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So it seems like Micaiah is one of the more polarizing lords in FE history. You either love her or hate her.

This will be purely about Micaiah, what you like and dislike, that sort of thing.

Personally I feel like Micaiah was a very good character that didn't have a chance to shine in what was supposed to be her game. I talked some in other threads about changes I would make to the game to remedy this but I didn't talk much about Micaiah herself and made no mention of gameplay.

So gameplay wise Micaiah is a mage lord in a game that hates mages. Makes a lot of sense... all of the mages in RD need to be fixed but none more so than the main character.. since she's the main character. She's pretty powerful but her speed stinks and she could use higher HP growths to make Sacrifice a more viable skill. Of course I was always lucky enough to get good Micaiahs that were really decent. She didn't have great speed but she wasn't getting regularly doubled and her HP was always good, not to mention she was a reliable dodger.

As for her character Micaiah would have greatly benefitted from being the actual main character of the game. She was made into a villain by the end of Part 3, especially when put in comparison to Ike, and was body snatched through most of Part 4. As for her personality, I find that I've always liked Micaiah. She's a kind person who's forced to choose between a bad situation or a bad situation and while it could have been handled better, I like that she struggles with her decisions.

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honestly for me I never had any issues with micaiah, story wise she had a very unique role in part 3, being a partial villain who was blackmailed into fighting for a cause she didnt believe in, I also find it interesting how she managed to get most of the daein army to hit the point of worshiping her and having absolute belief in her being able to make miracles happen. The matter of her breaking down as the crimeans began succeeding in their invasion also helped show a good level of weakness which all characters need to make them more human.

gameplay wise she always ended up good for me she just needed a seraph robe or two and a couple speed wings and she was good to go, (30% speed growth is still stupid though, if they ever remake RD she needs like 45% at least and then the likelihood of her getting screwed is diminished by quite a good margin) thani was also great low weight high might and bonus damage to the biggest nuisances in the series. her attack was always pretty good and with sacrifice she can heal and cure at the same time, as well as helping her run a great fury with a crt+ forged tome.

as for part 4, I am neutral on that one, I see its handling as necessary, to move the plot along and I also feel like it was reasonable enough, as it wasn't like micaiah's destiny was unforeseeable or anything and I can think of no greater honor than being the voice of a god, but I guess that's just my opinion.

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1 hour ago, thecrimsonflash said:

honestly for me I never had any issues with micaiah, story wise she had a very unique role in part 3, being a partial villain who was blackmailed into fighting for a cause she didnt believe in, I also find it interesting how she managed to get most of the daein army to hit the point of worshiping her and having absolute belief in her being able to make miracles happen. The matter of her breaking down as the crimeans began succeeding in their invasion also helped show a good level of weakness which all characters need to make them more human.

gameplay wise she always ended up good for me she just needed a seraph robe or two and a couple speed wings and she was good to go, (30% speed growth is still stupid though, if they ever remake RD she needs like 45% at least and then the likelihood of her getting screwed is diminished by quite a good margin) thani was also great low weight high might and bonus damage to the biggest nuisances in the series. her attack was always pretty good and with sacrifice she can heal and cure at the same time, as well as helping her run a great fury with a crt+ forged tome.

as for part 4, I am neutral on that one, I see its handling as necessary, to move the plot along and I also feel like it was reasonable enough, as it wasn't like micaiah's destiny was unforeseeable or anything and I can think of no greater honor than being the voice of a god, but I guess that's just my opinion.

Personally I really disliked that they forced into a villain role in Part 3. Against Ike what else could she be but unsympathetic when she's attacking them? Of course that's partially due to the focus being on Ike instead of Micaiah, but still. I feel like Micaiah becoming more desperate was a good move but it could have been handled far better than it actually was and ended up making her seem unlikable to many. Don't get me wrong, I love that part, but she would have benefitted from being the main focus so that we saw things from her side more than Ike's. As for her army that is something I found interesting, but it fits with the narrative from Part 1. It's those very people that she works so hard to protect and they look up to her and respect her, which is something she's never had in her life.

Gameplay wise she was always decent for me. Not a major liability but not someone I would send out alone to take care of huge volumes of enemies. A seraph robe and speed wing was perfectly satisfactory for me in many playthroughs and there were some where she didn't even need those! (Though I do always give her a seraph robe because HP).

