Nerfs/Buffs needed

[XRay]

3 hours ago, Soul~! said:

And why is everybody (aka fucking nobody) talking about this?

If they are on a defense team, My B!Cordelia and bonus unit can bait them apart. Reinhardt kills Effie and Zephiel. Olivia can take out Hector. Reinhardt or Olivia can take out the last armor depending on the color.

Since they are all so slow, many people run Firesweep Bows to shut down armor units completely.

[Ice Dragon]

3 hours ago, Soul~! said:

And why is everybody (aka fucking nobody) talking about this?

It's really, really fucking expensive to get 4 copies of Hector to feed Distant Counter, and the build is countered by Windsweep, Firesweep, and Cancel. There are also only about one and a half units worth using on a purely enemy-phase player-controlled armor team right now (Sheena and kinda Gwendolyn) because all of the other armors have shit for Res.

The build was reasonably viable before Firesweep Bow became prevalent. You also can't hope win any 738+ Arena matches with an armor team because the teams at 738 points and higher currently run anti-armor weapons.

[Xenomata]

I mean, fat chance anyone at whatever company will be browsing the web for fan ideas for how to alter their game and happen on this forum specifically, let alone they actually alter such stats, but hey.

• When applying Bladetome bonuses, bonuses to attack will not count (Rally Attack/Hone Attack 3 will show an increase of +4 attack, but in calculations only an additional 4 attack is added compared to 8, 4 from the attack boost and 4 from Bladetome bonuses).
• Desperation 1/2/3 trigger thresholds are changed from 25%/50%/75% to 30%/40%/50%. Sol Katti's built-in Desperation 2 will reflect this change, becoming 40% from 50%.
• Damage dealt by Fury 1/2/3 is lowered from 2/4/6 to 1/3/5. (this doesn't seem like much, but it  could theoretically make it harder to get the bonuses from skills like Vantage or Desperation)
• When attacking at weapon disadvantage, if a skill triggers during combat, the damage dealt by the skill will also be lowered by the amount if the current triangle disadvantages (20% normally, 40% against Triangle Adept 3, so on so forth). This also applies to damage bonuses from Wo Dao and Dark Excalibur.
• Killing Edge, Killer Axe, Killer Lance, and Killer Bow all have their attack lowered to 6, Special Cooldown -1 effect replaced with effectiveness against Infantry, OR all Killer Weapons have Quickened Pulse effect alongside current Special Cooldown -1 effect (the first one could easily be added with Venin weapons). No word on if these should also apply to Hauteclaire.
• Savage Blow/Breath of Life also affect the unit who the skill is surrounding at 25% or 50% effect. This also applies to any weapons with the skills built in.
• Pass will also allow the unit to move through any terrain besides completely impassable terrain regardless of unit type.
• Distant Counter, Close Counter, and any weapons with the skills built in will increase Special Cooldown by +1. Lightning Breath will remain the same.
• Ruby Sword, Emerald Axe, and Sapphire Lance can stack with Triangle Adept. Triangle Affinity bonuses can only go up to 50% maximum.
• Alfonse, Sharena, and Anna can achieve 6*, with +3 to each of their stats at 5* and only one new skill, Folkvangr+, Fensalir+, and Noatun+, each with 20 attack and their built-in skills at level 3. (this is just for lolz, and was gonna be for anyone with a legendary weapon, but just imagine)

Edited July 27, 2017 by Xenomata

[Clogon]

On 25/07/2017 at 2:32 PM, tumut said:

1. Nerf dire thunder to 7 mt, 9 mt is ridiculous and trust me Reinhardt will still be fantastic. But honestly it doesn't even make sense, since legendary tomes are 14, and all brave weapons except dire thunder are half of a legendary's mt. Poor humble Olwen though.

Your logic is flawed. Dire Thunder is not a Brave Blue Tome+ that is inheritable by any Blue Mage. It is a Legendary Tome and should therefore be buffed to 14 MT just like the rest if you want to follow that kind of logic.

