Opinions on that Fire Emblem Echoes SoV Character #1-#52 (Check the OP)

[Erureido]

Day 4 is now over, and with that we are now onto Day 5!

Considering two of the three characters we last talked about were quite controversial, today's characters will be much less of that. You can say today will be a cool down from yesterday with these three picks. One of these characters we will talk about is our first story-relevant non-unit character. 

Today's that we will discuss are Luthier, Kamui, and Irma.

What is your opinion of these three characters?

I will give my thoughts on them later.

Before I head out, I might want to give a brief refresher who Irma is: she is that one nun that Celica rescues from Grieth. Irma ks the one that tells Celica about her mother. She later appears in the Mila Temple to tell Celica the circlet has gone missing.

Though she isn't a unit, remember that you can discuss other aspects to her like her design, voice acting, or whatever stood out to you regarding her.

[bethany81707]

Luthier: A rather isolated individual. Though I'm isolated myself, I can say I don't really relate to him- but his reactions to Delthea's attempts to help him don't garner sympathy. Luthier, I wouldn't take her at face value.

Kamui: I'm rather fond of him, actually. Not really anything in particular (I'm not a fan of Valbar's group personality-wise), but as a unit, I find Kamui makes a good partner to Saber, and when he joins, I feel more inclined to use him rather than my magic brigade. Saber, in all honesty, makes me feel like I'm wasting experience not rushing to Celica's Seraphim and Genny's Invoke. I will say his ending gets better if Jesse dies... which says something unpleasant.

Irma: Who? I'm being serious, I don't remember anything about her.

[Armagon]

Luthier: He's middle-tier in my list of favorite characters. I can actually relate a bit to his isolated personality, but that's about it, since he tries to be a good example to his sister, Delthea, whereas i myself don't have any siblings which means i don't have to be a good example to anybody, haha. But i like him as a character. He's got a pretty good voice too. Some of my favorite quotes from him are "easy pickings", "this is clearly not edible", and "I will eradicate you". As a unit, ehh, he's alright. I found myself using Sage!Tobin more often. And of course, Delthea just blows them both out of the water. Luthier does come with Excalibur right out of the gate tho, so he's already got the best spell in the game.

As a fun piece of trivia, did you know Luthier appeared in the Shadow Dragon manga?

Spoiler

Look, there he is! Of course, this manga's pretty old so it's based of Luthier's Gaiden design (which actually isn't that different from his SoV design). In the manga, Luthier is actually shown to be friends with Merric. Even though this manga is non-canon, i like to think that Luthier's ending has him going to Archanea and meeting up with Merric again.

Oh, btw, Ryuuto is Luthier's Japanese name.

Kamui: I didn't know Corrin was in this game. Ok, all jokes aside, Kamui's a pretty decent character. Like Luthier, he's in the middle-tier of my favorite SoV characters. I like that this guy is honest. One of his victory quotes is "I'm just in it for the money". And in the famous words of Lukas: "there's nothing wrong in fighting for coin". I also like his "you can fall down now" critical quote. It's safe to say that Kamui is my favorite of Valbar's group. As a unit, i found him to be discount Saber (no wait, that's Jesse). He's not as good as Saber, but he's still pretty good.

Irma: Um.....i mean......she exists. I really can't say anything else about her. 

Edited August 17, 2017 by Armagon

[Fire Emblem Fan]

Luthier: Eh. As a character he's fine, he doesn't really have any negative traits that make me dislike him. It's true that he seems a bit distant, but he's really trying to set a good example for his younger, less mature sister. As a unit, I really didn't use him much, he was just outclassed by other characters so he just sat on the bench. His design isn't one of my favorites either, but it's not really bad.

Kamui: I enjoyed him as a character, but, like Luthier, I didn't use him all that much, not when Saber was around. I used him enough so he could survive and be there if I really needed him, but otherwise? Eh. His design is, again like Luthier's, not bad but also not my favorite, I just can't help but wonder how characters with constantly shut/squinting eyes can see.

Irma: She's...fine...I guess?

[Rex Glacies]

Luthier: Not the best. He's quite mediocre, and... boring. Character wise, he had some good moments in trying to teach Delthea, but he was in the end just bland. Gameplay, he was inferior to Delthea (like everyone) and my other mage Kliff. Sure, he still had some use but for the most part he was just an extra. Also: his crit "I will eradicate you!" is totally a near copy of Leo's "I will erase you!"

