Mortarion

Charlottesville Protests

150 posts in this topic

What caused the helicopter to crash?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It had to come to a head sometime. Funnily enough, Trump is bashing both sides of the issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just think it's hilarious that they used tiki torches. TIKI TORCHES. Apparently they don't know those were invented by the very people they're claiming to be superior over. Polynesians aren't considered "white", right? 

White supremacists are the stupidest embarrassments to humanity ever. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Hylian Air Force said:

It had to come to a head sometime. Funnily enough, Trump is bashing both sides of the issue.

What's so funny about Trump bashing both sides?

2 hours ago, Dragoncat said:

I just think it's hilarious that they used tiki torches. TIKI TORCHES. Apparently they don't know those were invented by the very people they're claiming to be superior over. Polynesians aren't considered "white", right? 

White supremacists are the stupidest embarrassments to humanity ever. 

Likewise I don't really see anything amusing about them using tiki torches. Believing you're superior to someone doesn't mean swearing off anything they've made. In fact taking their technology (for lack of a better word) and doing what you want with it is a real ubermensch thing to do.

Also I think while racial supremacists are certainly more harmful to the world, nothing is comparable to how embarrassing the flat earth society is.

Edited by Jotari

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Jotari said:

What's so funny about Trump bashing both sides?

Also I think, while certainly more harmful, nothing is comparable to how embarrassing the flat earth society is.

I thought he would only care about the counterprotest people, but because he's decrying the racists, it also shows how hypocritical he is.

They are only embarrassing themselves, though. People like in Charlottesville insult and shame everyone who lives in the South now. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nah, Trump isn't hypocritical.
He made the wishy-washyist, most half-hearted tweet he could have blaming 'all' sides when there was only one white supremacist, murdering side at play here, because he ultimately doesn't want to condemn these people. They put him in power and he knows it. 

I'm not going to link to the Daily Stormer but they read his tweet for what it was, a tacit endorsement of their protests.

The mother of the driver of the car that killed a woman (a terrorist act, although many news outlets were talking about the car as if this was somehow a rogue sentient vehicle) shows why it's important to discuss racism and politics with friends and family and to call people out, even when they're closest to you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I heard another of these Free Speech rallies is coming to Boston next week. Animals. 

Also, Richard Spencer was arrested at some point of this? I hope somebody punched him before then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nazi-isms and this sort of racial superiority don't have a place in America. We literally had a war over this shit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, Jotari said:

Also I think while racial supremacists are certainly more harmful to the world, nothing is comparable to how embarrassing the flat earth society is.

while the flat earth society do have a pretty embarrassing belief, it's not solely that racial supremacists being bigoted that makes them pathetic. i would argue that the thing even more embarrassing about them is the fact that they feel a need to take credit and pride in the accomplishments of others that simply shared their skin colour, because they are unexceptional and poor specimens of human beings to begin with who need to take solace in the accomplishments of other people, and to leech off a group identity.

You look at the dynamic of someone like David Duke and his response to Trump, reminding him it was "white Americans" who put him in the presidency, and that's not a good look.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/david-duke-strikes-out-at-trump-for-condemning-charlottesville-rally-2017-8?r=US&IR=T

2 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

Also, Richard Spencer was arrested at some point of this? I hope somebody punched him before then.

Some people did say he was arrested and there was a picture/video of that, but I'm pretty sure it was just someone who looked like him, he was tweeting around that time. Don't believe he was arrested.

Edited by Tryhard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

Also, Richard Spencer was arrested at some point of this? I hope somebody punched him before then.

