in your use of things that would raise your ESRB rating. By that logic, games will just keep getting worse, because "teens have seen that stuff, right, so who cares if they see it a little worse?"

It's just like cursing in TV shows. I don't mind it, but I hate it when they overuse it to appear cool or edgy when really it's just jarring and not needed. Cursing is good for dramatic effect when it isn't used often, because you don't expect it and it sets a sort of drastic-ness to the situation.

[Magical Glace]

My main problem with Camilla's design is the armor just looking silly.    Put her in clothing that doesn't look silly, and she looks rather nice (images are from the fan translation of Crown of Nibelung).

Regarding her character my main problem with it is she's just CORRIN CORRIN CORRIN all the time, and I really wish the game devoted more time to the concubine infighting thing that genuinely had a lot of potential for developing not just her, but Leo and Xander as well (not so much Elise as she was born around the time the fighting stopped iirc).  Tone down the Corrin worship and expand more on her past, and she could be pretty cool.

I do like her a bit more in CoN, though.

[Ether]

Just now, Florina's #1 Fan said:

There's a difference between a rational use of revealing clothing and just doing it and making no sense of why. For example, Olivia most likely has the revealing clothing she does because she gets more attention that way as a dancer, which means she gets more money (I think she gets paid?), and it's most likely traditional dancer garb in Regna Ferox. Camilla, on the other hand, there's just no reason she states, it's just a casual thing, which is totally silly. You'd think her brothers would at least be a little disturbed by their sisters' breasts hanging out in front of them, but no, it's just a normal clothing choice. Right.

And "teens deal with worse stuff" is not justification to be unnecessary in your use of things that would raise your ESRB rating. By that logic, games will just keep getting worse, because "teens have seen that stuff, right, so who cares if they see it a little worse?"

It's just like cursing in TV shows. I don't mind it, but I hate it when they overuse it to appear cool or edgy when really it's just jarring and not needed. Cursing is good for dramatic effect when it isn't used often, because you don't expect it and it sets a sort of drastic-ness to the situation.

She doesn't really need a reason to dress the way she does, she does it because she wants to, and how her brothers feel about it isn't really relevant. It'd be nice for us to know why she does, obviously, but we don't. It sucks, but it doesn't make her any lesser as a character, it just doesn't make her a better one for having an interesting reason. When Camilla isn't dealing with Corrin or her other siblings, she's known to be ruthless and aggressive, exuding confidence in her abilities. It doesn't seem that out of place for her to portray that confidence in her attire. She feels like the type that would just... dress that way because she knows she can pull it off, and who is gonna stop her?

As for the teens stuff, it wasn't to justify anything, I only brought it up because expecting Fates to be palatable for young children isn't really reasonable. The game isn't marketed to, or designed for young kids, and expecting it to be something it isn't just doesn't make for a fair comparison point. It sucks that you can't play it with the young ones if that's something you like to do, but being rated above E isn't something that makes a game worse. Imagine if someone got angry when the next smash game comes around, because Superman isn't in it? It'd seem like a silly complaint, why would you expect Superman to be in Smash? 

[Armagon]

2 hours ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Archers are now even more overpowered as they now have good skill growth.

Are they really? Because of the three Archers i use, Kliff is the best one, Leon is decent, and Python sucks?

27 minutes ago, Ether said:

Sexuality and fanservice isn't inherently bad character design, and Camilla's only real problems are that she's meant to be your sister figure and that the game's cameraman likes her more than most people. You can talk about impractical armour and riding clothes and all that, but it's been a series staple since forever and focusing in on Camilla for it is silly at best. Caeda rode a pegasus in a miniskirt in FE1 ffs, Camilla is not the root of all evil.

Agreed. Fanservice has existed since the start of the series. Neither Awakening nor Fates started it. Look at Caeda in FE1/3 (and the Whitewings in general). FE4 and 5 had the Dancers. Yes, they are Dancers, but it doesn't change the fact that they are practically in their underwear. The Pegasus Knights in the GBA games also wear miniskirts. Then there's Sonia. 

And we can't forget pantless Marth.

[Acacia Sgt]

I'd say, since it's likely to be an unpopular opinion, I'm not bothered with all that.