Kamui: He's OK; in my opinion much like Luthier but maybe a bit better. His character is very honest and straightforward, but it's done in a good way that still makes him likable. Gameplay, he was inferior to fellow mercenary Saber but superior to Jesse. Not the best unit but still usable. In all aspects though, he was probably the best of Valbar's group, though I wish he had a support with Valbar rather than just Leon.

Irma: ... who? She had relevance in part of Act 3, but beyond that was pointless. I'll give her a lower review for me thinking the Greith section should have optional (but recommended).

Edited August 17, 2017 by Rex Glacies

[Erureido]

I'll give my thoughts on these characters now.

Luthier: He's alright. Nothing stands out too much about him character-wise, but I can relate to his isolated and social awkwardness to some extent. His supports with Delthea were interesting to say the least. As for the other aspects, he was an alright mage. Delthea and Mage!Kliff easily outclassed him from my experience, but Lutheir was still able to hold on his own. His design is alright, and so is his voice-acting. He sounds like quite the nerd, fitting for his personality.

Kamui: Another character that I like but not as much as a standout compared to the others I enjoy. I appreciate Kamui's simple and honest personality. He was nowhere as good as Saber or Atlas in the Mercenary department, but he still got the job when he needed to. I enjoy listening to him with that surfer-attitude-like voice of his, and I like that kind of Asian-aesthetic IS was going for with his design. I like that one headcannon that Kamui is Yen'fay and Say'ri's ancestor. I mean, he has eyes like Yen'fay and the hair color of Say'ri (not to mention all three of them are skilled with the sword), so I can see where that headcannon comes from.

Irma: I'm sure some people are raising eyebrows and asking, "Why are we even talking about her?" Again, I'm picking out the characters listed in SereneForest's Echoes pre-release character poll (in addition to Grieth), and in that poll, some story-relevant non-unit characters appear. Of the four in it, Irma is the one with the least amount of memorability, but she did have some relevance (albeit not that much) to Celica's story in Act 3.

Anyways, Irma didn't stand out too much, though I did enjoy the scene when she recognizes Celica is the long lost Princess Anthiese and then proceeds to tell Celica about her mother. The way how she told that story and comforted Celica when she cried thinking about Liprica was rather sweet, and gave me the visage that Irma could make a fitting mother-figure for her if the two knew each other.

As for Irma's other traits, her voice acting is fine, and I do like her design. Her headdress looks nice, and so does her overall clothing. I particularly the color patterns of dark gold, white, and lightened black on her robe.

[Thane]

Luthier

A medieval geek. I find him endearing, but not complex or anything. He's an alright guy.

Kamui

Let's be honest, he's just sort of there. He's got wanderlust and likes money. That is effecively the only two important traits of his personality. 

[property of nuvelle]

Luthier is alright. His design is interesting, his personality is okay. I enjoy his talk about his cat friend.

I like Kamui. I like him more than Saber and ended up being better than him. He's the most legit asian character I''ve seen. Hoshidans have nothing on this guy. I like his special necrodragon dialogue, it was interesting to see that they actually brought him back into the picture there.

Irma: Who? Is that the one lady who was locked in the cell and remembers Celica? If so, I don't care much for her.

[bethany81707]

25 minutes ago, Erureido said:

Irma: I'm sure some people are raising eyebrows and asking, "Why are we even talking about her?" Again, I'm picking out the characters listed in SereneForest's Echoes pre-release character poll (in addition to Grieth), and in that poll, some story-relevant non-unit characters appear. Of the four in it, Irma is the one with the least amount of memorability, but she did have some relevance (albeit not that much) to Celica's story in Act 3.

I think we just legitimately don't remember her. You're getting Est at the same time, which is more heartwarming and immediately useful, and Irma... is she even the one that gives Celica her promotion at the Mila Temple? Look, lady, if you want to make an impression, don't look like a generic cleric.

[epilepsyduck]

Luthier

I like this kid. I'm fond of these smug redhead mage boys in general, I guess, and you gotta appreciate someone who thinks being friends with a cat is the same thing as having actual, human friends. As far as being a playable unit goes, well, Excalibur/10, and handing him a Magic Ring helped him out a lot. Admittedly even with said ring, he was overshadowed a bit by Delthea and Kliff, but still, extra magic damage is never a bad thing.

Kamui

Love this dude. He ended up being Celica's best Dread Fighter, and only a smidge behind Gray in that department. Once we got to that scene where he freaks out over the Necrodragon I was pretty much in love. Definitely should've been allowed to date fellow-favorite Leon, though.