If they do, I hope we get videos of it. There are already videos of him getting punched in the face, but you can never have enough.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What went down in Charlottesville is a perfect example of why being a Nazi is not a defensible political stance, nor is it a valid opinion, and that every pathetic, spineless centrist who's ever defended people's right to be Nazis and white supremacists has blood on their hands and should be legitimately ashamed of themselves.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

7 hours ago, Jotari said:

Also I think while racial supremacists are certainly more harmful to the world, nothing is comparable to how embarrassing the flat earth society is.

flat earth is not nearly as harmful and very easy to contradict

racial supremacists are harmful, evil, and really dumb all the same

anyway people are trying to say that the dude who ran over people did it by accident. yeah, right, okay

EDIT: also https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/13/charlottesville-james-fields-charged-with-was-pictured-at-neo-nazi-rally-vanguard-america

Edited by Lord Raven

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Lord Raven said:

anyway people are trying to say that the dude who ran over people did it by accident. yeah, right, okay

that's not as bad as people saying it was antifa members posing as nazis in a false flag, or the driver would be "proven a leftist"

i just wanted to dunk my head after I saw that several times

Edited by Tryhard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah i've been seeing a few (((soros))) posts as well, the lengths to which people defend this kind of crap is insane

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

7 hours ago, Tryhard said:

while the flat earth society do have a pretty embarrassing belief, it's not solely that racial supremacists being bigoted that makes them pathetic. i would argue that the thing even more embarrassing about them is the fact that they feel a need to take credit and pride in the accomplishments of others that simply shared their skin colour, because they are unexceptional and poor specimens of human beings to begin with who need to take solace in the accomplishments of other people, and to leech off a group identity.

You look at the dynamic of someone like David Duke and his response to Trump, reminding him it was "white Americans" who put him in the presidency, and that's not a good look.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/david-duke-strikes-out-at-trump-for-condemning-charlottesville-rally-2017-8?r=US&IR=T

Some people did say he was arrested and there was a picture/video of that, but I'm pretty sure it was just someone who looked like him, he was tweeting around that time. Don't believe he was arrested.

While I don't believe you're wrong, I can still at least understand why someone would be a racial supremacists. Flat Earthers just place their hands over their ears and ignore absolutely all logic and evidence to dissuade their beliefs. Course I'd still rather more of the latter than the former.

3 hours ago, Lord Raven said:

flat earth is not nearly as harmful and very easy to contradict

racial supremacists are harmful, evil, and really dumb all the same

anyway people are trying to say that the dude who ran over people did it by accident. yeah, right, okay

EDIT: also https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/13/charlottesville-james-fields-charged-with-was-pictured-at-neo-nazi-rally-vanguard-america

Eh yeah. I literally said racial supremacists are more harmful. You just repeated what I said.

10 hours ago, Res said:

Nah, Trump isn't hypocritical.
He made the wishy-washyist, most half-hearted tweet he could have blaming 'all' sides when there was only one white supremacist, murdering side at play here, because he ultimately doesn't want to condemn these people. They put him in power and he knows it. 

I'm not going to link to the Daily Stormer but they read his tweet for what it was, a tacit endorsement of their protests.

The mother of the driver of the car that killed a woman (a terrorist act, although many news outlets were talking about the car as if this was somehow a rogue sentient vehicle) shows why it's important to discuss racism and politics with friends and family and to call people out, even when they're closest to you. 

While you're probably bang on with Trump's agenda, let's not pretend it was done without escalation. The white supremacists certainly share a larger portion of the blame but they didn't suddenly attack a group that was larger than them without provocation.

 

Still any word yet on how the helicopter managed to go down? That's the most bizarre thing to me about all this. Helicopters don't just crash. Did someone throw something at them or something? Were the pilots improperly trained? All the news outlets just seem to mention it but don't elaborate at all.

Edited by Jotari

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

29 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Well let's not pretend it was done without escalation. The white supremacists certainly share a larger portion of the blame but they didn't suddenly attack a group that was larger than them without provocation.

These people carry the ideals of Nazis. They decided to carry the burden of Nazi crimes and actions when they took up the moniker of "Neo-Nazi" and swung around Nazi flags while chanting Nazi slogans about genocide. 

If no Nazis were seriously hurt(Which there weren't, cops broke up fights pretty quickly leading up to Fields plowing through a street full of people and the Nazis beating black people with sticks in a parking lot), claiming "escalation" lead to this is incredibly irresponsible. You could simply claim that just two sides simply being there was provocation and escalation. 