I know some people don't accept it even if it's a work of fiction, but for my part, being a work of fiction means I don't care as much as it would be in real life.

[Florina's #1 Fan]

1 minute ago, Ether said:

She doesn't really need a reason to dress the way she does, she does it because she wants to, and how her brothers feel about it isn't really relevant. It'd be nice for us to know why she does, obviously, but we don't. It sucks, but it doesn't make her any lesser as a character, it just doesn't make her a better one for having an interesting reason. When Camilla isn't dealing with Corrin or her other siblings, she's known to be ruthless and aggressive, exuding confidence in her abilities. It doesn't seem that out of place for her to portray that confidence in her attire. She feels like the type that would just... dress that way because she knows she can pull it off, and who is gonna stop her?

It doesn't make sense that she just wants to dress uncomfortably. I want them to explain why she dresses like that if they want people to take her seriously and not bash her for being fanservice. For example, if Camilla said in a support that she was insecure about how men would react to her doting personality and to counter that, she wears something so revealing that the men don't think about her as a person, that would make more sense than no one at all wondering why a royal princess would have her boobs hanging out in a game known for being in a sort of medieval period, where that would be unacceptable. Even if they just explained it in one single support, that's better than no explanation at all. She seems like the type to do it, but there are plenty of characters that seem like the type to get flustered by that sort of clothing choice (like maybe Sakura) or are totally into it (Niles doesn't even mention her clothing choice in their supports, which is super weird for him).

5 minutes ago, Ether said:

As for the teens stuff, it wasn't to justify anything, I only brought it up because expecting Fates to be palatable for young children isn't really reasonable. The game isn't marketed to, or designed for young kids, and expecting it to be something it isn't just doesn't make for a fair comparison point. It sucks that you can't play it with the young ones if that's something you like to do, but being rated above E isn't something that makes a game worse. Imagine if someone got angry when the next smash game comes around, because Superman isn't in it? It'd seem like a silly complaint, why would you expect Superman to be in Smash? 

I understand what you mean here. I don't get your superman analogy, but I do understand the game isn't targeted at children. I also understand not wanting people to see you playing the cutscene where Camilla is walking at you with her boobs jiggling at the camera. It makes me uncomfortable when anyone, not just kids, sees me playing a game with that sort of level of fanservice, y'know?  I can tolerate it myself, it doesn't at all get in the way of me playing the game unless there's no substance to the game itself, heck, I play Skullgirls, that game is all sorts of cleavage-filled, but I don't like to play it when there are people I don't know very well that see me playing something like that, it's embarrassing :\ 

[Emperor Hardin]

23 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Are they really? Because of the three Archers i use, Kliff is the best one, Leon is decent, and Python sucks?

Agreed. Fanservice has existed since the start of the series. Neither Awakening nor Fates started it. Look at Caeda in FE1/3 (and the Whitewings in general). FE4 and 5 had the Dancers. Yes, they are Dancers, but it doesn't change the fact that they are practically in their underwear. The Pegasus Knights in the GBA games also wear miniskirts. Then there's Sonia. 

And we can't forget pantless Marth.

Archers have a 20% skill class growth, Python's skill is great, and Leon's skill is absurd.

In the original, all had bad skill growth.

 

Edited September 19, 2017 by Emperor Hardin

[Interdimensional Observer]

10 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Then there's Sonia.

She's evil and exists to seduce Brendan, her appearance has a reason. If Limstella had the same outfit, then then I would complain since she has no good reason to be sexualized and Ephidel would then need a giant codpiece.

As long as there is good justification for a character's sexualization, I'm fine. But if there is a preponderance of evidence to suggest fanservicey reasons for it (such as boob and panty shots), or they have no justification at all, then I criticize it.

So I criticize Ophelia's outfit, but not Charlotte's. The former is an innocent girl, the latter tries to seduce for personal gain all the time. I don't criticize Nailah because she is a strong independent character for one. And two, Volug, a male, is similarly scantily clad, so it must be a Hatari thing, which is further justified and given they're both Laguz who live in what is probably something desert or desert-like, the attire is fine.

This said, it is just dawning on me that I'm a hypocrite- in the past I've criticized Camilla, but not Hyrule Warriors's Cia, thinking the latter had justification and the former didn't, but their situations aren't that different. Is it fair to distinguish between the two?