Part 4 with Yune is one of my major issues. Yune's a good character for the small time that we see her but she completely usurps Micaiah in scenes that Micaiah should have been in. I feel it would have been better for Yune to manifest in some other form or take control of someone that isn't supposed to be a main character so that Micaiah herself would actually be able to interact. Between Yune and Ike she really just gets messed over.

Still though I really like Micaiah and she remains my favorite Lord. Not saying that I don't like the others by any means, it's just that to me she remains by far the best.

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I love Micaiah's determination, bravery and resolve. Sure every FE lord has these qualities but Micaiah's put into such messy situations beyond her control that I have more sympathy for her than the other lords. 

More importantly, I find discussions involving her character to be fun to read which is probably the main reason why she's my favourite FE character. Furthermore, seeing her growth from a simple robin hood like figure to rebel leader to commander in chief is inspiring. Also, I enjoyed Micaiah's poetic lines as well as her sense of humour. 

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I love Micaiah's determination, bravery and resolve. Sure every FE lord has these qualities but Micaiah's put into such messy situations beyond her control that I have more sympathy for her than the other lords. 

This pretty much shares my opinion of her, so I don't really have anything to add right here.
The only problem I have with her is her relationship to Sothe - whose personality stinks for me - who's nothing more than her bodyguard. Each second line deals with Micaiah, Micaiah... Sure he's her main protector, but it's not like that she could take care of herself at the latest when she's leading an entire army. 

Gameplaywise she's suffering of all the problems mages have in this game: not only squishy but also slow with the same movement as knights (WTF!?)
Another main issue is that she has no authority stars is the entire game which is the main reason why the DB chapters are much harder than of the other two parties. She should start with one in part 1, two in part 2 and three in part 3 to match up with Ike and Elincia. Micaiah is an equal leader as the other two so there's no point not give her any leadership stars.

Edited by Byakuren Hijiri

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Micaiah let's see. I like her design and I think her personal skill is really cool and can be quite useful unfortunately this is held back by Micaiah's lousy HP stat and growth. I've often joked that Micaiah's family must struggle with short life expectancy referring to the HP stat because Sanaki suffers from some of the same problems. As a character I like her well enough although I have always wondered why they made the lord a mage sure it's an interesting class as it has not been done before but I think the fact that she is a mage hinders her useability and reliability. It's no small wonder why most prefer Ike over Micaiah the competition is a Sturdy Mercenary vs a Squishy Mage, because of this Micaiah really needs a higher bases in HP, Sp and preferably better Def not to mention growths in these areas lords typically are more on the front lines and the fact that Micaiah CAN NOT be on the front lines hinders and hurts her as a unit. Usually lords are well rounded in their bases and growths but when it came to Micaiah instead of going the "lords are well rounded" route which I think they should have they went the "mages are squishy" route.

Now I will add that I have always thought that Micaiah should be more of an advisor and perhaps tactician to the DB but it is Nolan who makes the decisions and is in fact the leader. Basically I've always felt Micaiah should be more of a major support character and Nolan is the protagonist especially since I've read that he was the one that formed the DB, but in spite of that most of the time it feels like Micaiah is the one who is the leader. Now Micaiah's ability to sense approaching danger certainly would be paramount but I don't think it would giver her leadership status but advisor and tactician makes sense. It also doesn't help that the writing ignores this ability of Micaiah's when it deems it convenient to do so. For instance why didn't Micaiah's Impending Danger Sense trigger when Pelleas was about to sign the Blood Contract?

Something that I think would have been good to focus on is that Micaiah seems to only care about Daein and anything else doesn't matter what I'm getting at here is she hates Ike for what he caused to Daein (understandably so) even though what she's doing and what Ike did are the same (standing up to protect and free their country). Which leads into the fact that the Black Knight served king Ashnard, SERVED KING ASHNARD Micaiah has no issues trusting him because he wants to see Daein restored and is from Daein. This is something that I think many of the DB and Tauroneo as well would have been skeptical about at least as this man served Ashnard. Decisions like this that are questionable I think should have been brought to attention even if it was just a private conversation say between Nolan and Micaiah. The story seems to brush over this and is like "oh Micaiah is completely right to trust the Black Knight he's one of the four riders that's still around" yeah almost all of the four riders were evil and isn't being that close to Ashnard a little sketchy on one's reputation? 

