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Cordelia and F!Robin comfirmed for Warriors from Famitsu Preview


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5 hours ago, Arthur97 said:

I never said no one, but it is small. Look, you don't have to agree with me, but you don't have to so...unagreeable about it. I honestly think that a lot of you are being kind of whiny about having to grind one clone. If that is all it takes to keep you from completing the game, then odds are you weren't going to do it anyways.

 

2 hours ago, Arthur97 said:

The hornets nest already is stirred, and will be stirred again; it is inevitable. Honestly, how many people are really going to be put off? If they were going to complete it, one clone isn't going to stand in their way. It's a mild inconvenience at worse, and frankly, I'm tired of everyone's rotten attitudes during the buildup to this game and how everyone hates almost everything they do. If you don't like it, that's fine, but just stop insisting it's an absolutely terrible thing to do.

The problem is, thus far, your argument has boiled down to "Hey, it wouldn't be that bad."

You have yet to provide a compelling reason why it would be good.

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On 8/7/2017 at 1:13 PM, thecrimsonflash said:

While I imagine that female robin must have some legitimate reason to be on the roster rather than an alt., I feel like your entire statement just boils down to "Agree with me damn it"

I'm sorry that everyone can't instantly love this game without question, I'm excited for this game but even I (With my almost blind bias toward fire emblem in general) can see the bad decisions that are associated with it, I have a feeling that you would be singing a different tune if your wifu wasn't in, I bet if the developers just outright said "lucina was just not unique enough to add" you would be in an absolute frenzy, meanwhile I have to deal with the fact that the only characters that I like that will get in are in my B-tier favorites who get by on concept long before personality.

It's not a matter of instantly loving it. People can hate it all they want for all I care, but when they do nothing but whine and complain, that's when it gets on my nerves. Oh, and I certainly have problems with this game, I just don't go around yelling about them and focus more on what I like. And don't get me started about "waifus." I don't care for that term, and I find it an insult to a character (well, most characters) to simply be labeled as a "husbando" or "waifu."

On 8/7/2017 at 1:13 PM, Deva Ashera said:

If there's one clone there will likely be more, such as male Corrin.

Let's try something different then. Many of us have explained why we feel FRobin being a separate clone character instead of alt would be a terrible idea. Why don't you explain what possible ways it would be a good idea because, frankly, there aren't any I could think of at all outside of a cosmetic change to the Character Select Screen since gameplay-wise having her as a clone or alt would function identically outside of having separate levels.

Because alts bug me. I never cared for any of them in Smash and I don't want them here. I don't like how they are inexplicably linked and share things like experience that they should not be sharing. Yes, I know it's a game mechanic, but I don't like it.

On 8/7/2017 at 2:26 PM, Anomalocaris said:

The problem is, thus far, your argument has boiled down to "Hey, it wouldn't be that bad."

You have yet to provide a compelling reason why it would be good.

That is exactly my point. It wouldn't be that bad. If the moveset if fun, it shouldn't be a problem. I do think they deserve to be separate. Since Awakening and beyond, they have stopped being avatars and started being Robin, and there are now essentially two Robins with similar but different personalities. If one gets in, it should just be them, and ideally they would be unique, but it looks like clones is the best we're getting. Good would be getting one with a sword and another with a tome. This is passable and better than an alt in my opinion.

Again, none of you have to agree with me, just everyone please stop moaning about it.

Edited by Arthur97
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16 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

It's not a matter of instantly loving it. People can hate it all they want for all I care, but when they do nothing but whine and complain, that's when it gets on my nerves. Oh, and I certainly have problems with this game, I just don't go around yelling about them and focus more on what I like. And don't get me started about "waifus." I don't care for that term, and I find it an insult to a character to simply be labeled as a "husbando" or "waifu."

Because alts bug me. I never cared for any of them in Smash and I don't want them here. I don't like how they are inexplicably linked and share things like experience that they should not be sharing. Yes, I know it's a game mechanic, but I don't like it.