[Emperor Hardin]

5 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

She's evil and exists to seduce Brendan, her appearance has a reason. If Limstella had the same outfit, then then I would complain since she has no good reason to be sexualized and Ephidel would then need a giant codpiece.

As long as there is good justification for a character's sexualization, I'm fine. But if there is a preponderance of evidence to suggest fanservicey reasons for it (such as boob and panty shots), or they have no justification at all, then I criticize it.

So I criticize Ophelia's outfit, but not Charlotte's. The former is an innocent girl, the latter tries to seduce for personal gain all the time. I don't criticize Nailah because she is a strong independent character for one. And two, Volug, a male, is similarly scantily clad, so it must be a Hatari thing, which is further justified and given they're both Laguz who live in what is probably something desert or desert-like, the attire is fine.

This said, it is just dawning on me that I'm a hypocrite- in the past I've criticized Camilla, but not Hyrule Warriors's Cia, thinking the latter had justification and the former didn't, but their situations aren't that different. Is it fair to distinguish between the two?

Tharja is weird because one of the DLC conversations says Tharja doesn't know her outfit is sexualized, which raises questions.

[Slumber]

34 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Agreed. Fanservice has existed since the start of the series. Neither Awakening nor Fates started it. Look at Caeda in FE1/3 (and the Whitewings in general). FE4 and 5 had the Dancers. Yes, they are Dancers, but it doesn't change the fact that they are practically in their underwear. The Pegasus Knights in the GBA games also wear miniskirts. Then there's Sonia. 

And we can't forget pantless Marth.

Caeda, the peggies and the Dancers are not comparable to Camilla, Tharja, or Charlotte. Or anything of that ilk.

Yes, Caeda and the Dancers ARE fanservice. But while the peggies inexplicably wear miniskirts, they're pretty tame. Caeda wears a full leather breastplate and high boots that are nearly pants. Similar deal with other peggies who wear armor plates and skirts. Dancers, meanwhile, at least have a contextual reason to wear skimpy clothes(Which is still far from underwear. They all wear skirts and wrapped tops. Hell, Lara doesn't even wear dancer garb in her game because she's a thief, meaning her default outfit that you see in the game is a shirt and a skirt). Free movement is also why Lewyn and Homer(And for Homer, barely a shirt at all) wear loose clothing, as they're also performers.

While Tharja and Charlotte ARE in their underwear. And Tharja's outfit makes negative sense, since she lives in a dry, arid environment, where skimpy clothes are actually more dangerous than helpful. The "well it's hot, wear less" argument doesn't make sense. The only time where less clothes are justified are in humid environments, which it definitely not Plegia. Charlotte's outfit only makes sense because she's specifically written to be fanservice, so there is some reason there, but it's still more extreme than the pre-Awakening games.

Camilla's outfit is just straight up dumb. Not only does form-fitting metal hurt women in the chest area more than help them, she specifically has a leather strap RIGHT between her boobs for the sole purpose of drawing your eyes in.

There's no excuse for Marth though. Put some damn pants on, you weirdo.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Slumber

[Ether]

10 minutes ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

It doesn't make sense that she just wants to dress uncomfortably. I want them to explain why she dresses like that if they want people to take her seriously and not bash her for being fanservice. For example, if Camilla said in a support that she was insecure about how men would react to her doting personality and to counter that, she wears something so revealing that the men don't think about her as a person, that would make more sense than no one at all wondering why a royal princess would have her boobs hanging out in a game known for being in a sort of medieval period, where that would be unacceptable. Even if they just explained it in one single support, that's better than no explanation at all. She seems like the type to do it, but there are plenty of characters that seem like the type to get flustered by that sort of clothing choice (like maybe Sakura) or are totally into it (Niles doesn't even mention her clothing choice in their supports, which is super weird for him).