In summary I think Micaiah is an interesting character she's been on the run because of being Branded, and despite possibly being mistreated because of this she has pure and noble intentions towards people. Even though she lacks experience and qualifications she will do whatever it takes to free Daein and it's people and even defend Daein.

P.S. Silver Haired Maiden whoever did the artwork for your profile did a great job. I feel it does Micaiah justice she looks like a cute, sweet girl.

Edited by SavageVolug

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Micaiah is a interesting idea for protag (being essencially the heroine of the former enemy in the franchise after their defeat, and her position puts her in hard circunstances having to deal with the blue-haired Gorila Ike, the other hero), specially for a Fire Emblem; I had always appreaciate even before I had properly learn about her.

I think I had an a bit depth personal story with her (I would told it if you want)... but other-wise I don't have a lot to say that you don't have already say, I'm bad to properly generate arguments xD

Gamepaly-wise I think she would like to have a better Speed and HP Base and growth (Specially because she has sacrifice and the biggest caps in these stats compared with the other mages not-named Lehran).

Edited by Troykv

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10 hours ago, Byakuren Hijiri said:

This pretty much shares my opinion of her, so I don't really have anything to add right here.
The only problem I have with her is her relationship to Sothe - whose personality stinks for me - who's nothing more than her bodyguard. Each second line deals with Micaiah, Micaiah... Sure he's her main protector, but it's not like that she could take care of herself at the latest when she's leading an entire army. 

Gameplaywise she's suffering of all the problems mages have in this game: not only squishy but also slow with the same movement as knights (WTF!?)
Another main issue is that she has no authority stars is the entire game which is the main reason why the DB chapters are much harder than of the other two parties. She should start with one in part 1, two in part 2 and three in part 3 to match up with Ike and Elincia. Micaiah is an equal leader as the other two so there's no point not give her any leadership stars.

Well, at least Sothe calls her out when he feels she's not doing the right thing. That's more than what you can say for Soren, Zelgius, etc. Also, I found his devotion to Micaiah quite endearing. Remember when he threatened to kill Pelleas out of the blue? That was savage. 

I think the development team thought to make mages as slow as armour knights because while armour knights are weighed down by armour, mages are not physical units and hence too weak to move long distances and physically slow. I prefer how mages were in the GBA games though. Authority stars were a missed opportunity that don't make much sense how they are currently used. Micaiah is portrayed to be a charismatic leader who inspires so much loyalty with her troops to the point of fanaticism. Why the zero authority stars? 

I would personally increase her speed growth to 45% and HP growth to 50%. I'll keep her defence the same because she's biologically a 14-year-old girl with no armour. I like growth rates reflecting a character's appearance and physical traits.  

2 hours ago, Troykv said:

Micaiah is a interesting idea for protag (being essencially the heroine of the former enemy in the franchise after her defeat, and her position puts her in hard circunstances having to deal with the blue-haired Gorila Ike, the other hero), specially for a Fire Emblem; I had always appreaciate even before I had properly learn about her.

I think I had an a bit depth personal story with her (I would told it if you want)... but other-wise I don't have a lot to say that you don't have already say, I'm bad to properly generate arguments xD

Gamepaly-wise I think she would like to have a better Speed and HP Base and growth (Specially because she has sacrifice and the biggest caps in these stats compared with the other mages not-named Lehran).

I would like to hear the personal story if you don't mind sharing it. 

Edited by Icelerate

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So, Micaiah.

Gameplay - Sacrifice is an interesting mechanic.  Being a one-hit kill machine works early-on, but eventually she's going to wind up being a staffbot (this is more of a comment regarding light magic, though).  Pity, because it would've been funny if she could've offed Ashera for an alternate ending.

Story - Running around Daein is cool.  Sacrifice is cool, because it has drawbacks.  The future sight can get lost, because a drawback shouldn't be a lack of something (she can lose her ability to heal as the chaos gets worse).

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I don't know what I can say about Micaiah other than she's complete trash. Garbage speed, non-existent durability, poor combat and a third tier promotion so late it's not even funny. I would say that she makes a good staffbot, but the fact that I play on Easy makes her useless even at this. It's no exaggeration to say that I'd rather use Meg or Fiona instead of her. The only reason I bother to train her up is because she's forced for the tower at the end.

