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What is your unpopular Fire Emblem opinion?


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  • People tend to overemphasize the "sympathetic" part and ignore the "villain" part for most antagonists in the series.
  • A remake of FE4/5 will only highlight the flaws in the game.
  • Despite Echoes presentation, it was a mediocre game.
  • People are too overly sensitive towards sexy females in the series.
  •  Fire Emblem Switch should be more like Awakening.
  • The magic triangle was always too much of a niche to use.
  • Lewyn/ Forseti is one of the worst written characters in the series.
  • Genealogy had some interesting story ideas, but it was poorly handled.
  • 3ds characters have better characterization than the games before.
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13 hours ago, Jingle Jangle said:
  • People tend to overemphasize the "sympathetic" part and ignore the "villain" part for most antagonists in the series.
  • People are too overly sensitive towards sexy females in the series.
  • 3ds characters have better characterization than the games before.

Definitely agree with all of these.

Also, a few more from me:

  • Birthright is best Fates path, both in gameplay and story
  • I think the reason Corrin gets so much is because they are a self-insert / Avatar character. Had they been their own character, but still with that personality, less people would hate them as they do.
  • Characters being popular because of terrible internet memes is just sad
  • I want another non-noble Fire Emblem lord
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3 minutes ago, Von Ithipathachai said:

That's not very difficult when your other counterparts' stories are so thoroughly problematic.

I kinda have the opposite opinion. Conquest may be very problematic but that's because it actually tries to do things and has things happen. It doesn't work but at least a story can be said to be there.

Birthright ''works'' but only because there's nothing there that could possibly go wrong to begin with. Its just going from point A to point B with barely anything of note happening before you reach Garon's castle. 

As such I feel the problematic story is much better then the one that barely exists. 

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-- I think Robin is an extremely well-written character, if you don't consider him to be an avatar. Probably one of the best in the franchise.

- I can't remember if I've said this before, knowing me I probably have, but...I would love to return back to Archanea in Marth's time. Yes, this is my Archanea bias speaking right now, but I just want one final Marth game which truly wraps everything up, kills off important characters, and is overall darker. Archanea is a bloody continent, even in the future, and I want to see this explored more.

- I don't think Chrom, Lucina, Lissa and Emmeryn are direct descendants from Marth. Instead, I think they descended from Marth's sister, Elice. I'm not saying it's fact, but it wouldn't be the first time this has happened - Marth is said to be the direct descendant from Anri, but is actually descended from Anri's brother.

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3 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I kinda have the opposite opinion. Conquest may be very problematic but that's because it actually tries to do things and has things happen. It doesn't work but at least a story can be said to be there.

Birthright ''works'' but only because there's nothing there that could possibly go wrong to begin with. Its just going from point A to point B with barely anything of note happening before you reach Garon's castle. 

As such I feel the problematic story is much better then the one that barely exists. 

I have a tendency to give Conquest more slack for at least being interesting in what it tried to do.

Birthright doing the standard FE thing(Post-path split) and still having really bad writing won't get nearly as much leeway as the one that tried something different and still had really bad writing. That said, my tune will change if IS ever tries the "Yeah, you play as the bad guys and the dialogue/plot is really edgy in the most shallow way" route ever again. I don't think that Conquest being more interesting than its more standard counterparts means that it's the model FE's story should ever go ever again. I feel like this should go without saying, but the bogus "Vampire Emblem" leaks that took over the community months ago had me realizing how bad of a direction this would be for the series.

But yeah. Somebody who fails in a unique way will always get a bit more credit from me than somebody who tries to follow the crowd and fails just as bad.

Edited by Slumber
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1 hour ago, Lau said:

- I don't think Chrom, Lucina, Lissa and Emmeryn are direct descendants from Marth. Instead, I think they descended from Marth's sister, Elice. I'm not saying it's fact, but it wouldn't be the first time this has happened - Marth is said to be the direct descendant from Anri, but is actually descended from Anri's brother.

I really like that headcanon! I think I believe it too.