Irma

Wasted potential tbqh. Irma's got just distinct enough a personality and design, and just enough of a connection to Celica, that she really should have been a playable character. I would've preferred her over the new character Celica actually gets, but I guess we can't add any female characters who might accidentally overshadow some rando dude. How disappointing.

[Zangetsu]

Edit: Damn it post this too late.*URGH*

I don't want to post anything about the new characters of the day.

 

Question: Are we allowed to post about previous characters?

 

On Topic: Wow, I must say that I'm genuinely surprise & impress how the reaction on these characters are something I can actually understand.

Anyways here's mine,

least

to

most controversial

 

Nomah: Oh hi Nomah, what are you doing here in this dank place I would never actually go exploring if this wasn't a video game.

Unit - Here's I was thinking that he would be as awesome as Athos......... I was very wrong. He still has his uses & by that I mean whenever there wasn't a damn dungeon to explore. No actual reason to choose him over..... pretty much any other mages

Support - Does Celica really give that good of massage? Alm a lucky fellow. I wasn't really creep out by this since I've seen this trope plenty of times before. That being said it just him getting a message from a young girl. I suppose this means he has a  minor of dirtiness but it never comes out like to me as oppose how everyone else see it. Not I can't understand that perspective. I suppose it would less dirty if it was a dude.

Presentation - He may be a crappy unit but he still has an excellent design. Then again I'm a sucker old man sage's looks so I'm probably in the minority here. Kirk Thorton's does him justice.

 

Berkut: & Here I thought Berkut was this well loved villain for Echoes. Considering how many times this guy get praise hell & back, I'm pretty shocked to see such a divided reception of this beloved villain. Nonetheless I fall into to the category of liking spoil brat. I said before & I'll say it again, Berkut reminds of Vegeta from DBZ. You might think it a stretch for me to compare the two but hear me out. They're both self-entitle royal jackass who believes they're destined for greatness only to be repeatedly humiliated. Where Vegeta took each of his defeat as a lesson in order to improve himself, Berkut did not. Hell they even sold their souls (figuratively speaking) so they can gain more power.

 

Support - His relationship with Rinea is endearing at 1st (especially in the Memory Prism) but other than showing that Berkut isn't a complete snob in his taste for women, there's not much to really say. His rivalry with Alm reminds me a lot about Vegeta's rivalry with Goku although somehow this rivalry is tame compare to Vegeta's obsession with being the best. Yet another similarity to the Prince of Saiyans with the Prince of Regelia. So what was Berkut's relationship with Fernand exactly supposed to be? 2 pompous douchebags? Oh & he desperately want to gain his "UNCLE'S!!!!" approval........because he needs to prove he fits to rule to him..........that's about it.

 

Presence -  What I really really enjoy about Berkut's villainy is that not once did I felt sorry for him. I don't think I was ever supposed to sympathize with him. He's not like Slayde or Desaix who are just deprave for the sake of being deprave. There's layers about Berkut but none of it to make him into a this over dramatic villain. Unlike Fernand, Berkut is a thoroughly a villain & I really like how none of his action actually sugar coated. However, I do understand the negative reaction with him acting a man-child/spoil brat.

Which is exactly when he sacrifice Rinea solidify him as a villain. Mind you, he still sounds like pampered brat but he's supposed to be since he's douche bag

 

Presentation -  Honestly, what else I can possibly Ian Sinclair's performance that hasn't been said already? This is man whose genuinely passionate about his job & more impressively loves it! That being said I do think Berkut's design is solid & that's about it.

 

Faye: Oh boy, by far the most controversial character in the game. Let me be clear about my feelings towards her. I'm very indifferent about her & now that I got that out of the way BY SACRED TOOTH OF NAGA, this is most disproportionate reaction I've ever seen for a character. All this controversy & here I was expecting this character to be as volatile as Tharja, Camilla, Takumi, or Corrin, but she's nowhere as close to that scale.

Support - If I'm excluding dlc support than I have to give to support award to Faye. Yes, the thing that makes her so damn controversial is what actually makes her appealing. I see her support with Silque is often use as evidence to show why she's unlikable. So what exactly happens in this support. Basically it's just Silque trying strike up a friendship with Faye, but she's not interested in any sort of friendships. How does she say exactly it though?

By saying "Talking about Alm isn’t fun unless Alm himself is there. Look, it’s okay. Not everyone has to be friends, right?" So she didn't respond by saying the equivalent of "Mind your own damn business", "Get the hell out of my face! I'm worshiping Alm here!" or even a "Fuck off!" she just says what basically amount to "Not interested". Admittedly she could've been a tad more polite but seeing how rude Kliff was with Tobin I don't people getting pitchfork for that guy. Hell, for that matter Faye actually she still apologize for the way she was behaving to Silque anyways.