There have been countless protests where fights have broken out between two sides, but rarely is anyone ever seriously injured. Rarely do people ever die. Difference here is, one of the sides in Charlottesville over the weekend happened to be the one of the groups in the country that has lead to the most death and violence in the country in the last 60 years(Including Islamic terrorists). Neo Nazis and white supremacists/nationalists actively side with a violent ideology. If I were to go out on a limb, I'd suspect that the death, injuries and gang beatings would have happened regardless of any escalation at the protests. 

The precedence here isn't that fights at protests lead to this kind of stuff, since they rarely do. Before anyone died, this was pretty typical protest stuff. The precedence here is that Neo Nazis being there lead to this kind of stuff. 

If you want to claim that 95% of the blame lies on the Nazis and 5% on the counter-protesters, sure. I can kind of see that. But if you're making such a stink about where the blame lies, I get the feeling that you see it as more like 75% on the Nazis, 25% on the counter-protesters, and that's completely wrong. One side got killed and scarred. Only one. And it wasn't the side that aligns themselves with one of the most violently evil armies in the last 500 years. 

Edited by Slumber

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

49 minutes ago, Jotari said:

While you're probably bang on with Trump's agenda, let's not pretend it was done without escalation. The white supremacists certainly share a larger portion of the blame but they didn't suddenly attack a group that was larger than them without provocation.

Not to be rude, but 100% of the blame lies with the racists who were threatening people's lives and promoting an idealogy based on violence and genocide. Precisely 0% lies with people who tried to stop them and got hurt in the process. Please don't pull this stupid "both sides are wrong" crap because it's utterly wrong and completely spineless.

Edited by epilepsyduck

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, Slumber said:

These people carry the ideals of Nazis. They decided to carry the burden of Nazi crimes and actions when they took up the moniker of "Neo-Nazi" and swung around Nazi flags while chanting Nazi slogans about genocide. 

If no Nazis were seriously hurt(Which there weren't, cops broke up fights pretty quickly leading up to Fields plowing through a street full of people and the Nazis beating black people with sticks in a parking lot), claiming "escalation" lead to this is incredibly irresponsible. You could simply claim that just two sides simply being there was provocation and escalation. 

There have been countless protests where fights have broken out between two sides, but rarely is anyone ever seriously injured. Rarely do people ever die. Difference here is, one of the sides in Charlottesville over the weekend happened to be the one of the groups in the country that has lead to the most death and violence in the country in the last 60 years(Including Islamic terrorists). Neo Nazis and white supremacists/nationalists actively side with a violent ideology. If I were to go out on a limb, I'd suspect that the death, injuries and gang beatings would have happened regardless of any escalation at the protests. 

The precedence here isn't that fights at protests lead to this kind of stuff, since they rarely do. Before anyone died, this was pretty typical protest stuff. The precedence here is that Neo Nazis being there lead to this kind of stuff. 

If you want to claim that 95% of the blame lies on the Nazis and 5% on the counter-protesters, sure. I can kind of see that. But if you're making such a stink about where the blame lies, I get the feeling that you see it as more like 75% on the Nazis, 25% on the counter-protesters, and that's completely wrong. One side got killed and scarred. Only one. And it wasn't the side that aligns themselves with one of the most violently evil armies in the last 500 years. 

 

42 minutes ago, epilepsyduck said:

Not to be rude, but 100% of the blame lies with the racists who were threatening people's lives and promoting an idealogy based on violence and genocide. Precisely 0% lies with people who tried to stop them and got hurt in the process. Please don't pull this stupid "both sides are wrong" crap because it's utterly wrong and completely spineless.

I'm not going to pretend I know nearly enough about the situation (nor do I think I even can know enough without being there myself) to assign a percentage, but I just don't think it's right to point a finger at one group and saying they're entirely to blame for something like this. Of course if you just let these people do what ever they want then you end up with Mussolini ruling your country so I'm not condemning counter protesters either in any way. I just think one needs to try and view these things with a certain level of objectification as almost everyone is going to be heavily biased towards one side or the other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly how are the supremacists threatened? They have the president and government they wanted. They have the police and the power. They have absolutely zero justification and haven't been provoked into anything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I just don't think it's right to point a finger at one group and saying they're entirely to blame for something like this.

