Conquest Lunatic: First Time Through

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

For the record while Josh tips are good.. if hard to read i disagree Jakobdin sucks lol

 

The problem with Jakobdin back then is that people that do it lowball him to death which is why you would find posts saying Jakob falls off back then. Now that its been found that Jakob is the most bullshit unit in the entire game because of his prepromote mechanic hes really the best non Camilla and Corrin unit. In efficiency its like anything into malig for a super early trample. In Non efficiency Myrmiddon master of arms Jakob is hilariously broken. Im currently at chapter 13 of Lunatic playthrough and my Jakob can one shot the Wyvern Knight pair up

Also Berserker pair up is OP as hell. Theres a reason why Effie is called OP and half the reason is Berserker Arthur being such a ridiculous pair up

Edited November 14, 2017 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[joshcja]

11 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

For the record while Josh tips are good.. if hard to read i disagree Jakobdin sucks lol

 

The problem with Jakobdin back then is that people that do it lowball him to death which is why you would find posts saying Jakob falls off back then. Now that its been found that Jakob is the most bullshit unit in the entire game because of his prepromote mechanic hes really the best non Camilla and Corrin unit. In efficiency its like anything into malig for a super early trample. In Non efficiency Myrmiddon master of arms Jakob is hilariously broken. Im currently at chapter 13 of Lunatic playthrough and my Jakob can one shot the Wyvern Knight pair up

Also Berserker pair up is OP as hell. Theres a reason why Effie is called OP and half the reason is Berserker Arthur being such a ridiculous pair up

Oh Jakob is solid as hell. Jakobdin is just terrible as anything but a short dip for stack lol.

[starburst]

Just like the recent thread about the Beastkin classes, I have been following this to gather some ideas for my next campaign. I have played a couple of chapters of Lunatic Conquest and still find it too demanding, but most of what is said here should also apply to Hard Conquest, which I love to play and re-play.

For starters, I really need to get used to abuse tonics (which I only sporadically use in Hard), to recruit way more children and to re-class the characters to optimise their skill pool.

I am still at Chapter 26 of my Hard Conquest campaign, and just started to play the GBA games (to learn more about the previous mechanics in the series), but Lunatic Conquest should not be that far.

Edited November 14, 2017 by starburst

[Mandokarla]

On on chapter 13 now, and I've had to reset a few times (stupid placements, nothing bad or even truly difficult). At this point Odin is promoted to Sorcerer, as he gained a lot of exp soloing a lot of ch.12, and now he can comfortably solo the right half of the map if he wants to. I did dip into samurai to give him vantage of course. I debated Dark Knight, but I'm really not a fan of that class for non-Corrin/Leo. I had no idea it would even be a viable thing. It's crazy. 

Effie and Arthur made Percy, haven't gone and grabbed him yet (his chapter always causes me problems). While we are on the subject, which kids should I get ASAP and which should I wait for Childhood Seals?

Corrin and Silas are the next to promote -- idk if I'm even going to HS Cornflake into her cavalier first (I probably should for shelter and elbow room). Still finding a husband for Camilla, Laslow and Harlot look to create the best overall Soleil based off the growths calc I'm using. Waiting for Jakob to get Tomebreaker before I reclass him at all. Need to find a wife for him too, even if Dwyer is kinda...meh, with a completely defunct personal. 

[joshcja]

Dwyer is crazy good early, he's on par with Percy and the not-Ophelia CQ gals. Trample+whatever+Eroom cav into a strong mid-endgame class off percy or a gen2gal is solid and he's avalible before ch9 off Cornmum. He also gives the high value +mag statue.

Percy, Dwyer, Sophie, and Ophelia are the strong early kids. Dwyer and Sophie will bury you in free exp though.

Percy is easy to recruit if you don't care for optimal exp spread, Odin walks up the left, Ophelia walks right. Done. (To be fair this is post ch8 cq in a shellnut)

Dark knight is good for magic based sword mooks (Corrin, servants, some Dwyers, end list) for better levin damage and the big value heartseeker/Mal aura dip. Elise also enjoys DK while building support for A+ sealing into magik if you're not rocking wyvern Elise strats. (Spoilers Elise+Bolt axe+Auras+skill books is a monster).

Edited November 14, 2017 by joshcja

[Shadow Mir]

1 hour ago, Mandokarla said:

Effie and Arthur made Percy, haven't gone and grabbed him yet (his chapter always causes me problems). While we are on the subject, which kids should I get ASAP and which should I wait for Childhood Seals?

Let me be frank--waiting for Offspring Seals is NEVER worth it. And in particular, it's a REALLY bad idea in the cases of Ignatius and Forrest, as well as Sophie. (There are a few others where it's a really bad thing to wait until Offspring Seals become available, but they're Birthright exclusive)

Edited November 14, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[joshcja]

The only bad late kid is Seigbert, that map is a controller breaker if you dont know the cheese.

Delaying child paralouges gives more exp.

