Cuphead In: Don't Deal With the Mafia (Game Over)

[Cú Chulainn]

I'm heading off for the night, I really am not feeling well now.

I'll be back tomorrow with hopefully a more clear-mind to respond to things.

[Shiki Ryougi]

i don't think i have another multiquote wall in me

gonna just reply to random bs

1 hour ago, Dr. Kahl said:

Oh, I didn't notice that Sally voted for Werner.  Never mind, I get your reasoning now (for the OMGUS and Werner disappearing, even though I don't agree w/it).

Mreh, willing to take this as me fucking up over your case having scum intent.  You having a disagreement read as scummy because you voted him over it (read my replies to Captain).  Agree to disagree on Werner, because it's not going to change my reads on you or him either way.

Are you looking for associative reads?  The Captain/Djimmi relation is confusing me.

##Unvote

##Vote: Werner Werman

associative reads d1 are a trap. impossible to call scum-motivated without more player meta type context (which, again, lol) but uh... don't do it lmao

[Marisa Kirisame]

WAIT NO FUCK THIS fuck this fuck this I changed my mind

##unvote
##Vote: Grim Matchstick

I'm going by my INSTINCT. consider this a pressure vote. 

[Shiki Ryougi]

think i like bvbb's p3 posting

no particular reason why tbh just GUT

 

speaking of GUT cagney carnation is officially my top town, fight me

[Shiki Ryougi]

wish more people were around

the number of posts that happened in the 80 years it took me to multiquote p2 was disheartening

[Marisa Kirisame]

i love you too honeybottoms <3.

I didn't like my Bon Bon vote after I made it because their content around their Beppi vote gets better and a Beppi vote is understandable whereas Matchstick feels like a better vote because it's true that their Kahl vote feels "safe" and so far their content has been more stay-under-the-radar type stuff. would like to see more from them.

[C. C.]

1 hour ago, Baroness Von Bon Bon said:

To be specific about the bolded part. I liked who he voted. I did not like his vote.  I already commented that I thought his vote was very sheepy.  I thought I had stated this, if I didn't then I must be a bit more out of it than I thought.  I may step away for the night, get a bite to eat and go to sleep.

well you said this: "I asked Beppi, because it seems their vote on Werner was very similar to Djinni's.  It seemed like they were sheeping Djinni's vote and overall I felt it was weak.  I felt if they were sheeping Djinni they might have a stronger read on Djinni so I wanted to gauge their response." and then this: "I like your one vote but you can also say it's very sheepy and you didn't state thoughts on anything else or on anyone else."

so in hindsight I probably focused a bit too much on that bolded part; your post is more critical of Beppi's vote than I'd initially thought. It does bother me though that you kind of had to be pushed to talk about Beppi and then when you did it was pretty whatever. when you say you want to ignore the gut feeling- is it one of those gut feelings where you don't know what's causing it so you don't want to pay attention to it, or is it one of those where you know what's causing it but it's stupid so you want to ignore it?

I thought rumor was either prims or sb after the first two posts and then remembered they were the hosts

[C. C.]

idk I don't really agree with the Matchstick case. the kahl vote was pretty original, not sure why you're being so grudging about it. plus there were only like 10 non-RVS posts by the time of his last post so it's not like there was that much to be revolutionary about. also come on lol if we had to go for a few hours he had to go, saying it's him "pre-emptively shutting the door for a Kahl rebuttal" is dumb.

Who do you think is scum Rumor?

[C. C.]

*if he had to go for a few hours

most of Rumor's stuff I generally agree with but actually the point about the Kahl/Matchstick interaction is worse now that I think about it more because she also says that she doesn't like how Kahl didn't really reply to the Matchstick case. So on one hand Matchstick shut down the door for a rebuttal and on the other hand Kahl should have rebutted it?

