Sooo I accidentally saw my teachers phone’s homescreen.

[Res]

33 minutes ago, Greencapps said:

To be fair I don't really pay attention to the news all that much but considering the political climate I'd assume there'd be so much outrage over most of them I'd hear about them regardless. If you want to continue the discussion I'd appreciate some sources so I know you didn't just pull the numbers out of thin air.

Sure! I actually had sources ready since I'm more used to posting in Serious Discussion.

Nearly 3 women killed each day by intimate partners. (This source claims it's more than 3).

1 in 3 women and 1 in 4 men have been victims of domestic violence at some point in their life; however, 94% of the victims of these murder suicides are female.

The deadliest shootings you didn't hear about in 2016 (most victims of mass shootings in the U.S. are women and children, and many mass shootings are domestic violence cases). And in 2017 (obviously this article was written prior to the Las Vegas mass shooting). 

17 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

though that even includes people who came out way later and said “I never reported this but here’s what happened”  so some could be lying BUT some still didn’t come up or didn’t even know they were victimized (yes this happens a lot)

so yea kinda sucks. 

This is a cartoon, but it handily explains why it's hard for victims (of all genders!) to step forward in general. I've also heard from people who've attempted to report to the police that often the interrogation makes them so feel humiliated or re-victimized that they turn around and go back home. And even when there's a conviction... a friend of mine was beaten so badly by her partner that her blood splattered onto the ceiling; she was saved because a neighbor was awake and happened to hear her screams and called the police. She nearly died and he received a one year sentence (she also had to go home and scrub her own blood off the ceiling after she got out of hospital!). 

And this isn't to say that men aren't victims too, because they often are. But when victims are disbelieved in general, it's hard for any of them to seek help.  

Edit: Well, this is a very cheerful top-of-the-page.

Edited October 20, 2017 by Res

[IEatLasers]

I know 

[Res]

3 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

I know 

I wasn't trying to disagree or argue with you; I quoted you so I could post the cartoon to back you up/for the benefit of others!

I must come across as a real ass in text because I'm always being taken the wrong way... 

[Greencapps]

Not to discount the facts or make it seem like less of a problem than it is, and additionally not saying that this is what you're saying I just feel like this should be brought up when discussing a topic like this, but perhaps the fact that we see a such a wide difference in what sex gets killed isn't because of a nebulous patriarchy entity keeping women down rather the innate differences between the sexes? Ex: Men are generally more aggressive and stronger than females and are more likely to resort to violence.

Either way it all sucks that stuff like this happens. :/

Additionally you don't know how nice it is to have someone actually cite some sources rather than just spew facts with no way to back them up.

[Res]

2 minutes ago, Greencapps said:

Not to discount the facts or make it seem like less of a problem than it is, and additionally not saying that this is what you're saying I just feel like this should be brought up when discussing a topic like this, but perhaps the fact that we see a such a wide difference in what sex gets killed isn't because of a nebulous patriarchy entity keeping women down rather the innate differences between the sexes? Ex: Men are generally more aggressive and stronger than females and are more likely to resort to violence.

There is actually something to be said for that; I've found experiences written by trans people to be really fascinating with regards to the effects of higher testosterone levels, for example! But it's also tricky because so much is embedded within society that it's very hard to divorce ourselves from our upbringing and the influence of our peers. (Heck, I find it really tough as a parent to avoid gender stereotyping). I just read this paper and found the section titled 'How to De-Naturalize Men's Violence and Build Human Connection' to address what you're saying. 

[IEatLasers]

It’s nt that just was trying to show I agreed  without really saying more on it 

[Greencapps]

Wow I'm really impressed by how well read you are and really just how civil this whole thread has been. I expected it spark a flame war almost instantly. I might be coming of as hyperbolic or pandering right now but I'm just legitimately impressed.

Anyways I'm kinda stuck in school right now so I can't really do heavy reading right now but I'll try to get to it in the future.

And on trying not to use stereotypes when raising kids, don't beat yourself up over it the fact that you're even thinking this much about it probably means your doing fine.