Edited November 14, 2017 by joshcja

[Shadow Mir]

9 minutes ago, joshcja said:

The only bad late kid is Seigbert, that map is a controller breaker if you don't lowman cheese with a minmaxed Ophelia. Even then it's hella tedious and if you have minmaxed Ophelia you've already won the game.

Sophie and Iggy are the easiest maps sans kana/shigure as long as you know how movement works.

Forrest's map is free exp.

Delaying child paralouges gives much more exp.

Ha! Delaying them also means less time to benefit from the other goodies they offer, and more exp doesn't make up for that. Ignatius late is extremely luck-based (better hope he doesn't get critted, or else you might as well press L R Start because you got a one-way ticket to Game Over-ville), and that's poor design.

[joshcja]

3 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Ha! Delaying them also means less time to benefit from the other goodies they offer, and more exp doesn't make up for that. Ignatius late is extremely luck-based (better hope he doesn't get critted, or else you might as well press L R Start because you got a one-way ticket to Game Over-ville), and that's poor design.

The only goodies come from Sophie/Ophelia/Nina/Soliel/Dwyer and kiiiiiinda sorta Midori. Of these only Soliel's full reward is remotely tricky late and only Ophelia gives incomperable goodies.

You can reach Iggy before he is attacked.

[Shadow Mir]

58 minutes ago, joshcja said:

The only goodies come from Sophie/Ophelia/Nina/Soliel/Dwyer and kiiiiiinda sorta Midori. Of these only Soliel's full reward is remotely tricky late and only Ophelia gives incomperable goodies.

You can reach Iggy before he is attacked.

I'd rather have those things earlier than later, anyhow, and let's not forget the money that Percy and Forrest's paralogues have. And frankly, I could say the same of the kids themselves.

How? With a Rescue staff that has better uses?? Because he gets attacked on turn 2, and you start way on the other side of the map.

Edited November 14, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[joshcja]

50 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

How? With a Rescue staff that has better uses?? Because he gets attacked on turn 2, and you start way on the other side of the map.

Shelterdanceing is strong.

[Shadow Mir]

37 minutes ago, joshcja said:

Shelterdanceing is strong.

Aaaaand how the hell is that supposed to be any help when Camilla is at least one turn's worth of movement away from everyone else (because she NEEDS that first turn dance to ferry Benny further)?!!

Edited November 14, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[Errorik]

Another thread with Josh and Levant arguing endlessly getting no where, and OP not wanting/liking answers to their asked questions. Don't we have enough of these?

[Mandokarla]

23 minutes ago, Centh said:

Another thread with Josh and Levant arguing endlessly getting no where, and OP not wanting/liking answers to their asked questions. Don't we have enough of these?

I mean, I've been given and applied some good advice from these two throwing things at eachother. It's also fun to watch

[Shadow Mir]

27 minutes ago, Centh said:

Another thread with Josh and Levant arguing endlessly getting no where, and OP not wanting/liking answers to their asked questions. Don't we have enough of these?

Apparently not, because this thread is a thing. But seriously, most of joshcja's "advice" sounds quarter-baked at best (Wyvern Elise is a meme that needs - and deserves - to die a fiery death, dissolve into water, and rejoin the stars).

Edited November 14, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[De Geso]

5 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Apparently not, because this thread is a thing. But seriously, most of joshcja's "advice" sounds quarter-baked at best (Wyvern Elise is a meme that needs - and deserves - to die a fiery death, dissolve into water, and rejoin the stars).

Most of josh's advice is fine though. It seems like you want to bicker with him at every opportunity instead of just saying your own piece. It isn't like he's perfect either, imo you guys should both stop going at each other every time the other posts.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

12 hours ago, Mandokarla said:

On on chapter 13 now, and I've had to reset a few times (stupid placements, nothing bad or even truly difficult). At this point Odin is promoted to Sorcerer, as he gained a lot of exp soloing a lot of ch.12, and now he can comfortably solo the right half of the map if he wants to. I did dip into samurai to give him vantage of course. I debated Dark Knight, but I'm really not a fan of that class for non-Corrin/Leo. I had no idea it would even be a viable thing. It's crazy. 

Effie and Arthur made Percy, haven't gone and grabbed him yet (his chapter always causes me problems). While we are on the subject, which kids should I get ASAP and which should I wait for Childhood Seals?

Corrin and Silas are the next to promote -- idk if I'm even going to HS Cornflake into her cavalier first (I probably should for shelter and elbow room). Still finding a husband for Camilla, Laslow and Harlot look to create the best overall Soleil based off the growths calc I'm using. Waiting for Jakob to get Tomebreaker before I reclass him at all. Need to find a wife for him too, even if Dwyer is kinda...meh, with a completely defunct personal. 