[Shiki Ryougi]

13 minutes ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

idk I don't really agree with the Matchstick case. the kahl vote was pretty original, not sure why you're being so grudging about it. plus there were only like 10 non-RVS posts by the time of his last post so it's not like there was that much to be revolutionary about. also come on lol if we had to go for a few hours he had to go, saying it's him "pre-emptively shutting the door for a Kahl rebuttal" is dumb.

Who do you think is scum Rumor?

not huge on matchstick. wouldn't really say i have any real scumreads outside of that. i tend to be a lot better at establishing townreads than scumreads, especially early on. shrug emoji

the kahl vote doesn't seem THAT out of left field to me but it could be because i have the benefit of hindsight

9 minutes ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

*if he had to go for a few hours

most of Rumor's stuff I generally agree with but actually the point about the Kahl/Matchstick interaction is worse now that I think about it more because she also says that she doesn't like how Kahl didn't really reply to the Matchstick case. So on one hand Matchstick shut down the door for a rebuttal and on the other hand Kahl should have rebutted it?

it's become clear to me that i probably worded the rebuttal thing poorly. so uh let me fix that

matchstick voting then bailing is basically passing the buck on taking actual responsibility for the vote. kahl can rebut, yes, but matchstick is no obligation to continue the interaction, because he's gone. after that one of three things happens: either the vote catches on and sustains itself without matchstick's help, the vote dies out forgotten and matchstick catches very little heat for it, or the case gets turned around on matchstick and he's forced to actually defend it. only one out of three of these is actually bad for a hypothetical scum!matchstick, and the prolonged absence (a few hours counts as prolonged, yes) buys him time to prepare in the event of this happening

[Shiki Ryougi]

tl;dr the vote 'n run is a classic scum move because there's a surprisingly good chance it lets you dodge taking any actual responsibility for the vote

[C. C.]

no, I understand that there's potential scum motivation there. it's just a very heavy case of presuming they have a scummy motivation when they, as either alignment, could have just been busy.

it might be different I guess because I was around at the time when Matchstick made his few posts and he was saying stuff that generally made sense to me. I don't think the Kahl vote was revolutionary but I don't understand how the vote can be safe if it was original. just kinda feels like you read his first couple posts and thought there was a case, and then saw the Kahl vote near the end and are trying to dismiss it because it doesn't fit with the narrative.

and also you're not voting for him so I don't know what to make of that

[Ochako Uraraka]

Hello all beautiful people and things, I'm here to grace you with my mesmerizing presence! <3

[C. C.]

Just now, Cala Maria said:

Hello all beautiful people and things, I'm here to grace you with my mesmerizing presence! <3

the only thing I get mesmerized by are good cases

[Ochako Uraraka]

I'm reading the thread right now; Drunk Captain, do you think Grim saying something along the lines of "Werner could go either way." is alignment indicative? 

[C. C.]

not really. I can see that as the kind of comment that could be interpreted as "safe" because it doesn't really say much. I just don't think characterizing Grim's entire play as such is accurate and I don't think it's very suspicious even if it was, considering how little of the game had elapsed

also, if I was drunk on a saturday night I wouldn't be playing mafia

 

[Kamina]

I'm trying to read through the thread again, and the main thing I've gleaned from it is that Matchstick's vote on Kahl doesn't seem to have a discernible reason. Or at the very least, I can't find it. Why is Matchstick voting Kahl again? Will probably need to reread Kahl as well, I just find myself skimming over their post.

[Ochako Uraraka]

I see; I felt like that kind of comment would give Werner the flexibility to commit to a read later in the game, but I understand that when you're on page 2 there's not a lot to be expected.

My take on honey is that she's more likely to be town here. I feel like going for "Grim shut the door for a Kahl rebuttal" over the obvious part where Grim was passive initially and didn't make any committed read on Werner is more complex and likely to come from town over scum wanting to get by. Do you disagree?

 

[Estelle]

Whose brilliant idea was it to give me half an hour for a mafia game?