[Res]

5 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

It’s nt that just was trying to show I agreed  without really saying more on it 

Ah, I'm sorry for the confusion. This is why I hate text sometimes!

4 minutes ago, Greencapps said:

Wow I'm really impressed by how well read you are and really just how civil this whole thread has been. I expected it spark a flame war almost instantly. I might be coming of as hyperbolic or pandering right now but I'm just legitimately impressed.

Anyways I'm kinda stuck in school right now so I can't really do heavy reading right now but I'll try to get to it in the future.

And on trying not to use stereotypes when raising kids, don't beat yourself up over it the fact that you're even thinking this much about it probably means your doing fine.

Thank you, I do try! Good luck with the rest of your day at school!

[Rezzy]

7 hours ago, Res said:

It's similar to how 'punching up' is considered acceptable in comedic routines, but not 'punching down'; until we actually have equality, I'm think it's fine to give a pass to the person who's punching up. 

Neither sex should get a pass when it comes to domestic violence.  The physical repercussions of domestic violence are very visible, but is most cases, it's the psychological damage that someone you is hurting you that deals the most damage, which isn't seen as a mark on the body.

I had a girlfriend who hit me and threw things at me.  I'm a large person comparatively and she was no physical match for me.  It doesn't occur to you to fight back.  You are stunned and numb when you're attacked by a partner, and whether she can do any actual harm isn't relevant.  I imagine guys feel the same way, and it's not funny when a partner attacks the other, even if they aren't doing any actual physical damage.

 

I was looking at some stats and one struck me as odd.  In 1976, the number of men and women killed by a partner was roughly equal with slightly more women the victim, but the numbers for 2000 has the women being the victim at a 3:1 rate. source

The numbers for men dropped precipitously, while the women's also dropped, but not by as much.  I'd be curious to see how the data was gathered, because that trend is odd.

 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Rezzy

[Res]

Yeah, I witnessed emotional abuse in my parents' marriage (between them, never directed at us although it had some effect on us, of course) for three decades and I was also bullied throughout my entire schooling, so I'm aware of the psychological damage and how a person can be worn down, piecemeal. It's definitely not to be ignored and I'm very sorry it happened to you. :(

I don't think *any* domestic violence is ever funny, to be clear. I meant that the teacher's home screen (which I don't think implies emotional violence, just assertiveness) doesn't carry the same societal implications as if it the saying was reversed. Hopefully she just has it on her phone as a mantra/reminder to herself to be strong and it isn't indicative of how she carries herself in a romantic relationship! 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Res

[Greencapps]

2 minutes ago, Res said:

I meant that the teacher's home screen (which I don't think implies emotional violence, just assertiveness) doesn't carry the same societal implications as if it the saying was reversed.

Double standards at work folks.

[Tryhard]

it was just an observation i found funny

i'd imagine anyone's reaction to it would be 'yikes'

yeah, if you want to look at purely with no other factors people might see a man saying the same being perceived as worse as being a double standard, but that's because it harkens back to times in admittedly male-dominated societies in which men had most of the power in family life and also a lot of the responsibility. something that we try to minimise these days

personally, i think some slack can be given on this one 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Tryhard

[Res]

I'm also admittedly probably perceiving it in a more positive light due to my own experiences (if someone like my mother had it as her home screen, I'd probably cheer her on) but on reflection I can absolutely see how it could equally be taken in a negative light. 

[Rezzy]

6 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

it was just an observation i found funny

i'd imagine anyone's reaction to it would be 'yikes'

yeah, if you want to look at purely with no other factors people might see a man saying the same being perceived as worse as being a double standard, but that's because it harkens back to times in admittedly male-dominated societies in which men had most of the power in family life and also a lot of the responsibility. something that we try to minimise these days

personally, i think some slack can be given on this one 

I have the same reaction to both honestly: mild amusement.  If you see yourself as the superior in a relationship, that's not the best way to be going about things.

I just get "triggered" for lack of a better word when domestic violence comes into the picture.

