Which FE is closest to being an epic?

[Alistair]

In the epic poem sense, at least. According to Wikipedia, these are some common elements of an epic poem:

1. Begins in medias res (at the start of the story).
2. The setting is vast, covering many nations, the world or the universe.
3. Begins with an invocation to a muse (epic invocation).
4. Begins with a statement of the theme.
5. Includes the use of epithets (character names like "grey-eyed Athena" in the Iliad).
6. Contains long lists, called an epic catalouge (unit list/inventory, any one?)
7. Features long and formal speeches.
8. Shows divine intervention on human affairs.
9. Features heroes that embody the values of the civilization.
10. Often features the tragic hero's descent into the Underworld or hell.

 

Now, of the games I have played I think Fates is the most epic-like, but from what I've heard Genealogy is probably the closest, even though it's still missing things like the invocation of the muse or extensive divine intervention (Naga et. al. don't get actively involved in Genealogy's plot, Forseti notwithstanding).

[eclipse]

Did somebody say Archanea?  I think both books should cover most of the points nicely.

[Dandy Druid]

Agreeing with eclipse, Archanea covers a lot of those points.

FE4 also has some of the points, but its backstory (The Twelve Crusaders) is more of an epic though.

The Kaga games feature more of these elements, because IIRC he had a fondness for Norse Mythology and King Arthur tales.

[Slumber]

Genealogy probably hits more of those, but you'd still have to stretch some of those qualifiers.

[ping]

Radiant Dawn?

The setting includes all of the known world, the protagonists are the "silver-haired maiden" and the "radiant hero" (although I'm not sure if Ike's called that during the story) and we most certainly see divine intervention. The first chapter features the usual bandits (i.e. not the true villains of the game), but the opening cutscene has Micaiah and Sothe on the run from Begnion soldiers, so I guess it's more In Media Res than most other FE games.

[sirmola]

 

4 hours ago, Alistair said:

Begins in medias res (at the start of the story).

That's not what that means. In medias res means partway through the story.

FE4 feels most like an epic to me. I will go over it one at a time (note: quotes use the old translation.

1. kind of... It's the begining of the main character's involvemonet, but not really the bengining of the story. THe war in isac is arguably the begining of the story, and that all takes place offscreen.

2. The entire point of this game's oft-maligned massive maps is to impart this sense of massive scale, and that this war is really covering a whole continent.

3 and 4. Not really, although the title does hint at the theme.

5. Some instances, such as langobalt being called "the avaricious Lord Langobalt of Dozel" during the prolog, but it does not happen that much. This point also seems like the sort of thing that would be vulnerable to being lost or gained in translation.

6. Not as clearly as many actual poems, but the introductory sequence of chapters often introduces all the bosses and such. Here the opening blurb from chapter 7:

Quote

Word spread of the liberation army under Imperial Prince Celice, instilling a sense of courage in those still suffering under the empire’s tyrannical rule.
As a result uprisings broke out in almost every corner of the continent.
However, many lacked solid leadership and were easily crushed by the empire.
Casualities at the hands of the imperial troops were enormous.

In the Kingdom of Lenster in the Thracia Peninsula, Cuan’s son, Prince Leaf, assembled a resistance force with Fin’s assistance.
But they suffered a crushing defeat before King Blume’s massive army and found themselves stranded in enemy territory.
The Yied Desert was administered by a Lopt Sectarian named Cutozov from Yied Shrine.
Stationed in the oasis town of Darna was Bramsel, a former merchant, and Jabarro, commander of a mercenary squad.

Prince Ishtor and the highly revered General Liza protected Melgen Castle, while Duke Leptor’s son, King Blume, was at the captal in Alster with his niece, a young mage named Tinny.

Celice was all set to depart Rivough and lead the warriors of Isaac’s liberation army on a rescue mission to distant Lenster.
Each warrior put aside his and her individual concerns as they embraced the new challenge before them.

Fully half of that is a list of the important people that we will either kill or recruit this chapter. The ending is also very list-like then it describes where everyone went afterwards.

7. Not really.

8.One of the main characters in the second half of the game, and the one who aids the heroes most, is lteraly a worshiped as a god in the setting. Also, the holy weapons in general.

9. Yes. Although sigurd is massively flawed, both sigurd and celice are good people, who never intentionally do anything evil (although for sigurd, the fact that the word "intentionally" is there is massively important).

10. No, although there is that optional event in chapter 10 where celice can talk to the spirits of his parents, which bares some tonal similarities.

Quote

???:
“Celice… Celice…..”

Celice:
“Who… who’s calling me?”

???:
“…Oh, how you’ve grown, Celice.”

Celice:
“M, mother!? Mother, is that you?”

Diadora:
“…Ah, Levin has done such a fine job with you. …Celice, always treasure those in your presence. Honour each and every one of them.”

Celice:
“Y, yes, mother! Hey, I slew Emperor Alvis! I’ve finally avenged father’s death!”

Diadora:
“…I see. …What then of Yurius and Yuria?”

Celice:
“Yurius and Yuria? Do you know where they are!?”

Diadora:
“…”

Celice:
“Mother?”

Sigurd:
“…Celice…”

Celice:
“Who’s th-“
Father? Is that you!?

Sigurd:
“…Celice, don’t let Alvis’ death go to your head. His defeat wasn’t by your hand alone.”

Celice:
“Huh? Father, what’s that supposed to mean?”

Sigurd:
“…Get to know the people’s sorrow. Your reality and theirs are still worlds apart. …If you can’t accomplish that, Celice, then this whole war has been for nothing.”

Celice:
“F, father! Please… wait a second!!”

???:
“…Take care of yourself, my son.”

Celice:
“Mother…”

 

Edited September 27, 2017 by sirmola

[Reality]

I swear wikipedia is gettting Worse. 

This kind of definition for the epic seems aimed  for the Odyssey, The Illiad, The Shashanah, and if you stretch things maybe the Eddas, but it's utterly absurd when applied many other epic poems. Thinking of Patterson, or The Cantos in these limited terms would be ridiculous..

Even in the context of the "traditional"folk-epics, such a list does not adequately explain commonalities in the epic as a form- and they (the listed common features) focuses much more on commonalities of plot and subject matter which are obviously not a fixed part of what defines an epic. 

 

Anyway, no Fire Emblem game is remotely like an epic. 

[edgelordweeaboo]

Genealogy of the Holy War