Before I go off on a giant analysis of the two-ish pages that cropped up, that vote on Sally was somewhat serious.  Everyone could see the interaction between the Captain and Honeybottoms on page 1.  When Sally brought it up, it felt like commenting on something for the sake of making the comment.  Hardly a case to lynch someone, but the most notable thing to happen on D1.

As for that interaction, I don't think it indicates anything, yet.  It's too early for associative reads.

[Ochako Uraraka]

I'm getting good vibes from the Baroness. While I was reading the thread I got the same idea of Djimmi's vote as she did, and  I feel like the switch to Beppi makes sense after Djimmi clarified his reasoning. I disagree with Briney's thoughts here- I don't think that voting Beppi at that point is scummy. That's a vote that could've come from either alignment, so why do you think that the vote has scum intent,  @Captain Brineybeard ?

I didn't like Kahl's vote on the Baroness because the issue he takes with her choice of words feels like grasping to me. Also didn't like the switch to Werner, because even though he did mention him in his second post, it felt odd that he had to default to Werner after his back and forth with the Baroness. I'd like to see more from him since most of his content right now was centered around the Baroness.

 

[Ochako Uraraka]

Ah, I noticed that the Honeybee didn't change her vote to Grim after defending her scumread on Grim. That is, I think, my only problem with her right now.

I feel like Djimmi fits the bill for an active lurker. It doesn't feel like he is being proactive with scumhunting at the moment. I feel like he'd be talking more about the Baroness,Kahl or the Captain at the point in time when he was active in the thread, instead of making mentions of Werner and Beppi only.

I didn't really like Cagney Carnation's switch to Grim. Sweety, you mentioned that you didn't like Kahl for switching to Werner. Do you feel that Grim's posts on page 2 are worse than Kahl's thought process in pages 2 and 3? Didn't like how you had to mention your vote as a pressure vote, felt like you didn't want to attach a lot of conviction to your vote.

##Vote: Cagney Carnation

 

[C. C.]

50 minutes ago, Beppi The Clown said:

I'm trying to read through the thread again, and the main thing I've gleaned from it is that Matchstick's vote on Kahl doesn't seem to have a discernible reason. Or at the very least, I can't find it. Why is Matchstick voting Kahl again? Will probably need to reread Kahl as well, I just find myself skimming over their post.

it's... literally the couple sentences right above his vote.

I guess sally can clarify but I'm quite sure she was just talking about RVS in RP fluff. I don't think she was trying to make any kind of point about me and Honeybee.

@cala- why is cagney "not attaching conviction" to his vote worse than honeybee not even voting? I do agree with your djimmi point though.

just realized I could constantly be ;)ing and nobody would know because I have an eyepatch.

[Estelle]

I had a post, lost the post, then apparently I'm on-call.  Fucking hell.

5 hours ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

@Werner- I guess you just want to end RVS but like, what kind of telling reaction are you going to get from a vote that's so contrived? 

Hopefully one that doesn't have empty comments and RP.

5 hours ago, Djimmi The Great said:

This comment rubs me the wrong way. It feels like an attempt to seem uninterested in the case on them to avoid drawing more attention to themselves.

##Unvote

##Vote: Werner Werman

Why?

5 hours ago, Dr. Kahl said:

Agreed.  I don't like Werner's reasoning for the vote either.  There's trying to get out of RVS, and there's voting someone just to vote someone (hardly better than RVS).

Why?

5 hours ago, Djimmi The Great said:

A better way to put my thoughts would be that Werner's reply seemed more like it was to shut down the interaction with Captain Brineybeard rather than adding to it since it added nothing.

Why?

5 hours ago, Beppi The Clown said:

##Unvote

##Vote: Werner Werman

Their vote on Sally rubs me the wrong way. Not so much that they blamed RP for trying to obscure a point, but it feels very reactionary, kind of like an OMGUS. Also, when voted by Captain says "we can do something productive now". And then promptly disappears. Comes off as someone who's trying to back off a suspicious post in a "that was just a reaction test" kind of way but doesn't actually stay for discussion.

