Are there any games that you loved at first, but now you dislike them?

[Water Mage]

As the title says, are there any games you guys really liked at first, but then you replay it, and the you start seeing it’s flaws which makes you dislike it? Like, you realize that the game’s story is really flawed or the gameplay is pretty bad? 

In my case it’s Persona 5.

I was replaying Persona 5, and I loved it at first, but now I’m starting to dislike it. Mostly because of how the story is actually really flawed. I mean, it’s too “black and white” and suffers from a serious case of protagonist-centered morality. When you think about it, changing someone’s heart is actually really creepy and not really heroic. The Phantom Thieves criticize the “Black Mask” for committing murder, but their alternative isn’t much better from a moral point of view. I mean, they are robbing someone of their desires and force that person to be apologetic for the rest of their lives. That’s actually really disturbing, no matter how much evil the person was.

[Gebby]

Every Call of Duty with advanced movement. It was cool at first, but now it's undesirable.

Also Smash Bros, not so much because I dislike the game, but the community can go fuck itself tbh.

[MCProductions]

Syphon Filter 3, I loved the game to death when I was younger, and as a GAME, I still do but...
Holy ASS what happened to the story? I never thought I'd see a game story where literally nothing happens but they STILL resort to asspulls to save the main character, including reviving a character who died in Syphon Filter 2 with the excuse "She was just wounded". Bullshit, she was shot in the head, and Syphon Filter is VERY CLEAR that headshots equal death in this series

[Tolvir]

World of Warcraft. I used to love that game, but both the older I got, and the more I paid any level of attention to the dev team, the more I disliked the game. Its probably one of the most annoyingly managed MMOs out there. Between them having to re invent the wheel every expansion with all the classes, their writing being really bad for the last 2 expansions (excluding Legion), their constant emphasis on raids, etc.

Every expansion they seem to take a few steps forward, and another 10 steps back. Legion is a great example of this. They got the story back on track, they brought back Illidan, we are finally taking care of the Burning Legion once and for all, Demon Hunters became playable, Thrall was entirely removed from the story, there was other content to do besides just raids and dungeons, mythic dungeons were great, the new change to eliminate PvP Gear was a good move, and then comes all the bad.

Unfortunately, the bad things they did are actually less than the good, but what they did was so bad that it made the expansion a pain in the ass. The biggest culprit being crafting. The new crafting system tried to get players more into crafting, more interactive. Quests, multiple ranks for gathering and crafting skills, etc. Unfortunately you also had to do quests for almost every recipe was locked behind questing, and even worst for cooking, an NPC that would very rarely actually give you recipes. These quests even required you to do dungeons, and even raids to get them, so for casual players it was locked behind content they otherwise had no interest in doing. The questing zones all had to be played through to get the end game stuff. So while one of the great points of Legion was freedom with questing, choosing where you want to go due to level scaling, ultimately that choice didnt matter because in order to unlock the ability to do world quests you had to go through all the major questlines. Meaning you had to do every questing zone in Legion. Suramar, while a fun and good idea, quickly became draining because of how slow reputation gains were, and leads to the other big issue of Legion. Reputations meant nothing. There wasnt a single reason to get reputations up besides unlocking flying.

And this is pretty much the story of WoW from start to finish. It sucks, because I have always loved the world and the lore, and the game at its core was always at least enjoyable, but having to relearn my characters every expansion because they completely redesigned the class isnt. And all the other 20k problems they have every expansion doesnt help.

Sucks because the new expansion is looking to be great, between the 4 new races they are introducing and them finally doing a South Seas expansion from the looks of things. But knowing how the game has worked in the past, unless there are some drastic changes to how they do things I wont be coming back.

[Duster]

Zelda: Breath of the wild

 

 

[Slumber]

Kingdom Hearts 2.

Spoiler

When I first played it, I was so nostalgia-blind for it being a new KH game after a long time without a proper one. Bad anime writing didn't grate on 14-year-old me(I was still mostly unfamiliar with anything not DBZ), and I didn't like the level design, but couldn't really figure out why.