I understand what you mean here. I don't get your superman analogy, but I do understand the game isn't targeted at children. I also understand not wanting people to see you playing the cutscene where Camilla is walking at you with her boobs jiggling at the camera. It makes me uncomfortable when anyone, not just kids, sees me playing a game with that sort of level of fanservice, y'know?  I can tolerate it myself, it doesn't at all get in the way of me playing the game unless there's no substance to the game itself, heck, I play Skullgirls, that game is all sorts of cleavage-filled, but I don't like to play it when there are people I don't know very well that see me playing something like that, it's embarrassing :\ 

I agree it was a missed opportunity, and we can only hope that some supplemental material like the Fates manga in progress go further into it. As it stands, I can see it as something that Camilla would do, it doesn't feel out of character for her to dress as she does, so it doesn't especially bother me. We see enough stuff in Fates to differentiate it from medieval times proper that I don't see it as especially world breaking, Garon clearly doesn't care, and any noble who complained to him for something so pointless in his eyes would likely just be executed and made an example of. Garon aside, who is going to oppose Camilla? Xander seems like the best bet, but he likely respects Camilla's autonomy enough to leave her be, or has tried and since grown tired of trying. We see other characters dress in similarly "unacceptable" ways within Nohr, such as Charlotte dressing as she does despite being on duty as a border guard, or Soleil's open courtship of other women. All we can gleam from this is that Nohr operates on a differing moral compass from our own, or from medieval times.

The Superman analogy was mostly meant to differentiate from "something the game dev promised" vs "something I promised myself because I wanted it", wanting Superman in Smash is fine, getting up in arms because he isn't in Smash is silly. Might not have been the best example but it was what I had at the time. Still, the good thing about portable systems is that they can be played anywhere, taken away from screens and all of that. If you don't want people to see you playing Fates, it's easy to control who can see your 3DS most of the time, since it's small and portable.

[Florina's #1 Fan]

1 minute ago, Slumber said:

While Tharja and Charlotte ARE in their underwear. And Tharja's outfit makes negative sense, since she lives in a dry, arid environment, where skimpy clothes are actually more dangerous than helpful. The "well it's hot, wear less" argument doesn't make sense. The only time where less clothes are justified are in humid environments, which it definitely not Plegia. Charlotte's outfit only makes sense because she's specifically written to be fanservice.

Charlotte I don't mind because she explains she has to get herself a rich man in her supports, her family is poor, but they have always loved and supported her, so she sends some of her pay to them. By marrying someone rich, she can send more money to her family, and the quickest way to get a man's attention is... well... yeah.

[Armagon]

20 minutes ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

It doesn't make sense that she just wants to dress uncomfortably.

It looks uncomfortable, but that's from our point of view. Tbh, a lot of clothing in FE look uncomfortable, but from the character's point of view, it isn't.

20 minutes ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

I want them to explain why she dresses like that if they want people to take her seriously and not bash her for being fanservice

Unfortunately, we live in an age where anything that's considered "fanservice" is a sin apparently. Even if the game explains why a character dressed that way, it'll still be bashed on for being "unnecessary fanservice". 

13 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Archers have a skill class growth, Python is great, Leon is Great.

Is Python that great though? He always fell behind for me. Leon's decent because he has no competition on Celica's route, unless you make Atlas an Archer.

8 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

As long as there is good justification for a character's sexualization, I'm fine. But if there is a preponderance of evidence to suggest fanservicey reasons for it (such as boob and panty shots), or they have no justification at all, then I criticize it.

I understand this and i'm the same way too, except i'm like, much less critical about things. Fanservice has to be super out of place for me to criticize it.

 

[Slumber]

Just now, Florina's #1 Fan said:

Charlotte I don't mind because she explains she has to get herself a rich man in her supports, her family is poor, but they have always loved and supported her, so she sends some of her pay to them. By marrying someone rich, she can send more money to her family, and the quickest way to get a man's attention is... well... yeah.

Oh, yeah. I added in that they at least wrote a reason for it, but Charlotte's still more extreme than previous FEs when it comes to skimpy-ness.

It wasn't meant to be a knock against Charlotte(Of the 3 people I brought up, she's probably my favorite by a country mile). Just commenting on the design sensibilities.

[Emperor Hardin]

Just now, Armagon said:

Is Python that great though? He always fell behind for me. Leon's decent because he has no competition on Celica's route, unless you make Atlas an Archer

Python has 45 skill growth and 50 speed growth combined with 40 strength growth, he's good.

Speaking of villagers, there's no reason to make any villager a Soldier, ever!