I had multiple votes on me by that time.  If I tried to avoid OMGUS, I'd still be on my RVS vote, and that's not very productive.

4 hours ago, Dr. Kahl said:

Werner was reactive, not proactive.

Explain this.

4 hours ago, Dr. Kahl said:

Being overly semantic (FMPOV the entire post implied BvBB not understanding Djimmi, so the bolded is objectively wrong) and asking for opinions (I didn't expect Grim to have detailed reads, I just wanted to understand where he was coming from) is alignment neutral, and you framing them as reasons that I'm scummy is questionable.  Your followup was good because it explained your thought process, so I don't think this is a scum vote but like...obviously these things are not telling. 

If Baroness thought the vote was reaching, she should have said that the vote was reaching.  Read my reply to Matchstick, I'm not posting it again.  I can get where you're coming from WRT the last sentence, but the vote read to me like calling out a bad vote over calling out a scum vote, if that makes any sense.

Oh, this is weird.  There's a lot of declaration - generally aggressive.  But statements to the Captain?  Passive.

Being overly semantic can contribute to a read.  It's why I vote people who I think are playing up the RP too much.

4 hours ago, Beppi The Clown said:

Either way, unless they come back and explain they had to leave without any notification, it always feels weird when someone is like "cool, now we can get started" and then vanishes without saying they need to leave.

I don't answer to you or anyone else in the game.  If I have better things to do with my time, I'm leaving.  This has got to be one of the graspiest reasons I've seen for a vote on anyone.

3 hours ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

after I decided not to RP as a pirate I was going to try to pretend I was Iris but my posts aren't upbeat enough to mimic her tone so I'll just leave it at ;)

Thanks.  Makes playing the game easier.

3 hours ago, Dr. Kahl said:

I don't know but it's frustrating getting voted for non reasons and I'm also biased because I know my alignment.  Werner's vote can come from both alignments but it's more likely to come from scum IMO.  

Not quoting but your Beppi/Baroness cases are good (moreso Beppi because it reads as Beppi's case contradicting itself).

Like how you're voting me, declaring a bunch of shit, and not backing it up with the all-important question of WHY.

3 hours ago, Beppi The Clown said:

Werner's vote comes off as an OMGUS because saying that Sally was obscuring their post with RP is already stretching it. I'd have likely considered it as an attempt to break out of RVS, Elie-style. But with Sally having voted Werner, it just felt like an overreaction to an RVS post. It just doesn't feel like a joking RVS overreaction to me, it feels like it's trying to start something.

You get it!  But somehow you came to the wrong conclusion.  I didn't see anyone else trying to get out of RVS, and it had already been 24 hours.  Should I vote every last one of you for not having the spine to do it?

2 minutes ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

I guess sally can clarify but I'm quite sure she was just talking about RVS in RP fluff. I don't think she was trying to make any kind of point about me and Honeybee.

Why mention it at all, then?  I don't mind the extra stuff you're putting in your posts, because there's a clear line between your random comments and your content.

I think my vote would be best placed here:

##Unvote
##Vote: Dr. Kahl

If you're going to state my intent, I expect to see logic behind it, so I can respond to that.  I shouldn't have to ask you "why" so many times.  This goes for everyone else who failed to explain things.

FoS: Beppi.  The OMGUS case as well as me leaving are really soft tells.  This almost feels like a guidebook on what Beppi would do if they are scum.  Not worth a case, but definitely worth remembering for later day phases.

Still want Sally to come back and say stuff.  Not really feeling the rest of you ATM.

[Estelle]

Test post, my browser is doing something weird.

[Kamina]

8 minutes ago, Captain Brineybeard said:

it's... literally the couple sentences right above his vote.

Well clearly I'm having trouble with this reading thing right now otherwise I wouldn't have asked in the first place.