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I dislike her a lot. I like her design, that's about it. IS dropped the ball so hard with her potential though, it came off as face-palm worthy to me. Her writing is bad, imo, and as a unit, she's awful because as pointed out, her speed and all suck, and being a forced unit, it's so hard to have to use her and keep her alive. She's good at taking out armors with Thani, that's about it.

If she and Ike shared the spotlight more equally and Yune didn't hijack her so much in part 4, she'd be much better. She's a character I want to like, but just dislike because of how poorly executed she is in general.

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Ahhh I knew these comments would be coming and here they are.

14 hours ago, NinjaMonkey said:

I don't know what I can say about Micaiah other than she's complete trash. Garbage speed, non-existent durability, poor combat and a third tier promotion so late it's not even funny. I would say that she makes a good staffbot, but the fact that I play on Easy makes her useless even at this. It's no exaggeration to say that I'd rather use Meg or Fiona instead of her. The only reason I bother to train her up is because she's forced for the tower at the end.

I agree about her late forced promotion, all forced promotions are garbage and need to be done away with. However your other points are rather off base. A seraph robe and a speed wing on easy take care of that speed problem and give her a boost in HP that makes her very viable for the endgame. If you train her light magic enough she can use the strongest light tomes in the game and she's perfectly useful as an effective nuke. Maybe yours just got RNG screwed but comparing her to the likes of Meg and Fiona is simply wrong.

14 hours ago, Anacybele said:

I dislike her a lot. I like her design, that's about it. IS dropped the ball so hard with her potential though, it came off as face-palm worthy to me. Her writing is bad, imo, and as a unit, she's awful because as pointed out, her speed and all suck, and being a forced unit, it's so hard to have to use her and keep her alive. She's good at taking out armors with Thani, that's about it.

If she and Ike shared the spotlight more equally and Yune didn't hijack her so much in part 4, she'd be much better. She's a character I want to like, but just dislike because of how poorly executed she is in general.

I've never actually had an issue with keeping her alive, ever. Not in any of my playthroughs of the game. Laura... totally. Edward and Leonardo? Yep. Not Micaiah. Maybe I just got blessed on her speed growths but I've never had a Micaiah get doubled by anything other than the speedier units in the game. Oh well.

Honestly that can be said about a lot of the writing in RD but if she wasn't cast against Ike of all characters, whose mere presence overshadows every other character in the game, I feel that she would be much more liked in general. Her writing really isn't all that bad until you get to later Part 3 and Part 4 where she suffers invasion of the body snatchers. Now don't get me wrong, I like Ike, I do, he's by far my favorite male Lord. RD shouldn't have been as Ike-focused as it was. He had his game. I'm not saying they shouldn't have included him, I'm just saying they shouldn't have made him the main character and villainized Micaiah in the process, because that's exactly what happened and the main reason why it seems many people dislike her.

Also lets be fair... IS has an issue writing strong female leads. The few they do have end up taking on a damsel in distress archetype or they're villainized so that the male lord can come swoop in and save them, either from the villains or from themselves. Seriously, name one strong female lead that doesn't end up needing saving in some way or another (by the male counterpart to them). You can't. Even Elincia falls into this trap.

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14 minutes ago, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

Also lets be fair... IS has an issue writing strong female leads.

This I agree with. IS doesn't know how to write female lords at all. I don't like any of them, honestly, save for Celica and that's only because I'm not as familiar with her. But to me, it's more of just constantly being overshadowed by a male lord and losing much relevance than needing to be saved all the time. It's like IS thinks a woman can't hold her own in a story and it always has to be a guy to have the most spotlight. :/

Edited by Anacybele

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1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

This I agree with. IS doesn't know how to write female lords at all. I don't like any of them, honestly, save for Celica and that's only because I'm not as familiar with her. But to me, it's more of just constantly being overshadowed by a male lord and losing much relevance than needing to be saved all the time. It's like IS thinks a woman can't hold her own in a story. :/

That's... pretty much it in a nutshell. It's the biggest issue FE's female characters have. Even Celica...

Spoiler

Just in case you didn't know, tagging it as a spoiler. Even Celica ends up needing to be saved by Alm.

Micaiah suffers the exact same problem. Lyn does, in many cases Robin does. Corrin.... well is Corrin.

Even Lucia in her big scene in Part 2 ends up being overshadowed and saved by Ike, making her whole sacrifice up until that point... meaningless. It's something IS really needs to work on.