Played it again like, 6 years later, and absolutely hated it. I finally wrapped my mind around why I hated the level design: It was all very flat and linear. Whereas the first game gave you tons of platforming abilities to make levels more vertical with more to explore, and more to make you go back and revisit levels for, KH2 relegated platforming abilities behind your Drives or whatever they were called. They were completely optional, meaning the levels in the game were designed around the abilities you have at the very beginning of the game. The first few worlds are no less intricate or complex than the last. On top of this, they pretty much removed all optional exploration and the platforming abilities you COULD get mostly existed to just make getting through levels faster. Exploring was one of my favorite parts of KH1, and I was sad to see it gutted.

On top of this, the bad, bad, BAD anime writing couldn't have bugged me any more. It'd be one thing if the bad anime writing simply existed and didn't displace anything else, but it did. The whole gimmick of you going from Disney world to Disney world basically became window dressing, and it was all a set up to just give you an excuse to chase around Organization XIII(Oh God, what a bunch of losers) members. It didn't really matter at all that you were in Mulan's China, or that you were in Tron, or the Underworld. These kinds of things DID matter in KH1, because the whole point of the game was to rescue Disney princesses, and the villains' plot revolved around Disney stuff. It seemed like an afterthought in KH2. The developers threw in Disney worlds because of contractual obligations.

Some more minor things like the combat also bugged me. I was never a huge fan of KH1's combat, but while I recognize that 2's better on a technical level and moving/fighting felt better, magic basically didn't matter anymore. You could pretty much spam anything mindlessly and beat anything pretty easily. Again, KH1 wasn't the most engaging combat, but you certain magics did do better against some enemies, and the game would toss enemies at you and reward you if you knew how to exploit their weaknesses.

Another Square title, Final Fantasy XIII.

Spoiler

I was pretty "meh" on it when it came out, but I'd defend it by saying stuff like "Well, at least it's not X." Pretty much immediately after starting my second playthrough, I regretted ever saying anything nice about it aside from when I said "It's pretty." It was pretty.

I couldn't stand any of the main characters beyond Fang and Sazh, arguably the two least prominent members of the party. Lightning was especially bad on a second playthrough. I thought she was pretty inoffensive the first time, but the second time made me realize what a fucking piece of shit she is. She's abusive, she's mean, she's arguably a genocidal maniac(Her first instinct upon becoming a L'cie is to bring down Cocoon, the one place humanity believes it can live). In the end, her plan is the correct one, but they come to this conclusion after conversations with Barthandelus and trips to Gran Pulse, which they learn isn't quite what they've been told. She violently assaults Snow on multiple occasions for trying to keep the group from falling apart and giving up(Imagine pretty much any of their scenes together if the genders were reversed), and her development is laughable. Visually she's literally just a gender-swapped Cloud, and personality-wise, she's a more emotionally immature and violently anti-social Squall. In case anyone forgot, Squall's whole schtick is that he's emotionally immature and anti-social. Whereas Squall was given a ton of backstory and development to address this, Lightning got none. Her backstory is "She's a soldier who had to take care of her sister.", and her development is "A whiny brat annoys her to the point where she learns to deal with it." If she got gradual development, it may have been fine. FFVIII takes place over the course of months, a reasonable time to expect a friendless asshole to make friends and open up. I believe FFXIII takes place over the course of about 2 days. Lightning goes from casually abusing her party members to wanting to fite 4 her frands in about 48 hours. Every attempt Square makes at trying to make Lightning an iconic character makes me hate her more and more.

The story's also a total mess, and narrative it's probably the worst presentation I've ever seen in a video game. There are tons of games that make you read random notes to get a full grasp on the story(Something games like Resident Evil made popular), but you never needed those to understand the absolute basics of what the world is about. Evil lab modifying life forms to make weapons, cops investigating, double crossing, evil ultimate weapon at the end. Simple, easy, everything you find out adds to it. FFXIII stumbles pretty much from the first cutscene, never giving you any sort of explanation of what the hell is going on, how/why people are being rounded up, why Lightning is there, where they're going, or really anything at all. We never see anything like that again for the rest of the game. Alien terms are being tossed around left and right with absolutely nobody stopping to explain anything(Which they realized was a horrible idea, since people stop and talk about things in the second game), and this continues for the rest of the game. Party members NEVER stop to talk about or try to understand things. If you want to know what's going on, you have to read through pages and pages of codex every time a major story beat happens. Even if you do, it's really not worth it. Events still feel random and half-cocked.

