what u DONT want to see in FE Switch

[Modamy]

47 minutes ago, Collindew16 said:

This might be a difficult topic to fix, but I don't want most of the characters to run away once they "die". This happens for both allies and villains. The thing that makes this difficult is how allowing the characters to live gives them the opportunity to show up in later cut scenes.  The GBA games an opposite issue, where a character would join and then would never be heard from again since they could die at any point. I feel that the best way they could prevent both of these issues is to have the aspect from echoes where every chapter you can talk to each member of your army and they will talk about whatever is currently happening in the story.

Since Fire Emblem is a series with permadeath its hard to justify a character who was playable and has "died" in gameplay is still around talking in the story. Some characters would just retreat if they died, and others would just straight up disappear from sequences thay would normally have lines in. The base conversations worked because there is no other point where those characters would talk since they aren't really important to the story. The only way to really fix the issue for story important characters would be to never make story important characters playable units. Maybe they could just be AI controlled?

[Guest Dreamyboi]

31 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

I disagree - while resource management is part of the strategy, durability does nothing positive for strategy - rather, it only encourages hoarding and the "Too Awesome to Use" trope, both of which inhibit strategy rather than promote it.

I guess I see what you mean, Breath of the Wild had a much similar issue with it's own weapon fragility. Do you suggest a better balanced version of what Fates did then?

[kiaxxl]

Replaying Echoes has inspired me; I DON'T want another Faye 2: Electric Boogaloo character. Cordelia were already kind of irritating at times  (some of her supports are good, some are "wahh chrom don't love me" and then Faye took it to a whole other level. We really don't need another character like that. If they have to do unrequited love then please, some subtlety. 

[Troublesome Knight]

Fortunately, the Catria archetype isn't one that's used as often as some other archetypes, so there's a good chance we won't see one of those (then again Intsys felt the need to add Faye in the first place even though we already had Clair as the Catria of Gaiden). 

[Darthkeeper]

On 12/21/2017 at 1:19 PM, John Denver Fan said:

I don't want to see A+ ranks that was from Fates, it was a terrible idea.

 

Not really. It was a way for players to customize more, which is what the latest games (I was going to exclude Echoes but it has Villager Fork) have been leaning towards. However, I will agree it's confusing with the whole overlapping and it's a  bit tedious in general.

[henrymidfields]

On 3/8/2018 at 6:32 AM, Modamy said:

Since Fire Emblem is a series with permadeath its hard to justify a character who was playable and has "died" in gameplay is still around talking in the story. Some characters would just retreat if they died, and others would just straight up disappear from sequences thay would normally have lines in. The base conversations worked because there is no other point where those characters would talk since they aren't really important to the story. The only way to really fix the issue for story important characters would be to never make story important characters playable units. Maybe they could just be AI controlled?

Or maybe...actually have different scripts, every now and then depending on whether the relevant characters are alive or dead?

[Troublesome Knight]

But there are some characters where it would completely derail the entire plot if they actually died because they're really just too important, so that doesn't work with everyone. That said, I remember that Path of Radiance actually did that with some characters at the beginning of the game.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Troublesome Knight

[Guest Dreamyboi]

Another thing I don't want to see come back to Fire Emblem it's immersion breaking characters.

I mainly mean people like Arthur and Peri (Conquests two worst characters IMO).

Characters with unbelievably cartoony personalities have no place in a game that tries to take itself seriously.....yes I'm talking about Fates.

I have nothing against comic relief but if it comes at the cost of what could have been a good character or at least a decent one while clashing with the tone as a result then they might as well not exist.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Dreamyboi

[Guest Dreamyboi]

On 3/7/2018 at 2:21 PM, Levant Mir Celestia said:

I'd agree if it weren't for the likes of Riev and Valter existing, since they had neither.

Just looking at Riev's portrait tells me all I need to know but what about Valter? Was he another "I'm possessed/corrupted and that lazily excuses my lack of depth" situation or is he just disappointing like Berkut? 

[Dragonage2ftw]

A return to the boring, bland, Pre-Awakening style.

[AsherCrane]

11 minutes ago, Dragonage2ftw said:

A return to the boring, bland, Pre-Awakening style.

Anything more specific, or do you want just absolutely everything that was in awakening but not the games before in every game from here on?

