MetalAmethyst

What classes do you want to see come back?

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I really want Pirates back badly, here's to hoping they return.

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On 8/1/2017 at 3:24 PM, Armagon said:

Warrior. Did anybody notice that Warrior wasn't in Fates?

I certainly did. And tbf, I'd much rather have had Warrior in that game over Berserker, which was too much risk and not nearly enough reward to make up for the high risk.

On 8/1/2017 at 3:09 PM, Extrasolar said:

I agree with all of this for the most part. Light magic may have low might, but if they give it chances to shine - versus monsters like Sacred Stones, or dark mages, for example, then it'll fit back in nicely. Weapon triangle has never exactly been make-it-or-break-it in the main series like it is a lot of the time in Heroes, but I think the magic triangle makes using magic a lot more dynamic. Radiant Dawn's magic system was basically perfect for me - the anima mage characters could use all three, but specialized (SS Rank) in one element.

In what way does the magic triangle make it more dynamic? Because let me be frank - with how little effect it has (due to nearly all mage units tending to have high resistance), I fail to see how the magic triangle makes using magic more dynamic.

19 hours ago, Slumber said:

Also, as I went into in another thread, if they don't do branching promotions that you choose(They probably will), personal promotions should come back. IE, depending on the character, some Fighters could turn into Heroes. Or say we had FE8 classes in FE7 and personal promotions. Upon using a Fell Contract, Legault becomes an Assassin, Matthew becomes a Rogue. 

I don't really like the personal promotion idea for reasons. I just don't.

Anyways... All I can really think of that I want back are Warriors and Griffon RIders.

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32 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

In what way does the magic triangle make it more dynamic? Because let me be frank - with how little effect it has (due to nearly all mage units tending to have high resistance), I fail to see how the magic triangle makes using magic more dynamic.

Because all magic being the same except "x magic hits harder. x magic is lighter" is stupidly uninteresting. Heck, there are times where I might need to kill a magic-using unit with another magic-using unit.

Not to mention, the physical weapon triangle makes gameplay a lot more interesting; not hating on games pre-WT, but it added a whole new element. With the weapon triangle, you at least have to macro around "okay, this weapon isn't great against x, i should use y."

I mean, if you're saying that the magic triangle has no effect, the weapon triangle isn't much better. Unless you're playing Heroes, you can flat out ignore it and go about your merry way. Does it give you small bonuses here or there? Sure, but there are plenty of units and situations where it's irrelevant. There's plenty of physically attacking units with high defense that can render the weapon triangle null, but that doesn't mean it should go completely.
Not to mention, it adds to the lore of magic.

Light strong against dark? Cleansing, divine energy against unholy, mysterious energy. Unholy, mysterious forces strong against the primal elements, etc. I really like that angle.

Edited by Extrasolar

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3 minutes ago, Extrasolar said:

Because all magic being the same except "x magic hits harder. x magic is lighter" is stupidly uninteresting. Heck, there are times where I might need to kill a magic-using unit with another magic-using unit.

Not to mention, the physical weapon triangle makes gameplay a lot more interesting; not hating on games pre-WT, but it added a whole new element. With the weapon triangle, you at least have to macro around "okay, this weapon isn't great against x, i should use y."

I mean, if you're saying that the magic triangle has no effect, the weapon triangle isn't much better. Unless you're playing Heroes, you can flat out ignore it and go about your merry way. Does it give you small bonuses here or there? Sure, but there are plenty of units and situations where it's irrelevant. There's plenty of physically attacking units with high defense that can render the weapon triangle null, but that doesn't mean it should go completely.
Not to mention, it adds to the lore of magic.

Light strong against dark? Cleansing, divine energy against unholy, mysterious energy. Unholy, mysterious forces strong against the primal elements, etc. I really like that angle.

From a gameplay perspective, though? Unless you have a game where even mages have low resistance, it feels more like sending a thief at a knight, aka, you're getting nowhere fast - and that's assuming that we're not talking about a game with weak enemies. That doesn't really feel dynamic to me. Also, that second comment (x magic is lighter) summed up magic in the very game that introduced the magic triangle (the anima magic types were literally the same in every other aspect; guess which type was superior, and which one got the short end of the stick?).

That's true, but as with the magic triangle, in the game it originated in, the laughable balance between weapons reared its ugly head.

I don';t really see it that way, because it's not like I can send, say, a fighter at a myrmidon and not expect to get my ass handed to me. Now, sure, high defense units might be able to ignore it, but needless to say, not all units have good defense.

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1 hour ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

I don't really like the personal promotion idea for reasons. I just don't.