That is exactly my point. It wouldn't be that bad. If the moveset if fun, it shouldn't be a problem. I do think they deserve to be separate. Since Awakening and beyond, they have stopped being avatars and started being Robin, and there are now essentially two Robins with similar but different personalities. If one gets in, it should just be them, and ideally they would be unique, but it looks like clones is the best we're getting. Good would be getting one with a sword and another with a tome. This is passable and better than an alt in my opinion.

Again, none of you have to agree with me, just everyone please stop moaning about it.

I can kinda understand when you say that alts bug you, but I feel like a Warriors game is a place where that principle needs to be put aside in favor of good, streamlined gameplay. Clone characters would be detrimental instead of "free dessert" like they are in Smash Bros.

The problem is that your argument is, by your own admission, "it wouldn't be that bad", and not in the litotical sense. "Not that bad" is still bad, so naturally we're going to argue against that because we want good, or at least neutral. You're entitled to your opinion, but we're also entitled to tell you why we think it's a terrible idea.

Edited by Anomalocaris
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Just now, Anomalocaris said:

You're entitled to your opinion, but we're also entitled to tell you why we think it's a terrible idea.

I think his main issue though is that we seem less "expressing our opinion", and more "just whining and complaining". 

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2 minutes ago, Anomalocaris said:

I can kinda understand when you say that alts bug you, but I feel like a Warriors game is a place where that principle needs to be put aside in favor of good, streamlined gameplay. Clone characters would be detrimental instead of "free dessert" like they are in Smash Bros.

The problem is that your argument is, by your own admission, "it wouldn't be that bad", and not in the litotical sense. "Not that bad" is still bad, so naturally we're going to argue against that because we want good, or at least neutral. You're entitled to your opinion, but we're also entitled to tell you why we think it's a terrible idea.

Sorry, but I take characters over gameplay in a game like this. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

1 minute ago, omegaxis1 said:

I think his main issue though is that we seem less "expressing our opinion", and more "just whining and complaining". 

After the first five or so times, yes, it crosses into whining and complaining. Some people are still clamoring for Ike and Hector. The ship has sailed.

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7 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

Sorry, but I take characters over gameplay in a game like this. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Okay, let me try a different approach here.

From a character perspective- not a gameplay perspective -does it really make a difference whether the two Robins share a slot or are separate? Either way they have separate dialogue, voices, appearances, ect. All the stuff that matters as far as their characterization goes.

If the gameplay is low-priority to you, then the fact that they just so happen to share their level-ups and weapons shouldn't matter to you. It's just a convenient gameplay mechanic.

Edited by Anomalocaris
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2 minutes ago, Anomalocaris said:

Okay, let me try a different approach here.

From a character perspective- not a gameplay perspective -does it really make a difference whether the two Robins share a slot or are separate? Either way they have separate dialogue, voices, appearances, ect. All the stuff that matters as far as their characterization goes.

If the gameplay is low-priority to you, then the fact that they just so happen to share their level-ups and weapons shouldn't matter to you. It's just a convenient gameplay mechanic.

Okay, you make a fair point, and as I have said, since they gave her her own page, I would let it slide if she is an alt. I still would rather she be separate. Plus, let's not forget bond conversations.

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I wouldn't mind fRobin having her own slot if she still shares levels, upgrades, etc with mRobin..in fact I'd prefer it that way.

I also just thought of how annoying it would be to have to upgrade (add new combos, no flinch for X number of strikes, elemental resistances, etc) like in Hyrule Warriors' Bazaar two identical characters..that could potentially be even more annoying then level grinding depending on the materials needed.

Since bond conversations are separate from battle, by which I mean they happen after you've already completed the mission, they may feature only mRobin regardless..any non-story or DLC characters may not even get any at all..

Edited by Deva Ashera
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Just now, Arthur97 said:

Okay, you make a fair point, and as I have said, since they gave her her own page, I would let it slide if she is an alt. I still would rather she be separate. Plus, let's not forget bond conversations.