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26 minutes ago, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

Also lets be fair... IS has an issue writing strong female leads. The few they do have end up taking on a damsel in distress archetype or they're villainized so that the male lord can come swoop in and save them, either from the villains or from themselves. Seriously, name one strong female lead that doesn't end up needing saving in some way or another (by the male counterpart to them). You can't. Even Elincia falls into this trap.

Elincia, Lyn, Celica, Eirika. All of these other Female Lord characters are either pushed to the side, make stupid mistakes, or become damsels. FE15 had Celica start off strong, but come Act 4, she ends up losing about 50 IQ points and suddenly makes some of the most ridiculous decisions because FUCK logic and make a deal with the man that tried to kill you several times. Lyn's issue is that her entire story... is a tutorial. Then she's more just this other character that's there but really has no huge impact to the story. Hell, she doesn't even get a real legendary weapon, but instead has this weapon that's about as powerful, but still her weapon holds no plot relevance in either FE7 or FE6. 

Eirika, the girl that should have been lord, but instead we have the Ephraim praises. Because why have a girl that is naive that can grow to be a great leader and instead just go with a guy that just can't fucking lose, because the plot demands that he's so epic and badass that cannot lose any fights because, "I don't pick fights I can't win." 

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4 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

Elincia, Lyn, Celica, Eirika. All of these other Female Lord characters are either pushed to the side, make stupid mistakes, or become damsels. FE15 had Celica start off strong, but come Act 4, she ends up losing about 50 IQ points and suddenly makes some of the most ridiculous decisions because FUCK logic and make a deal with the man that tried to kill you several times. Lyn's issue is that her entire story... is a tutorial. Then she's more just this other character that's there but really has no huge impact to the story. Hell, she doesn't even get a real legendary weapon, but instead has this weapon that's about as powerful, but still her weapon holds no plot relevance in either FE7 or FE6. 

Eirika, the girl that should have been lord, but instead we have the Ephraim praises. Because why have a girl that is naive that can grow to be a great leader and instead just go with a guy that just can't fucking lose, because the plot demands that he's so epic and badass that cannot lose any fights because, "I don't pick fights I can't win." 

So there's this channel on Youtube I really like called Overly Sarcastic Productions. I don't know if you or @Anacybele have heard of this channel but it's really cool and covers lots of tropes and stories and classic myths.

It seems like many of the FE lords fall into the whole "manly man" trope while many of the females tend to be overshadowed because of that. In fact.. here are a couple videos from that channel. Please go watch, the channel is really a lot of fun!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4InTzxkd_0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rLfENrnsoQ

But yeah, the female characters tend to get overshadowed by their male counterparts in their stories and that's a big issue I have with the FE games despite how much I love them. It's a big issue I have with RD especially because you have all of these otherwise strong and great female characters that... just get put aside. It's not just Micaiah either. It happens to Sanaki, Elincia, Lucia, Micaiah, etc.

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I actually don't think any male lords are all that manly except for Hector and Ike, more specifically RD Ike.

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1 hour ago, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

So there's this channel on Youtube I really like called Overly Sarcastic Productions. I don't know if you or @Anacybele have heard of this channel but it's really cool and covers lots of tropes and stories and classic myths.

It seems like many of the FE lords fall into the whole "manly man" trope while many of the females tend to be overshadowed because of that. In fact.. here are a couple videos from that channel. Please go watch, the channel is really a lot of fun!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4InTzxkd_0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rLfENrnsoQ

But yeah, the female characters tend to get overshadowed by their male counterparts in their stories and that's a big issue I have with the FE games despite how much I love them. It's a big issue I have with RD especially because you have all of these otherwise strong and great female characters that... just get put aside. It's not just Micaiah either. It happens to Sanaki, Elincia, Lucia, Micaiah, etc.

Oh hey, I love their Miscellaneous Myths. XD

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

I actually don't think any male lords are all that manly except for Hector and Ike, more specifically RD Ike.

The "Manly" is more on the case of them being heroic. Marth, Eliwood, and Alm are shown to not be violent or try to better their fighting, but they are clearly very strong warriors, and are very heroic. Being manly doesn't have to be defined as being the tough guy that Ike and Hector represent. 

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6 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

The "Manly" is more on the case of them being heroic. Marth, Eliwood, and Alm are shown to not be violent or try to better their fighting, but they are clearly very strong warriors, and are very heroic. Being manly doesn't have to be defined as being the tough guy that Ike and Hector represent. 