As annoying her worshiping of Alm can be, I still manage to enjoy it since it goes into detail about how the war is actually affecting someone for once. The only I can think of that the war of Valentia is also taking a toll on is Clive, but it's never discussed unlike Faye's. Granted this doesn't actually make her likeable but it does make her appealing to some extent. But the real highlight of that support is how she accepted Alm's rejection. She's doesn't even go yandere or psycho killer like so many people accuse her to be. It's one thing thing be unlikable but it's another when you're flat out lying! Hell, I'll say the most blasphemous thing that can be said about her. I'm more convince about Faye's love for Alm then I am with Celica's cliche love.

Presentation - I really like her design but that's about it. Amber Conner does more than serviceable job with role as Faye, but that tends to happen when you're not actually in the story. Overall I feel nothing but pity for Faye. She's honestly doesn't deserve half of the hate she's gotten unlike the other controversial character in this franchise. Hell, she never once hates Celica for marrying Alm, but her ending still horrible because someone thought it would be funny about a married woman never getting over her feelings for her 1st love. Seriously, how the hell is that family even remotely functional or the unnamed husband never feeling inadequate compare Alm?

 

18 hours ago, Thane said:

Faye

An almost insulting character in how bad she is portrayed and how other cast members approach her.

  Reveal hidden contents

I can see liking creepy and manipulative characters - Kreia is my favorite video game character, after all - but there is just nothing to Faye. She only has extensive dialogue in the prologue, in her two supports and in her base monologues. In those, she only talks about Alm, usually in the most obsessed way possible. She tries to manipulate Alm into forgetting Celica right after they had had a fight, she doesn't want to make friends that are not Alm, and her ending has her not getting over him and leaving her family without explanation for days at a time. So not only is she unsympathetic, but she is also completely static.

If they had expanded upon her desire to be nothing more than a normal girl in a small village, then there would have been something more to her character to enjoy. If characters had just reacted in a more normal fashion to the nonsense she was spewing - like Silque not being a doormat and Alm reacting a bit more forcefully to his childhood friend cheerfully proclaiming she'll murder people in his name - then she would've felt more realistic. As it stands, she's probably the character that has had the least thought put into her, and was added just so that Alm's early party wouldn't be a sausage fest.

Regardless of your opinion, the fact that Camilla and Tharja exist in the same series is not any reason to give Faye even one iota of praise.

 

 

By any chance do u mean Kreia from the KOTOR series?

 

[Thane]

2 minutes ago, Zangetsu said:

By any chance do u mean Kreia from the KOTOR series?

Bingo. Or, well, she only appears in the second game, but yes.

[Zangetsu]

2 minutes ago, Thane said:

Bingo. Or, well, she only appears in the second game, but yes.

Well, that why I said "series".

Yes, Kreia truly a magnificent character in comparison to Palpatine. She's make him look like Saturday Morning Cartoon (technically Evening villain).

I'll never forgive Bioware & Lucas Art for canceling KOTOR series for their MMO. I'm sure EA played a huge part but they still went with it.

But I'm getting off topic. I need to think out my response for the characters of the day.

[Erureido]

8 hours ago, phineas81707 said:

You're getting Est at the same time, which is more heartwarming and immediately useful, and Irma... is she even the one that gives Celica her promotion at the Mila Temple?

Irma does appear again when Celica visits the Mila Temple, but there, she tells her the circlet has gone missing. It's Conrad that comes in to reveal he was carrying the circlet. 

But yeah, I agree Irma wasn't all that special in the grand scheme of things.

8 hours ago, Zangetsu said:

Question: Are we allowed to post about previous characters?

Yep, that's totally fine. People who joined a thread like this later on have done something like that in the past. Just don't try to debate with someone on this thread over a character that was rated a long while back (i.e. like Alm or Celica).

[Ertrick36]

Wait, wat?  Irma's factored in this equation?  Okay???

Luthier

A mage snob, but I love him for it.  I just like a lot of his battle quotes.  His supports aren't too bad, either.  They express enough about his relationship with his sister, which I can get down with.  Like a lot of characters, he's sort of a "stub", which I think is something people ought to keep in mind when critiquing a lot of the characters in this game.

Kamui

He's a merc, though not the gruff, bad ass type of merc that Saber is.  Just wanders around, looking for opportunities to fill his purse.  Not much to his character, but I find his supports with Leon mildly amusing.