The combat was another big one. This one got to me before I started the second playthrough. The game goes through a lot of hoops to make you think the battle system is more tactical AND fast-paced than that stupid old ATB system FF has been using since IV... until you realize the game is still using ATB, and all of that flair is there to keep you from realizing that you have less control over your party than any of the games that came before it. FFXII also forced you to control just one party member, but it gave you a very, very in-depth system to have them act how you want them to at any given moment. Paradigms are the one thing that could have been a saving grace, but once you find out the right combo(There aren't many) for any given fight, the game can literally play itself. It becomes incredibly boring and frustrating.

You can bet your ass that after replaying both XIII and X, I had waaaaaay more fun with X. And I still don't really like X much. I've stopped saying "At least it's not X".

Those are the two big ones that come to mind. There are probably more.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Slumber

[Nobody]

Fire Emblem: Awakening, the topic.

Played the game a lot, nowadays I can't stand it. Basically, it was my first fire emblem game, but as soon as I played another of the games is the series back in 2013 I noticed that it wasn't that great. Then, I got better at the series, understood more and more of its concepts and noticed how terrible map design and balance were. THEN, I played Lunatic and Lunatic+ and through those experiences realized how extremely broken Robin, Pair Up and Veteran are, and how trivial the game is on any difficulty that does not revolve around luck (i.e. Lunatic+), since Robin can legitimately solo the entirety of Lunatic mode after being fed kills in the prologue.

My opinion of the game got worse and worse the more I played and thought about it.

 

ORAS is another one as well. I'm a huge fan of the original RSE games, and so I was really, really looking forwards to the remakes. Despite starting with Yellow back in 99, I was never that much of a fan of GSC (even as a kid, I'd still play yellow more, though I also played Silver a lot) and seeing how much HGSS improved them I couldn't help but be excited about how much the "Best Gen" would be made even better. What happened was the opposite. A lot of the game was made simplier, there was a focus on mega evolution that made the "main story" less important, many areas of the game were simplified and made smaller (sky pillar, desert, the cave in that island, etc), the game lacks a lot of charm the original had and honestly, soaring made the region feel small and unimportant, while in the original it felt huge and full of misteries. Then there's the fact the game didn't add any of the emerald latter additions. People tried to justify that saying that it was a "remake of Ruby and Saphire, not Emerald" but that didn't fly with me, since FRLG and HGSS added tons of features that the originals lacked. The sense of nostalgia was enough to make me enjoy the game a lot at first but as I started to look past that, I noticed how empty the game was and how much Emerald was better to this day.

Doesn't help that it was released after XY, which I absolutely loved and made me feel almost as I did when I played Ruby and Emerald.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Nobody

[MisterIceTeaPeach]

Honestly each (3)DS Fire Emblem game except for Conquest. Enjoyed them till I noticed by playing the Judgral games how amazing the FE gameplay already was almost two decades ago. Even Echoes became uninteresting in my second playthrough because of their mediocre game mechanics and map design.
 

[De Geso]

Super Smash Bros. I used to love playing them with my friends, but after playing Third Strike a lot I realize how bare bones Smash is as a fighting game and I don't really care for the simplicity of it.

[The Envoy of the Beginning]

The first-generation Pokemon games. I loved playing them back in the day, but they failed the test of time as the later Pokemon games got released.

Edited October 31, 2017 by BLSoldier

[Frosty]

Believe it or not, I don't like Call of Duty (the exception to this is the original game which I still adore).

There's a lot of stuff that the later games made me want to distance from it, and aside from those certain reasons; it started to lose its charm for me.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

FE7

 

Playing the game twice trying to practice my flier using skill and then trying ranked mode made me realize how WHO THE SHIT DESIGNED THIS PIECE OF CRAP it late game really is

[NSSKG151]

Xenoblade Chronicles- I like the characters but there are just way too many sidequests of gathering this many items or kill the enemy this many times. It's gets way too tedious.

Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time-  Hyrule Field and other locations feel too barren with nothing of note going on in that world. Not to mention the whole Zelda/Shiek thing although I have always disliked Shiek. I didn't really like how Zelda gets kidnapped the moment she goes from posing as a 'strong man' for seven years into a princess and Ganondorf whisks her away with ease.

Used to be my favorite Zelda game but that honors goes to A Link to the Past.  Now these days I dislike any Zelda game that came out after this game besides Oracle of Season/Ages.