People who are literally threatening violence against others for no reason other than malice and bigotry can and should absolutely be blamed when a situation they're in turns violent. These people were literally beating counter protestors and throwing shit before the dude started driving into them with his car, and even if they hadn't been, the mere act of being a Nazi is in and of itself violent. It is absolutely their fault, and to try and mewl that "well the counter protestors deserve some of the blame," while being unable to provide any actual reason why, is a weak attempt to remain neutral in a situation where neutrality is simply not defensible.

I don't want to pick on you here, because I don't think you mean any harm, but we really need to kill the idea that being neutral is always "objective" or the morally correct choice. Nazis consider people who would rather shuffle blame around and espouse some "both sides are wrong" bullshit instead of condemning white supremacy when they see it to be their greatest allies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually thought Trump was spot on with this.

"It has been going on for a long time in our country -- not Donald Trump, not Barack Obama. It has been going on for a long, long time. It has no place in America."

So tired of politicians blaming other politicians for what civilians do.  This is not a political issue, it's a people issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Jotari said:

While I don't believe you're wrong, I can still at least understand why someone would be a racial supremacists. Flat Earthers just place their hands over their ears and ignore absolutely all logic and evidence to dissuade their beliefs. Course I'd still rather more of the latter than the former.

Eh yeah. I literally said racial supremacists are more harmful. You just repeated what I said.

While you're probably bang on with Trump's agenda, let's not pretend it was done without escalation. The white supremacists certainly share a larger portion of the blame but they didn't suddenly attack a group that was larger than them without provocation.

 

Still any word yet on how the helicopter managed to go down? That's the most bizarre thing to me about all this. Helicopters don't just crash. Did someone throw something at them or something? Were the pilots improperly trained? All the news outlets just seem to mention it but don't elaborate at all.

eh, when it comes to flat earthers being deluded, it is indeed sad. but unfortunately ignoring science because it doesn't fit one's own narrative of the world is a practice common to 99% of the world population...including some folks here i won't name...

 

in any case, what do you see as a justification for white supremacy beliefs??? 

 

further, your point about blame is just silly. white supremacists are wholly in the position of power every step of the fucking way. if they feel threatened it's because they have a victim complex. if they commit violence because of the perceived threat, they are wholly to blame. and always will be wholly to blame. 

i don't think people should be going around hitting these neonazis. that feeds a narrative i don't think anyone needs. but goddammit these people should feel shame from every facet of life--from the workplace to the highest levels of government. their beliefs should be treated as the nonsense they are and cast out. crimes committed in the names of these beliefs should carry sentences akin to hate crimes. 

we need to show these beliefs are neither okay to hold socially/civically or privately. we should always aim to progress our society. 

Edited by Phoenix Wright

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Lushen said:

I actually thought Trump was spot on with this.

"It has been going on for a long time in our country -- not Donald Trump, not Barack Obama. It has been going on for a long, long time. It has no place in America."

So tired of politicians blaming other politicians for what civilians do.  This is not a political issue, it's a people issue.

See, this right here is complete bullshit and hypocrisy from him, because he rode into the White House off the backs of the very kind of people who started the shitshow in the first place. The rise of right-wing fringe groups is absolutely a political issue and he not only knows that, but is part of the reason it happened at all. It's a deflection to avoid having to actually call out his own base, nothing more.

You can stop tripping over yourself to defend everything he says and start using the brain nature gave you any day now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

5 minutes ago, epilepsyduck said:

 

You can stop tripping over yourself to defend everything he says and start using the brain nature gave you any day now.

I didn't want or vote for Trump.  But nice try, I guess...well not really.

This is not a political issue.

What about the left wing fringe groups?  They're ok?

Edited by Lushen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.