On 25/07/2017 at 2:32 PM, tumut said:

5. Give dagger users 1-2 range. Dagger users are overshadowed by the strong archers and this way they can make good use of vantage and have more of a niche. Introducing a brave dagger could also help, or a dagger exclusive movement +1 or acrobat abilities to ignore terrain. 

Archers aren't stronger than Dagger users except B!Cordelia. Even with those changes, Kagero would still be the only one to use. The difference between the classes aren't their stats but their weapons. Bows have more MT and are designed to KILL while Daggers are weaker and are designed to WEAKEN, except Poison Dagger but it's low MT is to prevent it from OHKO'ing every Infantry.

 

On 25/07/2017 at 3:35 PM, Ice Dragon said:

Latona: (Assist, Staff only) Range 1. Restores 5 HP. Accelerates Special trigger (cooldown count -2).

Guarantees Heavenly Light or a Balm on every heal. Reduces the cooldown for Miracle to 3. Totally not broken, I swear. On that note:

Lol, add in QP and you get 2 CD Miracle while keeping your B Skill. I like this. (Edit: Dazzling Staff anyone?) XD

On 26/07/2017 at 7:55 AM, NekoKnight said:

Maybe a lack of DC to put on everything.

Edit:

Quoted the wrong person. Here is the correct one:

On 26/07/2017 at 7:27 AM, Soul~! said:

And why is everybody (aka fucking nobody) talking about this?

 

A Meta is not defined by the numerically most optimal units. Reinhart, horse emblem and Blade tomes are meta because they are easy to get AND strong. Armour emblem are not only hard to get but are lock behind the fact that multiple Hectors need to be sacrificed.

Edited July 28, 2017 by Clogon

[Clogon]

6 hours ago, Xenomata said:

I mean, fat chance anyone at whatever company will be browsing the web for fan ideas for how to alter their game and happen on this forum specifically, let alone they actually alter such stats, but hey.

Dunno about Nintendo, but a lot of companies do look into these kinds of forums for feedback. They usually will not totally follow the ideas of its fanbase because Dev's desires are different from Fan desires. But sometimes the fan ideas do get implemented.

[thecrimsonflash]

4 hours ago, Clogon said:

Dunno about Nintendo, but a lot of companies do look into these kinds of forums for feedback. They usually will not totally follow the ideas of its fanbase because Dev's desires are different from Fan desires. But sometimes the fan ideas do get implemented.

Some companies may do that for the big releases, but for a game as inconsequential as heroes I don't expect them to look to non-japanese(or even japanese forums for that matter) forums for tips on how to improve their game. Now the only thing that I think would happen for heroes is if there was suddenly a big surge in orb purchases, then I think nintendo and IS would take note of the current banners and consider adding more of the type of characters were in that banner.

[YotsuMaboroshi]

On 7/25/2017 at 9:22 PM, NekoKnight said:

Going by the naming theme of the Def/Res variants, "Boosting Gale/Huricane/Ventus"

I suppose if they wanted a non-dragon themed Attack version, they could do "Tumbling Stone/Landslide/Terra"

'Howling Gale' would probably sound better for the weakest skill.  Wind can chill and embers can glow, but gales don't generally boost anything.

I think for earth, it would be more interesting to have that deal damage based on your current HP (basically the opposite of Retribution/Reprisal/Vengeance, deal a % of your remaining HP as additional damage), since they're less likely to have multiple specials that function off the same stat.

Edited July 27, 2017 by YotsuMaboroshi

[NekoKnight]

5 hours ago, Clogon said:

A Meta is not defined by the numerically most optimal units. Reinhart, horse emblem and Blade tomes are meta because they are easy to get AND strong. Armour emblem are not only hard to get but are lock behind the fact that multiple Hectors need to be sacrificed.

Um... I said in my post that DC is hard to get which is a reason why Armor Emblem isn't as discussed.

34 minutes ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

'Howling Gale' would probably sound better for the weakest skill.  Wind can chill and embers can glow, but gales don't generally boost anything.