[Talcinel]

- I dont want the Avatar to be important to the plot. Just another customizable soldier in the army.

- I dont really care if weapon durability returned for normal weapons, but legendary weapons should absolutely not have durability attached.

-No more my room stuff. Petting game that the west didnt get aside, I really didnt enjoy all the time I wasted inviting people to my room to get affection up and having them spew the uninspired lines over and over. It made my runs to get a 100% support log completion a slog. If this does return, I have a few ideas to improve it, but that'd be for another topic.

- NO anime tropey characters. I dont mind mild tropes and cliches too much, but when they overdo it like Fates it just really leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Particular tropes I dont want:

-NO more character designs like Nowi. Putting clearly underage looking girls in lingerie with garters is disgusting, plain and simple. I dont care that she's 'technically 1000 years old', she acts and looks like an 8 year old. None of that

- NO characters obsessed with other characters to the point its ridiculous, unrealistic, and perverse. No more Fayes or Camillas

- NO incest overtones please. Not even step siblings. I dont even get squicked by fictional incest that much, but it's a seriously over beaten trope that the Japanese reeeeeally need to get over.

- NO eternally praised protagonists that can do no wrong and get things handed to them for no good logical reason. No more Corrins and Alms.
 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Talcinel

[Marty]

 - No Avatar character. They always have their own personality and the only actual avatar part of them is the ability to change the way they look and having an S support with essentially everyone. 

- No FE13/14 style of support. Echoes was a step in the right direction by having fewer supports that actually add something to the character's personality instead of the orgy that the other 3DS games went for. 

- No S supports, or at least not like how they worked in FE13/14. C to A supports were nice, but then comes S support where the character randomly shows up with a ring and asks for the other's hand in marriage when in most supports, they are barely good enough friends by their A supports. If anything them at least give us more lgbtq S supports besides the creepy weirdos we got in Fates.

- No sword/blue haired Lord. Heck, stepping away from the usual melee weapons would be a nice change altogether. Leo and Takumi are one of the few actual good characters in Fates, both of them are royals and step away from the usual sword or lance wielding Lord. Maybe even give us a female protagonist that doesn't feel like a side story like Celica, Eirika or Micaiah for once?

- No incest. I doubt we'll see this happening since FE fandom is pretty incestuous and prone to shoving those pairings out of nowhere (like how people try to make the fe8 twins work as a ship even though there's an actual line in heroes where Ephraim made it obvious how disgusted he is by that), but at least stepping it down to side characters instead of the royal harem from fates would be nice.

- No more bikini manakete girls. 

- No useless archers. Fates and Echoes took steps in the right direction, so I expect them to keep them useful.

- No more major changes to the basics like the weapon triangle. Fates already gave us amazing gameplay (for conquest at least), work on improving that instead of having us relearn Fire Emblem every time we decide to (re)play one of the games.

- No weapon durability. It's not strategic, it's a chore. 

- Take the game seriously when introducing tropey characters. I don't mind them as long as they are taken seriously in the chapter they get introduced in; Awakening and Fates broke my immersion many times because a character showed up making jokes in the middle of a battle all the way in the very beggining of Fates when Miriel shows up carrying Vaike's Axe. Maybe instead of re-using the same paralogue trope were a village gets attacked, explore other things like a tournament happening in a city. Echoes did this perfectly with most characters joining in the villages, keep that.

- No children. I did not play FE4 so I don't know how well they work there, but they were garbage in awafates. In Awakening they are interesting characters for the most part, but I hate how their relationship with their parents is portrayed (seriously. If you show up in the present with similar ages then it makes no sense whatsoever to automatically treat each other by a father-son basis. it never felt natural to me except for main plot!Lucina, but it still shows up in her supports.) and I specially hate how monotone your army turns out because of them. In older games you are always gaining new allys with diverse origins, while awafates has the playable cast cut in half. And the worst part is how powerful they are when compared to their parents with basically forces you to use them and, in harder playthroughts, you barely grow attached to your units because you are rushing to create the perfect army to deal with that lunatic run.

[FireEmblemfan2006]

32 minutes ago, Marty said:

 - No Avatar character. They always have their own personality and the only actual avatar part of them is the ability to change the way they look and having an S support with essentially everyone. 

- No FE13/14 style of support. Echoes was a step in the right direction by having fewer supports that actually add something to the character's personality instead of the orgy that the other 3DS games went for. 