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2 hours ago, Lau said:

I don't think Chrom, Lucina, Lissa and Emmeryn are direct descendants from Marth. Instead, I think they descended from Marth's sister, Elice. I'm not saying it's fact, but it wouldn't be the first time this has happened - Marth is said to be the direct descendant from Anri, but is actually descended from Anri's brother.

If this were true, and I wouldn't mind it, then where is my Exalted Excalibur swingin' Lucina and Aum-mighty Chrom? Descent from Merric and Elice can only help their reputation in my case.

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Let's see what I can bring to the table:

  • S-Supports shouldn't have conversations (similar to the A+ Supports for indication). Contentwise most of them are pretty bad (GBA and SoV are prime examples that romances can be established without them)
  • Lucina (honorable mention: Yarne) is one of the least interesting child untis awakening has to offer, while Brady is shining the most
  • Nils > Ninian
  • I love FE4's oversized maps
  • I enjoy using Wolt in FE6 and Wil in FE7
  • Python is not that bad gameplaywise as people tend to make him look like

 

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1 hour ago, fOrEiGn sOUl said:

S-Supports shouldn't have conversations (similar to the A+ Supports for indication). Contentwise most of them are pretty bad (GBA and SoV are prime examples that romances can be established without them)

It didn't always work out. HectorxFlorina is pretty bad I'd say for a support, two rounds of "Eek! Men scare me! *Runs away*" from Florina, followed by a conversation that somehow has Hector subtly falling in love with her? That is bad writing. I feel they could have cut to the chase a little faster with RebeccaxWil, have them discuss their childhood together a little more a little sooner. But that is a bit more nitpicky.

EliwoodxLyn, Kentxany of his trio of choices, these are couple cases where I feel the romance was much better handled. You don't need an outright confession all the time, leave the proposal to the imagination and establish enough intimacy and chemistry between the two individuals that the leap to marriage is reasonable.

 

1 hour ago, fOrEiGn sOUl said:

Nils > Ninian

Agreeing here in full.

Ninian is too secretive, too mysterious, too fragile, just too cliched. Mystery Amnesiac Special Powers Girl that speaks with..... too.... many... ellipses.. just isn't very appealing. And while being dragon is certainly reason for secretiveness, they're only half dragon and I find Ninian's mysteriousness thinner for it. I honor her "sacrifice" by giving herself to Nergal at that one point, but that is about it. Her behavior is justified by “…Ninian’s power is greater than mine (Nils), but it costs her physical and emotional strength" but I don't really like this excuse, it's a little thin and only emphasizes the "special powers" part in her cliched nature. It does make her align well with Sophia who has the same traits, but was Sophia even really good, or even if she was, worth repeating in the next game?

Nils has the same powers and hidden truth behind him, but he is so much more open than Ninian is and seems like a normal person with his somewhat cheery personality. He never says "Oh we're different, so why do you treat us so nicely?" like Ninian does all the time (having Supports hurt her since they're repetitive), whilst still getting the point across he and Ninian are different from everyone else. Maybe because he's shota that he is this way, but he is the pillar that has to keep the baggage of his sister afloat. Not that I mind the little sibling keeping the stronger alive, but it's still annoying Nils is a bit burdened with her. While she gets lost in herself despairing after separating from Nils, he manages to hide out in ruins perfectly sane and then rescues the damsel. Nils does collapse once, but in comparison that is nothing.

 

Design-wise, Nils also looks better to me, at least in their original FE7 artwork. Ninian is too washed out samey blue, whereas Nils has actual contrast. The scarf does more for him than the shroud does for Ninian. Ninian's accessories are neat though.

Spoiler

ninian.png

nils.png

 

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23 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

It didn't always work out. HectorxFlorina is pretty bad I'd say for a support, two rounds of "Eek! Men scare me! *Runs away*" from Florina, followed by a conversation that somehow has Hector subtly falling in love with her? That is bad writing. I feel they could have cut to the chase a little faster with RebeccaxWil, have them discuss their childhood together a little more a little sooner. But that is a bit more nitpicky.