 

Dwyer entire strength comes from being jakob's son. Someone once optimized him in such a way that he's actually on the level of Birthright Ryoma in term of how completely overpowered he is. His main power over Jakob is his ease of finding spouse with better support bonus than Jakob(Jakob support bonus all sucked in the long run). He's probably the best children overall when optimized

 

Childhood Seals isn't worth it, since from my experience they hurt your progression on that character. The one time i would say its semi worth it, was to make 3 Rally Percy but its dubious because Rally STR is plenty most of the time before Rallyman. One use you can make off late paralogue is to top up your EXP to reach x/15 earlier

 

 

for example in my Cq Lunatic run, i used the Paralogue to give Leo Swordmaster Astra + Life and Death

Edited November 15, 2017 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[Shadow Mir]

1 hour ago, YouSquiddinMe said:

Most of josh's advice is fine though. It seems like you want to bicker with him at every opportunity instead of just saying your own piece. It isn't like he's perfect either, imo you guys should both stop going at each other every time the other posts.

It's not my fault that I thought he was a BS artist from the very beginning, you know... I mean, hyping up Berserker Arthur when Arthur is already "most likely to wind up in a body bag because a grunt got a crit in", and one of the worst Nohrian units as well??? I'm sorry, but that's enough for me to have EXTREME doubts about your credibility. That also suggests a failure to grasp that not all instruments of war are created equal (to put it into perspective, why the fuck do you see a lot of complaints about status staves??? The answer is simple: They're incredibly annoying to deal with, and when you get them they're incredibly niche, if they're even useful at all, which they often aren't. Critical hits are another thing that's incredibly lopsided in terms of usefulness - like I've said in other threads, they're generally not much help when you get them, but if you wind up on the receiving end of a critical hit, you probably have to restart because you lost a unit; incidentally, this is why I think Berserkers are MUCH better as an enemy class than they are as a player class in Fates).

Edited November 15, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

Wait what

 

All the status staves in this games is incredibly busted

Its weaker than older games but thats because in older game status staves is literally cheat code while Fates Status Staves is merely strong

Edited November 15, 2017 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[Shadow Mir]

27 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

Wait what

 

All the status staves in this games is incredibly busted

Its weaker than older games but thats because in older game status staves is literally cheat code while Fates Status Staves is merely strong

Uh, yeah... I wasn't talking about Fates specifically with my point on status staves. Anyway, outside of Jugdral, I generally find status staves' use extremely limited, which isn't helped by their generally being one-of-a-kind. Of course, Fates DOES have the Hexing Rod, which is more like the status staves from GBA in terms of usefulness (aka, if there's something worth hitting with it, odds are your hit rates with it are too low to bother with)... And guess who it does more good for? Here's a hint - it ain't you.

Edited November 15, 2017 by Levant Mir Celestia

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

1 minute ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Uh, yeah... I wasn't talking about Fates specifically with my point on status staves. Anyway, outside of Jugdral, I generally find status staves' use extremely limited, which isn't helped by their generally being one-of-a-kind.

Thats also partly because players tend to think 'wtf i can't use it always" first

 

Berserk is op basically everytime it exists and Silence have always been strong for locking down Status Staves. Sleep obviously is an instant kil

Disregarding Tellius, FE8 is really the only time it can qualify being useless and thats most because the fuck you need Status Staves when Seth exist

[joshcja]

For CQ:

Freeze and entrap may as well read "instant death" when used by the player.

Enfeeble just wrecks bosses and sub-bosses.

For DS FE's: Lololol "staves are limited and underwhelming"

Edit: I remember Lutes husbando being ranked over Lute in fe8 viability based on his ability to warp Seth sooner...

 

Edited November 15, 2017 by joshcja

[Shadow Mir]

15 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

Thats also partly because players tend to think 'wtf i can't use it always" first

 

Berserk is op basically everytime it exists and Silence have always been strong for locking down Status Staves. Sleep obviously is an instant kil

Disregarding Tellius, FE8 is really the only time it can qualify being useless and thats most because the fuck you need Status Staves when Seth exist

Well, I'll give you credit for getting at what I was trying to refer to - Too Awesome To Use.

Outside of Jugdral (where status staves were guaranteed hits if the target's Res was lower than the user's Mag), I'd say Berserk was only worth it in FE6 - FE8's, well, FE8, and I'm struggling to see it as worthwhile in FE7 as well. Silence is good for locking down status staves... If it hits, that is, which it tends not to do on the very units it's meant to be used on.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

47 minutes ago, joshcja said:

For CQ:

Freeze and entrap may as well read "instant death" when used by the player.

Enfeeble just wrecks bosses and sub-bosses.

For DS FE's: Lololol "staves are limited and underwhelming"

Edit: I remember Lutes husbando being ranked over Lute in fe8 viability based on his ability to warp Seth sooner...

 

DSFE Staves are ridiculous but they aren't really status staves

 

Or is it? All i remember is had DSFE did not degenerate into Warp vs warp it would become Ultimate Fortify vs Fortify, fate of two Fortify

[Shadow Mir]

1 hour ago, joshcja said:

For CQ:

Freeze and entrap may as well read "instant death" when used by the player.

Enfeeble just wrecks bosses and sub-bosses.

For DS FE's: Lololol "staves are limited and underwhelming"

Edit: I remember Lutes husbando being ranked over Lute in fe8 viability based on his ability to warp Seth sooner...

 

Erm, you do know the DS FE games didn't have status staves, don't you?? While Mystery did have Silence, it was a map-wide seal on magic for one turn, not a status staff.