I think for earth, it would be more interesting to have that deal damage based on your current HP (basically the opposite of Retribution/Reprisal/Vengeance, deal a % of your remaining HP as additional damage), since they're less likely to have multiple specials that function off the same stat.

Hah, I had considered that but the first skills are supposed to sound kind of wimpy. "Nearly burnt out cinders" "uncomfortably cold air current" "RAGING STORM". One of these stands out. Maybe "_______ breeze" would work but now I'm having trouble thinking of -ing words that pair up well with breeze.

The HP idea isn't bad but it would be the odd one out (a stat that can fluctuate heavily in battle) despite sharing the elemental theme name. They should have made the Fire theme for the Atk stat and an Earth theme for the Def stat. Ignis was originally calculated from the user's strength/magic in Awakening.

[YotsuMaboroshi]

42 minutes ago, NekoKnight said:

Hah, I had considered that but the first skills are supposed to sound kind of wimpy. "Nearly burnt out cinders" "uncomfortably cold air current" "RAGING STORM". One of these stands out. Maybe "_______ breeze" would work but now I'm having trouble thinking of -ing words that pair up well with breeze.

The HP idea isn't bad but it would be the odd one out (a stat that can fluctuate heavily in battle) despite sharing the elemental theme name. They should have made the Fire theme for the Atk stat and an Earth theme for the Def stat. Ignis was originally calculated from the user's strength/magic in Awakening.

If you're going to reduce things that far, a howling gale is a 'strong air current that makes an eerie noise', not a 'raging storm'.  A gale is any strong wind, not a storm (though storms often have gales, you can have a gale without a storm), and gales are generally associated with howling.  Going with your 'breeze' would match better than anything with 'gale' for this, at least if you're trying for something 'wimpy'.  Maybe 'Invigorating Breeze'?

The main issue with 'wind' based speed specials is that IS already matched 'wind' to Iceberg/Glacies.  Something with 'snow' (piling snow or melting snow) might fit an 'ice' theme better, and then chilling wind could be used with the speed based specials.

I do agree on the elemental distinctions (especially given the Boost skills), but that's not what we have to work with, and as I mentioned, they probably aren't going to make a new special that does exactly the same thing as another one (unless they make it staff only).

Edited July 28, 2017 by YotsuMaboroshi

[Clogon]

3 hours ago, thecrimsonflash said:

for a game as inconsequential as heroes

If a game that made over $100m within 6 months is inconsequential to you, then I hope you have unlimited income. Nintendo treats ALL of their games with a lot of caution and care. Working with them previously was a pain in the ass, especially during the Wii era. Though they have changed in recent years and the grip on their IP's have lessened (thanks to the good work of companies like Next Level Games for Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon), the importance of their IP's have not diminished.

Heroes is just like all of their first party releases are extremely important for Nintendo and their plans moving forward (you can look up the various interviews about the game and the importance of their IP's moving forward). As their second mobile game, they are not only using it to advertise games for their system but also to experiment and understand the mobile market. Many people in the NA division of the company already knows about this forum. No doubt, the Japanese headquarters do too. Sadly, we will never know if they gather feedback from here.

2 hours ago, NekoKnight said:

Um... I said in my post that DC is hard to get which is a reason why Armor Emblem isn't as discussed.

Sorry, I quoted the wrong person. My bad.

Edited July 28, 2017 by Clogon

[Junkhead]

7 hours ago, Clogon said:

Bows have more MT and are designed to KILL while Daggers are weaker and are designed to WEAKEN, except Poison Dagger but it's low MT is to prevent it from OHKO'ing every Infantry.

Funny that you mention it, because neutral Atk Kagero actually kills Lukas (tankiest infantry next to Hinata) without his Fortress skill.

[thecrimsonflash]

3 minutes ago, Clogon said:

If a game that made over $100m within 6 months is inconsequential to you, then I hope you have unlimited income. Nintendo is treats ALL of their games with a lot of caution and care. Working with them previously was a pain in the ass, especially during the Wii era. Though they have changed in recent years and the grip on their IP's have lessened (thanks to the good work of companies like Next Level Games for Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon), the importance of their IP's have not diminished.

