Why Lyn is likely to be a Navarre clone or at least extremely similar to him

[Seazas]

This picture right here shows Lyn dual wielding.

Navarre was confirmed off a screenshot who's famous for his dual wielding (most notably out of game stuff that depicts him dual wielding) 

Characters in this game tend to be similar to each other (Sakura sharing some attacks and animations with Takumi, Cordelia and Hinoka fiasco) The last minute additions from IS aka Nintendo tend to be the most similar... (Lucina completely copying Chrom's moveset except the special animations but that's it). So it's extremely likely Lyn is really similar to Navarre especially since she doesn't dual wield to begin with. 

[HK Motendra]

I've been saying this for a while now.

That they might be similar is prolly how she got into the game. Or rather, thats just my understanding.

[Seazas]

3 minutes ago, Motendra said:

I've been saying this for a while now.

That they might be similar is prolly how she got into the game. Or rather, thats just my understanding.

She likely will be. Hopefully Celica doesn't get stuck with a stupid tome. 

[HK Motendra]

Just now, Peaceful_User said:

She likely will be. Hopefully Celica doesn't get stuck with a stupid tome. 

Assuming Celica is in the game, it'd be an injustice if she had a tome at all, since Valentia employs black magic. In that respect, I'd imagine her charge attacks to take advantage of that and combine it with her sword

[SMinairo]

4 minutes ago, Motendra said:

Assuming Celica is in the game, it'd be an injustice if she had a tome at all, since Valentia employs black magic. In that respect, I'd imagine her charge attacks to take advantage of that and combine it with her sword

If she used magic without a tome she would hurt herself, it would make sense to give her one, and it could be used for a support, talking about how useful it is.

[Anacybele]

Hey, Freddy is sitting directly next to my two favorite wives for him. Hee hee, cute!

In all seriousness though, I was thinking more of the other way around, that Navarre is a clone of HER, but I guess this would depend on just when they were added. Lyn could've very well come later.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Anacybele

[TheSS]

If this is true, then the generic moveset theory is only gaining more traction. Which I like. I want more characters if possible.

[Yexin]

well, i'm not so sure about it. I mean, looking at the other lords in the game, we have rowan and lianna which are basically clones, since they're the "tutorial" unit, marth shares his moveset with no one as far as we know, then chrom and lucina, sicne they're father and daughter, it makes sense that they have similar moves, and finally corrin, who's a lord on his/her own

other characters sharing movesets (or at least parts of them) are leo and elise, sakura and takumi, and camilla and hinoka

now, for leo-elise and takumi-sakura, it makes sense, since they're from the same game they just wanted to add the little sisters in the easiest and fastest way possible, but the cordelia-hinoka thing is a bit different: they are from different games, it's unlikely that both in awakening's world and fates' world pegknights fight almost the exact same way, but since they are indeed basically the same class, they just made them with the same moves (ad i'm ok with that)

this said, i don't think lyn and navarre are gonna be clones, because 1) navarre isn't a lord (and as we've just seen, lucina, the only lord who's a clone, is another lord's clone), and 2) they're not from the same game/world: yes, there's the cordelia-hinoka case, but none of them is a lord

you can say that lyn's lord class is basically a myrmidon of royal blood, but that's just what i think

btw, i don't care if they're clones, i'd play them anyway

Edited September 19, 2017 by Yexin

[Deva Ashera]

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Lyn dual wielding was a reference to her Awakening DLC, who appeared to dual wield as well in artwork and, if I recall, in-game, as well as a way for them to make her more unique while also letting her have both the Sol and Mani Katti.

[HK Motendra]

1 hour ago, Sbuscoz said:

If she used magic without a tome she would hurt herself, it would make sense to give her one, and it could be used for a support, talking about how useful it is.

Perhaps so as a fail-safe, though in gameplay, it'd make for an interesting playstyle at least, as a trade off for being able to do both physical and magical damage

EDIT: @Deva Ashera SHe doesn't in FE7, is the thing. Agreed on the Awakening DLC though

Edited September 19, 2017 by Motendra

[Tolvir]

I can see this being the case, along with Celica likely being a Robin clone since they have a very similar style, sword and magic.