[Ertrick36]

2 hours ago, Gebby said:

Also Smash Bros, not so much because I dislike the game, but the community can go fuck itself tbh.

I feel this so much on a spiritual level.

Smash has always been more of a party game for me, so if there's any reason I don't play it that much anymore, it's because I don't do parties anymore.  Though I'll still gloat about that level I made in Brawl that was literally just two adjacent treadmills going opposite ways.

 

I'll say Saints Row the Third.  It was my introduction into that series, and it was so wild and amazing for me when I initially played it.  But then I later played SR2 (since it came with SRIII), and realized how much better of a gang-war game that was.  I still think SRIII is okay, but it isn't quite as fun for me anymore.

Call of Duty is more a series I loved at first, but now I can't really stand it.  I originally played CoD 3 on the Wii, and then later CoD 4 on the PS3, and I had an excellent time with them.  MW2 and WAW rolled out, I still had fun and even played the first game.  Though I played MW2 multiplayer so often (and lost so often) that I got extremely burnt out; it almost got me to stop playing games entirely.  I hope this new CoD could respark my interest in the series, but I'm unsure if it can.

And kudos to Hideo Kojima for creating such a wonderful franchise, but Metal Gear Survive isn't looking to be my cup of tea.  Heck, even MGS V became one of those games that sorta just lost my interest after a bit.  This all being said, I'm still rarin' to play through MGS3, like, a hundred more times.  That game is still great even after all these years.

[Reality]

Dark Cloud

I really like the idea of the dungeons and how they kind of interact with the town building. However, all of the dungeon's are really flat, and combat is made extra unfun due to some halfbaked resource management (breakable weapons, stamina, water). Actually going through them is pretty awful, and even the weapon skill/crafting system doesn't really redeem it when 1/2 of the skills are either effectiveness skills for specific monster families, or skills that make the weapon use less durability against specific monster families! What's worse is that the game gives you multiple playable charathers but you really bother leveling up most of them in order to get through the rare "charather limited" floors in the later dungeons. And this is going beyond the fact that the main charather + Ruby are blantantly going to outclass everyone else either due to Ruby's range attacks, or the main character's having fast start up and wind down animations on his swings compared to all other melee characters.  Game is just too tedious to be worth replaying. Dark Cloud 2  (Dark Chronicle) works a lot better.

Sonic Rush 

 I used to think that the Rush series was a "return to form" but when I try to replay them, I just end up feeling like the boost mechanic is misused, where the Genesis/Advance games would make you work hard to maintain your speed / reserve it for "payoff" by mixing it in with a lot of complicated "claustrophobic" sections. 

Tony Hawk's Underground 2

I really want to like the THUG2 levels, but a lot of them have problems (Skatopia/Barcelona especially). Even the most interesting levels have a very weird flow because all of the good trick lines begin in the same area of the map. (Germany/Australia) At least New Orleans is awesome.  There is also a lot of other disappointing stuff- Even on the high difficulty, the point values you have to earn to get the "Sick" score are really low by the standards of other games. Additionally Focus time and the "Caveman" walking trick, are absurdly broken and let you continue combos that would otherwise be suicidal (doing 1080 of of ramps without enough height, continuing a grind combo even after accidentally going beyond the rails). It really cheapens a lot of the game. Classic mode is nice and it thankfully has more demanding goals than the Story, but it isn't really enough, and the levels don't have the personality of the original due to removal of cut scene oriented goals (EG stopping the police chase in THPS 3 San Fransisco or the Guy with his Tongue stuck to a  pole in Canada) Finally the alternate vehicles are a total disapointment. All of them have generic "super stats" so they all play the same with their magical acceleration/hang time. They just aren't really satisfying due to the total lack of "weight" that they have and their tiny trick lists. In THUG1, the BMX bike was given its own set of physics that made it really stand out from the skateboard, and THPS4 had the idea of vehicles that created difficulties due to having LESS control than the skateboard such as the grocery kart in the Margera Pro Challenge. These were good uses of physics.