[Greencapps]

9 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

personally, i think some slack can be given on this one 

Literally the definition of a double standard.

And again my reaction is more of a "Yikes" than "Wow this teachers a dick" just pointing out the fact it is one regardless of its preserved severity.

[Res]

4 minutes ago, Rezzy said:

I just get "triggered" for lack of a better word when domestic violence comes into the picture.

I'm really sorry I triggered you, it was a bad tangent for me to go off on.

5 minutes ago, Greencapps said:

Literally the definition of a double standard.

And again my reaction is more of a "Yikes" than "Wow this teachers a dick" just pointing out the fact it is one regardless of its preserved severity.

The one thing I really hope I can do is to bring up my kids to a) treat others as equally as possible and b) not be abusers/manipulators of any kind! 

 

[Tryhard]

4 minutes ago, Greencapps said:

Literally the definition of a double standard.

And again my reaction is more of a "Yikes" than "Wow this teachers a dick" just pointing out the fact it is one regardless of its preserved severity.

it doesn't really matter to me, because I think both are dumb things to say, but I was just pointing out the historical reasons that come to mind, not necessarily the statement itself

if you want an actual example that I can recall, I remember the hosts on The Talk joking about a story on daytime TV where a man was castrated by his wife and his penis thrown in a garbage disposal unit. some people were outraged, but I don't remember hearing anyone really condemning the show for that and life went on.

if guys on a panel sat around joking about a husband who mutilated his wife's genitals I have a feeling there would be more outrage in that particular case, but maybe I'm just extrapolating.

alas

[Rezzy]

1 minute ago, Res said:

I'm really sorry I triggered you, it was a bad tangent for me to go off on.

 

It's okay, it's something that happened, but I don't want people walking on eggshells around me, it's just that's why it's a touchy subject for me.

I don't want to be a buzzkill, so let's keep smiling.

[Greencapps]

9 minutes ago, Res said:

The one thing I really hope I can do is to bring up my kids to a) treat others as equally as possible and b) not be abusers/manipulators of any kind! 

Res your fine that wasn't even directed twords you! Keep doing what you're doing and I'm sure they'll turn out fine.

5 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

it doesn't really matter to me, because I think both are dumb things to say, but I was just pointing out the historical reasons that come to mind, not necessarily the statement itself

if you want an actual example that I can recall, I remember the hosts on The Talk joking about a story on daytime TV where a man was castrated by his wife and his penis thrown in a garbage disposal unit. some people were outraged, but I don't remember hearing anyone really condemning the show for that and life went on.

if guys on a panel sat around joking about a husband who mutilated his wife's genitals I have a feeling there would be more outrage in that particular case, but maybe I'm just extrapolating.

alas

You're not extrapolating that's exactly what would happen and it sucks that our society has gotten to the point where that was ok.

I get where you were coming from I just don't think it was a very good argument.

[Res]

8 minutes ago, Tryhard said:

if you want an actual example that I can recall, I remember the hosts on The Talk joking about a story on daytime TV where a man was castrated by his wife and his penis thrown in a garbage disposal unit. some people were outraged, but I don't remember hearing anyone really condemning the show for that and life went on

Sadly there probably would be more outrage. I feel like in general that it's becoming less acceptable to joke about such things, thankfully. I do feel like society is becoming more aware and sensitive to such issues.

Incidentally I looked up the case and the woman did receive a life sentence, so that's good!

[IEatLasers]

It’s a misconception that girls get away with anything we want 

 

but yes it can be a thing that happens. Sometimes girls are treated more easily in bad situations. 

 

So yea. That happens. 

 

Thats NO reason to ignore that women were, and very much still are, treated poorly, unfairly, not taken seriously, and are often assaulted. Or hurt. We shouldn’t just ignor it 

[claire]

P U $$ Y

[Greencapps]

11 hours ago, IEatLasers said:

It’s a misconception that girls get away with anything we want 

I don't think anybody was saying this

[IEatLasers]

2 hours ago, Greencapps said:

I don't think anybody was saying this

Maybe not here.