Yeah, I can see why. I just liked it. Thought it was a neat little touch to some characters.

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3 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

From a gameplay perspective, though? Unless you have a game where even mages have low resistance, it feels more like sending a thief at a knight, aka, you're getting nowhere fast - and that's assuming that we're not talking about a game with weak enemies. That doesn't really feel dynamic to me. Also, that second comment (x magic is lighter) summed up magic in the very game that introduced the magic triangle (the anima magic types were literally the same in every other aspect; guess which type was superior, and which one got the short end of the stick?).

That's true, but as with the magic triangle, in the game it originated in, the laughable balance between weapons reared its ugly head.

I don';t really see it that way, because it's not like I can send, say, a fighter at a myrmidon and not expect to get my ass handed to me. Now, sure, high defense units might be able to ignore it, but needless to say, not all units have good defense.

Then that's a call for more diverse magical stats. After all, there really is no point for mages having high resistance if you're never meant to attack a mage with another mage. All that needs to happen, have mages with lower resistance stats, and you're good to go. The magic triangle will serve a function. Easy fix.

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I honestly want wyvern classes to use lances again

Mage knight seems like it could be an interesting class if magic is divided again

Pirates

Gaiden/Echoes Priestesses

Bishops or Saints

Rogue because trickster is an odd class that imo doesn't do it's job as well as adventurer does it

on that note, I also want outlaw back alongside thief, maybe give outlaw capture as a class skill instead of lockpicking

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On 8/3/2017 at 0:36 AM, Extrasolar said:

Then that's a call for more diverse magical stats. After all, there really is no point for mages having high resistance if you're never meant to attack a mage with another mage. All that needs to happen, have mages with lower resistance stats, and you're good to go. The magic triangle will serve a function. Easy fix.

Like I hinted at, if the magic types aren't balanced, as was the case in Genealogy, which introduced the magic triangle, it just might be pointless anyhow. (What I'm getting at was that fire magic was near useless in said game, and having WTA over wind didn't make up for it because it was just that heavy.)

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Mercenary/Hero: make them look cool: no leather or weird awakening armour. Fates did it a lot better. - a sentence one does not often get to say.

Warrior: bring warriors back!

priest/bishop: bring them back and give them light magic.

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4 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Like I hinted at, if the magic types aren't balanced, as was the case in Genealogy, which introduced the magic triangle, it just might be pointless anyhow. (What I'm getting at was that fire magic was near useless in said game, and having WTA over wind didn't make up for it because it was just that heavy.)

Genealogy doesn't have the best unit balance in general, though. Fire magic not being great is hardly a symptom of a potential magic triangle not working, since Genealogy has a lot of unit balance problems in general. I mean, as we all know, if you don't have a horse in that game, you're automatically inferior to units with horses. Don't have Pursuit? Well, welcome to mediocrity! Don't have Pursuit (or Lex with a Brave Axe) and don't have Holy Blood? Yeah, you won't be able to compete. And axes in general were pretty garbo because of their awful accuracy.

The magic types don't need to be the exact same, because they'll have different uses. Tweak the tome weights a bit, and you're good to go.

Wind? Use it when you want to be extra accurate, despite the lower might, it's good against thunder mages and flying units. Fire? Balanced, not too much raw power, decent accuracy. Use it against wind mages, and it would be a lot more useful should you bring back beast units or something similar that's weak to it a la RD. Thunder, if you want to nuke, but be a little less accurate, and good against wind mages and dragons/wyvern riders (I liked the idea of that in RD, but mages were nerfed into the ground anyway and rendered it kind of a moot point).

Light, use it against monsters and dark. Dark, use it against anima. Every single magic will have a role/niche, despite all of them not being equal in raw number strength.

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Gryphon Riders could be made into a more balanced base class, maybe with a slight emphasis on Speed and the Falcon Knight can use Bows.  Wyvern Riders would use Axes, Pegasus Knights use Spears, and that would leave the Gryphon Rider with Swords.  I'd want both Rouges and Assassins, maybe Rouges having the option to use Bows, or having some sort of class ability to make Sword attacks at range like in Fe7x Immortal Sword.  I'd want Summoners to return, hopefully well-balanced now, as well.

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Not factoring in gameplay-mechanics, I'd be fine with seeing pirates from the GBA and different types of mages like in Tellius again.

Going off the mages thing as well, I'd also love for Manaketes to come back except have one for each magic type, as long as they're not the limited-use nukes again and function as one-space magic users. It'd be refreshing to have dragon characters that aren't special and are "normal" (for dragon standards) for a change.

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9 hours ago, NoirCore said:

Not factoring in gameplay-mechanics, I'd be fine with seeing pirates from the GBA and different types of mages like in Tellius again.