Well then, say heroic or something. xP I always consider manliness to be looking masculine and having little to no feminine traits/characteristics.

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2 hours ago, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

That's a pretty cool channel that I'll check out more later. :]

Anyway, I can't bring myself to *like* Micaiah for a couple of reasons, even though I highly enjoy the first two parts of RD and I appreciate how Micaiah mirrors PoR!Ike in a somewhat cynical way - PoR's liberation story works out like a disney fairytale, with Ike as the "knight" for the noble princess Elincia, while Micaiah and Pelleas are manipulated into a similar constellation because Izuka recognizes the power of that narrative. And while Crimea in PoR gets strong support from the benevolent empress of Begnion, the corrupt senate of the very same country bleeds Daein dry and basically vassalizes them the moment they formally regain their independence. I really like that RD kinda acknowledges how improbably smooth PoR's plot had unfolded, and while it's not part of the topic, I also like that part 2 shows that it's not just gumdrops and icecream for Elincia after her coronation, either. So what do I dislike about Micaiah?

First, she stops thinking at a crucial point of the plot, i.e. when Pelleas gets blackmailed by the Begnion senate via the blood pact. In part one, she shows that she will trust her own judgement, stand up against Izuka's horrible planning and, if necessary, work without Pelleas' support (I'm thinking of the swamp chapter). In part three, she basically goes, "welp, I'll trust my king" when Pelleas' orders clearly go against Daein's interest and it's up to Sothe to pressure the reasoning out of Pelleas.

Speaking of Sothe: Ugh. I can't stand his character and how he interacts with Micaiah in RD at all. I mean, Micaiah is a General of Daein, she's the older sibling, but Sothe still has to be her white knight and save her when she explicitly says that she's doing everything out of her own free will? Come on. I find Micaiah to be one of the best examples that Fire Emblem just doesn't seem to be able to have a female MC that's just strong. (Well Lyn in her own story fits the bill, what with pride and self-reliance being her main character traits, but she's really just a minor character in the main story) (I also find it more than just a little creepy that Sothe is the closest Micaiah has as a canon love interest. Sure, they're not related by blood, but they're still siblings :/ )

2 hours ago, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

But yeah, the female characters tend to get overshadowed by their male counterparts in their stories and that's a big issue I have with the FE games despite how much I love them. It's a big issue I have with RD especially because you have all of these otherwise strong and great female characters that... just get put aside. It's not just Micaiah either. It happens to Sanaki, Elincia, Lucia, Micaiah, etc.

I would kinda disagree when it comes to Sacred Stones - it's less that Eirika gets overshadowed by Ephraim (the focus stays on whoever you choose to go with), it's more that the game fails to really showcase Ephraim's flaw, which would be his recklessness. It does bite him in the ass when he decides to confront the demon king 1vs1 (in the mirror scene to Eirika's infamous naivety peak), but for the rest of the game, he just keeps succeeding, which makes Seth criticism after they retake Renais come out of nowhere. As such, they don't come across as two flawed individuals (i.e. Eirika who is too trusting and Ephraim who overestimates his own abilities), but the cool twin and the stupid twin.

Edited by ping

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Problem with Micaiah is not only the inconsistency with her character at times, but her lack of a backbone or any kind of charisma/authority that would make her feel like a legitimate leader. I was fairly indifferent about her before, but the more I actually read into the dialogue/characterisation (for the purposes of re-writing it) the more disappointed I became with how she was/is written. 

By far, the worst part is how her overall 'value' as a character is mostly based around her powers/abilities (such as her healing/mind-reading/farsight). It basically becomes the entire basis for her leadership and also her character as a whole. If you were to strip those away from her, what is she is left with? There are rare occasions where she does have some characterisation outside of just being 'passive/polite', or her powers dictating the plot, but those are fairly rare (leaving her otherwise one-dimensional or largely uninteresting). And in terms of actual leadership/decision making... her farsight (or Yune) makes all of those decisions for her.