Bond conversations are the big unknown here, yes, and we'll have to wait and see what they do with it.

If they were separate characters, that would pretty much guarantee they each have their own sets of bond conversations, so that would be a point in favor of them being separate characters. That being said, sharing a slot wouldn't necessarily guarantee the opposite. If they're willing to go through the effort of getting a voice actor to record all sorts of dialogue for female Robin (and male Corrin), they might be willing to go the extra mile and give them their own separate bond conversations as well (or at least do male and female versions of the same conversation).

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Just now, Anomalocaris said:

Bond conversations are the big unknown here, yes, and we'll have to wait and see what they do with it.

If they were separate characters, that would pretty much guarantee they each have their own sets of bond conversations, so that would be a point in favor of them being separate characters. That being said, sharing a slot wouldn't necessarily guarantee the opposite. If they're willing to go through the effort of getting a voice actor to record all sorts of dialogue for female Robin (and male Corrin), they might be willing to go the extra mile and give them their own separate bond conversations as well (or at least do male and female versions of the same conversation).

I thought that too, honestly. Tecmo Koei may consider fRobin/mCorrin their own characters even if they share slots, levels, upgrades, etc.

Alternatively, it may be possible that non-story or DLC characters don't get bond supports all..particularly likely for DLC characters..I mean, we know that some villains will be playable, they may not get supports at all dye to not making sense.

That said, I'd love to see supports between the two Robins and Corrins.

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1 minute ago, Deva Ashera said:

I thought that too, honestly. Tecmo Koei may consider fRobin/mCorrin their own characters even if they share slots, levels, upgrades, etc.

Alternatively, it may be possible that non-story or DLC characters don't get bond supports all..particularly likely for DLC characters..I mean, we know that some villains will be playable, they may not get supports at all dye to not making sense.

That said, I'd love to see supports between the two Robins and Corrins.

I'm pretty sure we'll see support conversations outside of story mode. They're advertising it pretty prominently compared to other FE staples, and excluding it from the main meat of the game or denying entire characters access to it would be a big let-down.

Playable villains might make things a bit odd, but it would be fun if they at least had supports with fellow villains where they're all "Muahaha! I'm evil! You're evil! Let's be evil together!"

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1 minute ago, Anomalocaris said:

Playable villains might make things a bit odd, but it would be fun if they at least had supports with fellow villains where they're all "Muahaha! I'm evil! You're evil! Let's be evil together!"

You may have just summed up 50% of the plot.

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4 hours ago, Lightchao42 said:

I think that F!Robin will just be a costume with only cosmetic differences (such as her own voice lines of course), mostly because if the developers saw her as her own unique character then she probably wouldn't be unplayable in story mode. They way I imagine it is that you can boop a button when picking Robin to switch between the two genders.

Remember that this game has full voice acting and plenty of it, so making clones (that are completely different characters) would require more effort and time than just making another model and calling it a day, and this means they can't be added at the last minute either. They're willing to put in the extra effort for female Robin and male Corrin because they're meant to be equal to their opposite gendered counterpart and they're customizable in their home games.

Yeah, sure. But it also cuts a lot out by making them clones. VA and model work still needs to be done, as well as script writing, but animating and designing their own move set along with balance would be cut out.

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The whole reason why I personally want F-Robin to be an alt is because I don't want to go through the hassle grinding. In Hyrule Warriors the reason why I didn't buy the 3DS expansion was because I couldn't transfer my characters stats to the 3DS version & I didn't want to go through the time or effort. Especially training Agitha & Tingle again.

It's also not like in Hyrule Warriors where they can afford having the same characters. Each of the Links' had their own impact & appeal to the player over the years. Of course the same argument applies to Zelda & her alter-ego as well. There's also the fact the Zelda's franchise doesn't exactly have a rich cast until (apparently) BOTW (plz no spoilers).