Irma

Okay, so I talk about how some characters are essentially just device characters.  Namely, I've criticized Azura from Fates for basically being just this exposition bot and a plot device in and of herself.  But Irma is literally just a device character.  She's there to expose plot elements to Celica, and is also a bit of a catalyst with a minor McGuffin accessory for Celica.  She has as much character as any messenger or plot expositor ever has, so there's no point in talking about that.  In that sense, I wouldn't even call her "wasted potential" because she was doomed since her conception.

That isn't to say I think all device characters are bad, though.  Characters like the postman in Zelda or the guy who takes pictures instantaneously in Earthbound all have their unique charms for as minor of roles as they're given.  They serve their roles, and they leave you with a smile on your face.  Though I think aside from Anna (whose status as a "device character" might be debatable), there haven't really been too many notable device characters.  Most messengers and plot expositors are generics or are like Irma, with nothing really interesting to them.  Or these roles are filled by more major characters, which can lend itself poorly to the story, world-building, and narrative, which we've seen with Fates.  I will say that Irma doesn't do anything egregious like some minor characters do, so at least she isn't frustrating.

In summation, she serves her purpose.  No more, no less.  And I didn't expect anything of her, so she wasn't even a disappointment.  She's just... there.

14 hours ago, Thane said:

Bingo. Or, well, she only appears in the second game, but yes.

Totally off-topic, but...

As a fan of Star Wars since I was a kid who loved Mass Effect and had plenty of friends and family who felt the same way, it's strange that I never was even exposed to KotOR.

Maybe I should be grateful because I wouldn't have to experience the heartache of Disney canning the canonology of the expanded universe.  Then again, I couldn't give a rat's buttocks about what the authors consider "canon".  I grew up with Zelda, after all; you just learn to live for the experience with those games, or you go insane trying to connect all the arbitrary timeline dots.

[Erureido]

Day 5 is now over, and with that, we are now onto Day 6!

Today's characters that we will discuss are Mycen, Boey, and Rinea.

What is your opinion on these three characters?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'll give my thoughts on today's characters now.

Mycen: I never used Mycen in any battle, so I can't say anything about my thoughts on him as a unit. In terms of his character, I don't have much to say about that either. I can tell he is meant to play as the "Jagen-character" of this game, acting as a mentor to Alm. I really liked the support the two have together. It was rather touching for Mycen to reach out to Alm by telling him that he would always view our hero as his grandson despite the truth Alm discovered. The way he lectures Alm at the beginning of the game right before Lukas was cool too, and so was the way he came to the rescue during the prologue. So in all, I guess you can say he's a character I like, but nowhere as much as others. His voice acting is good too, and so his design. That stache makes him look badass!

Boey: I really like him! Boey makes a great foil to Mae. Whereas Mae is the cheerful, optimistic, and brave individual, Boey is the more insecure and cautious individual between the two. Despite his insecurities, Boey still means well. He tries to make himself braver than he seems to feel more confident. Later into the game, I liked his character development where he does his best to overcome his fears (i.e. the Terrors) and put a more earnest act. Between Boey and Mae, I like Boey because I can relate to his insecurities.

Unit-wise, the RNG gods really blessed him. Normally, he is supposed to quite slow for a mage, but my Boey managed to have a Speed stat that rivaled Mae's. This was due to giving him some Speed boosts from one of the lion fountains early into the game, along with some very lucky level ups. Thus, my Boey was as good my Mae. The difference between the two came down to their defenses. Whereas Boey was better at handling physical attacks due to his high Defense and worse at magical attacks due to his low Resistance, Mae was the opposite. Both filled their niches quite well.

I love Boey's design. The white-hair looks good on him. In fact, when he uses Sagittae, he reminds me of Archer from Fate/Stay Night due to the fact that character also has white hair and can shoot multitudes of magic-produced arrows (or rather swords most of the time) at once. The rest of his design looks good too. I dig the cape and his overall choice of garments. 

His voice acting was very enjoyable to listen to as well. My favorite voiced line has to be one of his level-up quotes: "Evading attacks is easy when you can see what's coming." He says it in a smug way that fits his character, complete with his character portrait giving that smug half-smile that fits the quote.

Rinea: She looks pretty and she is a nice lady, but... that's about it. All she was a device that was meant to show Berkut's good side, but in reality the game didn't quite succeed in that regard. The only times we see her and Berkut having good chemistry is in their first scene together and their memory prism. The latter helps delve into her character to reveal she comes from a lower noble class and thus feels anxious attending a royal ball, yet she has a passion for dancing.