[Slumber]

Just now, Emperor Hardin said:

Python has 45 skill growth and 50 speed growth combined with 40 strength growth, he's good.

Speaking of villagers, there's no reason to make any villager a Soldier, ever!

Python's biggest boon isn't even his stats, it's BECAUSE he's an Archer that he's a solid unit. Being able to cover nearly half the map on even the biggest maps is pretty damn good utility in the late game. His solid stats are somewhat hindered by the poor promotion gains that Archer classes get.

And yeah, Soldier's pretty worthless on units who aren't forced to be Soldiers.

[Florina's #1 Fan]

2 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Python has 45 skill growth and 50 speed growth combined with 40 strength growth, he's good.

Speaking of villagers, there's no reason to make any villager a Soldier, ever!

Python has a 25% skill growth in SoV and a speed growth of 55%.

[Interdimensional Observer]

7 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Tharja is weird because one of the DLC conversations says Tharja doesn't know her outfit is sexualized, which raises questions.

What!?!

This might be IS pointing out that in different cultures, what is considered sexualized is different. Boobs might be okay to show in one culture and they aren't sexualized, but shoulders are sexualized. Plegian/Grimlealan civilization is one such culture. Or, maybe its like how Beach Volleyball players say their bikinis are just work clothes to them and that a one piece would have sand stuck in places. For Tharja, it's what just works for being a hexer. Or, maybe its a sign of Tharja's (unexplored?) upbringing being quite terrible.

But then again, I seriously doubt any of these are the answer.

 

6 minutes ago, Armagon said:

I understand this and i'm the same way too, except i'm like, much less critical about things. Fanservice has to be super out of place for me to criticize it.

Yeah, in desert conditions you want to wear thick clothes for water retention, avoiding sunburns, and to keep the wind from blasting you with sand every time it picks up. No wonder Tharja is angry all the time- her skin must be in complete agony.

Also, on your point with the dancers- Kaga has his weird thing with female slavery, but I think at the end of the day he's condemning it (?).

 

7 minutes ago, Armagon said:

I understand this and i'm the same way too, except i'm like, much less critical about things. Fanservice has to be super out of place for me to criticize it.

I'm less critical then I let on. Pegasus Knights in skirts and Zelda showing a bit of top boob in her Warriors outfit I give a quick sigh to but move on and accept.

Rikku's outfit in FFX-2, now that I will tear apart (she also looks uglier compared to her FFX self too), though I exercise some restraint knowing that game was always intended to be so lighthearted. Yuna's new outfit I'm mixed on- fix the innerboob showing, and I think it works well.

 

Interesting this topic seems to have been a little derailed by Camilla. She breaks topics the same way she smashes the CQ early-midgame.

[Emperor Hardin]

1 hour ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Also, on your point with the dancers- Kaga has his weird thing with female slavery, but I think at the end of the day he's condemning it (?).

In many Fire Emblem games, bandits mention selling females. Like every female lord in my memory but Eirika gets a boss line like that.

1 hour ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

What!?!

This might be IS pointing out that in different cultures, what is considered sexualized is different. Boobs might be okay to show in one culture and they aren't sexualized, but shoulders are sexualized. Plegian/Grimlealan civilization is one such culture. Or, maybe its like how Beach Volleyball players say their bikinis are just work clothes to them and that a one piece would have sand stuck in places. For Tharja, it's what just works for being a hexer. Or, maybe its a sign of Tharja's (unexplored?) upbringing being quite terrible.

But then again, I seriously doubt any of these are the answer.

I'll find the quote basically.

Here we go.

1 hour ago, Slumber said:

And yeah, Soldier's pretty worthless on units who aren't forced to be Soldiers.

They are actually worse in SOV!

1 hour ago, Florina's #1 Fan said:

Python has a 25% skill growth in SoV and a speed growth of 55%.

I was adding adding archer class growth.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Emperor Hardin

[Mackc2]

 

55 minutes ago, Ether said:

Garon aside, who is going to oppose Camilla?

 The sword that's now resting nicely resting in her cleavage because she decided to protect everything but her vitals for some reason that could not have been worth her life.

As for my unpopular opinion I think fates weapon system is far better than that of other games.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Mackc2