 

I just don't think having F-Robin & M-Corrin with their own character slots will go to well with the fans. There's already a backlash on the focus for the 3DS era & 1st game. The only way I can possibly see them being accepted is if their own movesets had a positive reception from the hands-on beta tester & that's assuming they would let them test out on the day they get announce. I still would love to see both of the Corrins' & Robins' conversing with each other but I don't think you really need to have your own unique moveset to have that being possible.

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3 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

The whole reason why I personally want F-Robin to be an alt is because I don't want to go through the hassle grinding. In Hyrule Warriors the reason why I didn't buy the 3DS expansion was because I couldn't transfer my characters stats to the 3DS version & I didn't want to go through the time or effort. Especially training Agitha & Tingle again.

I totally forgot about that backlash- and it's so relevant, too.

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7 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

I actually just thought; Palla is probably deconfirmed for this game, because her Japanese voice actress was in treatment for an illness up until this month.

Well, that's depressing. And I don't even know which bit is most so.

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6 hours ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

I actually just thought; Palla is probably deconfirmed for this game, because her Japanese voice actress was in treatment for an illness up until this month.

They'd find someone else if necessary. This wouldn't change a thing. They wouldn't throw away all that programming for such a reason.

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Just now, Florete said:

They'd find someone else if necessary. This wouldn't change a thing. They wouldn't throw away all that programming for such a reason.

The thing is though, Risa Taneda has been sick since September 2016, and the Japanese don't really change voice actors lightly. They've done stuff like change the plots of three consecutive anime after the first one, just because a voice actor was unavaliable.

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1 minute ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

The thing is though, Risa Taneda has been sick since September 2016, and the Japanese don't really change voice actors lightly. They've done stuff like change the plots of three consecutive anime after the first one, just because a voice actor was unavaliable.

That's a coincidence. In anime and games I've seen actors get changed plenty, it just depends on the people behind it. This game has been in development since long before September 2016 and if Palla is in (which I honestly don't think she is anyway), they're not going to trash all that work just because they don't want a new actor.

And honestly, anime can often be a whole different ballgame. Not saying actors aren't a big deal for games, but it's much more of a factor with anime where actors really make themselves known through certain characters.

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1 hour ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

The thing is though, Risa Taneda has been sick since September 2016, and the Japanese don't really change voice actors lightly. They've done stuff like change the plots of three consecutive anime after the first one, just because a voice actor was unavaliable.

oh yeah, when I was in high school I watched an anime called Fairy Tale and my nerd friend told me it was cancelled because a voice actress couldn't continue her role. Pretty weird. Here in the west voice actors get dropped in the games industry for any petty reason you can imagine. But I guess better working contracts is what the Voice Actors' Strike is trying to address huh.

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12 hours ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

I actually just thought; Palla is probably deconfirmed for this game, because her Japanese voice actress was in treatment for an illness up until this month.

Usually, recasting in games isn't such a big issue. Old fighting games series like Street Fighter and King of Fighters often do it. Looking at a Japanese wiki, apparently she had a different VA in an old drama CD too. I doubt they'll be able to keep consistent VAs with so many characters, especially due to many characters from all games getting voiced in Heroes.

Edited by NeonZ
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I mean, we do have a somewhat recent example of japanese VA changing with Tekken. The original voice actor of Heihachi died, so Namco just made Heihachi younger because he drank a potion or something like that, got a new guy to do voices and it was business as usual. Also One Piece didn't stop getting new episodes when Chopper's voice actress went on a maternity leave, they just got a replacement while she was away.

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Risa Taneda's been replaced on two distinct occasions, FGO (In which Rie Takahashi took over the role of Mash) and Shokugeki no Souma (With Erina)

It would not be out of the question for her to have been replaced. There is always the possibility that her japanese lines were recorded well in advance, but that's not a guarantee. If Palla's in, they'll either have them done already, or new voice actor. Then again, I never suspected Palla was getting in in the first place so whatever for me I guess.

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I think the only way Palla is in is if they managed to include the Pegasus Sisters as a single character somehow. Maybe like Female Robin/Male Robin or a single character that has the other two sisters as part of their moveset.

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