As for the other times we see Rinea with Berkut? Not good. How is Rinea still in love with Berkut despite the fact he doesn't treat him well. First, there's that scene in Act 4 when Berkut has a breakdown following his loss to Alm at the Rigelian border, and he screams "shut up" to her at the top of his lungs despite the fact she tried to console him. But it gets even worse in Act 5.

Spoiler

Berkut ends up killing Rinea and turning her into a witch all because she didn't want to be his empress. Despite that, she still forgives him following that battle. Like, what was that about? That "forgiveness" scene felt random, and I don't know why she would forgive Berkut like that after what he just did to her.

So in all, Rinea has a nice design, but there isn't much to her character at all. Her role in showing Berkut's better side was also quite lackluster.

I will give her credit for one thing: fighting her in that Act 5 was quite the challenge. She can be pretty scary to fight up close, and considering she stands right by a super-powered Berkut, I had to be quite cautious when dealing with her. It took using a bunch of Invoke units, some help from Clair, warping from Silque in order to get Clair away to heal when necessary, and then Delthea with a Mage Ring to finally bring her down.

 

Edited August 18, 2017 by Erureido

[Armagon]

Mycen: I didn't really use Mycen in battle, only because he joins right before the final dungeon and there's not much for him to do. As a character, he's definitely one of the better Jaigens, but that's about it. I didn't pay that much attention to his character. He has good Supports with Alm tho.

Boey: One of my favorites in this game. I really like Boey's casual personality. In some ways, he reminds me of myself. He's got really great chemistry with Mae, and i like that. I also like how he freaks out at every graveyard battle. His Supports with Mae are some of my favorites in the series. He's got a pretty neat design too. As a unit, he suffered a bit. He was useful up until the near end of Act 3. He makes a decent Sage but ehh. Mae's just objectively better as a unit. Doesn't help that Boey's spell list is kinda lackluster too.

Rinea: She's a nice girl but that's all that there is too her. She didn't really show Berkut's soft side like she was intended to. Someone once described Berkut and Rinea's relationship as being a copy of Anakin Skywalker and Padme's relationship and you know what? That person wasn't wrong. Both Berkut and Anakin end up causing the death of Rinea and Padme respectively. And both Rinea and Padme forgive them. And then, both Berkut and Anakin redeem themselves (it took Anakin like 20 years tho).

[Ertrick36]

Oh hey, from one device character to another!  What're the odds?  Pretty likely, actually, 'cuz there are a lot of these contrived, boring characters.

Mycen

Best grandpa...

Spoiler

Actually, sort of worst grandpa because what kind of grandpa doesn't tell you that you're predestined to kill your dad, who was deliberately evil so that he could save your continent from insane dragon gods?

I like him well enough, though.  My favorite Jeigan-like figure, even though he isn't a Jeigan gameplay-wise.  Nice mustache, total bad ass, and definitely is a grandfather-like figure for the Ram Villagers and Celica.  Definitely one of my more favored characters from this game.

David Boey

I know that someone named themselves that on this very site, so you know for sure this isn't an original joke.  When I think of this guy, I think about how he bounces off of Mae, but he's still his own man.  Definitely progressed from his one trait of dudebro who thinks that Celica setting off with only girls is an unsettling prospect (and apparently being the lesser mage out of the duo of him and Mae because she used thunder magic, even though he gets it at, like, level 3).  Serious, but has his quirks, like being deathly afraid of the undead (forgot to mention Kamui's comical fear of Necrodragons, which led to an amusing scene).  Overall, I like him, and he plays well off of Mae too.

Rinea

Rinea, Rinea, Rinea...  Oh, how tragic you are.  You love a whiny PoS who sees fit to cry whenever things don't go his way.

I don't get why you pine for a man who seeks power and revels in bloodshed when you are the complete opposite.  And tell me again how it is that Berkut is somehow able to see past your station which, while it is a moderately high station, is still far below his own.  Oh Rinea, I get that you might feel obligated to take his hand because he offered it to you when you stood alone, but if it is out of fear, then why is that aspect never conveyed?  Or be it out of the desire to rise to a higher station, why do you seem to express the opposite?  And if it is because you truly love him... then why?  What is there to love about such a pathetic, despicable man?

And most important of all...  Why oh why do you have hardly an inkling of an identity of your own, Rinea?  Why do your gods see fit to relegate all the women to paltry roles, living as mere objects for the pleasure of men, to produce and raise offspring, or otherwise fail in their more ambitious pursuits?  Do they truly not understand what a gift your kind is?  How much more compelling a powerful woman is than a Gary Stu like the future king of Valentia?