Really at this point its wait and see though, we should have most of our roster at the end of this week, and only have whatever is hidden left to find for when the game releases. Looking forward for the next couple of days, just to be able to get the speculation done and over with would be nice.

[TheSS]

1 hour ago, Yexin said:

this said, i don't think lyn and navarre are gonna be clones, because 1) navarre isn't a lord (and as we've just seen, lucina, the only lord who's a clone, is another lord's clone), and 2) they're not from the same game/world: yes, there's the cordelia-hinoka case, but none of them is a lord

You're making assumptions not based on any sort of recurrent pattern (clones exist) or deviations from what was expected (Lyn has two swords), but instead on tiny, arbitrary relationships between possibly unrelated variables (no known cloning between someone who was a lord in their base game and someone who wasn't). This is the kind of thinking that made people absolutely sure that the only way a new FE character could be added to Smash Brothers was if Ike was removed the same way Roy was.

Yeah, I agree that we haven't seen a lord share a moveset with a nonlord. So? Not knowing something exists is not the same as knowing it does not exist. After the first trailer, there was no one in the game that we knew of but Chrom. It doesn't mean that no one will be in the game but Chrom. 

Those reasons you listed aren't actually reasons. We don't have any reason to think they're reasons. There's no gameplay issues you run into, and any story problems are arbitrary at most,

[Florete]

Yes, yes, this has been said over and over again at this point. Holy crap people slow down a bit and just wait for more details already.

By the way, where did that image come from?

Edited September 19, 2017 by Florete

[Yexin]

20 minutes ago, TheSS said:

You're making assumptions not based on any sort of recurrent pattern (clones exist) or deviations from what was expected (Lyn has two swords), but instead on tiny, arbitrary relationships between possibly unrelated variables (no known cloning between someone who was a lord in their base game and someone who wasn't). This is the kind of thinking that made people absolutely sure that the only way a new FE character could be added to Smash Brothers was if Ike was removed the same way Roy was.

Yeah, I agree that we haven't seen a lord share a moveset with a nonlord. So? Not knowing something exists is not the same as knowing it does not exist. After the first trailer, there was no one in the game that we knew of but Chrom. It doesn't mean that no one will be in the game but Chrom. 

Those reasons you listed aren't actually reasons. We don't have any reason to think they're reasons. There's no gameplay issues you run into, and any story problems are arbitrary at most,

well, i explained my reasons why i don't think they'll be clones since the topic is about expressing our thoughts, i never said they are absolute truth and that everyone in this world must believe it

if for some reason my comment offended your feelings (which i believe, judging by your reaction), i sincerely apologize

Edited September 19, 2017 by Yexin

[TheSS]

10 minutes ago, Yexin said:

well, i explained my reasons why i don't think they'll be clones since the topic is about expressing our thoughts, i never said they are absolute truth and that everyone in this world must believe it

if for some reason my comment offended your feelings (which i believe, judging by your reaction), i sincerely apologize

Did my reaction seem emotional? That wasn't my intent. I just wanted to elaborate on my points so that they didn't confuse you. I didn't think my word choices had an emotional tinge to them.

[NoirCore]

Er, we haven't even seen Navarre in action. All we got is that UK trailer leak. I think it's too soon to claim one is "likely" a clone of another. With the logic of Lyn not dual wielding in the first place, we can also apply that logic to Navarre who may just use one sword instead, famous for dual wielding or not.

[Ertrick36]

3 hours ago, TheSS said:

If this is true, then the generic moveset theory is only gaining more traction. Which I like. I want more characters if possible.

Maybe.

Or it could just be that they're using the concept of cloning movesets specifically so that they can include certain characters.  As in, they're only doing it to put in popular characters like Lyn, Lucina, or all the Fates royals without exerting the time and effort to give all of them unique movesets.

Though it's too early to tell at this point.

[TheSS]

37 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

Maybe.