Also it goes without saying that the game suffers from "Bam-Mania" which really dates it. Wanton destruction/property damage can remain fun if it's taken to really absurdist levels (Aggresive Inline, to a lesser extent Twisted Metal/World Destruction League) but the in-your-face attitude of this game makes it seem really juvenile.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Reality

[SoulWeaver]

1 hour ago, Nobody said:

ORAS is another one as well. I'm a huge fan of the original RSE games, and so I was really, really looking forwards to the remakes. Despite starting with Yellow back in 99, I was never that much of a fan of GSC (even as a kid, I'd still play yellow more, though I also played Silver a lot) and seeing how much HGSS improved them I couldn't help but be excited about how much the "Best Gen" would be made even better. What happened was the opposite. A lot of the game was made simplier, there was a focus on mega evolution that made the "main story" less important, many areas of the game were simplified and made smaller (sky pillar, desert, the cave in that island, etc), the game lacks a lot of charm the original had and honestly, soaring made the region feel small and unimportant, while in the original it felt huge and full of misteries. Then there's the fact the game didn't add any of the emerald latter additions. People tried to justify that saying that it was a "remake of Ruby and Saphire, not Emerald" but that didn't fly with me, since FRLG and HGSS added tons of features that the originals lacked. The sense of nostalgia was enough to make me enjoy the game a lot at first but as I started to look past that, I noticed how empty the game was and how much Emerald was better to this day.

Doesn't help that it was released after XY, which I absolutely loved and made me feel almost as I did when I played Ruby and Emerald.

The justification I most heard about the lack of Emerald content was either the hope for a Delta Emerald version or the Delta Emerald episode itself, neither of which worked out. I'm still mad that they threw a model of the Battle Frontier into the old location of the Battle Tower from Ruby/Sapphire because it implied that they'd, you know, actually work on adding that in as like an update or, as everyone kept telling me, through a Delta Emerald version.

Really, I think most of the Pokemon games haven't held a lot of replay value for me, though I haven't finished my only Gen 4 game(Platinum), so we'll see how it holds up.

[DarkDestr0yer61]

Skyrim.

Idk why, but I really loved the game when it first came out..... but the game feels like a broken mess and the combat doesn't feel good

[Slumber]

29 minutes ago, DarkDestr0yer61 said:

Skyrim.

Idk why, but I really loved the game when it first came out..... but the game feels like a broken mess and the combat doesn't feel good

I was tempted to say Skyrim as well. The RPG mechanics are super streamlined and way too simplified compared to the games that came before this. Without the flexibility of previous ES games, the core gameplay struggles to hold up a 100 hour adventure. The writing's awful, too. But I still like a lot about Skyrim, even if it's not nearly as amazing as I thought when it came out.

Similar deal with Fallout 3, which I am tempted to say is a game I dislike these days. Replaying Fallout 2, and playing New Vegas after it made me realize that, surprise surprise, Bethesda went overboard with simplifying the RPG mechanics and the open-endedness that the series became famous for. The DC tunnel system ruins the open world, and the shooting mechanics are just bad. Since they didn't add iron sights yet, your only way of reliably hitting things in combat is V.A.T.S., which becomes incredibly tedious after a while. The writing of the main story(I'm starting to think the people who knew how to write at Bethesda left mid-development of Fallout 3, and never came back, because Bethesda's writing has been atrocious since) is also really bad, and the fact that they needed an expansion to address how awful and pointless the "Selfless sacrifice" at the end of the game was? And that the story of Fallout 3 is straight up a rehash of Fallout 1's, but with a really, really bad dad story?

The RPG mechanics, gameplay and world of Fallout 3 hasn't aged well, and the story, IMO, has never been good. Which is bad when it was supposed to be an evolution of a franchise known for its writing, RPG mechanics and world(At least they got the spotty gameplay down!).

Edited October 31, 2017 by Slumber

[Azure Sen]

Probably Persona 4 is the best example for me. It's not a bad game by any means, but writing-wise I consider it one of the weakest Persona games, and one whose flaws just keep piling up. The pacing is awful, the tone is inconsistent and there's a dramatic shift in tone towards the end that the game has not earned in the slightest, the plot runs on stupid contrivances to even get going, several "sympathetic" characters distinctly aren't (oh hai Yosuke, Chie, Namatame and late-game Dojima!), the humor is...just bad like 90% of the time, and overall it feels a lot like Atlus didn't know what direction to take the game in so they went in all the directions.

[Thany]

Im gonna say hyrule warriors. the repetiveness of giant bosses that dont die started getting to me.