 

Seriously, though, Rinea is just another device character, and she's the worst kind.  I really don't like characters that are created with the sole purpose of being a love interest.  Rinea is just that, and she has little else to her.

28 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Someone once described Berkut and Rinea's relationship as being a copy of Anakin Skywalker and Padme's relationship...

Holy shit.

It all makes sense now.  Especially since we never see Berkut in any levels where there is sand.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

Mycen: Out of all the elderly Jagen-type characters, I'd say he has one of the best designs, it's up there with Marcus' for me as far as that goes. I like his character, too, although I wouldn't say he's my favorite Jagen-type character in the series. But he's a good character with good chemistry with the Ram villagers and Celica, when they show 'em together that is. As a unit, I only used him a little bit and he served his purpose, but Mathilda was still my go-to cavalier unit.

Boey: Boey never really performed amazingly as a unit for me, but he still performed enough to be one of the Celica units I kept around. It also helps that he was one of my favorite characters in her army. His chemistry with Mae is fantastic, and he and the others (Mae, Genny and Saber) rounds out Celica's initial group wonderfully! I enjoyed his supports, and his design was pretty cool.

Rinea: Nice girl, nice design, but that's it. She was just there to be a plot device for Berkut, and I feel like they dropped the ball with Berkut so by extension...yeah. She was wasted potential, honestly. And I mean, come on, after what Berkut did to you, you forgive him? Nope. Let him rot.

[property of nuvelle]

Mycen: I thought he was a cool gramps. I didn't use him but he was cool.

Boey: I like his design and he made a good DF. It's nice to see a mage who actually sucks at being one, rather than getting crazily gifted people a lot of the time. I don't know of any other characters like him. With all the designs he went through, I think this is clearly the greatest one.

Rinea: I'm guessing she was supposed to be part of Berkut's redeemable side, but he was still a dick to her and it doesn't make sense why she stayed. Honestly, if Berkut was a better rival//villain, she would've been a better/more interesting character.

Edited August 18, 2017 by KongDude

[Thane]

9 hours ago, Ertrick36 said:

As a fan of Star Wars since I was a kid who loved Mass Effect and had plenty of friends and family who felt the same way, it's strange that I never was even exposed to KotOR.

Heh, and I was never a big Star Wars fan, but I really like Kotor. The first game is effectively just the fourth movie with better worldbuilding, but the second one is its own thing, in large part thanks to Kreia. I remember the days when I hoped Azura would be like her, sigh...

As for todays characters...

Mycen

An asshole who effectively tells his adopted grandson "walk it off" after the latter kills his own father.

Spoiler

He's manipulative and really cold towards Alm, which I believe they thought meant he was supposed to be strict, but it sort of missed its mark. He's got insane plot powers, appearing wherever the game needs him to be in order to move the plot forward, and then Alm conveniently forgets asking him about his heritage as the crowd starts cheering...even though the two stay at the castle long enough for Celica to get there and meet them both.

Of all the characters in the game, I've changed my opinion the most about Mycen. I thought he was pretty cool at first - and he's nice in the prologue - but then he just turns out to be an ass who religiously follows Rudolf's idiotic plan. 

His support with Alm is still great, however, even if Alm should've been more pissed, but hey, at least the God-Emperor is consistent in his saint-like behavior.

Boey

Cute kid. Probably the one with the best romantic relationship in the game with Mae. Good support, good role in the main story, mostly some well-timed comic relief...a solid support character.

Rinea

The closest a character can get to being a literal accessory. She does and says absolutely nothing of importance, and she never once interacts with someone other than Berkut (unless you count her saying "that's awful" to something Nuibaba says). Let that one sink in. How much more of a plot device can a character be? If she had been an object, almost nothing would've changed - hell, things might've improved for Berkut's character because we wouldn't have had to listen to him treat his supposed beloved like garbage.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Thane

[Ertrick36]

6 minutes ago, Thane said:

Heh, and I was never a big Star Wars fan, but I really like Kotor. The first game is effectively just the fourth movie with better worldbuilding, but the second one is its own thing, in large part thanks to Kreia.

Bioware does have the power to draw people in, or at least had that power.  I mean, I haven't played some of their latest stuff like DA: Inquisition or ME: Andromeda, and I don't think I'd hate them at all...  It could be that the people complaining about those games are just the same people who cry "SJWs" whenever a gay dude or a woman is treated with even a modicum of respect in a game.  I only know of the ugly face stuff from Andromeda that was supposedly fixed sort of.  And apparently one of the characters is trans... which is nice if it's handled well, I think.