Or it could just be that they're using the concept of cloning movesets specifically so that they can include certain characters.  As in, they're only doing it to put in popular characters like Lyn, Lucina, or all the Fates royals without exerting the time and effort to give all of them unique movesets.

Though it's too early to tell at this point.

This is very possible, and something I'm a bit afraid of. Still, the fact that generic mages use the same attacks as Robin is pretty good evidence, too.

[Deva Ashera]

5 minutes ago, TheSS said:

This is very possible, and something I'm a bit afraid of. Still, the fact that generic mages use the same attacks as Robin is pretty good evidence, too.

Not too surprised there, honestly. Hylian Captains in Hyrule Warriors used moves from Link too..so I think it's possible we'll see more stuff like this..maybe even from unique movesets.

[Tenzen12]

4 hours ago, Deva Ashera said:

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Lyn dual wielding was a reference to her Awakening DLC, who appeared to dual wield as well in artwork and, if I recall, in-game, as well as a way for them to make her more unique while also letting her have both the Sol and Mani Katti.

Yes, that's what I think so too. Also considering Lyn is featured (in that picture at least) as part of main cast it's very possible that Navarre will be clone of Lyn rather then opposite. If he is gonna be dual wield in first place that is. 

Edited September 19, 2017 by Tenzen12

[The DanMan]

7 hours ago, TheSS said:

If this is true, then the generic moveset theory is only gaining more traction. Which I like. I want more characters if possible.

It's not really. This is likely due to Lyn being a late addition; they were able to use Navarre as a pre-established base.

Clones are still a minority, and they seem to have been done when it was most convenient rather than any pre-determined class theory.

[Seazas]

2 hours ago, Tenzen12 said:

Yes, that's what I think so too. Also considering Lyn is featured (in that picture at least) as part of main cast it's very possible that Navarre will be clone of Lyn rather then opposite. If he is gonna be dual wield in first place that is. 

Nope. Navarre is from one of the three games so it makes no sense for him to be a clone of Lyn. Lyn was forced last second from Intelligent Systems like Lucina. There's likely a generic myrmidon moveset and instead of one copying another they copied that. 

"It's not really. This is likely due to Lyn being a late addition; they were able to use Navarre as a pre-established base." -Dan

^ This

 

Edited September 19, 2017 by Peaceful_User

[Arthur97]

2 hours ago, Tenzen12 said:

Yes, that's what I think so too. Also considering Lyn is featured (in that picture at least) as part of main cast it's very possible that Navarre will be clone of Lyn rather then opposite. If he is gonna be dual wield in first place that is. 

Consider that, other than Marth, this picture is mostly secondary characters anyways. Female Robin isn't even in the story. This picture shouldn't be taken as she was a main focus.

[Deva Ashera]

18 minutes ago, Peaceful_User said:

Nope. Navarre is from one of the three games so it makes no sense for him to be a clone of Lyn. Lyn was forced last second from Intelligent Systems like Lucina. There's likely a generic myrmidon moveset and instead of one copying another they copied that. 

"It's not really. This is likely due to Lyn being a late addition; they were able to use Navarre as a pre-established base." -Dan

^ This

You're making an assumption. Koei Tecmo said MOSTLY pulling from those three titles as a focus, not only. It's possible it was worded this way due to Lyn and possibly Celica being in from the get-go but not feeling a need to have those games as a focus. 

Fact is, at the moment, we just don't know who came first or even if Navarre plays like Lyn.

[TheSS]

1 hour ago, The DanMan said:

It's not really. This is likely due to Lyn being a late addition; they were able to use Navarre as a pre-established base.

Clones are still a minority, and they seem to have been done when it was most convenient rather than any pre-determined class theory.

Well, if Lyn and Navarre use the same moveset, then there will be 9 characters of the 26 we know of who share a moveset with someone else. Which means only 17 of them are unique movesets.

My guess is that so far they've focused on bringing out big names, and that the remaining unique movesets (Such as Kellam as a knight, or Inigo as a Hero) as well as a large number of clones comprise many lesser characters who wouldn't excite as many people.