I admit, especially this support is proof not to generalize my statement. Funnily enough I think the HectorxFlorina support has an awkward charme to it, but I definetly can see your point of view here.

33 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

EliwoodxLyn, Kentxany of his trio of choices, these are couple cases where I feel the romance was much better handled. You don't need an outright confession all the time, leave the proposal to the imagination and establish enough intimacy and chemistry between the two individuals that the leap to marriage is reasonable.

True words.

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1 hour ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Not that I mind the little sibling keeping the stronger alive, but it's still annoying Nils is a bit burdened with her. While she gets lost in herself despairing after separating from Nils, he manages to hide out in ruins perfectly sane and then rescues the damsel. Nils does collapse once, but in comparison that is nothing.

Nils also gets captured by Vaida at one point I believe. But otherwise I agree. Nils is generally the more pleasant and competent character compared to his sister who's kind of a downer all the time. 

I also liked how he had a bit of an arc with Hector. Especially in Hector's story Nils really doesn't like Hector at the start but the piggy back ride and Nils later mentioning Hector to his sister implies they grow much closer throughout the story. Hector being good with kids is a nice little moment of depth on his part. 

Edited by Etrurian emperor
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3 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Nils also gets captured by Vaida at one point I believe. But otherwise I agree. Nils is generally the more pleasant and competent character compared to his sister who's kind of a downer all the time. 

I also liked how he had a bit of an arc with Hector. Especially in Hector's story Nils really doesn't like Hector at the start but the piggy back ride and Nils later mentioning Hector to his sister implies they grow much closer throughout the story. Hector being good with kids is a nice little moment of depth on his part. 

You're right about the Vaida moment in Unfulfilled Heart, a two second capture simply because he apparently couldn't sense her. All it takes is a shout from Lyn to set Nils free, despite Vaida having the power to one round everyone in the LEH crew here.

The blessing Nergal bestows on Vaida for this chapter and embodied in the stat bonuses embodied by the "Uber Spear" are why I say that. I'd critique the blessing as a deus ex machina and the magic barrier he grants Jerme/Kenneth to keep the heroes from fleeing during Pale Flower of Darkness. Yet I get the point these things are supposed to indicate Nergal is regaining strength after the failed gate opening and Elbert stab crippled him. Yet knowing all it takes later to drop him from sufficient quintessence to not enough is a Forblaze chip from Athos, this seems an inefficient use of limited resources that he should have invested all in sooner. But I'm used to Nergal as illogical by virtue of being the shell of a human being driven mad by darkness. He and Gharnef can be illogical (although Gharnef is very logically devious in FE1), Manfroy, Validar, Iago, Jedah and Riev aren't known to have been driven insane in the same way, so it is less justifiable for them to be illogical.

 

Back to Nils, I flipped through the dialogue of a bunch of chapters looking for what you meant about him and Hector. I believe I found them all:

Spoiler

New Resolve:

Nils:
“So much has happened since we left you and Caelin.”

Hector:
“Hey, care to talk about things the rest of us can follow?”

Nils:
“Hmph. Who’s he?”

Lyn:
“This is Hector. He’s Marquess Ostia’s brother. Don’t let his attitude fool you. He acts mean, but he’s decent enough.”

 

Living Legends:

Nils:
“…So hot. I’m…going to die.”

Hector:
“Hey, do you want me to carry you on my back?”

Nils:
“Huh?”

Hector:
“Why are you looking at me like that?”

Nils:
“Such kindness from you surprised me, Lord Hector. Is this some fever dream?”

Hector:
“What’s that supposed to mean? I was concerned that you might collapse again, like the other day.”

Lyn:
“You’re usually so brusque. It’s no wonder he’s confused. Don’t be shy, Nils. Let him help you out.”

Nils:
“…But…”

Hector:
“Do as you’re told, boy!”

Nils:
“Waaa!!”

(Hector picks Nils up)

Nils:
“Waaaaaaa!!! I’m going to fall! I’m going to fall!!!”

 

Unfufilled Heart:

Nils:
“Um, Ninian? Lord Hector’s a strange guy, isn’t he?”