Heroes is just like all of their first party releases are extremely important for Nintendo and their plans moving forward (you can look up the various interviews about the game and the importance of their IP's moving forward). As their second mobile game, they are not only using it to advertise games for their system but also to experiment and understand the mobile market. Many people in the NA division of the company already knows about this forum. No doubt, the Japanese headquarters do too. Sadly, we will never know if they gather feedback from here.

The point that I am trying to make is that mobile games in general are not expensive to produce, neither nintendo nor intelligent systems are going to go out of their way to search for ways to improve a game that can go just as easily as it came. Heroes by its very nature requires very little resources to both produce and maintain, The number of people working on a full main series Fire Emblem would number in the hundreds, whereas the number of people that would be necessary for a game like heroes would equate to at the very most 100.

I hope that you didn't think I hate heroes, I'm just acknowledging the fact that heroes has significantly less importance than other projects. 

To a multi billion dollar company $100million is still another bucket on the mound, yeah if you look at it from the perspective of most people it's quite a bit, but to a collective of tens of thousands of people in the games industry, that's like one year's salary for most of the employees.

[XRay]

8 hours ago, thecrimsonflash said:

The point that I am trying to make is that mobile games in general are not expensive to produce, neither nintendo nor intelligent systems are going to go out of their way to search for ways to improve a game that can go just as easily as it came. Heroes by its very nature requires very little resources to both produce and maintain, The number of people working on a full main series Fire Emblem would number in the hundreds, whereas the number of people that would be necessary for a game like heroes would equate to at the very most 100.

I hope that you didn't think I hate heroes, I'm just acknowledging the fact that heroes has significantly less importance than other projects. 

To a multi billion dollar company $100million is still another bucket on the mound, yeah if you look at it from the perspective of most people it's quite a bit, but to a collective of tens of thousands of people in the games industry, that's like one year's salary for most of the employees.

Do you have enough business or game industry background to speak from personal experience without substantiation? If not, you need research to back up your claims with numbers and evidence.

Just because something may be less expensive does not mean it is cheap. Voice acting, artists, online servers, data management, marketing, etc. all cost lots of dough, especially for professional services that is required to give Heroes its current polish and quality. We also do not know for sure that Heroes is less expensive to make compared to other games, so before you claim that it is, you should ideally dig out the company's books to support your position. From a quick Google search, I cannot find any information on how much Nintendo and Intelligent Systems spent on making Heroes so we have no idea if they are actually made money. According to this article, Angry Birds got about $140 million in investments, and Fire Emblem Heroes looks a lot more expensive than Angry Birds.

I see a lot of improvements to the game implemented between the launch of the game and the current day. What improvements do you want to see that they are not implementing? They have implemented skill inheritance, more and more Orbs and Feathers, battle preparation positioning, and other features and quality of life improvements.

Unless you show me the financial statements or some other evidence, I am not convinced that it takes little resources to make, let alone maintain.

Seriously, check the credits! It is most definitely over a hundred. That statement would be classified as Pants on Fire.

I am not sure if you are acknowledging anything. What other projects are you comparing Fire Emblem Heroes to? I am pretty sure Heroes is more significant than Super Mario Run after seeing this tweet. I will agree with you that Pokémon Go is more significant than Fire Emblem Heroes, but other than that, I do not think you will find another app created by/related to Nintendo that is more significant than Heroes. Awakening sold at least 2 million copies, so $40*2M is about $80 million in gross revenue not including DLC; Fire Emblem Heroes got over $100 million gross in less than six months, so it is very comparable to a 3DS title in terms of significance.

[Jingle Jangle]

What could use a buff are effective weaponry, mostly towards wolf tomes. In the future there could be a seal called slayer that allowed triangle adept 3 if the user has effective damage to any horse unit regardless of color. So that any wolf tomes user can be a hard counter against horse teams. Thoughts?