- No S supports, or at least not like how they worked in FE13/14. C to A supports were nice, but then comes S support where the character randomly shows up with a ring and asks for the other's hand in marriage when in most supports, they are barely good enough friends by their A supports. If anything them at least give us more lgbtq S supports besides the creepy weirdos we got in Fates.

- No sword/blue haired Lord. Heck, stepping away from the usual melee weapons would be a nice change altogether. Leo and Takumi are one of the few actual good characters in Fates, both of them are royals and step away from the usual sword or lance wielding Lord. Maybe even give us a female protagonist that doesn't feel like a side story like Celica, Eirika or Micaiah for once?

- No incest. I doubt we'll see this happening since FE fandom is pretty incestuous and prone to shoving those pairings out of nowhere (like how people try to make the fe8 twins work as a ship even though there's an actual line in heroes where Ephraim made it obvious how disgusted he is by that), but at least stepping it down to side characters instead of the royal harem from fates would be nice.

- No more bikini manakete girls. 

- No useless archers. Fates and Echoes took steps in the right direction, so I expect them to keep them useful.

- No more major changes to the basics like the weapon triangle. Fates already gave us amazing gameplay (for conquest at least), work on improving that instead of having us relearn Fire Emblem every time we decide to (re)play one of the games.

- No weapon durability. It's not strategic, it's a chore. 

- Take the game seriously when introducing tropey characters. I don't mind them as long as they are taken seriously in the chapter they get introduced in; Awakening and Fates broke my immersion many times because a character showed up making jokes in the middle of a battle all the way in the very beggining of Fates when Miriel shows up carrying Vaike's Axe. Maybe instead of re-using the same paralogue trope were a village gets attacked, explore other things like a tournament happening in a city. Echoes did this perfectly with most characters joining in the villages, keep that.

- No children. I did not play FE4 so I don't know how well they work there, but they were garbage in awafates. In Awakening they are interesting characters for the most part, but I hate how their relationship with their parents is portrayed (seriously. If you show up in the present with similar ages then it makes no sense whatsoever to automatically treat each other by a father-son basis. it never felt natural to me except for main plot!Lucina, but it still shows up in her supports.) and I specially hate how monotone your army turns out because of them. In older games you are always gaining new allys with diverse origins, while awafates has the playable cast cut in half. And the worst part is how powerful they are when compared to their parents with basically forces you to use them and, in harder playthroughts, you barely grow attached to your units because you are rushing to create the perfect army to deal with that lunatic run.

Hate boner for Awakening detected. Fan boner for Echoes detected.

[Marty]

1 hour ago, FireEmblemfan2006 said:

Hate boner for Awakening detected. Fan boner for Echoes detected.

Your point is?

[Guest Dreamyboi]

The Hexing Rod, they should either tweak that or remove it.

Edited March 15, 2018 by Dreamyboi

[Morian]

 

2 hours ago, Dreamyboi said:

The Hexing Rod, they should either tweak that or remove it.

Hayato 

6 hours ago, Marty said:

- No FE13/14 style of support. Echoes was a step in the right direction by having fewer supports that actually add something to the character's personality instead of the orgy that the other 3DS games went for.  

I don't understand why people like Echoes supports. Making your units talk in the middle of a battle is not practical (that's another thing i don't want to see again), and they don't say much either, "Hey Kliff, how are ya?" "F**k off Tobin".

However, Alm and Celica's base convos with their parties are pretty alright.

There isn't that much i don't want to see in FE16. My biggest complaint was the time wasting aspects of the franchise, but that was fixed with the 3DS hadware and mechanics (Sleep Mode, short loading times, Turnwheel, Casual Mode for newest players, fast battle animations...) and I'm not worried because of Switch's hardware nature, despite the game being a home console FE according to the devs.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2018 by Morian

[Guest Dreamyboi]

16 minutes ago, Morian said:

I don't understand why people like Echoes supports. Making your units talk in the middle of a battle is not practical (that's another thing i don't want to see again), and they don't say much either, "Hey Kliff, how are ya?" "F**k off Tobin".

However, Alm and Celica's base convos with their parties are pretty alright.