Ninian:
“Nils, that’s impolite, saying he’s strange.”

Nils:
“But it’s true. He is strange. He doesn’t put on airs like other nobles. He even lets me ride on his shoulders. He’s pushy and rough, but nice, too… I really like him.”

Ninian:
“Nils…”

Nils:
“What if the people from long ago were like him? I just wish everyone could’ve gotten along better, you know?”

It isn't a lot, but the Living Legends piggyback is unforgettable since it starts at the center of a CG (which had a much better colored version over that sepia filth that made it into the game, and with Ninian and Eliwood in it too):

Spoiler

Desertfun

Note to self, when Nils finally gets added to FEH, somebody just has to ask for the above CG in sprite form. It is too good to pass up.

And you also have me realizing, Nils is more social with all three lords. Nils has his Lyn Mode time with Lyn, and has a nice bit with Hector as you point out. And like Ninian he spent much time with Eliwood's father, was told about Eliwood a good deal from Elbert and thus already likes him besides Eliwood rescuing Ninian in Lyn Mode, and later shares with Eliwood in lament over Ninian's death, and is possibly even willing to let Eliwood take his sister away.

Ninian might have a little with Lyn because of Lyn Mode (less than Nils I would say), and some bond over both being female surrounded otherwise by men. But Ninian has absolutely nothing with Hector. Ninian is notably more Eliwood's girl, and most of her interactions expressly center around him. Ninian is no stalker at all, she has reasons for loving Eliwood so, and I think its owing to what she is versus what Nils is that decreases her sociability. Ninian is a young woman, she has to fall in love, Nils is a boy, he is under no obligation (thank Elimine) to fall in love with Lyn or Hector and thus can have his screentime not half focused on feelings of love.

Ninian does have her Supports with Florina and Hawkeye. The Florina is fairly good, if in this weird place where A ranking denies an A Eliwood- that ending affecting Support. The Hawkeye though is plagued by Ninian being unable to speak her secret, which hurts the Eliwood and Florina to lesser degrees. Overall, I'd say Ninian's supports do not enough to overcome her Eliwood-centricism.

 

Lastly, back to Hector, his B Support with Eliwood, the dream of their future kids, has him envisioning little Lilina on his shoulders, and then ends with Hector being very protective of this hypothetical dream daughter. So I think Blazing firmly establishes Hector in the future relishes in being a dad.

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-I didn't use Niles in Fates because I wanted to use Anna.
-I like Wil better than the other archers in the series. Even statistically better ones like Shinon and Takumi.
Also, not sure if unpopular, but I wanted to kill Peri when I read her supports with Felicia.

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On 4.2.2018 at 2:23 PM, Etrurian emperor said:

I kinda have the opposite opinion. Conquest may be very problematic but that's because it actually tries to do things and has things happen. It doesn't work but at least a story can be said to be there.

Birthright ''works'' but only because there's nothing there that could possibly go wrong to begin with. Its just going from point A to point B with barely anything of note happening before you reach Garon's castle. 

As such I feel the problematic story is much better then the one that barely exists. 

 

23 hours ago, Slumber said:

I have a tendency to give Conquest more slack for at least being interesting in what it tried to do.

Birthright doing the standard FE thing(Post-path split) and still having really bad writing won't get nearly as much leeway as the one that tried something different and still had really bad writing. That said, my tune will change if IS ever tries the "Yeah, you play as the bad guys and the dialogue/plot is really edgy in the most shallow way" route ever again. I don't think that Conquest being more interesting than its more standard counterparts means that it's the model FE's story should ever go ever again. I feel like this should go without saying, but the bogus "Vampire Emblem" leaks that took over the community months ago had me realizing how bad of a direction this would be for the series.

But yeah. Somebody who fails in a unique way will always get a bit more credit from me than somebody who tries to follow the crowd and fails just as bad.