I wouldn't say that Micaiah is polarizing -- there isn't really much about her that would make her overly liked or disliked. She isn't a dramatic character; so it's difficult having strong feelings towards her one way or another. It's more the fact that she's just used as a plot device, so any criticisms towards the plot itself can be redirected at her. And honestly, the reason why Part 3 falls flat for her is because they didn't even push the 'villain role' nearly enough since they clearly wanted her to be 'pure/innocent' (which did not work). If she was a more morally grey character that was confident in her stance/perspective -- maybe to the point where herself/Pelleas could be justified (in a way that makes sense, which the plot itself didn't allow for) then she could have actually been a really interesting character. 

In the end, she really is just an inoffensive Corrin. That's the best way to describe her IMO. She's not exactly controversial, just forgettable/boring, as much as the story/plot tries to keep reminding you that she's a special snowflake. Part 4 really just seals the deal.

It really doesn't help either that there is a large disconnect with her power/potential (story-wise) with gameplay. She's not terrible, but you'd think that she'd be a lot more powerful than she is, especially when surrounded by so many other powerful units in this game. Magical units clearly got the short end of the stick overall... but the fact that her T3 promotion gains are the same as everyone else, despite promoting so late, and she doesn't even get her own legendary weapon? It's like the developers forgot that she's a main character late into development. Felt like she should have been the Gotoh/Athos archetype (due to Yune mirroring Ashera), but no.

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I wouldnt mind if Sothe's role is greatly diminished in a remake. Push Nolan up further instead, considering he is supposed to be the actual tactician and leader of the Dawn Brigade. That way instead of a silly, forced romantic connection between Sothe and Micaiah, you can build a more platonic bond between Nolan and Micaiah.

As far as Micaiah goes, I really liked her as a lord. One of my favorites in the series. I dont entirely blame her problems of Ike taking the spotlight, as much as just not writing her well enough and not giving the DB as a whole enough spotlight. Part 3 needed a lot more DB presence, and Part 4 should have left Yune out of the picture for the most part. Micaiah can be her voice, sure, but lets not have Yune just take over her body completely. Ike wasnt as much of an issue because I think Ike needed to be important anyway. This is a sequel to Tellius, and Ike is heavily involved, so him taking a bit of the spotlight is fine. They just needed to give more spotlight to Micaiah than they did to compensate.

Gameplay wise she needs some fixed for sure. And forced promotion doesnt help her either, as by the time you get to the end of part 1 a good chunk of the DB should be promoted. Unfortunately for Micaiah, she is still stuck at level 20.

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2 hours ago, omegaxis1 said:

Oh hey, I love their Miscellaneous Myths. XD

The "Manly" is more on the case of them being heroic. Marth, Eliwood, and Alm are shown to not be violent or try to better their fighting, but they are clearly very strong warriors, and are very heroic. Being manly doesn't have to be defined as being the tough guy that Ike and Hector represent. 

Oh yay another fan! :)

2 hours ago, Anacybele said:

Well then, say heroic or something. xP I always consider manliness to be looking masculine and having little to no feminine traits/characteristics.

Honestly it's not really described as being "heroic" as you can be heroic and not manly, but it's definitely a lack of feminine characteristics. In that thread Ike, Hector, Ephraim, Chrom, Xander, Ryoma.... most of the lords can be considered "manly men". If you're going by what they look like then Hector and RD!Ike definitely fall into that trope but the others do too. It's not a bad thing by any means and there are a fair number of "manly heroines" out there too, who doesn't love someone that can kick butt?

1 hour ago, ping said:

That's a pretty cool channel that I'll check out more later. :]

Anyway, I can't bring myself to *like* Micaiah for a couple of reasons, even though I highly enjoy the first two parts of RD and I appreciate how Micaiah mirrors PoR!Ike in a somewhat cynical way - PoR's liberation story works out like a disney fairytale, with Ike as the "knight" for the noble princess Elincia, while Micaiah and Pelleas are manipulated into a similar constellation because Izuka recognizes the power of that narrative. And while Crimea in PoR gets strong support from the benevolent empress of Begnion, the corrupt senate of the very same country bleeds Daein dry and basically vassalizes them the moment they formally regain their independence. I really like that RD kinda acknowledges how improbably smooth PoR's plot had unfolded, and while it's not part of the topic, I also like that part 2 shows that it's not just gumdrops and icecream for Elincia after her coronation, either. So what do I dislike about Micaiah?