Yeah, this is one of several complaints I had with Echoes. The base convos were great for the most part but the supports were either too short, wasted time, or told us stuff about the characters we already knew. Plus there are some characters who should be able to support with others and don't (Alm can only talk to one of his childhood friends and it's Faye, the one nobody likes) AND some characters who have a severe lack of them. Kliff can only support with Tobin and Genny can only support with Sonya (who you can choose to kill and then Genny has none at all).

[MystiClabo]

I'd love to go back to the inventory system from Path of Radiance. four weapon and four item slots. The single held item from Echoes was my second biggest hurdle to enjoying the game. In addition, accessory items can add more to the strategic and role-playing elements of the game if done right.

If it makes sense to the story and it is done well, I'm all for bringing back children. The Fates way of things was annoying and illogical. War or no, Royals would not dump their children in an alternate dimension.

I like S-Supports and I like adding in romance as an option. To an extent, I can understand the (non-royal) characters jumping into a marriage when they are t wr and could die tomorrow, but I will agree that a declaration of love would be better in most cases than an out of nowhere proposal. Romance/children should also not be required to beat the game. Have it for people that want it. Don't make it game breaking. Perhaps make skill inheritance more limited or remove it all together.

If we are going to have beast race characters, take a page out of PoR/RD and give options. I'd much rather have several races with different strengths and weaknesses than generic quadrupedal beasts that have next to no differences from one another. Fates was better, but not by much. 

Either drop or redo the forge system. It's too broken.

Having started with FE7 on GBA, I can see the merit of bringing back Weapon Durability. I grew up with it, I enjoyed it. However, while you can argue strategy, Durability really just leads to hording for old players and running out good weapons too quickly for new players. If possible, maybe make it an option, not a requirement.

Don't bring back old characters unless they only arrive in the post game or as DLC.

No linear path upgrades. Options are nice, even if its only two.

That's all I can think of for now, granted most of this I am sure has been covered already.

Edited March 15, 2018 by MystiClabo

[Von Ithipathachai]

4 hours ago, MystiClabo said:

I like S-Supports and I like adding in romance as an option.  To an extent, I can understand the (non-royal) characters jumping into a marriage when they are at war and could die tomorrow, but I will agree that a declaration of love would be better in most cases than an out of nowhere proposal.  Romance/children should also not be required to beat the game. Have it for people that want it.  Don't make it game breaking.  Perhaps make skill inheritance more limited or remove it all together.

If we are going to have beast race characters, take a page out of PoR/RD and give options. I'd much rather have several races with different strengths and weaknesses than generic quadrupedal beasts that have next to no differences from one another. Fates was better, but not by much. 

Having started with FE7 on GBA, I can see the merit of bringing back Weapon Durability. I grew up with it, I enjoyed it. However, while you can argue strategy, Durability really just leads to hording for old players and running out good weapons too quickly for new players. If possible, maybe make it an option, not a requirement.

Absolutely these.

Again, I would prefer significantly if S-Supports were mere declarations of love.  It would be a heck of a lot less awkward.  Also, in this scenario, Child Units should ideally be left out to avoid implications of being born out of wedlock.

I kind of like weapon durability, but what I would do is make weapons slightly more durable than they have been and bring back Genealogy of the Holy War's repair system.

[AsherCrane]

I'd like conversations to be somewhat of combination of Fates and Echoes. Echoes's support conversations weren't bad in general, the problem was mostly their length and their rarity (Which probably came from trying to avoid deviating from pre-created characters, but also wanting to add some new supports at the same time), for me. I did however like the fact that a solid amount of them were relatively serious and pretty diverse in their content. Fates ,on the other hand, had a lot of their supports being long and frequent, but ran into a problem of beating us over head with the character's iconic trait, which I found really annoying, and made them really one dimensional. (Not that Echoes's supports didn't did that a bit ad well, but like, I said,  to me, that's more due to length and rarity.) I'd like conversations with the character of Echoes, in that they sound like actual people and not cardboard cutouts, but be more frequent and longer so they actually develop character. 

 

That being said, I Don't see any real problem with in battle supports. Granted, I am going from my knowledge of the GBA Games, as I haven't played echoes in months, but the GBA Games had mountains in their maps, so they clearly were happening over a length of time. If Echoes had nothing like that, and all their maps had the implication of being small, then the battle conversations were probably an homage to the GBA Games, in which case It's a one off issue anyway. 