You see, I personally don't feel like giving the writer's any slack for Conquest, because this isn't a 14 year old's first fanfic. They are professionals and this isn't their first FE game. And for all the "new things" (RD had a very similar set up and did it better) it tried, it couldn't actually commit to any of them.  It retreated back to well-known paths and made sure to keep things as inoffensive for the self-insert as possible. Birthright may be nothing special, but Conquest's main problem literally was the writer's trying to appeal to the base too hard. Don't see how that makes it better.

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On 2/4/2018 at 10:23 PM, Etrurian emperor said:

As such I feel the problematic story is much better then the one that barely exists. 

I think it's a matter of scale. I consider SoV to be problematic, but not without its merrits. Some interesting themes, albeit clumsily handled. Conquest is a constant barage of bad writing and I find myself more in favor of ('more' being a relative term) the safer but decently written Birthright. Conquest would have to be magnitudes less offensive to make me give them the "At least you tried" reward.

I'm closer in agreement to you if you want to compare Conquest to Revelation, however. Revelation was too boring for me to finish.

Edited by NekoKnight
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I don't like using Pegasus Knights, the only ones I enjoy using are Caeda and Sumia. Caeda because Wing Spear ftw, plus best girl, and Sumia because Galeforce is broken to hell and back.

While this may not be unpopular...it annoys me so much that Aunts and Uncles don't get supports with their nieces and nephews. Could you imagine how supportive Kaze would have been to Asugi? Or how interesting a Chrom-Owain support would have been?

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Just now, Lau said:

I don't like using Pegasus Knights, the only ones I enjoy using are Caeda and Sumia. Caeda because Wing Spear ftw, plus best girl, and Sumia because Galeforce is broken to hell and back.

While this may not be unpopular...it annoys me so much that Aunts and Uncles don't get supports with their nieces and nephews. Could you imagine how supportive Kaze would have been to Asugi? Or how interesting a Chrom-Owain support would have been?

Forrest and Elise should also have a support since Forrest recruitment shows the two immediately got very close to each other. And seeing shy and proper Siegbert talk to Camilla would have been funny. 

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1 hour ago, Lau said:

I don't like using Pegasus Knights, the only ones I enjoy using are Caeda and Sumia. Caeda because Wing Spear ftw, plus best girl, and Sumia because Galeforce is broken to hell and back.

While this may not be unpopular...it annoys me so much that Aunts and Uncles don't get supports with their nieces and nephews. Could you imagine how supportive Kaze would have been to Asugi? Or how interesting a Chrom-Owain support would have been?

We may yet get one in Warriors at least. Chrom doesn't seem too keen on Owain's theatrics.

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2 hours ago, Lau said:

While this may not be unpopular...it annoys me so much that Aunts and Uncles don't get supports with their nieces and nephews. Could you imagine how supportive Kaze would have been to Asugi? Or how interesting a Chrom-Owain support would have been?

Yeah, I totally agree, though I don't think this is really unpopular.  

Forrest/Elise is probably the most notable one for me, since Elise absolutely adored him in his paralogue, but I'd really appreciate Elise with both her nephews really.  

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Not sure how unpopular this is but despite some of the praise it has gotten over recent developments, I don't think Heroes has a good story. It moves at a snail's pace, character depth and development is minimal, and at its best moments, it's a typical Fire Emblem sort of story, nothing to write home about. It's a mobile game, so I don't expect it to have an amazing narrative but I know they can do better. Granblue Fantasy is another gaccha game that pumps out more developed side stories and main story developments in a month than Heroes did in a year.

Also, Xander and Veronica are still horrible people, and people seem to have forgotten that they are totally chill with enslaving the multiverse just because Veronica is ronery and Xander is "so noble, so brave".

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1 minute ago, NekoKnight said:

Also, Xander and Veronica are still horrible people, and people seem to have forgotten that they are totally chill with enslaving the multiverse just because Veronica is ronery and Xander is "so noble, so brave".

…I'm more like welp, she's psycho and they clearly chose Story Xander instead of Support Xander to be represented in Heroes. Really it's the devs' fault.

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Xander shouldn't have been a GHB unit, and same with Camus. 

Or else they might have been twice as better than the way they are now thanks to natures.

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