Going off the mages thing as well, I'd also love for Manaketes to come back except have one for each magic type, as long as they're not the limited-use nukes again and function as one-space magic users. It'd be refreshing to have dragon characters that aren't special and are "normal" (for dragon standards) for a change.

I get what your saying and going for but joining our army frequently means some sort of specialness even beyond just being a dragon or whatever. (And with playable dragons I think it's been 100%, in some games that may have been unavoidable but others less so) Just providing a different pespecitve. 

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I mostly want just dark mages to go back to the gba shaman aesthetic. It would especially cool if they were armored in addition to having the full robes. 

Other than that, echoing things many others have said: soldiers/halberdiers, split magic lines, light magic classes, re-doing griffin riders (sword fliers?).

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On 8/1/2017 at 3:24 PM, Armagon said:
  • Summoner. 
  • Maybe throw in the Master Knight for some laughs as well.
  • Oh, and bring back Light-Magic Classes.
  • Dread Fighters. Preferably the FE13 version.
  • Barons, except with more than 4 Mov
  • Lord promotions that aren't "Great Lord". Bring back the Knight Lord or heck, even the Blade Lord.
  • Valentian Priestesses, except with more than 4 Mov.
  • Dark Fliers.
  • Malig and Kinshi Knights. These two Classes felt a bit underdeveloped.
  • Griffon Riders, except make them relevant.
  • Wyvern Knights.
  • The other types of Manaketes
  • Warrior. Did anybody notice that Warrior wasn't in Fates?
  • Infantry Lancers.
  • Rogues. I always felt Trickster/Adventurers were just not as cool replacements for the Rogue.

 

Yes, I agree with everything listed here and I at least noticed that Warriors were absent which I was disappointed about. Warriors, Mercs and Berserkers are my top three foot infantry picks. Don't take my warriors away, I at least usually prefered Warriors to Snipers because Warriors have higher levels of strength give him a bow he's going to hit HARD usually harder than a Sniper. This seems especially true in the GBA games. 

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Gryphons. I loved them in Awakening, even though they werent all that great. Probably one of my favorite fantasy creatures though, and I loved seeing them in Fire Emblem for once. I would absolutely love to see them return.

Weapons Master. I loved this class, I wasnt big on its design though, but that was a specific thing for Fates. I would love to see a class return that has control over the weapon triangle like that. It was a lot of fun in my opinion.

Sentinel/Halberdier. I would love to see this class from Tellius return. They kind of did in Fates, but we only got one, which was Oboro, and no Conquest equivalent other than the typical armors.

Reaver/Warrior. We kind of skipped them in Fates for Berserkers, which I wasnt big on. Want to see a little more balanced axe wielder come back.

The concept of what the Oni Cheiftan was. An axe using magic class. That was pretty cool, obviously the whole Oni concept of the class will need to go depending. I really dont want to see a whole Dread Fighter thing happen again, where we got Ninjas in a more european style fantasy setting. It just didnt fit seeing Saber flip around and teleport when he was just a mercenary maybe 5 minutes ago.

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11 minutes ago, Tolvir said:

Sentinel/Halberdier.  I would love to see this class from Tellius return.  They kind of did in Fates, but we only got one, which was Oboro, and no Conquest equivalent other than the typical armors.

Reaver/Warrior.  We kind of skipped them in Fates for Berserkers, which I wasn't big on.  Want to see a little more balanced axe wielder come back.

The concept of what the Oni Cheiftan was an axe using magic class: that was pretty cool, obviously the whole Oni concept of the class will need to go depending.  I really don't want to see a whole Dread Fighter thing happen again, where we got Ninjas in a more European-style fantasy setting.  It just didnt fit seeing Saber flip around and teleport when he was just a Myrmidon maybe 5 minutes ago.

Don't forget Shiro.  He's also a Spearfighter like Oboro.

As for Oni Chieftains, I always thought of them as Fates's version of the Warrior class as slightly tankier alternatives to Berserkers with access to a ranged secondary weapon.  I would like to see Warriors come back, though.

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4 minutes ago, Von Ithipathachai said:

Don't forget Shiro.  He's also a Spearfighter like Oboro.

As for Oni Chieftains, I always thought of them as Fates's version of the Warrior class as slightly tankier alternatives to Berserkers with access to a ranged secondary weapon.  I would like to see Warriors come back, though.

I did kind of forget about that. Its something that, at least to me, was annoying with Fates. I think there should of been equivalents on both sides for each type, like there should of been a Lancer equivalent for Conquest and there should of been an Armor equivalent for Birthright. I see why they did what they did, but it was just a small problem I had.