9 minutes ago, Thane said:

How much more of a plot device can a character be?

You think they're testing how far they can take that?  Next thing you know, there'll be a character in your army who is effectively a robot that exposites plot and will literally turn into a sword that you'll have to use to kill the 501st evil dragon in the series after uniting the four MacGuffins of the game.

2 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

And I mean, come on, after what Berkut did to you, you forgive him? Nope. Let him rot.

Spoiler

But he apologized, man.  Isn't that enough to forgive him for sacrificing her to an insane dragon god who subverts her body into a terrifying flaming weapon of death and destruction?

 

[Thane]

5 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

Bioware does have the power to draw people in, or at least had that power.  I mean, I haven't played some of their latest stuff like DA: Inquisition or ME: Andromeda, and I don't think I'd hate them at all...  It could be that the people complaining about those games are just the same people who cry "SJWs"

Spoiler

"Had" really is the key word here, and I think the people crying about SJW's are just a vocal minority. The problem with Dragon Age is that it suffers from a serious identity crisis, trying to be every game and genre at once. Inquisition tried to implement elements from so many games that the gameplay never felt like its own; it was flat, boring, and played like a single player MMORPG. Like, pretty much all the side quests were about collecting, killing or exploring in the most tedious fashion possible, unlike in Origins where you had a bunch of branching paths. Inquisition merely pays lip service to the idea of choice - your actions don't have any consequences, and you're on a collision course for one of the worst villains I've ever seen.

What bothers me is that Thedas has so much history and lore, yet all they do is pile on the mysteries without addressing the questions we already have. Dragon Age II was a prequel to Inquisition, which in turn is effectively a prequel to the fourth game. 

As for Andromeda, that whole game was just a mess. I'm not even talking about the bugs and the animations, I'm talking about how utterly devoid of creativity and passion the story and characters were, written without ever realizing what made Mass Effect good in the first place. 

So yeah, as much as I want Dragon Age IV to deliver on all the hype and all the mysteries left to explore in Thedas, I've got very low expectations. Sigh, and it's going to be set in Tevinter...I dearly hope they don't mess this up. The Andromeda series is probably dead now after the horrible reception and the studio responsible for it was merged with an EA one, or something.

 

23 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

You think they're testing how far they can take that?  Next thing you know, there'll be a character in your army who is effectively a robot that exposites plot and will literally turn into a sword that you'll have to use to kill the 501st evil dragon in the series after uniting the four MacGuffins of the game.

So, Azura, then? All she does is spout exposition without a shred of personality of human emotion, her song is the plot equivalent of the card in Monopoly that gets you out of jail, and she leads you on a quest to defeat yet another generic dragon after uniting all the siblings.

[bethany81707]

Mycen: An alright Gotoh (I don't know how you call him a Jeigan outside the literal tutorial), but he was just a bit too Dumbledore-ish for my liking. The bad parts of him, not the kooky parts that were fun.

Boey: ...Eh, there's something there, but his terrible gameplay doesn't really help me appreciate him in story.

Rinea: ...Meh. She's good for what she tries to be.

[epilepsyduck]

Mycen

Well, he's better than Nomah, on account of having a better voice actor, being around longer, and having more to do in the plot. With that said, I'm not really a big fan of Mycen. He's part of the silly reveals that come out like a spray of bullets towards the end of the game, and while he's around longer than Nomah he's still absent for a really long time, which makes it hard to get attached to him. At least he's a pretty solid unit overall.

Boey

He's not a redhead, but he is a (slightly) smug mage boy, so I like him anyway. It helps he's considered part of a duo with indisputably-best-character-in-the-game Mae, and that he genuinely respects Celica in a way most of the dudes who eventually take bigger speaking roles than him really don't. As a unit, Excalibur is pretty much always a guarantee of unit viability, especially for Sages, and while he started to taper off a bit towards the end he never felt truly useless like some units did.

Rinea

Deserved writers who gave a fuck about her, tbh. As it is in Echoes she's Berkybore's accessory who he mistreats the whole game but who we're supposed to assume he loves and cherishes in some way. Her eventual fate is capital-B Bullshit, made even worse by her completely absolving Berknut of his actions and the game basically forgetting what a shitheel he was. I don't hate her, but her existence just bring a bunch of dumb bullshit into the mix and the game would've really benefited from her not being there.