[Marty]

6 hours ago, Morian said:

 

Hayato 

I don't understand why people like Echoes supports. Making your units talk in the middle of a battle is not practical (that's another thing i don't want to see again), and they don't say much either, "Hey Kliff, how are ya?" "F**k off Tobin".

However, Alm and Celica's base convos with their parties are pretty alright.

 

 

5 hours ago, Dreamyboi said:

Yeah, this is one of several complaints I had with Echoes. The base convos were great for the most part but the supports were either too short, wasted time, or told us stuff about the characters we already knew. Plus there are some characters who should be able to support with others and don't (Alm can only talk to one of his childhood friends and it's Faye, the one nobody likes) AND some characters who have a severe lack of them. Kliff can only support with Tobin and Genny can only support with Sonya (who you can choose to kill and then Genny has none at all).

 I don't like the supports in the middle of a battle either, I'd rather have them in the base. But besides that, the only other problem with echoes was having fewer supports than expected.

 But I heavily disagree with Dreamyboy. The supoorts in echoes were diverse and showed us some really interesting dynamics (like Tobin and Python, or Sonya and Genya) or were just fun in general (I really enjoyed watching Faye get rejected 3 times, for once). The "show something we already know" argument doesn't really work because fe characters in general tend to be pure archetypes (awa fates being the worst offenders of this, mostly fates though) so it's to be expected. 

 I also don't mind their length. I don't need my supports to be long all the time, just fun to watch.

For example, Boey and Mae. The two bicker all the time so the romance was implied even if you don't support them, but it was really nice to see how oblivious they were to each other's feelings. It's even nicer if you did Celica and Mae before doing Boey and Mae's A support since it builds up nicely.

I'd say overall that's what I enjoyed the most in Echoes supports: they were all canon and they all added up to the existing characters and their roles on the plot. It's stuff that happened in the story wether you did tje supports to find out or not.

Meanwhile, in the other games (or at least the 3ds ones since I don't really remember the supports In gba games) they seem like an after thought that has little to no impact in the story whatsoever, even if you get the S rank one. There's conversations that are obviously locked to that support and didn't really happen in the normal game. Heck, there's even conversations that are flat out plot holes (like how Morgan doesn't remember anything other than Robin but will say they remember Lucina wielding Falchion in the future in one of their supports).

 

[FireEmblemfan2006]

6 hours ago, Dreamyboi said:

Yeah, this is one of several complaints I had with Echoes. The base convos were great for the most part but the supports were either too short, wasted time, or told us stuff about the characters we already knew. Plus there are some characters who should be able to support with others and don't (Alm can only talk to one of his childhood friends and it's Faye, the one nobody likes) AND some characters who have a severe lack of them. Kliff can only support with Tobin and Genny can only support with Sonya (who you can choose to kill and then Genny has none at all).

Actually japan like her more than Alm lover Celica.

[Collindew16]

One thing I absolutely loved from Echoes was the conversations Alm/Celcia could have with his companions at the shrines. I always found it so interesting to hear what each solider's thoughts on the events in the story were, such as Saber talking about his return to Rigel. I disliked how in previous games you would get a character at a random point of the story, and then disappear from the narrative, only existing to the people they can support with.

This might seem like a weird hope, but I don't want most of the cast to know each other prior to the events of the game (I'm mainly talking about how most of fate's crew on both sides is just royals and retainers). I prefer to have the support conversations to focus on the characters meeting for the first time and sharing their differing paths that led them to join the main lord's army. The best supports in my opinion have both one character and player simultaneously learn about the other character's past events that turned them into the person they are. In fates the royals and retainers to an extent already knew each other, which caused the supports to be less focused on the characters discussing each other's pasts.

[Lewyn]

No avatar character.  I think this always seems awkward and forced, particularly if playable.  It distracts from the story and world and other characters greatly.  

Agree no more designs like Nowi.  I think the sexualization of pre pubescent children is just really offputting.  I'd also go lighter on incest themes, which seem to happen a lot in the series.  No children, unless the game is built around them such as Genealogy of the Holy War.  No petting scenes, and while fan service has always been a part of the series I would prefer it to be more subtle.  I think Echoes is a great example.  Serious storyline, sure some characters are very attractive but nothing seems to be pushed on the player and distracting from the story and world.