First, she stops thinking at a crucial point of the plot, i.e. when Pelleas gets blackmailed by the Begnion senate via the blood pact. In part one, she shows that she will trust her own judgement, stand up against Izuka's horrible planning and, if necessary, work without Pelleas' support (I'm thinking of the swamp chapter). In part three, she basically goes, "welp, I'll trust my king" when Pelleas' orders clearly go against Daein's interest and it's up to Sothe to pressure the reasoning out of Pelleas.

Speaking of Sothe: Ugh. I can't stand his character and how he interacts with Micaiah in RD at all. I mean, Micaiah is a General of Daein, she's the older sibling, but Sothe still has to be her white knight and save her when she explicitly says that she's doing everything out of her own free will? Come on. I find Micaiah to be one of the best examples that Fire Emblem just doesn't seem to be able to have a female MC that's just strong. (Well Lyn in her own story fits the bill, what with pride and self-reliance being her main character traits, but she's really just a minor character in the main story) (I also find it more than just a little creepy that Sothe is the closest Micaiah has as a canon love interest. Sure, they're not related by blood, but they're still siblings :/ )

I would kinda disagree when it comes to Sacred Stones - it's less that Eirika gets overshadowed by Ephraim (the focus stays on whoever you choose to go with), it's more that the game fails to really showcase Ephraim's flaw, which would be his recklessness. It does bite him in the ass when he decides to confront the demon king 1vs1 (in the mirror scene to Eirika's infamous naivety peak), but for the rest of the game, he just keeps succeeding, which makes Seth criticism after they retake Renais come out of nowhere. As such, they don't come across as two flawed individuals (i.e. Eirika who is too trusting and Ephraim who overestimates his own abilities), but the cool twin and the stupid twin.

As I haven't played PoR I can't say one way or the other about parallels but that's still really cool and interesting to read. I always thought Micaiah's struggle was more realistic in terms of warfare than most FE stories where everything seems to miraculously work out for the small, ragtag group. I do wish Micaiah had stood up to Pelleas more than she did as she's definitely shown in Part 1 that she's more than capable of it but I feel that's more an effect of the writers trying to move the plot along and having a reason to make Ike and Micaiah fight than anything else. As for Sothe I always found their ending to be... weird, but I get why he's overprotective of her. Though you're definitely right, they needed to handle Micaiah far better than they did.

As for Sacred Stones, I will say that I haven't played it myself, but I've read enough to get that Ephraim has very much overshadowed Eirika in the minds of the masses. Ephraim is the cool one and she's dumb for her choices and the same is applied to Alm and Celica. So basically, IS needs to work on their female characters... badly.

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On ‎08‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 2:40 PM, Silver-Haired Maiden said:

Maybe yours just got RNG screwed but comparing her to the likes of Meg and Fiona is simply wrong.

Except, I really would rather use either of those two over Micaiah. Oh, and I'd say that the probability of getting RNG screwed on all five of the playthroughs that I've done of this the game is very low, and that she really is that bad.

Edited by NinjaMonkey

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21 hours ago, Tolvir said:

Even Lucia in her big scene in Part 2 ends up being overshadowed and saved by Ike, making her whole sacrifice up until that point... meaningless. It's something IS really needs to work on.

Objection!

The conclusion of Part II was a powerful scene for both Elincia and Lucia, and it was not at all invalidated just because Lucia survived. Elincia proved to herself and her subjects that she is a strong leader, and Lucia made a badass speech and showed absolute loyalty, even though she expected to die.

-----

Concerning my thoughts on Micaiah, I'd say she's one of my favorite protagonists. I'm quite fond of the Jeanne of Arc archetype, and the determination and selflessness she showed was endearing. She's like Conquest Corrin but infinitely better executed. They did stack a few too many special traits on her but it didn't affect the plot in a negative way.

For the Ike vs Micaiah rivalry, I think it's good that that you play both from Ike's perspective and hers. One of Radiant Dawns strong points is showing you different perspectives and how morally good people can still become enemies. I do wish Micaiah had more screen time, however.

I might be one of the few people who liked Sothe and his relationship with Micaiah. Micaiah was the reckless savior and Sothe the cautious realist. Later, Micaiah becomes shackled with pragmatic concerns and it's Sothe who has to slap some morality into her. I thought Sothe's protectiveness was endearing rather than controlling or weird. They were separated once and rely on each other more than anyone else. Of course Sothe is protective. I'll even buy their potential to become romantic as their relationship is ambiguously described by Sothe in PoR.

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