[Armagon]

Paper Mario: Sticker Star. As my first Paper Mario game, i actually enjoyed it. But then, after playing the other Paper Mario games, i realized Sticker Star isn't that good. Like, i don't think it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be but i will agree that it's still the worst Paper Mario game. Though sometimes, the way the Paper Mario community acts makes me want to put TTYD at the bottom out of spite.

1 hour ago, NSSKG151 said:

Xenoblade Chronicles- I like the characters but there are just way too many sidequests of gathering this many items or kill the enemy this many times. It's gets way too tedious.

As someone who loves Xenoblade Chronicles to death, i have to agree with this. The sidequests were probably the worst part of Xenoblade Chronicles because they could get tedious. It usually happened with gathering items (killing enemies was actually fairly straightforward). Some of the items you're tasked to find are super rare. Some only appear during the sidequest but they are still hard to find. Game: "This item is located in Eyrth Sea." Me: "Boi, do you know how big Eyrth Sea is?"

There's also the issue of not being able to find the NPC you need to complete a part of or finish the sidequest.

While i've never played it, i hear Xenoblade Chronicles X fixed this issue by having markers where both the objectives and the people you're supposed to talk to to complete the sidequest are located. And it looks like Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is doing the same. So at least the issue is exclusive to the first game.

3 hours ago, Gebby said:

Also Smash Bros, not so much because I dislike the game, but the community can go fuck itself tbh.

Yeah, the Smash community can get really bad. Usually, it's just Melee worshippers but the Smash 4 community has gotten really toxic as of late. I read an article about how ZeRo got a death threat just because he's considered the best player in the game. Being the best at something will get you hate, that's just human nature. But that doesn't mean we should do it. ZeRo doesn't deserve the hate, especially given how nice he is.

I don't want to generalize everyone in the Smash 4 community (or any part of the Smash community), otherwise, i'd be calling me and my friends toxic, but i won't deny that the Smash community can't get pretty toxic on the competitive side of things.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Armagon

[Tuvy2]

3 hours ago, Gebby said:

Also Smash Bros, not so much because I dislike the game, but the community can go fuck itself tbh.

Hey slow down bud, I wouldn't be so quick to judge entire communities.

Splatoon, it just gets kind of boring after a while. (For me.)

In my case it's not so much as I dislike the game, I just like it less.

[Armagon]

23 minutes ago, Tuvy2 said:

Hey slow down bud, I wouldn't be so quick to judge entire communities.

Splatoon, it just gets kind of boring after a while. (For me.)

In my case it's not so much as I dislike the game, I just like it less

Yeah, the entire Smash community isn't bad. Every community has it's toxic portion, it's just that the toxic portion of Smash's community is very loud. But there are good people in the Smash community. As a somewhat regular at SmashBoards, i can confirm that.

Also, i have to second your thoughts on Splatoon. I never played the first one but i have the second one. It's fun, but it gets really boring after a while.

[NinjaMonkey]

3 hours ago, YouSquiddinMe said:

Super Smash Bros. I used to love playing them with my friends, but after playing Third Strike a lot I realize how bare bones Smash is as a fighting game and I don't really care for the simplicity of it.

Someone hasn't played Street Fighter 5. Also, it's a party game, not a fighting game.

[Water Mage]

2 hours ago, Azure Sen said:

Probably Persona 4 is the best example for me. It's not a bad game by any means, but writing-wise I consider it one of the weakest Persona games, and one whose flaws just keep piling up. The pacing is awful, the tone is inconsistent and there's a dramatic shift in tone towards the end that the game has not earned in the slightest, the plot runs on stupid contrivances to even get going, several "sympathetic" characters distinctly aren't (oh hai Yosuke, Chie, Namatame and late-game Dojima!), the humor is...just bad like 90% of the time, and overall it feels a lot like Atlus didn't know what direction to take the game in so they went in all the directions.

Out of curiosity, what’s your opinion Persona 5’s story?

 

Do you think it’s too black and white? Do you think it suffers from protagonist-centered morality? Honestly, in a story that is supposedly about rebellion, the only morally grey character in the entire game is Akechi. I find him a much more interesting character than all of the Phantom Thieves, and I don’t like when people call him a villain because it puts him in same level as the cartoonishly evil villains of this game like Shido and Kaneshiro. Seriously, Persona 5 has to many cartoonishly evil villains. I suppose it was only way to justify something as morally questionable as changing someone’s heart. 

Edited October 31, 2017 by Water Mage