I also did forget about Shiro, I really didnt use many of the 2nd gen units in Fates.

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There are several classes that I would love to see return or in some cases reused.

1) Gold Knights- I love the 3tier class system idea and liked the Gold Knights in Echoes but would want them to have access to swords and axes in addition to lances.                          2) Bow Knights- Mounted bow units have always been favored for me over the non mounted Sniper or Marksman.                                                                                                           3) Great Knight- One of the reasons I like the Great Knight is that you can get this unit where you need him/her and they can do what they do best TANK, I would like to see this class be made exclusive to the Armor Knight class though.                                                                                                                                                                                                             4) Wyvern lord- Do I really need to say why? I would prefer if the design was more like how it was in FE10 though, I will add that I liked the idea of Malig Knight and wouldn't mind seeing it again, but some things would have to be fixed. The main problem was that all those who could be a Malig Knight either excelled at one of the weapon choices or the other instead of being able to use both well.

5) Seraph Knights- One thing I would want fixed with these guys is make their defense and strength more similar to cavaliers. I'ts a flying horse or in some cases unicorn! Why on earth does it have poor levels of strength and defense?

6) Griffon Riders- These could have worked I think especially had they given another weapon option such as swords to the class, and would like to see this revisited

7) Dark Fliers- This is awesome! All of a sudden they can now take on both mages and knights and be good at it.

8) Valkyrie- Mounted healers that can counter with magic is NEVER a bad idea.

 

a) Dread Fighters- they're awesome.

b) Berserkers- these guys I always want at least one of.

c) Warriors- I want these guys back with either their bows or crossbows

d) Druids- I want them to look like how they did in the GBA games but in 3d this time and keep the awesome staff animation

e) Marshall/Baron

f) Sentinal- I loved this class in FE10 and want to see it again

g) Trueblade- I have never enjoyed this class as much as I did in FE10

h) Marksman- this class NEEDS to return.

i) Elemental Mages

l) Weapon Master- I liked the idea behind this class, I just didn't care too much for their design

k) Summoners- Or maybe this could be an ability of all mages.

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I'd love to see something similar to Laguz units return, complete with transformation gauges and all that jazz.

I mainly just want to have a giant cat kill everything again.

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On 8/31/2017 at 7:56 AM, Intercopter said:

I'd love to see something similar to Laguz units return, complete with transformation gauges and all that jazz.

I mainly just want to have a giant cat kill everything again.

No. Just no. Not after IntSys dropped the ball so hard with laguz in Radiant Dawn.

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On 8/31/2017 at 7:56 AM, Intercopter said:

I'd love to see something similar to Laguz units return, complete with transformation gauges and all that jazz.

I mainly just want to have a giant cat kill everything again.

Laguz are awesome! I too would love to see this, although for me Volug was my favorite non royal laguz, in spite of the fact that he doesn't get much dialogue or development. However I enjoy using almost all of the laguz, the only ones I had trouble with were the cat Sisters and that one tiger I can't recall his name right now. Not Mordecai and not Muarim the other one, for the tower at the end of the game I did a laguz only run, meaning aside from forced characters I used only laguz which was a lot of fun to do and worked really well.

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On 8/30/2017 at 5:08 PM, SavageVolug said:

k) Summoners- Or maybe this could be an ability of all mages.

No. Just no. In case you're wondering why I'm opposed to this... Go play Shadows of Valentia. I bet that you're gonna change your tune on wanting summoning back by the time you finish the game.

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Levant Mir Celestia, I have played Shadows of Valentia twice actually, it's where I got the idea. I found summoning a tactic that was fun to do but maybe that's just me. I will say though that if it was a choice between a Summoner or a Druid I would pick the Druid 10x10. For one thing I love their design, for another they have the coolest staff animation. One final note because of the Cantors in SOV I can see why some would be opposed to the idea of summoners.

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7 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

No. Just no. In case you're wondering why I'm opposed to this... Go play Shadows of Valentia. I bet that you're gonna change your tune on wanting summoning back by the time you finish the game.

Summoning was one of my favorite things from SoV, it gave Clerics way more utility and I would love to see it better refined in a future instalment, shoot the only thing that made cantors difficult was when summoned enemies flew, but they were typically weak and you could also summon and expel enemy monsters which was borderline op in comparison, my complaints fall on the enemy only spells like medusa and mire (yes I know that the enchantress can use mire but that's basically post game content so it's meaningless without way more grinding than is necessary) which had stupid MT and very cheap costs, though arcanists were just stupid stat wise, their defence was higher than their resistance which was just annoying for magic users.

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